Guillen questions Jenks' regimen

[DBAHO]

I don't have much of a problem with Logan and/or Lopez.  Both would only be used as LOOGY's and face a few lefties per outing and they actually appear to throw strikes.

But is Ozzie actually going to use them as LOOGY's, or even much at all?

 

Of course if we actually signed Mike Myers, we wouldn't be having this discussion at all probably.

 

But the Thornton thing is almost like the Neal Cotts situation all over again. He's not going to put up good numbers straight away, and I think people realize that. But hopefully, once they key in on what he's doing wrong and what he needs to work on, he can turn it around, like Cotts did (who's our best reliever right now).

[SSH2005]

But is Ozzie actually going to use them as LOOGY's, or even much at all?

 

Of course if we actually signed Mike Myers, we wouldn't be having this discussion at all probably.

 

But the Thornton thing is almost like the Neal Cotts situation all over again. He's not going to put up good numbers straight away, and I think people realize that. But hopefully, once they key in on what he's doing wrong and what he needs to work on, he can turn it around, like Cotts did (who's our best reliever right now).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think so. Ozzie loves the lefty-lefty matchup. He used Marte the same way last season and even did it with Cotts a bit before he let him face both lefties and righties. I think KW and Ozzie view Logan as our true LOOGY and Thornton as a long reliever / mop-up guy to replace Vizcaino. The problem is that even Vizcaino saw some important innings last year so Thornton likely will see a few this season as well.

[Steff]

should have called out the fat boy's conditioning a month ago -- and done something about it.

 

 

 

He did make comments about his bad habits. Old news..

[Steff]

But Jphat told me that Jenks wasn't fat....he just came in with more muscle, and that no one should be worried about him?

 

 

No way jose!! He's a big fat beast. And he sweats like a spring rainy day.

[Dick Allen]

Jenks may have added more muscle, but he also added more fat. Also if he was lifting weights not using a program the White Sox would give to him, that would be stupid. I don't care what the televison speed gun shows, I was at Wednesday's game and I saw the guns in TEP. He basically was throwing 91, he did hit 93 once, he also was at 89 a couple of times. It shouldn't surprise anyone that Bobby was irresponsible this offseason. Its one reason I advocated the Sox going after a closer this past November and making Jenks a set-up. Bobby's gut is HUGE.

[SSH2005]

Jenks may have added more muscle, but he also added more fat. Also if he was lifting weights not using a program the White Sox would give to him, that would be stupid. I don't care what the televison speed gun shows, I was at Wednesday's game and I saw the guns in TEP. He basically was throwing 91, he did hit 93 once, he also was at 89 a couple of times. It shouldn't surprise anyone that Bobby was irresponsible this offseason. Its one reason I advocated the Sox going after a closer this past November  and making Jenks a set-up. Bobby's gut is HUGE.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I guess that makes more sense. If Jenks was actually hitting 95 like the television speed gun shows, he probably wouldn't be getting rocked so hard.

[jphat007]

Jenks may have added more muscle, but he also added more fat. Also if he was lifting weights not using a program the White Sox would give to him, that would be stupid. I don't care what the televison speed gun shows, I was at Wednesday's game and I saw the guns in TEP. He basically was throwing 91, he did hit 93 once, he also was at 89 a couple of times. It shouldn't surprise anyone that Bobby was irresponsible this offseason. Its one reason I advocated the Sox going after a closer this past November  and making Jenks a set-up. Bobby's gut is HUGE.

 

Opponents are batting .321 this spring against Jenks, who has walked eight and struck out two in eight innings. His fastball was clocked at 94 m.p.h., according to a veteran American League scout.

 

Chicagosports

 

While the decline in velocity of Jenks' fastball was highly exaggerated this spring, the location of his fastball is a concern. Bullpen coach Art Kusnyer said Jenks has been consistently at 94 mph.

 

"You can't just take off all winter and come in thinking you're going to throw 100,'' Kusnyer said. "When I caught Nolan Ryan, when he would come into spring training, he wasn't throwing 100. And that's when he was a legitimate 100. He'd start off 95 to 96, but by the end of spring -- there it is. Bobby is not far off.''

