Cwsox/Vince

[cwsox]

I've had a lot of good will toward you, bro and have been on your side on many issues in  the past, but this is getting out of hand...

 

I don't know anything about baseball you say?  That may very well be true, but out of 2000+ posts of yours...show me ONE that contains any special baseball insight or showcases superb arguementative skill.  Molto, Chisoxfan, Whitesox6111995, Cludjer and many others  have all a ton of "analytical" posts......where's yours?

 

I wqould suggest before you decide to engage in pompous, lame sarcasmo smack, why don't you learn what OPS and Rbi/ab ratio stand for or how Real Range Rating is...Maybe? I never expect anything however elemental from BMR, but you aim so high all the time, so it's time to back it up, no?

this is out of line and not worthy of any other response than this: attack away.

[Bmr31]

I've had a lot of good will toward you, bro and have been on your side on many issues in  the past, but this is getting out of hand...

 

I don't know anything about baseball you say?  That may very well be true, but out of 2000+ posts of yours...show me ONE that contains any special baseball insight or showcases superb arguementative skill.  Molto, Chisoxfan, Whitesox6111995, Cludjer and many others  have all a ton of "analytical" posts......where's yours?

 

I wqould suggest before you decide to engage in pompous, lame sarcasmo smack, why don't you learn what OPS and Rbi/ab ratio stand for or how Real Range Rating is...Maybe? I never expect anything however elemental from BMR, but you aim so high all the time, so it's time to back it up, no?

this is out of line and not worthy of any other response than this: attack away.

Brando is an outstanding individual.

[BrandoFan]

that is what is missing in all of those who go on and on about Jose Valentin

 

Oh, please...I only started to defend him after the second wave of bashings. But, like you, whenever I watch a game form now on and Jose makes a great play, I will notice it and comment on it....And for all the claims that you "cheer for him more than anybody", you sure as hell harbor enough thinly-veiled hostility to last a lifetime...whether against him or more likely me. Too bad.

 

I didn't know you were a Clayton fan. [immitating cwsox brand of point-making] Toss his salad lately? Is he braided down there as well? [/immitating cwsox brand of point-making]

 

The game was barely over, and even the mose partisan Jose fan shouuld have been able to say, hey, he had the ball and he dropped it, Jose messed that play up

 

Since you bring up errors so much, you should know better than anybody that Jose didn't mess up that play...Ask the official scorer

 

 

But I get called out by name - f*** you all.

 

I called you out because of your shots at me, it was sufficiently imperative for me to bring attention to it, lest it be forgotten in the tide of posts....What's the big deal anyway, everyone knows your "name". Overreacting much?

 

 

But when the ignorant childish "jose is perfect can do no wrong stuff" is posted, I guess that I am not allowed to make a comment without being insulted or called out, huh?"

 

Forget about such "difficult" concepts to grasp as saves, DP, range, comparison to other SS, etc for a second.....That Jose only "brought in" 3 legitimate runs all season long and that Minnesota game was the only remotely attributable loss (if you don't take into account that without his bat the score is 3-0 and the error makes no difference that is) this iseason....is a COLD.HARD.FACT and not a silly exaggeration of a love-struck fan as you seem to be implying in every post nowdays...Show me where I said he is a "perfect" or even a "very good" player for that matter......To think you almost pissed your pants when I jokingly called him a Devil...all the while pouring backhanded (up until today that is) abuse and overlooking substance in others' posts routinely and playing innocent, offended "truth-teller". Whatever.

 

 

this is out of line and not worthy of any other response than this: attack away.

 

Glass house, eh? My facts and opinions were sound enough that you could have at least addressed them point by point..but no, half-baked ridicule is all I got back. Hypocrite.

 

As for the rest of your post....pure and unadulterated horse manure- I have stated many times what I think of Jose's struggles, his mediocre defensive abilities, the fact that he makes that " very makeable" play 9 ouf 10 times like most SS of his caliber and all that other crap that "I should have" said according to you but didn't......even though if you read my numerous "Jose" posts, besides defending him and myself, I also discuss his negatives as a player. Maybe you should concetrate less on what you want me to have said and more on what I actually said. It'd make a big difference.....What, you want me to start exaggerating and "ridiculing" Crede and Konerko in every post? Trust me, I wouldn't have to stoop to "____ thinks he is so perfect, does he suck his dick" type rhetoric to make my point either.

 

When people post l;ike arrogant assholes and self righteousness know-it-alls, am I to blame for tweaking that

 

Me thinks you'd benefit greatly from a mirror and a glass of "uncalled for".......You didn't tweak anything by short-sightedly repeating how bad Jose really is....nor by needlessly attacking me, knowing full well I wouldn't strike back. I have brought up enough facts to support my stance on this issue and to warrant some credibility and respect. Oh, well, if that makes me a AA and SRKIA according to some, then so be it.

