A Deeper Look: What Should Kenny Do?

[Chisoxfn]

A Deeper Look: What Should Kenny Do?

By: Jason Gage

June 1, 2003

SoxNet.net

 

Lets be honest, who expected the White Sox to be 6.5 games out of first place with a 25-29 record? This team was a team expected to contend for the playoffs and in my mind the World Series.

 

Obviously, I, and many others, misjudged this team. During the off-season Ken Williams acquired Bartolo Colon, Billy Koch, Tom Gordon, Rick White and Esteban Loaiza to bolster the pitching staff. This is what was considered the big weakness with last year’s team. With a newly vamped pitching staff and what was a great offense in years past the Sox expected to dominate and as we can see, that’s not the case. It isn’t the pitching that’s failed, although Rick White and his 9.47 ERA is the exception.

 

The two huge problems with the Sox have been the hitting, where everyone other then D’Angelo Jimenez has been a disappointment, and the defense – rated eighth in the American League.

 

The question management and Sox fans should be asking is what should this team do. To me there are three options: you could go with another White Flag deal, retool – meaning move one or two players, or acquire an additional player to improve the team, or stay put. The answer is rather simple in my mind and that’s to have another White Flag.

 

While I think the ability is there, rotation wise, I realize that this offense/defense isn’t build with the right mix of players. With Konerko, Valentin and Thomas clogging the middle of the lineup and showing little to no ability to pitch in defensively, it leaves a great void.

 

Since Konerko and Thomas are tough to move due to their large salaries and poor play, the Sox are going to have to find a way to get new talent in and make this a much more balanced attack. We know Reinsdorf isn’t going to go the free agent route and just pour money at the problem and I can’t blame him for that. Plus going the free agent route solves nothing in regards to this season.

 

To me the White Flag trade is the way to acquire the talent, lower the payroll (something Reinsdorf is going to want to do; especially when you have Valentin, Colon and Carlos Lee hitting the open market). The big question is how will the Sox go about solving their problems. Sadly, I’d like to see two of the big three of the rotation go (Loaiza, and Colon).

 

Personally I feel that Loaiza is one of the most valuable trading commodities in the majors because of his great numbers and affordable contract (3.5 mill option for next year). For this reason people could call me nuts to trade him, but the amount of talent we could get far exceeds his worth to a team, that in my mind is only getting worse and wouldn’t be contending anyway next year. If the Sox plan to spend the money and contend next year, I’d have a different solution.

 

Now lets get to the fun stuff - the trades.

 

The Trade: Sox Deal Esteban Loaiza, centerfield Aaron Rowand, and Kelly Wunsch to the Angels in exchange for Alfredo Almazega (SS), Bobby Jenks (SP) and Earvin Santana (SP).

Why: The Angels do this because they have a huge hole in the rotation. John Lackey and Ramon Ortiz have been a shadow of what they did last season, while Kevin Appier and Aaron Sele (both due big bucks) have been disappointing, especially this year. They also have a hole in the outfield where Erstad is missing. There have been talks about adding Beltran, but the offense isn’t really the Angels problem and they can’t really add Beltran’s contract financially. This move would make sense cause it gives them a quality backup outfielder and a starting pitcher that could step in and be their ace without costing much money.

 

The White Sox do this deal because of what they get in return. Its no secret that the Angels have a very talented minor league system, thanks to new General Manager Bill Stoneman, former GM Bill Bavasi and now White Sox minor league director Bob Fontaine Jr. The Sox would fill an immediate need with shortstop Alfredo Almazega. Almazega is a 25-year-old switch-hitter that was rated by Texas League managers as the best defensive SS, best base runner and most exciting player in their circuit. Currently he has a .352 AVG with 14 walks and 25 strikeouts. He isn’t known as an offensive wiz, although the ability is there. He is older then a typical prospect, but the talent is there and he is ready to contribute.

 

In Jenks and Santana that Sox get two guys that have some of the best talent in the entire minors. Jenks has been known to hit 100 MPH and possesses a knee-buckling curve. The big question with him, like most power pitchers, is his control as he’s walked 19 in 23 innings of work this year. When scouts talk about Jenks, comparisons to Roger Clemens come up because of his “rocket” arm and great curveball. Jenks, 22, is also working on a changeup. He is currently in AA and the sky is the limit with him. In the Arizona Fall league he started utilizing a sinker much more and had immediate success. Jenks would be the top guy in most organizations, but he’s had a few issues in the past and seems to have gotten over them. Either way, he is the type of guy that could come in and make an immediate impact.

 

Santana is a 19-year-old pitcher that is currently in high-A. He is a young foreign-born player that is still filling out. He already possesses a 93 MPH fastball and everyone believes it should reach the mid 90’s as he develops. Unlike most youngsters he has very good control as he showed off a 3:1 K/BB ratio last season (His first full season). Thus far this season he’s 4-1 with a 2.58 ERA and has struck out 72 in 69 innings of work walking just 20. He’s prime for a promotion and him and Jenks would provide a great influx of starting talent with the Sox.

 

The only concern in this trade is the Sox only get one guy for immediate help. The other question is will the Angels be willing to give up these two young and talented players. I think they are willing, mainly because they have quite a few other pitchers that are exceptionally well and closer to the show. The only thing with them is none of them have the upside of these two kids.

 

The Trade: Sox trade Bartolo Colon and Flash Gordon to the Giants for Jerome Williams (RHP), Boof Bonser (RHP) and one from a list of: Jesse Foppert (RHP), Kurt Ainsworth (RHP) and Ryan Hannaman (LHP).

