Dick Allen Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 03:13 PM) He'll be a free agent in two years. I wonder what his relationship with Guillen is like. 2 years from now, maybe nobody will want him. Last year wasn't all that great for him, and the Phillies aren't really getting their money's worth this year either. He's got decent stats, nothing eye-popping for a guy making his type of money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Pratt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 03:13 PM) I wonder what his relationship with Guillen is like. Rowand's? Very good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Hurtin Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 04:07 PM) I give it two years before Abreu is on the Sox. Red Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 04:17 PM) Rowand's? Very good. Duh. He was talking about Abreu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Pratt Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(greasywheels121 @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 03:20 PM) Duh. He was talking about Abreu. I wasn't aware that indicated confusion (that, my boy, is hinted at by that little punctuation mark with the curved line and dot) was a valid prompt for rudeness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinningUgly85 Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 you got to be kidding me we just traded him. Has this ever been done before with a team? I mean I would love to have Rowand back but what makes these philly fans think that their organization would give up Rowand for Garland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWhiteSoxinNJ Posted June 3, 2006 Author Share Posted June 3, 2006 Sorry I started this thread, forgot about Garland having a no trade clause. Seems like the people in Philly don't want him to leave but the fan base is overvaluing Rowand's worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(AWhiteSoxinNJ @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 06:38 PM) Take it for what it's worth, got it off the Philles board. http://www.philaphans.com/forums/showthrea...&threadid=41726 Actually it could be our relief corp plus prospects for Rowand or it could be Freddie Garcia, the bullpen and prospects for Rowand. QUOTE(AWhiteSoxinNJ @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 08:32 PM) Sorry I started this thread, forgot about Garland having a no trade clause. Seems like the people in Philly don't want him to leave but the fan base is overvaluing Rowand's worth. It's not your fault. Actually I would love to have "Crash" back in a Sox uniform Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamTell Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(WinningUgly85 @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 03:29 PM) you got to be kidding me we just traded him. Has this ever been done before with a team? I mean I would love to have Rowand back but what makes these philly fans think that their organization would give up Rowand for Garland. lol Carl Everett and Roberto Alomar are pretty close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 (edited) QUOTE(WinningUgly85 @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 01:29 PM) I mean I would love to have Rowand back but what makes these philly fans think that their organization would give up Rowand for Garland. Or that our organization would give up a young, healthy, workhorse starter like Garland for a mediocre hitter like Rowand. As poorly as Jon has pitched this year, the Sox wouldn't even think about a deal like this unless they wanted to unload payroll. you got to be kidding me we just traded him. Has this ever been done before with a team? The Indians traded Kenny Lofton to the Braves (for David Justice, IIRC) after the '96 season and traded back for Lofton a year later. So I guess there is some sort of precedent. Edited June 3, 2006 by WCSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 (edited) Lest we forget, Carl Everett was logged significan experience in CF. Edited June 3, 2006 by Greg The Bull Luzinski Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 04:17 PM) Lest we forget, Carl Everett was logged significan experience in CF. Think about how quickly Rowand built a reputation of being a great player. In the middle of 2003 KW had to get Everett, a DH basically, to play CF because Rowand wasn't getting the job done. Rowand came on in 2004, and in 2005 was average at best offensively, and played a decent CF, although he had a 2 or 3 week stretch of being awesome, even though his throwing was far more erratic than ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 04:20 PM) Think about how quickly Rowand built a reputation of being a great player. In the middle of 2003 KW had to get Everett, a DH basically, to play CF because Rowand wasn't getting the job done. Rowand came on in 2004, and in 2005 was average at best offensively, and played a decent CF, although he had a 2 or 3 week stretch of being awesome, even though his throwing was far more erratic than ever. I think Everett was about 50 pounds lighter in 2003 too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 04:22 PM) I think Everett was about 50 pounds lighter in 2003 too. And he still had the range of the Bull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg The Bull Luzinski Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 04:22 PM) And he still had the range of the Bull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDsDirtySox Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 It is well known throughout baseball that Philly desperately wants a solid starter. But I have not heard anything about them wanting to deal Rowand (and I doubt they do). The Phils are looking to deal either Burrell or Abreu for a frontline starter. The hot rumor I have heard is Bobby Abreu to the Cardinals for Mark Mulder. That would be a solid trade for both teams, as the Phils would save alot of cash and get the starter they need, and the Cards would get an OF that actually can contribute in the majors. I have also heard Burrell for Bedard and a prospect, and Abreu for Jeff Weaver and Dallas McPhearson. Who knows... but I would be willing to bet anything that that Phils WON'T be trading Aaron Rowand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(fathom @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 03:02 PM) Rowand is the center piece of the new style of play the Phillies are going for, and Burrell/Abreu are more likely to be traded than