 

SunTimes

 

Who to believe? THis is a tough one......

[SSH2005]

Who to believe? THis is a tough one......

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Both Dick Allen and Art Kusnyer are to be believed. Jenks could have been hitting 94 MPH in his other outings but he may not have been hitting 94 MPH at the game Dick Allen went to. Dick Allen is just telling us what he saw Jenks throwing at the game he went to. I don't see the need to call him out.

Edited March 24, 2006 by SSH2005

[Steff]

Both Dick Allen and Art Kusnyer are to be believed.  Jenks could have been hitting 94 MPH in his other outings but he may not have been hitting 94 MPH at the game Dick Allen went to.  I don't see the need to call him out.

 

 

He didn't break 92 the 2 games I saw him pitch in.

 

Your stupid if you believe everything that comes from the company men. These are the same folks that said that Hermy was fine... :rolly

[jphat007]

He didn't break 92 the 2 games I saw him pitch in.

 

Your stupid if you believe everything that comes from the company men. These are the same folks that said that Hermy was fine...  :rolly

 

What reason do they have to lie? People will know come opening day. And it could have been 92 when you were there. Was it early in the spring?

 

And a scout from another team isn't spouting the company line.

[SSH2005]

He didn't break 92 the 2 games I saw him pitch in.

 

Your stupid if you believe everything that comes from the company men. These are the same folks that said that Hermy was fine...  :rolly

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, I definately don't believe everything I read in the paper but I could see Jenks hitting 94 MPH once or so and then not hitting it again and mostly working at 92 MPH. Trust me, I'm no homer.

 

And good point about Hermanson. He was supposed to be ready for this season. :rolly

[jphat007]

Both Dick Allen and Art Kusnyer are to be believed.  Jenks could have been hitting 94 MPH in his other outings but he may not have been hitting 94 MPH at the game Dick Allen went to.  Dick Allen is just telling us what he saw Jenks throwing at the game he went to.  I don't see the need to call him out.

 

My point is we have three different sources saying it was around 94 when we saw it on TV and Dick Allen saying it wasn't. Just wanted to let everybody see all the sources so they wouldn't take Allen's post as the absolute truth.

[SSH2005]

What reason do they have to lie? People will know come opening day. And it could have been 92 when you were there. Was it early in the spring?

 

And a scout from another team isn't spouting the company line.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you really need an answer to that? Just look at the team up north. They have been lying about their injuries for years. Wood, Prior, etc. They are always supposed to be healthy to start the season and then end up missing a month or so to start the season.

 

My point is we have three different sources saying it was around 94 when we saw it on TV and Dick Allen saying it wasn't. Just wanted to let everybody see all the sources so they wouldn't take Allen's post as the absolute truth.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

TV gun readings are absolute s***.

Edited March 24, 2006 by SSH2005

[jphat007]

Do you really need an answer to that?  Just look at the team up north.  They have been lying about their injuries for years.  Wood, Prior, etc.  They are always supposed to be healthy to start the season and then end up missing a month or so to start the season.

TV guns are absolute s***.

 

What does that have to do with the White Sox? Guillen doesn't lie and he's said that he isn't worried about his velocity, and just wants him to throw more strikes.

 

This isn't football where you don't want the opponents to knwo about injuries. YOu don't gameplan baseball.

[Steff]

What reason do they have to lie? People will know come opening day. And it could have been 92 when you were there. Was it early in the spring?

 

And a scout from another team isn't spouting the company line.

 

 

 

I love this place..

[jphat007]

I love this place.. 

 

Good point.....

 

And were you there early in the spring or middle of the spring? That would tell a lot about where his velocity was at the time. And you didn't really answer any of my questions for that matter.

Edited March 24, 2006 by jphat007

[SSH2005]

What does that have to do with the White Sox? Guillen doesn't lie and he's said that he isn't worried about his velocity, and just wants him to throw more strikes.