Why: This would be a tough deal for GM Brian Sabean to make. He has some great prospects in the minors, but with the opportunity to win the series he’ll be willing to part with a few prospects (maybe not three like I’m requesting, but at least two of them) and he’s shown this willingness in the past. Colon would immediately bolster the rotation with him, Schmidt, Kirk Rueter and Damian Moss and one of their youngsters (Most likely Ainsworth). Flash would then enter the bullpen as a potential closer if Worrell falters in replacement of the injured Rob Nenn. With this trade the Giants would be able to feel much more comfortable in the race with the Dodgers and still wouldn’t be mortgaging the future as they could afford to bring Colon back in at a reasonable price while Flash makes basically nothing.

 

Its simple why the Sox do this deal … the pitching. While I know they already would of acquired two great arms in Jenks and Santana, those are arms that aren’t ready for the show. Both Williams, Bonser are ready for the majors, while Foppert and Ainsworth are already in the majors; Hannaman is a work in progress, but a lefty.

 

Bonser, 21, is pitching in AA but is ready for a promotion and could easily make the jump to the majors. He features a mid-90s fastball, a great curve and a good changeup. Control is definitely an issue with him, but he has the size, stamina and stuff to be a front-end pitcher. Thus far he is 2-4 with a 3.16 ERA. He’s pitched 57 innings giving up just 43 hits, striking out 42 while walking 28.

 

Williams, 21, has already been on the major league roster this season. Currently he’s in AAA where he’s dominating. He has a 2.52 ERA in 50 innings of work giving up 47 hits while walking 16. Williams not only possesses a mid-90s fastball (anyone starting to notice a trend in the guys I like) but he also has a plus curve, slider and changeup. At 21 he is extremely young, yet so major league ready.

 

Of the other list, two are ready for the majors. Ainsworth is starting for them right now and doing very well while Foppert has been up and down thus far this season. The key to this deal would be getting the first two guys, but I’d try to work on acquiring another pitcher or position player if possible. If the Giants didn’t want to give up one of the first do, then the Giants would have to include Foppert or Ainsworth. Hannaman is a lefty who was in A ball last season.

 

The Trade: Sox trade Jose Valentin and Billy Koch to the Cardinals for J.D. Drew

Why: The Cardinals make this trade because it gives them a much deeper bullpen. The Cardinals would be interested in Buehrle, but the fact is the Cards just don’t have what it takes to get him. Instead they settle for Billy Koch, who can combine with Izzy (once healthy) to give St. Louis a formidable bullpen. Valentin, part of his salary paid for by the Sox, would fill in for the injured Fernando Vina. Once Vina comes back, Jose would fit in as the perfect utility player, and La Russa is known to like having those type of players.

 

The Sox do this because they are able to dump salary while picking up a stud outfielder. Drew hasn’t lived up to his hype and there is risk involved, but he can come in and provide the Sox with a rather young, talented player who should only get better. Plus he’ll provide a left-handed stick near the top of the revamped lineup.

 

The Trade: Padres trade Phil Nevin to the White Sox for Paul Konerko and a PTBNL

Why: The Padres make this trade because Nevin is out for the year and most feel he will be gone. He is owed money just like Konerko, but Konerko is a much younger player and would fit in better with the Padres down the line.

 

The Sox do this because Nevin, unlike Konerko, is a much more versatile player. He can play third, left, and first or DH which gives the Sox plenty of options. The Sox would only hope that Nevin makes it back, but either way he is nowhere near as slow as Konerko and gets on base.

 

The Untradeable One: Frank Thomas

Why: No team will be willing to pick up his contract, which guarantees him $22.5 million, unless he starts hitting. At times Thomas has shown signs of waking up, and even though he’s struggling, he still is hitting for homers and has one of the better OBPs. The big thing is, Frank can no longer continue hitting in the 3-hole where he is too much of a liability.

 

The Aftermath

 

2B – D’Angelo Jimenez

1B – Carlos Lee

LF – JD Drew

RF – Magglio Ordonez

DH – Frank Thomas

CF – Joe Borchard

3B – Joe Crede

C – Miguel Olivo

SS – Alfredo Almazega

 

Bench: Brian Daubach, Aaron Miles, Armando Rios, Tony Graffanino, Sandy Alomar Jr.

 

Rotation

Mark Buehrle

Jon Garland

Danny Wright

Jerome Williams

Jon Rauch

 

Bullpen

Damaso Marte – closer

Royce Ring

Arnie Munoz

Gary Glover

Edwin Almonte

Dave Sanders

 

The White Sox fire manager Jerry Manuel and hire Wally Backman. Backman takes over the club with around half a season left to play. The Sox can use this six-month period to evaluate the current team and all the newcomers. You can definitely see some weaknesses in the fact that this team would be extremely young and that the bullpen would definitely have some flaws early one, but I say this team would solve many problems of the current regime.

 

First off, the defense would no longer be suspect. Magglio Ordonez is an average to above average rightfielder. Joe Borchard is an average to above average centerfielder while JD Drew (who would occasionally DH to rest his knee) is an above average leftfielder. We already know that Crede is great defensively, while Almazenga has great range, a strong arm, and great fundamentals. Jimenez is average while Carlos Lee should be an average first baseman and could be better then that while we have the human gun, Miguel Olivo behind the plate. Folks, there is no position where you could say we have a really bad fielder and that will be really helpful to the young pitching staff.

