Hermanson update, not much news but...

[SSH2005]

Would that mean goodbye Sweeney, Owens, or Fields?  Sort of f***s up Williams 4 year board.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I doubt we would have to trade any of those guys for a decent reliever. Do you remember who we traded for Scott Sullivan back in 2003? Tim Hummel and some cash. Tim Hummel is back with the Sox now. I'm thinking more along the lines of Borchard + a mid-level prospect or two.

Edited March 13, 2006 by SSH2005

[fathom]

Sweeney and Fields aren't going to be traded. Ozzie loves Sweeney, and Fields gives us more leverage in future negotiations with Crede. Owens would be the ideal guy to trade, IMO. His value will never be higher than it is right now.

[SSH2005]

Sweeney and Fields aren't going to be traded.  Ozzie loves Sweeney, and Fields gives us more leverage in future negotiations with Crede.  Owens would be the ideal guy to trade, IMO.  His value will never be higher than it is right now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't see KW trading Owens either. As much as some people may not like it, Owens fits too much with Ozzie's smallball. I think KW views Owens as Podsednik's replacement when he gets too expensive.

[DBAHO]

If ever Borchard is going to be dealt, now is the time. A team that is craving for a power hitting outfielder like Pittsburgh, could be inclined to make a move for him still.

[fathom]

For some reason, I've thought all along Borchard would be involved in a deal with another prospect to the Pirates for Salomon Torres.

[Flash Tizzle]

I doubt we would have to trade any of those guys for a decent reliever.  Do you remember who we traded for Scott Sullivan back in 2003?  Tim Hummel and some cash.  Tim Hummel is back with the Sox now.  I'm thinking more along the lines of Borchard + a mid-level prospect or two.

That's an entirely different situation. First, it was midseason. Second, Cincinnati was willing to unload anyone with a salary above one million.

 

Sullivan, at the time of the trade, was a good example of an average pickup. Not anyone you'd expect to dominate opposing hitters, but rather, eat innings. We're not going to be the recepient of such a gift preseason.

 

But if I'm wrong and Borchard plus (s***ty) mid-level prospects give us a decent reliever, I'll be satisfied.

[SSH2005]

If ever Borchard is going to be dealt, now is the time. A team that is craving for a power hitting outfielder like Pittsburgh, could be inclined to make a move for him still.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Indeed, IIRC the Pirates were looking for a young power-hitting outfield before they signed Burnitz. Burnitz is ancient and is only signed for one season. The Royals were also looking for a young power-hitting outfielder as well. I would take a guy like Joel Peralta for Borchard in a second but I don't see a trade within the division happening.

[hi8is]

peralta for borchard is a pipe dream that i HIGHLY doubt happens.... even in dreams.

[SSH2005]

That's an entirely different situation. First, it was midseason. Second, Cincinnati was willing to unload anyone with a salary above one million.

 

Sullivan, at the time of the trade, was a good example of an average pickup. Not anyone you'd expect to dominate opposing hitters, but rather, eat innings. We're not going to be the recepient of such a gift preseason.

 

But if I'm wrong and Borchard plus (s***ty) mid-level prospects give us a decent reliever, I'll be satisfied.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Okay, I'll give you another example...

 

Latest News  Dec. 9, 2005 - 2:11 pm et

 

Angels acquired LHP J.C. Romero from the Twins for infielder Alexi Casilla.

That's it? Twins GM Terry Ryan should have exercised some patience if this was the best he could do now. Damaso Marte brought a real player in return, and he's owed more money than the $2.45 million Romero is guaranteed. Casilla, 21, hit .325/.392/.409 with 47 steals for low Single-A Cedar Rapids last season, but that only makes him the Angels' sixth- or seventh-best middle-infield prospect. Romero isn't exactly reliable, but he can be one of the league's better lefty relievers when he's on.

Alexi Casilla is no where near a top prospect and the Angels netted a decent lefty in J.C. Romero for him.