 

not when Royce outhit Jose last season

 

This exactly what I am talking about...you are FLAOUT wrong on this one as well as many other things about Jose (check the OPS, check RBI/at bat ratio as well as the RISP for Royce and Jose in 2002 if you wanna talk about clutch...who outhit who)....and yet you arrogantly keep insisting on "Jose police" coming after you instead of maybe reevaluate your own info a bit...Unreal. What's next? Are you gonna continue to hold against me the fact that Sox are a 600 team when Jose starts at short? I mean, it's like I am basing my entire point on that, it was just a side note that YOU my friend blew out of proportion with your midplaced ridicule more than once.

 

 

Since I know so little about baseball, at least you could provide an example or two of "real" baseball insight, so I could, like, learn and stuff....For my sake, make a difference.

[BrandoFan]

I've had a lot of good will toward you, bro and have been on your side on many issues in  the past, but this is getting out of hand...

 

I don't know anything about baseball you say?  That may very well be true, but out of 2000+ posts of yours...show me ONE that contains any special baseball insight or showcases superb arguementative skill.  Molto, Chisoxfan, Whitesox6111995, Cludjer and many others  have all a ton of "analytical" posts......where's yours?

 

I wqould suggest before you decide to engage in pompous, lame sarcasmo smack, why don't you learn what OPS and Rbi/ab ratio stand for or how Real Range Rating is...Maybe?   I never expect anything however elemental from BMR, but you aim so high all the time, so it's time to back it up, no?

this is out of line and not worthy of any other response than this: attack away.

Brando is an outstanding individual.

This comes from the King of Class and Introspection...

 

 

 

(I still love you, beamer.)

[Bmr31]

I've had a lot of good will toward you, bro and have been on your side on many issues in  the past, but this is getting out of hand...

 

I don't know anything about baseball you say?  That may very well be true, but out of 2000+ posts of yours...show me ONE that contains any special baseball insight or showcases superb arguementative skill.  Molto, Chisoxfan, Whitesox6111995, Cludjer and many others  have all a ton of "analytical" posts......where's yours?

 

I wqould suggest before you decide to engage in pompous, lame sarcasmo smack, why don't you learn what OPS and Rbi/ab ratio stand for or how Real Range Rating is...Maybe?   I never expect anything however elemental from BMR, but you aim so high all the time, so it's time to back it up, no?

this is out of line and not worthy of any other response than this: attack away.

Brando is an outstanding individual.

This comes from the King of Class and Introspection...

 

 

 

(I still love you, beamer.)

I dont pretend i'm self righteous.

[clujer420]

that is what is missing in all of those who go on and on about Jose Valentin.  I cheer for him far, far more than most members of Soxtalk because I go to far, far more games than most, and I travel a hell of along way to get to the park and back.  Off the top of my head, I can think that maybe only HSC and Steff have actually cheered for Jose more than I have.

You can cheer and root for a team just as much at home in front of your TV as you can at the ballpark. The fact that you have the opportunity and fortune of attending many live games doesn't mean you're any more of a Sox supporter than anyone else.

 

Maybe you are one of the Sox biggest fans, I don't know -- but the mere fact that you attend many games doesn't prove a thing.

[Bmr31]

You can cheer and root for a team just as much at home in front of your TV as you can at the ballpark.  The fact that you have the opportunity and fortune of attending many live games doesn't mean you're any more of a Sox supporter than anyone else.

 

Maybe you are one of the Sox biggest fans, I don't know -- but the mere fact that you attend many games doesn't prove a thing.

I agree. If i lived in Chicago, id be at many games. I havent attended a MLB game in YEARS.

[YASNY]

CWSOX: I have seen your name used on this board many times and don't recall ever seeing you get upset about. My mistake and I humbly aplolgize for making it. It will not happen again, sir.

 

At the time that post was made, I had not seen the play. I have since, and yes, that play should have been made. Not an easy play, going full speed away from the plate, CF and 2B coming at him hard, but still .... Jose should have made the play.

[YASNY]

One other point I'd like to make. I did not call you anything. I said that on this particular subject, you "come across" in that way. I was very careful to word it like I did so as I would not be calling anyone anything. That being said, it was still a bit on the harsh side and I wish I wouldn't have made that post. I have offered apologies a couple of times already, earlier in the thread. They were/are sincerely offered. I do regret shooting of my mouth as I did.

[clujer420]

I did not call you anything.  I said that on this particular subject, you "come across" in that way.  I was very careful to word it like I did so as I would not be calling anyone anything.