 

This is a pitching staff that has a guy that won 19 games a season ago, and two guys that are right on the brink of turning into real gems. Then you have two others that have all the potential to be aces.

 

In the off-season the general manager would have to fill a few voids via free agency, but the team wouldn’t be in need of a star and would have plenty of flexibility to sign both Buehrle and Ordonez to long-term deals. I’d expect them to sign two veteran relievers as well as some veterans to come off the bench. I’m a firm believer in having a couple veterans in the pen who are proven and comfortable, and I think the bench is a place for veterans. Look at the winning teams and their benches are full of vets that have bounced from place to place, but flat out get things done in limited time.

 

This team wouldn’t be expected to win right away, although it could – considering the division - but it is one that could contend next year, especially considering the additions that would be made via free agency. Well that’s my plan. Let me also say that I wouldn’t make these moves until mid-June, giving the Sox plenty of time to show whether this team could contend.

 

Note: Typically A Deeper Look contains in depth analysis of an individual player, but in this case I felt it would be best to analyze what I would do as the general manager to solve the team. My next installment will go in-depth on the problems with the Sox. If you have any suggestions please email me at [email protected]

[Cerbaho-WG]

With the success of the last two drafts, I'd mainly just let everyone walk after the season and receive a ton of Type A comp picks. You'd be getting, I believe Jose, Colon, and C Lee. That's seven first round picks for next years draft.

[Soxfest]

Kw can go :fyou

[method]

With the success of the last two drafts, I'd mainly just let everyone walk after the season and receive a ton of Type A comp picks. You'd be getting, I believe Jose, Colon, and C Lee. That's seven first round picks for next years draft.

Thats a pretty good plan... esp with Jose. Think we might be able to get better for colon at the deadline...

[method]

A Deeper Look: What Should Kenny Do?

 

Resign.

[clujer420]

Resign.

Don't worry, he's going to -- any moment.

[Heads22]

Jas has already named me his stat b**** for when he is named GM. Those minor league stats suck. Jas knows what I'm talking about....

[Chisoxfn]

Cerb, to me the problem with comp picks is you don't get anywhere near the amount of talent that you do in those trades. I also think it is key to get talent that is ready to help the team.

 

If you go via the draft, you get guys that don't make the majors for 3 years and plenty that won't make it. I'm not saying all the guys in the trade make it, but everyone of those guys are top 5 prospects on their respective teams with the exception of Almazega and he was a top 5 prospect last year; But now that he's a year older he fell.

[SI1020]

Resign.

Either that or go on a long term scouting assignment in the Amazon Basin.

[whitesox61382]

I am a huge fan of Loaiza with the way that he has pitched so far, but just like a stock you want to sell high and I don't think Loaiza's value could get any higher then what it is right now. I think it is inevitable that his numbers will fall some as the season goes on. Not even the best pitchers in the game can keep up an ERA under 2. The question is how much will it fall off. Will he be able to maintain a solid ERA in the 3's or is he going to revert back to his old ways with an ERA in the high 4's? So I think in the near future is a perfect time to trade him and get the most value for him. I woundn't be upset if the Sox lost Wunsch. One thing the Sox seem to have a lot of in the minors is solid lefty relievers, so trading Wunsch is doable and might net something good in return seeing as how good lefty relievers are like gold. Rowand is heading for a career as a 4th outfielder. I think his injury this offseason might affect him for the rest of his career. With that said I don't think Anaheim will give up that much for Loaiza, Wunsch, and Rowand. I am sure that they are aware that Loaiza might slip a little as the season goes on and giving up 3 top prospects for a career bottom of the rotation starter(although it appears that he is taking a step in the right direction), a solid lefty reliever, and a 4th outfielder seems like a little much. I do think Anaheim is a team that would be interested in Loaiza, Wunsch, and Rowand, especially considering that all are cheap. I would take 2 of the 3 purposed prospects and be happy. For example Allmazega and Santana is something that Anaheim will probably do. The Sox get their SS of the future and a very talented young pitcher(I love the fact that he is only 19 and could be promoted to AA). Jenks has great stuff but his future is probably in the pen as a closer, so I think Santana has a little more value(I am also a fan of good control in prospects as well). This is a deal that I would do, maybe even have Anaheim throw in another decent but not great prospect. That seems like a fair deal that helps both teams. Who would have thought that Loaiza would help the Sox this much and possible land them 2 or 3 solid prospects? Nice pick up KW.

 

I would love to see the Sox keep Colon and sign him long term. Quality front of the rotation starters that eat innings and save your bullpen are rare. With that said if the Sox have no intention of resigning him, than the you may as well trade him and get a couple of solid prospects back in return. How does the draft pick compensation stuff work? I like Gordon and think he will be a key set up man from the right side if the Sox are going to make a run. However, if the Sox are out of contention, than he is a perfect guy to trade at 35 and signed to a 1 year deal. I think the Giants would be more then interested in Colon and Gordon to make a stretch run. The question is whether they want to add that much payroll. I don't think you are going to get 2 out of the Giants big 3 pitching prospects(Williams and Bonser) and possible the 3rd(Foppert). I think the Sox would be lucky to get 1 of the big 3 and 2 other decent prospects for Colon and Gordon. There will be some good interest in Colon at the deadline as teams look to add quality front of the rotations starters at the deadline. I think the Sox should be able to get the equivalent of what they gave up to get Colon in return as far as talent is related. I just dont think the Giants will give up 2 or more of their top pitching prospects, especially if they don't feel like they have a good shot of resigning Colon.