 

This isn't football where you don't want the opponents to knwo about injuries. YOu don't gameplan baseball.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Guillen doesn't lie? And you know this how? Who is he... Mother Teresa?

 

I remember Ozzie saying during the offseason before Marte was traded that the Sox were going to count on him as our second lefty out of the bullpen. Do you really think that Ozzie didn't know that Marte was going to be traded? He probably lied about it to up Marte's trade value a bit.

[Steff]

Guillen doesn't lie?  And you know this how?  Who is he...  Mother Teresa?

 

I remember Ozzie saying during the offseason before Marte was traded that the Sox were going to count on him as our second lefty out of the bullpen.  Do you really think that Ozzie didn't know that Marte was going to be traded?  He probably lied about it to up Marte's trade value a bit.

 

 

 

Seriously... what's the point?

 

 

:banghead :banghead :banghead

[jphat007]

Guillen doesn't lie?  And you know this how?  Who is he...  Mother Teresa?

 

I remember Ozzie saying during the offseason before Marte was traded that the Sox were going to count on him as our second lefty out of the bullpen.  Do you really think that Ozzie didn't know that Marte was going to be traded?  He probably lied about it to up Marte's trade value a bit.

 

LOL. Those are two completely different situations. Ozzie is about as up front as you get in sports. I'm not saying you have to believe any of this. I was just throwing out the three sources that said he was hitting 94 consistently. Many others have said it too. But don't believe them. I don't care. It doesn't mean I won't post them to give people the option to read them.

[jphat007]

Seriously... what's the point? 

:banghead  :banghead  :banghead 

 

How come you won't discuss the situations. YOu just keep putting up smilies in the place of substance. Were you there at the beginning or end of spring?

 

I know people in the business aren't all that reliable/honest but almost everywhere we have seen that Jenks is hitting 94 consistently except for the Rocky Mountain news, whose story was debunked, and a couple of people on this message board. So who would you advise we go with?

[Chisoxrd5]

LOL. Those are two completely different situations. Ozzie is about as up front as you get in sports. I'm not saying you have to believe any of this. I was just throwing out the three sources that said he was hitting 94 consistently. Many others have said it too. But don't believe them. I don't care. It doesn't mean I won't post them to give people the option to read them.

 

What exactly is the big difference between 92 and 94mph??????

 

Either way his velocity is down and he is as big as a house.

[Steff]

How come you won't discuss the situations. YOu just keep putting up smilies in the place of substance. Were you there at the beginning or end of spring?

 

I know people in the business aren't all that reliable/honest but almost everywhere we have seen that Jenks is hitting 94 consistently except for the Rocky Mountain news, whose story was debunked, and a couple of people on this message board. So who would you advise we go with?

 

 

What's the point of discussing it? You have one opinion, others have another. And all you seem to want to do is argue like a f***ing 2 year old. STFU and move on.

[SSH2005]

What exactly is the big difference between 92 and 94mph??????

 

Either way his velocity is down and he is as big as a house.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And even more troublesome -- he can't find the strike zone to save his life.

[Guest JimH]

In today's paper Guillen says he loves Ross Gload, having someone like Gload on the bench makes the White Sox a better team, etc. - but then we have SoxTalk people insisting Guillen has a grudge against Gload.

 

Hmmm, who to believe?

 

Guillen is a lot more honest and forthcoming with information about his players than any manager I've seen. He is clearly concerned about Jenks, he's pulled him aside twice for a heart-to-heart talk. It's now up to Jenks to respond. On the velocity situation, Jenks hasn't been totally cutting loose, he's focusing on what they want him to do, which is throw strikes.

 

What all of this tells me is, Jenks will get a lot of work this next week, both on and off the field. If he's not ready to go 100% then we'll see Cotts get more early season chances to close games, which is not a bad thing.

[Steff]

Good point.....

 

And were you there early in the spring or middle of the spring? That would tell a lot about where his velocity was at the time. And you didn't really answer any of my questions for that matter.

 

 

I was there 3/8 to 3/15.

 

 

Ask some questions rather then attempting to argue over news articles and I'll give you some responses.