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The Continuing Rise of Mark Buerhle


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QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 02:30 AM)
Did you ever see Gooden in 84-85?  He was a poster boy for great mechanics.  Know what the hell you're talking about before talk. 

 

And anybody, even those with great mechanics can have injury problems.  Look eight miles north at Chewing Gum Dump and #22.

I think the main argument is that Mark has a good chance to become a 300 winner and HOFer with his current stats as long as he can sustain that rate for the rest of his career. Which is not an easy task by no means, but he has shown nothing to lead us to believe that he won't do it.

 

You really can't compare Prior and Buerhle, other than they both pitch in Chicago (that is when Prior is not on the DL). Prior has only pitched over 200 innings once, and has one season with more than 11 wins. I wouldn't say that Prior has or had great mechanics either. He is more of a strikeout pitcher on the DL.

Edited by RME JICO
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QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 02:30 AM)
Did you ever see Gooden in 84-85?  He was a poster boy for great mechanics.  Know what the hell you're talking about before talk. 

 

His motion/mechanics got considerably worse after those two seasons. Gooden's first two years in the league he has sensational mechanics... then it was a continues down hill roller coaster for him... he began tipping his pitches and his delivery started becoming awkward compared to before... was clearly not as fluid. His delievery and motion (his first two years in the league) have been thought of as one of the smoothest ever in baseball. It's believe that the mets coaches at the time really f***ed up with him (that and cocaine/liqour). Buehrle is yet to have any sort of hiccups with his delivery. Personally i do not see any reason for buehrle to start changing anything in what will be his sixth full season in the majors this year. He has looked nearly identical out there since day one.

 

This article basically explains how they f***ed him up...

 

http://www.thesportscritics.com/listingsEn...pt=Jeff+Kallman

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QUOTE(RME JICO @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 02:53 AM)
I think the main argument is that Mark has a good chance to become a 300 winner and HOFer with his current stats as long as he can sustain that rate for the rest of his career. Which is not an easy task by no means, but he has shown nothing to lead us to believe that he won't do it.

 

Dude, nobody is above becoming a drug addict.

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QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 22, 2006 -> 11:49 PM)
Are you stupid?  Where did I say MB would suffer the same fate?  But nobody is above becoming a drug addict. 

 

But MB has to prove he can pitch well into his 30's before we talk about him being a HOF or winning 300 games. 

 

All those people mentioned showed tons of flashes.  But they faded out real quick.  Whether it was in their 3rd year or their 7th year.

 

Do you even know who Vida Blue is?  Without looking at baseballreference.com?

 

Layoff the personal insults, OK?

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QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 08:37 AM)
Are you saying you think Buehrle is likely to start doing drugs, and that that's a likely scenario -- that Buehrle might become a drug addict?

 

 

Let me type real slow, so you will be able to understand. Drugs are very addictive and can ruin ANYBODY.

 

That doesn't say or imply that MB will become a drug addict. But that also doesn't mean that MB is above becoming a drug addict.

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QUOTE(qwerty @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 01:01 AM)
His motion/mechanics got considerably worse after those two seasons. Gooden's first two years in the league he has sensational mechanics... then it was a continues down hill roller coaster for him... he began tipping his pitches and his delivery started becoming awkward compared to before... was clearly not as fluid. His delievery and motion (his first two years in the league) have been thought of as one of the smoothest ever in baseball. It's believe that the mets coaches at the time really f***ed up with him (that and cocaine/liqour). Buehrle is yet to have any sort of hiccups with his delivery. Personally i do not see any reason for buehrle to start changing anything in what will be his sixth full season in the majors this year. He has looked nearly identical out there since day one.

 

This article basically explains how they f***ed him up...

 

http://www.thesportscritics.com/listingsEn...pt=Jeff+Kallman

 

 

Yeah Gooden's lack of work ethic and his drug problems didn't have anything to do with it? Gooden came into the league as a 19 year old. He could basically not work out and still be in shape. Then his body matured and he had to work out but didn't. He also started his drug issues after 85. They came to light after the Mets won the WS.

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QUOTE(RME JICO @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 12:53 AM)
I think the main argument is that Mark has a good chance to become a 300 winner and HOFer with his current stats as long as he can sustain that rate for the rest of his career. Which is not an easy task by no means, but he has shown nothing to lead us to believe that he won't do it..

 

Umm HELLO my examples show that there are some pitchers who weren't able to main their early success. What part of that don't you understand?

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How to Win Friends and Influence People...

 

Walker2Baines 

 

 

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QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 22, 2006 -> 10:49 PM)
Are you stupid?  Where did I say MB would suffer the same fate?  But nobody is above becoming a drug addict. 