 

I would love to get rid of Valentin and get something in return. I think you will have to package him with a good player like Koch to get something of value in return. I don't know if the Cardinals would give up Drew for Valentin and Koch even though they have a need for a closer and middle infielder with Izzy and Vina hurt. The Cardinals would be dealing from their strength(offense) and getting some needs so they might be interested. That would be a very good trade for the Sox if it went through. I don't understand the lovefest that Sox fans have for Drew though? On the ESPN board many Sox fans mentioned Drew as someone they wanted to trade for. He has good potential, but hasn't reached that potential and has had some injury problems as well. Still I think it would be a good trade for the Sox.

 

Getting Nevin for Konerko and another player is interesting. I really think the Sox need to get rid of Konerko. He is one dimensional, and by that I mean he does nothing else average or better besides hit for average and power. When he isn't doing either he really hurts this team and these are the type of players that the Sox need to get rid of. They need players with more tools so if they aren't hitting well they can do other things to help this team(ie draw walks, steal bases, or play exceptional defense). I think the Sox should wait until Konerko heats up a little before trading him so his value is a little higher. What is the story with Nevin? Is he suppose to be back any time this season? He has developed into a really solid hitter and I like the idea of possible getting him. I think it would take at least Konerko and another good prospect to get him though.

 

I wish the Sox could somehow get out of Thomas's contract. He just isn't the same player that he use to be and at 35 isn't a key part to the future. I love what he has done for this organization, but you have to know when to cut ties and move on.

 

I like the general idea of your trades if they went through. The Sox would really stock pile some top pitching prospects, and I am a firm believer that you can never have enough pitching. The outfield D still scares me with none of them being above average at their position. They aren't going to cover much ground either. I would love to see the Sox get a true CF like Beltran(although I doubt it will have for financial reasons). Still some solid ideas and a lot of good work and research put into the article. Lets hope the Sox can rebound and go on a winning streak or start to trade veterans for prospects. I still think there is a solid young core to build around and the Sox can retool more than rebuild. I think the Sox can add by substracting deadweight/one dimension players like Thomas, Valentin, and Konerko. I also think they need to release White ASAP and call up Ginter(who has been very hot at AAA over the past couple of weeks).

[aboz56]

Good article Jason, keep up the good work, I enjoy reading it.

[Mr. Showtime]

Read bits and pieces of it, not a fan of trade ideas though. Just to many what if's for me. Good article though.

[Cerbaho-WG]

The sox don't need any more pitching prospects at all, the entire system is just pitching prospects. The main focus of these trades would be to get the following:

 

A catcher - absolutely barren at the position

1B - Only viable prospect is Rogowski, and he is iffy. Drag Kotchman out of Anaheim.

2B - Pedro Lopez? Ruddy Yan looks good, but it would be essential to get some insurance.

SS - Andy Gonzalez? To be honest, I was never blown away by him. His numbers were iffy, and he's been almost awful at kannapolis. Lots of upside, but eh.

3B - Schnurstein, and that's it. I'd try and swing a trade for an Andy Marte or someone to solidify the position.

OF - Webster, Reed, Brice? Anyone!

[whitesox61382]

The sox don't need any more pitching prospects at all, the entire system is just pitching prospects. The main focus of these trades would be to get the following:

 

A catcher - absolutely barren at the position

1B - Only viable prospect is Rogowski, and he is iffy. Drag Kotchman out of Anaheim.

2B - Pedro Lopez? Ruddy Yan looks good, but it would be essential to get some insurance.

SS - Andy Gonzalez? To be honest, I was never blown away by him. His numbers were iffy, and he's been almost awful at kannapolis. Lots of upside, but eh.

3B - Schnurstein, and that's it. I'd try and swing a trade for an Andy Marte or someone to solidify the position.

OF - Webster, Reed, Brice? Anyone!

You can always use more pitching prospects and take that to the bank. The Sox may have a lot of pitching prospects, but they don't have a lot of top/front of the rotation pitching prospects. Cotts, Rauch, and Honel are really the only guys that have front of the rotation potential, but from all of the scouting reports and minor league reports that I have read none of these guys have lights out stuff. They have good enough stuff that if they learn how to pitch they can become solid front of the rotation starters, but their stuff alone wont care them. You point at the lack of position prospects, and yes there are some weaknesses in the minors, but the same could be said with the pitching(at least the starters). Also keep in mind that a majority of the major league positions are currently being held by guys under 28(C, 1B, 2B, 3B, LF, CF, and RF). The Sox on the other hand have 2/5ths of the current rotation that could be gone by the start of next season, and have failed to develop any young pitchers that have proven to be consistant middle of the rotation starters at the least. So yes pitching prospects are needed and are always welcomed even if you have a lot of depth at that position. I hate to say this, but look at the Cubs, they are getting by with great starting pitching alone. Look at the majority of playoff teams and you will see they have one consistant simialrity, good pitching. Why did the Tribe never win the WS with their great teams in the 90's? Not enough pitching. The Sox have had a great offense the past couple of years and where has it gotten them? Texas and Cinncinati have similar problem. Great offenses and little pitching. Pitching is the sole reason that the A's compete every year although they are straped by financial limitations. Even the oldest saying in the book is pitching wins championships. Can you honestly look me in the eye and say that you think the Sox pitching is some of the best in the league and has no room for improvement, especially if they lose Colon and Loaiza before the start of next year? Didn't think so. The Sox should also look into getting catching, 1B, SS, and 3B prospects because they are weak at those positions in the minors, but top pitching prospects are always welcomed.