Semantics.

[Steff]

I'd just like to make a comment relating to the manner in which things are debated here..

 

People have opinions. 50% of people might agree with that opinion. Obviously the other 50% wont. Regardless of someone's stance I find it very disheartening that someone would get bashed for having an opinion. It seems to be happening more and more here lately where someone will say a play was bs, the player should have gotten it.. bring up their stats.. either prove or disprove someone elses theory, etc, etc..

 

But then it gets personal. Calling someone names and I'm not talking about calling out someone's lack of knowldge and calling their "facts" stupid, but telling someone their opinion makes them an asshole is really disgusting. I don't like certian players, but I definitely don't bash others because they do. And I don't go off on people when they make negative comments about players I do like. It's silly and unproductive. And it's making things here a bit tense at times. To call someone out on their posting times (incinuating they don't have a life) or the amount of posts they post, is rather juvinile, IMO. Who cares.

 

My point, should anyone care, is that all the bs and bickering is getting so tiresome. If you don't like what someone has to say ignore it. If you can't reply without tossing insults then perhaps you should pass on hitting the reply button. JMO for what it's worth.

[clujer420]

But then it gets personal. Calling someone names and I'm not talking about calling out someone's lack of knowldge and calling their "facts" stupid, but telling someone their opinion makes them an asshole is really disgusting.

 

If you don't like what someone has to say ignore it. If you can't reply without tossing insults then perhaps you should pass on hitting the reply button. JMO for what it's worth.

 

Amen to both of those statements. If you disagree with someone, go ahead and reply and indicate that to the person, but leave the insults and name calling out of it. If you are unwilling or unable to do that, don't bother replying at all, because there's nothing less productive than juvenile swearing and name calling.

[southsider2k5]

Amen to both of those statements.  If you disagree with someone, go ahead and reply and indicate that to the person, but leave the insults and name calling out of it.  If you are unwilling or unable to do that, don't bother, because there's nothing less productive than juvenile swearing and name calling.

Preach on! Both Clu and Steff are right on! If you want to attack the opinion fine, but don't make it personal.

[Soxplosion]

Give the man a break for cryin out loud. Insulting him for expressing his opinion and calling him out by name is just wrong. We have screen names, so use em. And even if his opinion is a short and harsh one like Jose sucks (which I agree with btw) its still his opinion and you cant rip him for that. Not to mention that Joses play is enough of an example of why cw thinks what he thinks. Hes hitting .230 with nine errors and his D has cost us a few games. And brando I think leadership is important too. Lead by example leadership. Joses pointing his finger at everyone else when he should really be pointing at himself. Loaiza is the greatest leader on this team...

[SI1020]

I'd just like to make a comment relating to the manner in which things are debated here..

 

People have opinions. 50% of people might agree with that opinion. Obviously the other 50% wont. Regardless of someone's stance I find it very disheartening that someone would get bashed for having an opinion. It seems to be happening more and more here lately where someone will say a play was bs, the player should have gotten it.. bring up their stats.. either prove or disprove someone elses theory, etc, etc..

 

But then it gets personal. Calling someone names and I'm not talking about calling out someone's lack of knowldge and calling their "facts" stupid, but telling someone their opinion makes them an asshole is really disgusting. I don't like certian players, but I definitely don't bash others because they do. And I don't go off on people when they make negative comments about players I do like. It's silly and unproductive. And it's making things here a bit tense at times. To call someone out on their posting times (incinuating they don't have a life) or the amount of posts they post, is rather juvinile, IMO. Who cares.

 

My point, should anyone care, is that all the bs and bickering is getting so tiresome. If you don't like what someone has to say ignore it. If you can't reply without tossing insults then perhaps you should pass on hitting the reply button. JMO for what it's worth.

I try to go out of my way to be decent while still giving my opinion. I've probably been over the top a few times. The situation you describe Steff is a big reason why I don't post on Whitesox.com and basically stick here. (Still lurk on WSI) I hope all the hard feelings are smoothed over. The whole White Sox SS situation has been a touchy subject (among many others!) for several seasons. The team is imploding and everybody is getting in a foul mood. Yesterdays game was just a brutal one to lose. YASNY and CW are great WS fans in my book. Hope everything is cool now and I don't mean to ignore anybody else who posted here. Lets win one today, Cleveland is one of my favorite teams to beat. I remember the great rivalry we had with the Tribe back in the day.