 

peralta for borchard is a pipe dream that i HIGHLY doubt happens.... even in dreams.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The Royals claimed Joel Peralta on October 7th, 2005 after the Angels DFA'ed him. The Royals got him for the cost of a waiver claim. If they could turn a waiver claim into a power-hitting outfielder, I think they would be interested.

 

BTW, I guess Kenny was on Talkin' Baseball with Levine and Defalco this morning(before Hermansons back went out...) and Williams flat out said he thought the bullpen was a concern. I did not hear the piece, this is all 2nd hand from my father. He said he got the jist Kenny was going to make a move, and rather quickly if possible.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But you were wrong, Tony82087!

Edited March 13, 2006 by SSH2005

[Flash Tizzle]

BTW, I guess Kenny was on Talkin' Baseball with Levine and Defalco this morning(before Hermansons back went out...) and Williams flat out said he thought the bullpen was a concern. I did not hear the piece, this is all 2nd hand from my father. He said he got the jist Kenny was going to make a move, and rather quickly if possible.

That's odd. I shouldn't be surprised, but usually you would expect an executive--when assessing his team-- to give the usual bulls*** about "our guys will perform," "I have confidence in them," etc. Atleast he recognizes an upgrade is necessary.

 

Personally, I agree something will happen soon. We can't just wait around till the end of spring training, trade several players, then automatically throw add the bullpen arm to our roster. Especially if it's for Borchard/prospects. You figure the person we'd receive for such a package isn't exactly proven. Their talent needs to be assessed.

[Jordan4life_2007]

For some reason, I've thought all along Borchard would be involved in a deal with another prospect to the Pirates for Salomon Torres.

 

Only Jim Hendry is capable of fleecing the Pirates to that degree.

[Flash Tizzle]

Okay, I'll give you another example...

Alexi Casilla is no where near a top prospect and the Angels netted a decent lefty in J.C. Romero for him.

Angels farm system exceeds ours to such a degree it's almost ridiculous. Only they could have such a hitter available in their low A system, trade him, and not blink. Whose a hitter in our organization with such numbers in Low A that Williams could trade without hurting us? Take Casilla's number on our Low A ballclub and they'd exceed everyones aside from Gentz.

 

According to John Sickels, Gentz is rated as our 14th prospect. Casilla, with his numbers, is the 5th/6th rated INFIELD prospect. Not including outfield or pitchers. Considering our organization hasn't exactly done well recently producing IF talent, I'd think twice about moving Gentz.

 

Although honestly, without hesitation, I'd trade Gentz alone if it gave us Romero. But you add our 14th rated prospect, another prospect, Borchard for a decent reliever--in an offseason where we've unready unloaded the pantry of prospects--I'm a little reluctant. That decent reliever status better be more assured that a Felix Diaz clone.

Edited March 13, 2006 by Flash Tizzle

[SSH2005]

Angels farm system exceeds ours to such a degree it's almost ridiculous. Only they could have such a hitter available in their low A system, trade him, and not blink. Whose a hitter in our organization with such numbers in Low A that Williams could trade without hurting us? Take Casilla's number on our Low A ballclub and they'd exceed everyones aside from Gentz.

 

According to John Sickels, Gentz is rated as our 14th prospect. Casilla, with his numbers, is the 5th/6th rated INFIELD prospect. Not including outfield or pitchers. Considering our organization hasn't exactly done well recently producing IF talent, I'd think twice about moving Gentz.

 

Although honestly, without hesitation, I'd trade Gentz alone if it gave us Romero. But you add our 14th rated prospect, another prospect, Borchard for a decent reliever--in an offseason where we've unready unloaded the pantry of prospects--I'm a little reluctant. That decent reliever status better be more assured that a Felix Diaz clone.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

His name is Chris Getz.

 

And just because the Angels have a better farm system than us doesn't mean that Alexi Casilla is some sort of stud prospect. John Sickels didn't even have Casilla ranked on his Angels Top 20 Prospects list. Why? Because guys that break out in Single A are a dime a dozen.