[witesoxfan]

The sox don't need any more pitching prospects at all, the entire system is just pitching prospects. The main focus of these trades would be to get the following:

 

A catcher - absolutely barren at the position

1B - Only viable prospect is Rogowski, and he is iffy. Drag Kotchman out of Anaheim.

2B - Pedro Lopez? Ruddy Yan looks good, but it would be essential to get some insurance.

SS - Andy Gonzalez? To be honest, I was never blown away by him. His numbers were iffy, and he's been almost awful at kannapolis. Lots of upside, but eh.

3B - Schnurstein, and that's it. I'd try and swing a trade for an Andy Marte or someone to solidify the position.

OF - Webster, Reed, Brice? Anyone!

You can always use more pitching prospects and take that to the bank. The Sox may have a lot of pitching prospects, but they don't have a lot of top/front of the rotation pitching prospects. Cotts, Rauch, and Honel are really the only guys that have front of the rotation potential, but from all of the scouting reports and minor league reports that I have read none of these guys have lights out stuff. They have good enough stuff that if they learn how to pitch they can become solid front of the rotation starters, but their stuff alone wont care them. You point at the lack of position prospects, and yes there are some weaknesses in the minors, but the same could be said with the pitching(at least the starters). Also keep in mind that a majority of the major league positions are currently being held by guys under 28(C, 1B, 2B, 3B, LF, CF, and RF). The Sox on the other hand have 2/5ths of the current rotation that could be gone by the start of next season, and have failed to develop any young pitchers that have proven to be consistant middle of the rotation starters at the least. So yes pitching prospects are needed and are always welcomed even if you have a lot of depth at that position. I hate to say this, but look at the Cubs, they are getting by with great starting pitching alone. Look at the majority of playoff teams and you will see they have one consistant simialrity, good pitching. Why did the Tribe never win the WS with their great teams in the 90's? Not enough pitching. The Sox have had a great offense the past couple of years and where has it gotten them? Texas and Cinncinati have similar problem. Great offenses and little pitching. Pitching is the sole reason that the A's compete every year although they are straped by financial limitations. Even the oldest saying in the book is pitching wins championships. Can you honestly look me in the eye and say that you think the Sox pitching is some of the best in the league and has no room for improvement, especially if they lose Colon and Loaiza before the start of next year? Didn't think so. The Sox should also look into getting catching, 1B, SS, and 3B prospects because they are weak at those positions in the minors, but top pitching prospects are always welcomed.

Great post 61382....just something I'd like to add

 

As a pitcher....knowing how to use their stuff is vital to a developing pitcher. I look at Lorenzo Barcelo as an example. Here is a kid that is the gem of the San Francisco farm system in the late 90s, and has lights out stuff....he's probably going to to be a top of the line starter within a few years because of his stuff alone. He then throws out his arm twice, and his career is basically done. He uses his stuff correctly....or in other words, not overthrowing everything....and he might still be pitching(or he might be at the major league level).

 

What I'm trying to point out is that you said Honel, Rauch....who not...do not have great, top of the rotation stuff and that they need to be able to use their stuff very well...and I agree with that. As an exception to the rule there, you just look at Lorenzo Barcelo. The converse in this situation is also true....Lorenzo needed to be able to use his stuff accordingly to get to the top...he didn't, and he is essentially done with baseball as a profession.

[CWSOX45]

The sox don't need any more pitching prospects at all, the entire system is just pitching prospects. The main focus of these trades would be to get the following:

 

A catcher - absolutely barren at the position

1B - Only viable prospect is Rogowski, and he is iffy. Drag Kotchman out of Anaheim.

2B - Pedro Lopez? Ruddy Yan looks good, but it would be essential to get some insurance.

SS - Andy Gonzalez? To be honest, I was never blown away by him. His numbers were iffy, and he's been almost awful at kannapolis. Lots of upside, but eh.

3B - Schnurstein, and that's it. I'd try and swing a trade for an Andy Marte or someone to solidify the position.

OF - Webster, Reed, Brice? Anyone!

There's an outfielder in Kannapolis that looks pretty good so far, his name is Julio Reyes. Don't know much about him.

 

CWSOX45

[Chisoxfn]

Cerb, while I think the Sox got some good pitching, I am a big believer that you can never have too much pitching, like whitesox61382 is.

 

Secondly I think the Sox strength pitching wise, is with their relievers. I believe quite a few of their starters will eventually be converted into relievers. Right now I'd say front end wise: Rauch, Honel, Wing, and Cotts have the possibilities, but I really have questions about all of them. Cotts has control issues; Rauch with health concerns and Honel and Wing are still at very low levels.

 

The Giants guys are freaking studs in my book. While I think they would be giving up a lot, I fully believe Colon is worth your two best pitching prospects and maybe a third. I see what the Indians got for Colon and think the Sox can match it. The Expos couldn't cause they were in a bad position. The Sox can let him walk and grab two or three comp. picks.

 

In regards to first, I don't consider that a huge need because any clobbering hitter can eventually be moved there. First base is a position you don't worry about in my books. You can find them at any time. I think with JImenez at 2nd the Sox are alright, especially considering Yan and Lopez are in the minors.