Rowand is. I can't believe people actually write crap like this. You can't really believe what you're saying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(JDsDirtySox @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 02:52 PM) It is well known throughout baseball that Philly desperately wants a solid starter. But I have not heard anything about them wanting to deal Rowand (and I doubt they do). The Phils are looking to deal either Burrell or Abreu for a frontline starter. If the Phillies really want Garland, they would have to give up much more than just Rowand. It'd probably take Rowand and a couple of relievers. I have no idea what Philly has in their pen besides Gordon, but the deal isn't going to happen anyway. The hot rumor I have heard is Bobby Abreu to the Cardinals for Mark Mulder. That would be a solid trade for both teams, as the Phils would save alot of cash and get the starter they need, and the Cards would get an OF that actually can contribute in the majors. Jim Edmonds can't contribute in the majors? Unless he's suffered some injury that I'm unaware of, that's not really an accurate statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(TaylorStSox @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 06:02 PM) I can't believe people actually write crap like this. You can't really believe what you're saying. I don't follow you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(TaylorStSox @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 10:02 PM) I can't believe people actually write crap like this. You can't really believe what you're saying. :headshake QUOTE(WCSox @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 10:03 PM) Jim Edmonds can't contribute in the majors? Unless he's suffered some injury that I'm unaware of, that's not really an accurate statement. He's terrible now. His body has broken down, as his bat speed has diminished significantly. Also, he's about to go on the DL. QUOTE(TaylorStSox @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 10:02 PM) I can't believe people actually write crap like this. You can't really believe what you're saying. Yep....I can't believe that I wrote that the Phillies would want to keep a fairly cheap CF, and unload their huge contracts in RF/LF, in order to free up money to acquire a top starting pitcher. Maybe I should go buy an XBox, and come up with more trade proposals that clog this site that don't have a chance in hell of ever taking place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaylorStSox Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(fathom @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 05:08 PM) :headshake He's terrible now. His body has broken down, as his bat speed has diminished significantly. Also, he's about to go on the DL. Yep....I can't believe that I wrote that the Phillies would want to keep a fairly cheap CF, and unload their huge contracts in RF/LF, in order to free up money to acquire a top starting pitcher. Maybe I should go buy an XBox, and come up with more trade proposals that clog this site that don't have a chance in hell of ever taking place. So basically what you're saying is the Phillies are going to build their team around your poor man's Mark Kotsay. Not only that, they're not going to take an 18 game winner for him, straight up. And, you're the one shaking your head? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WCSox Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(fathom @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 03:06 PM) :headshake He's terrible now. His body has broken down, as his bat speed has diminished significantly. Also, he's about to go on the DL. "Terrible"? That's a pretty bold statement, and one that would be more accurately used to describe someone like Anderson (at the plate, at least). His numbers don't look good so far this year, but he's still a ML-caliber player. He had an OBP of .385 and hit 29 jacks last season, so I wouldn't say he's washed up just yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(TaylorStSox @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 10:11 PM) So basically what you're saying is the Phillies are going to build their team around your poor man's Mark Kotsay. Not only that, they're not going to take an 18 game winner for him, straight up. And, you're the one shaking your head? Wait, so Rowand is terrible now, and Garland's this glorious 18 game winner? If Garland is struggling to keep the ball in the park, I'm sure the Phillies would want him then also. :puke Garland's value is definitely not what it was, as he's not exactly a cheap commodity anymore. He might be signed for a few more years, but you're not getting a bargain if you trade for him. The Phillies have their 4 building blocks in place on offense, and it's Howard, Utley, Rollins, and Rowand. Now, they want some pitchers to go along with Hamels, Myers, and Floyd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felix Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 QUOTE(TaylorStSox @ Jun 3, 2006 -> 06:11 PM) So basically what you're saying is the Phillies are going to build their team around your poor man's Mark Kotsay. Not only that, they're not going to take an 18 game winner for him, straight up. And, you're the one shaking your head? Well first of all, Garland is an average pitcher. Nothing more. Don't pull out this "18 game winner" garbage, it doesn't mean anything in terms of how good a pitcher he is. Second of all, Rowand has a .303/.353/.513 line this year and had a .310/.361/.544 line in 2004. On top of that, he plays phenomenal defense, is a clubhouse leader, and a fan favorite wherever he goes. He leaves it all on the field, and teams love players like that. Now, I don't think they would accept that deal, but you vastly underrate Rowand and overrate Garland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punch and Judy Garland Posted June 3, 2006 Share Posted June 3, 2006 Yeah Jimmy was starting to get it going when he got the injury. His average had jumped a bit. I don't see Mulder for Abreu because with only 1 starter (besides Wainwright and Reyes) locked up for next year, I can't see them making a 13 million dollar committment to an aging outfielder who isn't that good in the field (GG and all). THe Cardinals value pitchign too much to do this trade. BTW, for the guy who mentioned bourn and Golson, I had heard that Golson has not been doing well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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