[SSH2005]

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...ack=1&cset=true

Two injuries could be a pain

Sox's Hermanson, Podsednik unable to shake soreness

 

By Dave van Dyck

Tribune staff reporter

 

March 12, 2006, 10:05 PM CST

 

TUCSON, Ariz. -- Suddenly the White Sox are short in two areas they least can afford it: bullpen and leadoff hitter.

 

Dustin Hermanson left Sunday's 6-1 loss to the Angels with a recurrence of back problems that slowed him the second half of last season. The ailment could cost him a spot on the Opening Day roster.

 

In addition, Scott Podsednik missed his fifth straight game with shoulder soreness that has soured this spring's grand experiment of Juan Uribe learning to bat behind him. While Podsednik might return this week, the early prognosis on Hermanson isn't as good.

 

"Right now I can't count on him," manager Ozzie Guillen said. "We're going to see what happens, but right now we'll look for people to replace him."

 

Hermanson, who has had a shaky spring, allowed three booming hits and a run in the sixth inning Sunday. He landed awkwardly while warming up for the next inning and tried to continue but finally left after another double.

 

Trainer Herm Schneider called the problem "discomfort and instability in the back." Hermanson left the clubhouse without commenting.

 

Hermanson saved 21 games in the first half last season but lost his spot to rookie Bobby Jenks in the second half when his back made him unreliable. At the end of the season Hermanson was mostly a middle reliever. Cliff Politte became the eighth-inning right-handed bridge to Jenks.

 

So what happens now? A trade?

 

"We'll take a look at a couple guys here, then make a decision," Guillen said. "We have another two weeks to go. We'll give a chance to the guys who are here. I'll go righty or lefty, whatever I have to do."

 

Among those who will get looks are right-hander Austin Montero and lefties Armando Almanza, Paulino Reynoso and Logan Boone, all of them inexperienced. The Sox already are thin in the bullpen after trading Luis Vizcaino and Damaso Marte. Brandon McCarthy will fill Vizcaino's spot, but now the Sox may need two more bodies to replace the left-handed Marte and Hermanson in middle relief.

 

"We've got five starters who go deep [into games], so we might not have to go crazy about hurrying to get somebody," Guillen said. "I would worry if [the starters] went down."

 

Meanwhile, Podsednik continues to miss valuable time because of his left shoulder, injured in late February by what he calls "overwork." He has gone 1-for-9 in three games, none since March 6.

 

"We're trying to make sure the shoulder responds to treatment and strengthening," he said. "We just want to make sure we don't do anything to jeopardize me being ready to go Opening Day. It's progressively getting better. I've never really been a guy who needs 50 to 100 at-bats in spring training to get ready.

 

"My legs and the rest of my body are great. I think we're taking the right approach [by taking time off]."

 

An MRI and X-rays revealed no structural damage, but with a new No. 2 hitter in Uribe, it's important they play together to learn each other's tendencies.

 

"You have to have a game plan," Podsednik said. "Both hitters have to be on the same page."

 

Hitting coach Greg Walker said "we've still got time" to have the two play together.

 

"The way [camp is] set up, we phase into it," he said. "When we leave here, we want everyone playing and on a roll."

 

[email protected]

[Flash Tizzle]

His name is Chris Getz.

 

And just because the Angels have a better farm system than us doesn't mean that Alexi Casilla is some sort of stud prospect.  John Sickels didn't even have Casilla ranked on his Angels Top 20 Prospects list.  Why?  Because guys that break out in Single A are a dime a dozen.

Acknowledging that, it's even more of an indictment on our minor leauge development. What does it say when players with comparable numbers on opposing teams are listed as 14 in one, and not listed in another. You can criticize Sickels, but the true difference is our system is weak. Even if Getz turns to s***, he's the best of the Low league talent we have. Every prospect has to begin somewhere.

 

Class A talent is abundant--yes--but for the Angels, they don't need to rest their future on those players. It would be different if Getz were an outfielder. Sox seem to have no problem developing those.