 

Actually position wise they aren't that bad. I think pitching wise they don't have many of those guys that project as "aces" and with the pitching the Sox have, they could trade two veterans (one that will walk at the end of the season) and rebuild their entire farm system and the rotation. The guys that don't make it can get tossed aside or switched to the pen.

 

whitesox61382; I do tend to agree with you on the Angels and while I love Jenks I think Santana is brilliant. I've heard some say he could be the best prospect in the game in a year or two as he develops more. Jenks is the same type of mold as well. If the Sox couldn't grab two of them and Almazenga I'd ask for Bootcheck or Joe Torres. Neither project to be as good of pitchers as the ones acquired, but both should be solid. Torres was once a stud but he's lost velocity. Still pitches very good though.

 

I really think Loaiza has insane market value because of how cheap he is over not only this year, but next year.

 

One alternative and I have to thank and emailer who read the column for this is making a deal with the Phillies for Bobby Abreu for Billy Koch and someone. They could definately use a closer and have a strong offense. Don't know if they'd trade Abreu though.

[Chisoxfn]

I am a huge fan of Loaiza with the way that he has pitched so far, but just like a stock you want to sell high and I don't think Loaiza's value could get any higher then what it is right now.  I think it is inevitable that his numbers will fall some as the season goes on. Not even the best pitchers in the game can keep up an ERA under 2. The question is how much will it fall off. Will he be able to maintain a solid ERA in the 3's or is he going to revert back to his old ways with an ERA in the high 4's? So I think in the near future is a perfect time to trade him and get the most value for him. I woundn't be upset if the Sox lost Wunsch. One thing the Sox seem to have a lot of in the minors is solid lefty relievers, so trading Wunsch is doable and might net something good in return seeing as how good lefty relievers are like gold. Rowand is heading for a career as a 4th outfielder. I think his injury this offseason might affect him for the rest of his career. With that said I don't think Anaheim will give up that much for Loaiza, Wunsch, and Rowand. I am sure that they are aware that Loaiza might slip a little as the season goes on and giving up 3 top prospects for a career bottom of the rotation starter(although it appears that he is taking a step in the right direction), a solid lefty reliever, and a 4th outfielder seems like a little much. I do think Anaheim is a team that would be interested in Loaiza, Wunsch, and Rowand, especially considering that all are cheap. I would take 2 of the 3 purposed prospects and be happy. For example Allmazega and Santana is something that Anaheim will probably do. The Sox get their SS of the future and a very talented young pitcher(I love the fact that he is only 19 and could be promoted to AA). Jenks has great stuff but his future is probably in the pen as a closer, so I think Santana has a little more value(I am also a fan of good control in prospects as well). This is a deal that I would do, maybe even have Anaheim throw in another decent but not great prospect. That seems like a fair deal that helps both teams. Who would have thought that Loaiza would help the Sox this much and possible land them 2 or 3 solid prospects? Nice pick up KW.

 

I would love to see the Sox keep Colon and sign him long term. Quality front of the rotation starters that eat innings and save your bullpen are rare. With that said if the Sox have no intention of resigning him, than the you may as well trade him and get a couple of solid prospects back in return. How does the draft pick compensation stuff work? I like Gordon and think he will be a key set up man from the right side if the Sox are going to make a run. However, if the Sox are out of contention, than he is a perfect guy to trade at 35 and signed to a 1 year deal. I think the Giants would be more then interested in Colon and Gordon to make a stretch run. The question is whether they want to add that much payroll. I don't think you are going to get 2 out of the Giants big 3 pitching prospects(Williams and Bonser) and possible the 3rd(Foppert). I think the Sox would be lucky to get 1 of the big 3 and 2 other decent prospects for Colon and Gordon. There will be some good interest in Colon at the deadline as teams look to add quality front of the rotations starters at the deadline. I think the Sox should be able to get the equivalent of what they gave up to get Colon in return as far as talent is related. I just dont think the Giants will give up 2 or more of their top pitching prospects, especially if they don't feel like they have a good shot of resigning Colon.

 

I would love to get rid of Valentin and get something in return. I think you will have to package him with a good player like Koch to get something of value in return. I don't know if the Cardinals would give up Drew for Valentin and Koch even though they have a need for a closer and middle infielder with Izzy and Vina hurt. The Cardinals would be dealing from their strength(offense) and getting some needs so they might be interested. That would be a very good trade for the Sox if it went through. I don't understand the lovefest that Sox fans have for Drew though? On the ESPN board many Sox fans mentioned Drew as someone they wanted to trade for. He has good potential, but hasn't reached that potential and has had some injury problems as well. Still I think it would be a good trade for the Sox.

 

Getting Nevin for Konerko and another player is interesting. I really think the Sox need to get rid of Konerko. He is one dimensional, and by that I mean he does nothing else average or better besides hit for average and power. When he isn't doing either he really hurts this team and these are the type of players that the Sox need to get rid of. They need players with more tools so if they aren't hitting well they can do other things to help this team(ie draw walks, steal bases, or play exceptional defense). I think the Sox should wait until Konerko heats up a little before trading him so his value is a little higher. What is the story with Nevin? Is he suppose to be back any time this season? He has developed into a really solid hitter and I like the idea of possible getting him. I think it would take at least Konerko and another good prospect to get him though.

 

I wish the Sox could somehow get out of Thomas's contract. He just isn't the same player that he use to be and at 35 isn't a key part to the future. I love what he has done for this organization, but you have to know when to cut ties and move on.