 

But MB has to prove he can pitch well into his 30's before we talk about him being a HOF or winning 300 games. 

 

All those people mentioned showed tons of flashes.  But they faded out real quick.  Whether it was in their 3rd year or their 7th year.

 

Do you even know who Vida Blue is?  Without looking at baseballreference.com?

 

 

QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 01:30 AM)
Did you ever see Gooden in 84-85?  He was a poster boy for great mechanics.  Know what the hell you're talking about before talk. 

 

And anybody, even those with great mechanics can have injury problems.  Look eight miles north at Chewing Gum Dump and #22.

 

 

QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 01:56 PM)
Let me type real slow, so you will be able to understand.  Drugs are very addictive and can ruin ANYBODY. 

 

That doesn't say or imply that MB will become a drug addict.  But that also doesn't mean that MB is above becoming a drug addict.

 

 

QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 02:01 PM)
Umm HELLO my examples show that there are some pitchers who weren't able to main their early success.  What part of that don't you understand?

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QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 01:56 PM)
Let me type real slow, so you will be able to understand.  Drugs are very addictive and can ruin ANYBODY. 

 

That doesn't say or imply that MB will become a drug addict.  But that also doesn't mean that MB is above becoming a drug addict.

 

Hahahaha!

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QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 10:37 AM)
Are you saying you think Buehrle is likely to start doing drugs, and that that's a likely scenario -- that Buehrle might become a drug addict?

 

I was just mocking him... the comment amused me.

 

QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 03:00 PM)
Yeah Gooden's lack of work ethic and his drug problems didn't have anything to do with it?  Gooden came into the league as a 19 year old.  He could basically not work out and still be in shape.  Then his body matured and he had to work out but didn't.  He also started his drug issues after 85.  They came to light after the Mets won the WS.

 

Coaches and management f***ing with everything you do... after you have proven to be the best pitcher in the game likely had a bigger impact than either his liqour addiction of cocaine. Players through out the ages gave been addicted to drugs/ liqour and went on to have hall of fame/extremely good careers. How about from the 1950's and previous? They drank before... during... and after games... yet could still produce. People closest to the organization truly believe if they left him alone he would have went on to have a hall of fame career, addictions or not. His work ethic was also praised his first two years in the league. Once they f***ed with him though...

Edited by qwerty
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QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Apr 23, 2006 -> 10:37 PM)
This guy still hasn't been banned?

 

 

No s*** dude. Great way to start off on a message board, implying that MB could be a drug user.

 

:rolly

 

 

Methinks the bannage monster is getting ready to stomp all over this dude.

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This from Baseball Reference's

 

Similar Pitchers through Age 26

John Candelaria (957)

Mike Hampton (949)

Mark Mulder (945)

Jim Merritt (944)

Tom Glavine (942)

Bill Monbouquette (940)

Ross Grimsley (939)

Dave McNally (937)

Mark Gubicza (936)

Tony Cloninger (935)

 

 

Of those listed only Glavine will make the HOF. Others fizzled out for whatever reason.

 

So please stop this BS about MB. He's nothing about a crybaby. Hey MB great game vs Seattle. Hey are they cheating???

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QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 28, 2006 -> 02:36 AM)
This from Baseball Reference's

 

Similar Pitchers through Age 26

John Candelaria (957)

Mike Hampton (949)

Mark Mulder (945)

Jim Merritt (944)

Tom Glavine (942)

Bill Monbouquette (940)

Ross Grimsley (939)

Dave McNally (937)

Mark Gubicza (936)

Tony Cloninger (935)

Of those listed only Glavine will make the HOF.  Others fizzled out for whatever reason.

 

So please stop this BS about MB.  He's nothing about a crybaby.  Hey MB great game vs Seattle.  Hey are they cheating???

 

Speaking of fizzling out, I wonder how long you will last around here...

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QUOTE(Walker2Baines @ Apr 28, 2006 -> 01:36 AM)
This from Baseball Reference's

 

Similar Pitchers through Age 26

John Candelaria (957)

Mike Hampton (949)

Mark Mulder (945)

Jim Merritt (944)

Tom Glavine (942)

Bill Monbouquette (940)

Ross Grimsley (939)

Dave McNally (937)

Mark Gubicza (936)

Tony Cloninger (935)

Of those listed only Glavine will make the HOF.  Others fizzled out for whatever reason.

 

So please stop this BS about MB.  He's nothing about a crybaby.  Hey MB great game vs Seattle.  Hey are they cheating???

 

I luuuuv it when you analyze.

 

:rolly

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