[Dick Allen]

Give the man a break for cryin out loud. Insulting him for expressing his opinion and calling him out by name is just wrong. We have screen names, so use em. And even if his opinion is a short and harsh one like Jose sucks (which I agree with btw) its still his opinion and you cant rip him for that. Not to mention that Joses play is enough of an example of why cw thinks what he thinks. Hes hitting .230 with nine errors and his D has cost us a few games. And brando I think leadership is important too. Lead by example leadership. Joses pointing his finger at everyone else when he should really be pointing at himself. Loaiza is the greatest leader on this team...

Yea last week in one of the papers Jose says he is biting his tongue, trying not to complain about a lack of effort. Look in the mirror, one of the reasons this team sucks is because he can't hit and you can see better defensive shortstops at any local little league field. He is stealing money this year.

[elrockinMT]

We win and lose as a team. I just want to see some wins for a change.

[Bmr31]

I'd just like to make a comment relating to the manner in which things are debated here..

 

People have opinions. 50% of people might agree with that opinion. Obviously the other 50% wont. Regardless of someone's stance I find it very disheartening that someone would get bashed for having an opinion. It seems to be happening more and more here lately where someone will say a play was bs, the player should have gotten it.. bring up their stats.. either prove or disprove someone elses theory, etc, etc..

 

But then it gets personal. Calling someone names and I'm not talking about calling out someone's lack of knowldge and calling their "facts" stupid, but telling someone their opinion makes them an asshole is really disgusting. I don't like certian players, but I definitely don't bash others because they do. And I don't go off on people when they make negative comments about players I do like. It's silly and unproductive. And it's making things here a bit tense at times. To call someone out on their posting times (incinuating they don't have a life) or the amount of posts they post, is rather juvinile, IMO. Who cares.

 

My point, should anyone care, is that all the bs and bickering is getting so tiresome. If you don't like what someone has to say ignore it. If you can't reply without tossing insults then perhaps you should pass on hitting the reply button. JMO for what it's worth.

I try to go out of my way to be decent while still giving my opinion. I've probably been over the top a few times. The situation you describe Steff is a big reason why I don't post on Whitesox.com and basically stick here. (Still lurk on WSI) I hope all the hard feelings are smoothed over. The whole White Sox SS situation has been a touchy subject (among many others!) for several seasons. The team is imploding and everybody is getting in a foul mood. Yesterdays game was just a brutal one to lose. YASNY and CW are great WS fans in my book. Hope everything is cool now and I don't mean to ignore anybody else who posted here. Lets win one today, Cleveland is one of my favorite teams to beat. I remember the great rivalry we had with the Tribe back in the day.

Hard feelings? Cmon people this is a f***ing internet site. If someone gets offended or leaves a site because of what someone says, its their OWN fault. Get over it.

[SI1020]

I'd just like to make a comment relating to the manner in which things are debated here..

 

People have opinions. 50% of people might agree with that opinion. Obviously the other 50% wont. Regardless of someone's stance I find it very disheartening that someone would get bashed for having an opinion. It seems to be happening more and more here lately where someone will say a play was bs, the player should have gotten it.. bring up their stats.. either prove or disprove someone elses theory, etc, etc..

 

But then it gets personal. Calling someone names and I'm not talking about calling out someone's lack of knowldge and calling their "facts" stupid, but telling someone their opinion makes them an asshole is really disgusting. I don't like certian players, but I definitely don't bash others because they do. And I don't go off on people when they make negative comments about players I do like. It's silly and unproductive. And it's making things here a bit tense at times. To call someone out on their posting times (incinuating they don't have a life) or the amount of posts they post, is rather juvinile, IMO. Who cares.

 

My point, should anyone care, is that all the bs and bickering is getting so tiresome. If you don't like what someone has to say ignore it. If you can't reply without tossing insults then perhaps you should pass on hitting the reply button. JMO for what it's worth.

I try to go out of my way to be decent while still giving my opinion. I've probably been over the top a few times. The situation you describe Steff is a big reason why I don't post on Whitesox.com and basically stick here. (Still lurk on WSI) I hope all the hard feelings are smoothed over. The whole White Sox SS situation has been a touchy subject (among many others!) for several seasons. The team is imploding and everybody is getting in a foul mood. Yesterdays game was just a brutal one to lose. YASNY and CW are great WS fans in my book. Hope everything is cool now and I don't mean to ignore anybody else who posted here. Lets win one today, Cleveland is one of my favorite teams to beat. I remember the great rivalry we had with the Tribe back in the day.

Hard feelings? Cmon people this is a f***ing internet site. If someone gets offended or leaves a site because of what someone says, its their OWN fault. Get over it.

I'm not comfortable any where else but here and I make no apologies for it. That MLB site had some of the greatest posters ever. The combination of trolls, cliqueishness and mindless fights ruined the place in my book. They lost a lot of posters and not just because of hard feelings.