 

I like the general idea of your trades if they went through. The Sox would really stock pile some top pitching prospects, and I am a firm believer that you can never have enough pitching. The outfield D still scares me with none of them being above average at their position. They aren't going to cover much ground either. I would love to see the Sox get a true CF like Beltran(although I doubt it will have for financial reasons). Still some solid ideas and a lot of good work and research put into the article. Lets hope the Sox can rebound and go on a winning streak or start to trade veterans for prospects. I still think there is a solid young core to build around and the Sox can retool more than rebuild. I think the Sox can add by substracting deadweight/one dimension players like Thomas, Valentin, and Konerko. I also think they need to release White ASAP and call up Ginter(who has been very hot at AAA over the past couple of weeks).

Just wanted to say awesome post. I responded to most of this stuff in the post above this one.

[whitesox61382]

Cerb, while I think the Sox got some good pitching, I am a big believer that you can never have too much pitching, like whitesox61382 is. 

 

Secondly I think the Sox strength pitching wise, is with their relievers.  I believe quite a few of their starters will eventually be converted into relievers.  Right now I'd say front end wise: Rauch, Honel, Wing, and Cotts have the possibilities, but I really have questions about all of them.  Cotts has control issues; Rauch with health concerns and Honel and Wing are still at very low levels. 

 

The  Giants guys are freaking studs in my book.  While I think they would be giving up a lot, I fully believe Colon is worth your two best pitching prospects and maybe a third.  I see what the Indians got for Colon and think the Sox can match it.  The Expos couldn't cause they were in a bad position.  The Sox can let him walk and grab two or three comp. picks. 

 

In regards to first, I don't consider that a huge need because any clobbering hitter can eventually be moved there.  First base is a position you don't worry about in my books.  You can find them at any time.  I think with JImenez at 2nd the Sox are alright, especially considering Yan and Lopez are in the minors. 

 

Actually position wise they aren't that bad.  I think pitching wise they don't have many of those guys that project as "aces" and with the pitching the Sox have, they could trade two veterans (one that will walk at the end of the season) and rebuild their entire farm system and the rotation.  The guys that don't make it can get tossed aside or switched to the pen. 

 

whitesox61382; I do tend to agree with you on the Angels and while I love Jenks I think Santana is brilliant.  I've heard some say he could be the best prospect in the game in a year or two as he develops more.  Jenks is the same type of mold as well.  If the Sox couldn't grab two of them and Almazenga I'd ask for Bootcheck or Joe Torres.  Neither project to be as good of pitchers as the ones acquired, but both should be solid.  Torres was once a stud but he's lost velocity.  Still pitches very good though. 

 

I really think Loaiza has insane market value because of how cheap he is over not only this year, but next year. 

 

One alternative and I have to thank and emailer who read the column for this is making a deal with the Phillies for Bobby Abreu for Billy Koch and someone.  They could definately use a closer and have a strong offense.  Don't know if they'd trade Abreu though.

Refering to the poster that brought up Reyes, he is an interesting offensive prospect. He has always seemed to hit for power where ever he has played. His lack of plate disipline could hurt him in the upper minors. He will never get recognition as a top prospect(unless he has a breakout year), but is a guy to keep an eye on in the upper minors.

 

The Abreu idea is extremely interesting. I would much rather have Abreu than Drew. Talk about impressive consistancy, the guy has put up the following numbers the last 4 years .289+/20+/89+ 35+ 2B 100+ BB 25+ SB .900+ OPS plus he has a very good arm and is a solid corner outfielder defensively. He might be the most underrated offensive player in baseball(in a catogory with Giles and Maggs). These are the type of players that the Sox need to add. Guys that do 4 or 5 of the tools average or better and Abreu certainly does that. Philly is looking for pitching help and has the flexibility to add payroll, although Abreu makes a good amount and would offset most of the salary added. I know that Philly was interested in possible adding Shilling later in the year if the D-Backs were out of the race, so I assume that they want another top of the rotation starter. I would assume that they would be one of the teams interested in Colon, especially if they can't land Shilling. They also need a better closer then Mesa, so Koch would probably interest them. The question is would Philly be will to give up a key piece offensively(a strength for them) to add pitching help for the stretch run(a weakness for them)? I think a Koch and Colon for Abreu and Philly's top pitching prospect in the minors(I would love to see the Sox get their hands on Myers, but it isn't going to happen) is a fair deal. Since Colon is a FA after this season his value might be a little less, so I think giving up 2 quality players(1 a FA) for 1 quality player and a top prospect is a pretty fair deal. I am pretty sure that Abreu isn't a FA next year. I think the Sox could do this deal because Colon is likely gone after this season anyways. The Sox have an extremely deep minor league system when it comes to relievers, so they can afford to trade Koch(and even a guy like Wunsch for that matter) and move Marte to the closer role. I would love to see Abreu in a Sox unifrom playing LF(with Lee moving to DH/1B if the Sox can move either/both Konerko and Thomas). The only question is will they be willing to give up Abreu?

 

Some random questions:

 

How does the compensation draft picks work?

 

Is Nevin suppose to come back sometime this year or is he done for the season?

[YASNY]

Regarding Nevin, isn't there some kind of rule that says you cannot trade a player while he is on the DL? It seems I heard this when Piazza went down. By the time he comes off the DL, he'll be a 5/10 guy and have the right to nix any trade.