 

For the reason Twins selected Casilla lends me to believe they notice something in him. They could afford to give up Romero for nothing, anyways, with the Juan Rincon cloning facility they seem to have built in Minnesota. Every year there's a new pitcher in their organization throwing 95+ with a nasty breaking ball.

[SSH2005]

Acknowledging that, it's even more of an indictment on our minor leauge development. What does it say when players with comparable numbers on opposing teams are listed as 14 in one, and not listed in another. You can criticize Sickels, but the true difference is our system is weak. Even if Getz turns to s***, he's the best of the Low league talent we have. Every prospect has to begin somewhere.

 

Class A talent is abundant--yes--but for the Angels, they don't need to rest their future on those players. It would be different if Getz were an outfielder. Sox seem to have no problem developing those.

 

For the reason Twins selected Casilla lends me to believe they notice something in him. They could afford to give up Romero for nothing, anyways, with the Juan Rincon cloning facility they seem to have built in Minnesota. Every year there's a new pitcher in their organization throwing 95+ with a nasty breaking ball.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't understand what you mean. Chris Getz tore it up in Single A as well. We probably could have gotten Romero for Getz but the Twins damn sure aren't going to trade a reliever to us.

 

And we won the World Series last season. The Angels and Twins didn't. Would you rather we be the Twins and have a team with a crappy payroll, a s***hole stadium, and the risk of contraction? We won the World Series last year because KW wasn't afraid to trade highly rated prospects like Jeremy Reed, not because he horded unproven talent to show off an impressive farm system.

Edited March 13, 2006 by SSH2005

[RME JICO]

What would the Sox have to do to pick up one of these guys from the WBC that is not on an MLB roster. Some of the pitchers have looked pretty decent vs Major League competition.

[Chisoxfn]

The Angels are the most ridiculous farm system in baseball. They have some insane hitting prospects. The Angels and Dodgers are in a whole other league when it comes to farm systems (at this moment).

[SSH2005]

What would the Sox have to do to pick up one of these guys from the WBC that is not on an MLB roster.  Some of the pitchers have looked pretty decent vs Major League competition.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Help them defect from their home country.

[RME JICO]

Help them defect from their home country. 

Yeah, and we won't need rafts or boats since they will all be playing in the states for the next round.

[Flash Tizzle]

I don't understand what you mean.  Chris Getz tore it up in Single A as well.  We probably could have gotten Romero for Getz but the Twins damn sure aren't going to trade a reliever to us.

 

And we won the World Series last season.  The Angels and Twins didn't.  Would you rather we be the Twins and have a team with a crappy payroll, a s***hole stadium, and the risk of contraction?    We won the World Series last year because KW wasn't afraid to trade highly rated prospects like Jeremy Reed, not because he horded unproven talent to show off an impressive farm system.

 

If Getz could give our ballclub a pitcher on par with Romero I would overwhelmingly approve of it. But with that, I'd be a little reluctant since we're not exactly stacked with infield talent. You posted a rare trade scenario with Minnesota and Anaheim, and I'm suggesting it wouldn't likely occur with our ballclub. Sure, a team will accept Gentz alone, but are we receiving a pitcher of Romero's caliber? Probably not.

 

Do you honestly believe I would rather have a highly touted farm system than a world series championship? There's no clear model to winning a title. I believe Almighty Beane has proven that assertion correct. However, I would like to have some talent available for our future. Ideally to suppliment our roster. Sustaining success is difficult in MLB; as evident by the fact no team has repeated since the Yankees. I'm looking forward to next year and hoping we repeat, but in addition, looking onward to 2007 and beyond. It's really not difficult to do--cheering for this years club to do well while silmutaneously criticizing our s***ty minor league system.

 

I despise watching the Lance Broadway's of the world throwing meatballs, whereas a hardthrowing Twins pitcher spontaneously generated out of the air just now. I envy their system. They envy our championship. And to clarify my position, yes, I would rather have a world championship. I don't mention this in my posts because I believe it's implied.

 

I can complain all night about our system, but you've kept me up too long. We've diverted attention from the topic long enough. Jphat will s*** himself in the morning with my sacreligeous comments, anyways. So I'll probably pick it up then if it drags on, and people continue to believe our weak system consumes my life....