[MnSoxFan]

Someone asked about Julio Reyes, forget him, 5th year in low minors already, may never see AA.

 

I want nothing to do with Jenks, and I agree with the one poster we would be LUCKY to get one of the 3 pitchers from SF, no way they let Foppert go, he is a stud.

 

Good post, but you need to think a little more objectively on what other people think of their prospects and what they think about what we are offereing.

[Jim Fainter]

Jason, your proposed trade with the Giants hit a snag within just two days (trading Bart and Flash for young pitchers). Two of your selected targets (Ainsworth and Foppert) just cooled off the red hot Rockies with lights out performances. I don't think those guys are available.

[CWSOX45]

Someone asked about Julio Reyes, forget him, 5th year in low minors already, may never see AA.

 

I want nothing to do with Jenks, and I agree with the one poster we would be LUCKY to get one of the 3 pitchers from SF, no way they let Foppert go, he is a stud.

 

Good post, but you need to think a little more objectively on what other people think of their prospects and what they think about what we are offereing.

MNSF- Thanks. I don't know much about Sox prospects down in low A ball.

 

CWSOX45

[CWSOX45]

Jason, your proposed trade with the Giants hit a snag within just two days (trading Bart and Flash for young pitchers).  Two of your selected targets (Ainsworth and Foppert) just cooled off the red hot Rockies with lights out performances.  I don't think those guys are available.

You're probably right. We'll only end up getting prospects from AA or A I think.

 

The Giants seem to have good prospects in their system, I was happy when we acquired Felix Diaz and Ryan Meaux. I don't know why Meaux is still in A ball. As for Diaz, he hasn't been that impressive with a E.R.A. of 4.62 but I'm sure he'll straighten things out.

 

CWSOX45

[Cerbaho-WG]

Cerb, while I think the Sox got some good pitching, I am a big believer that you can never have too much pitching, like whitesox61382 is. 

 

Secondly I think the Sox strength pitching wise, is with their relievers.  I believe quite a few of their starters will eventually be converted into relievers.  Right now I'd say front end wise: Rauch, Honel, Wing, and Cotts have the possibilities, but I really have questions about all of them.  Cotts has control issues; Rauch with health concerns and Honel and Wing are still at very low levels. 

 

The  Giants guys are freaking studs in my book.  While I think they would be giving up a lot, I fully believe Colon is worth your two best pitching prospects and maybe a third.  I see what the Indians got for Colon and think the Sox can match it.  The Expos couldn't cause they were in a bad position.  The Sox can let him walk and grab two or three comp. picks. 

 

In regards to first, I don't consider that a huge need because any clobbering hitter can eventually be moved there.  First base is a position you don't worry about in my books.  You can find them at any time.  I think with JImenez at 2nd the Sox are alright, especially considering Yan and Lopez are in the minors. 

 

Actually position wise they aren't that bad.  I think pitching wise they don't have many of those guys that project as "aces" and with the pitching the Sox have, they could trade two veterans (one that will walk at the end of the season) and rebuild their entire farm system and the rotation.  The guys that don't make it can get tossed aside or switched to the pen. 

 

whitesox61382; I do tend to agree with you on the Angels and while I love Jenks I think Santana is brilliant.  I've heard some say he could be the best prospect in the game in a year or two as he develops more.  Jenks is the same type of mold as well.  If the Sox couldn't grab two of them and Almazenga I'd ask for Bootcheck or Joe Torres.  Neither project to be as good of pitchers as the ones acquired, but both should be solid.  Torres was once a stud but he's lost velocity.  Still pitches very good though. 

 

I really think Loaiza has insane market value because of how cheap he is over not only this year, but next year. 

 

One alternative and I have to thank and emailer who read the column for this is making a deal with the Phillies for Bobby Abreu for Billy Koch and someone.  They could definately use a closer and have a strong offense.  Don't know if they'd trade Abreu though.

Rauch will never be a front-end starter. He'll project as a 3, but that's it. If I would trade Colon, I'd go mainly for position players. Look at what Cleveland did last year; they picked up Brandon Phillips, who was probably the best infielder in the minors, and Grady Sizemore, who has consistently hit .300 in his career. Also picked up Cliff Lee, who is defintely good, but the main cogs were Phillips and Sizemore.

 

I really doubt Sabean would unload Ainsworth, Bonser, and Foppert/Williams for Colon and Gordon. He'd ask for Marte, Munoz, Ring, etc. He's not going to give up three of his top tier pitching prospects for an ace he might no resign and an injury prone reliever.

 

I like the trade with Anaheim, with the exception of Jenks. I hate the guy, I hate his stats, I hate his hype. Most likely he could be a closer, but he has no clue where the ball is going half the time. Again, I'd try and drag Kotchman out of Anaheim. With Percival being diagnosed with a degenrative hip, they will want a closer. Erstad is coming back, and with Owens as a CF, they don't have a need for Rowand. Ship him to Colorado, they've been longing for him for a while.

 

Koch and Valentin for J.D. Drew, who's agent is Scott Boras, would be a f***ing steal for St. Louis. They get a closer who is turning it around, and a pretty good shortstop who will most likely walk at the end of the year and get either A or B comp for him, for a center fielder who will never resign with the Sox.

 

Nevin for Konerko? I'd probably do it, only because Konerko is so one-dimensional it sickens me.

 

If these trades did go down, the rebuilding project would be miles and miles away from the one Mark Shapiro did in Cleveland.