[Flash Tizzle]

The Angels are the most ridiculous farm system in baseball.  They have some insane hitting prospects.  The Angels and Dodgers are in a whole other league when it comes to farm systems (at this moment).

What's the reason? Los Angeles scouts been solid since the early 90's. Is it as simple as suggesting both Angel and Dodger scouting departments are tremendous at identifying talent? Are their foreign scouts actually traveling south of Texas, unlike ours? Damn, do we even have representatives in Venezuela or the Domincan Republic?

 

I believe Guillen opening a baseball facility recently in Venezuela was a tremendous idea. Not for the community, no--but when a situation arises where employeers observe a quality prospect we can snatch that bastard right up.

Edited March 13, 2006 by Flash Tizzle

[SSH2005]

What's the reason? Los Angeles scouts been solid since the early 90's. Is it as simple as suggesting both Angel and Dodger scouting departments are tremendous at identifying talent? Are their foreign scouts actually traveling south of Texas, unlike ours? Damn, do we even have representatives in Venezuela or the Domincan Republic?

 

I believe Guillen opening a baseball facility recently in Venezuela was a tremendous idea. Not for the community, no--but when a situation arises where employeers observe a quality prospect we can snatch that bastard right up.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How do you think we got guys like Magglio Ordonez and Carlos Lee?

 

Maggio Ordonez

Signed by the Chicago White Sox as an amateur free agent in 1991.

Carlos Lee

Signed by the Chicago White Sox as an amateur free agent in 1994.

We also got a damn good player in Iguchi from Japan in case you've forgotten. Shingo was only good for one season but the Sox also recruited him from Japan. I think you are being overly pessimistic.

Edited March 13, 2006 by SSH2005

[Flash Tizzle]

How do you think we got guys like Magglio Ordonez and Carlos Lee? 

 

Maggio Ordonez

Carlos Lee

We also got a damn good player in Iguchi from Japan in case you've forgotten.  Shingo was only good for one season but the Sox also recruited him from Japan.  I think you are being overly pessimistic.

Cmon, Jabs. Those signings took place respectively 15 and 12 years ago. What's been going on since? Those foreign scouts have had one hell of slump.

 

Iguchi was recruited by Williams from a video tape. Shingo, I believe, was recruited through the same method.

 

Although I am pessimistic, I'm tired of the crap. Our hitters are fine, but there's no above average player. Nothing to be critical about. If we're merely producing Aaron Rowand clones there's still a wide market for a good defensive outfielder capable of consistently hitting .280. It's our pitching which disgusts me. Maybe Brandon McCarthy is the baseball Gods gift for the years of sucktitude we've produced. His way of suggesting, "here's your ace--now prepare for soft tossing t-ball stands the next 6 years."

[DBAHO]

The Sox have been improving their scouting in the Dominican Republic over the past couple of seasons. That's how they got Salvador Sanchez (the prospect who Phil Rogers compared to Juan Gonzalez). They also got Anderson Gomes from Japan, which was one out of the blue.

 

The Dodgers got so many good prospects from that region like Joel Guzman that finally other teams like ours are beginning to take notice.

 

If we're going to sucessful as a ballclub in the long - term, we will always need to keep building up the farm system as much as we can, whether they play for us one day or whether they're traded for talent that is ready now is a question for KW to decide.

 

But we're not going to have a lot of high draft picks either which isn't going to help. Hence the need to keep improving the international scouting system. Hell send a guy out down here, the Padres, Red Sox, Mariners and Twins have a mortgage on the talent down here.

 

It's our pitching which disgusts me.

If we still had Gio Gonzalez and Dan Haigwood, I'm sure most teams would like to have the pitching we have in the minors. Tyler Lumsden will be back from injury, and a lot of people think he could be the best lefty in our system when healthy. Ray Liotta's down well at every stop, Broadway can finally show what he can do this season without being tired etc., there's still some good talent down there.