Post game show?

[Baines3]

I like Ozzie alot, he was one of my favorites in his playing days, but he was clearly wrong for his actions with Tracey.

 

If Ozzie ordered Tracey to intentinally hit the Rangers batter with a pitch, it seems to me that Ozzie could face a suspension.

 

Since it looks like Tracey was sent down to the minors, I hope he is able to put it behind him and work on his control.

[gojimthome]

The general Sox fan internet population suffers from occasional bouts of temporary stupidity when "prospect" pitchers are involved. I submit the follwing for evidence (we've seen it time and again):

 

Sox fan hears Player a is being traded. Player a is a random mid-round pick from 4 years ago. He's 25 years old. He's a couple years older than his peers. He's never dominated in the minors to any degree, but the Sox of course call him a prospect. This is not suprising, because the Sox call all of their minor leaguers "prospects with great tools." To back this up they give Sox fans useful statistics like "in rookie league 2004, player a held left-handed hitters to an amazing .017 batting average in day games during the second week of July when no one was on base and a slight drizzle was falling sideways from a south-southeasterly direction."

 

Sox fans naturally reply with "Wow! We need him in our bullpen to get lefties out! No one can hit him! He's the next Hoyt Wilhelm!" or "We're trading him for WHO??!??!?! He's an amazing prospect, we need to be getting at least a Carl Crawford or Vernon Wells for him!!!"

 

Sox fans love to ignore the giant elephant in the middle of the room when "prospects" are involved in any situation that could be conceived as detrimental to their "progress." That giant elephant being that every pro scout not on the Sox payroll says that player a is a heap of dog doodie...

 

Anyway, the moral of the story is this, folks:

 

NO ONE OUTSIDE OF THE WHITE SOX ORGANIZATION CONSIDERS SEAN TRACEY TO BE A GREAT PROSPECT! You won't see him on any list of notable prospects.

 

Settle down! What we have here is either:

1) a non-prospect, unimportant minor league callup that thinks he doesn't have to listen to Ozzie

2) a non-prospect, unimportant minor league callup that is unable to plunk a 6'1" 200 lb target when he's really trying to

 

In either case, he's not worth worrying about and does not belong on a major league club, let alone one in contention. If Ozzie yelling at him makes him tear up like a little girl with a skinned knee, how could he ever handle the pressure of a playoff game? Sean Tracey is not worth worrying about and we now have the talented and proven Mr. Riske here to take his spot. Hopefully Kenny can work his magic and turn Tracey, under the guise of him being a "prospect" into a piece of a trade for another dependable relief arm around the deadline.

 

Sean Tracey...He Gawn!

Edited June 15, 2006 by Contreras' Crew

[3RDBASE]

POST OF THE DAY, MADE MY DAY!!!!! THANK YOU!^^^

[SoxFan1]

The question that needs to be asked is.....why would Ozzie send Tracey in to hit somebody?? Even if you 100 percent agree with the move, Tracey has the worst control on the team and would be most likely to miss by far.

Oh my goodness. Everyone is playing the "no control" card. GMAFB. Tracey could have hit Blalock if he wanted to.

 

I am a high school pitcher and when my coach told me to bean someone, I hit him dead in the ribs. Right where he told me to. This was a game in which I walked 4 batters in 1 1/3 innings. I had no control and still beaned the guy who was showing us up. It's not hard hitting someone with a pitch. It is in fact hard hitting the corners of a 16 inch plate.

 

He told Tracey to retaliate because he is a rookie and is least valuable. If he was to get suspended, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. If it was Vazquez, then it would.

 

No control. Please.

[henry wiggins]

POST OF THE DAY, MADE MY DAY!!!!! THANK YOU!^^^

 

I'll drink to that!!

[SoxFan1]

The general Sox fan internet population suffers from occasional bouts of temporary stupidity when "prospect" pitchers are involved. I submit the follwing for evidence (we've seen it time and again):

 

Sox fan hears Player a is being traded. Player a is a random mid-round pick from 4 years ago. He's 25 years old. He's a couple years older than his peers. He's never dominated in the minors to any degree, but the Sox of course call him a prospect. This is not suprising, because the Sox call all of their minor leaguers "prospects with great tools." To back this up they give Sox fans useful statistics like "in rookie league 2004, player a held left-handed hitters to an amazing .017 batting average in day games during the second week of July when no one was on base and a slight drizzle was falling sideways from a south-southeasterly direction."

 

Sox fans naturally reply with "Wow! We need him in our bullpen to get lefties out! No one can hit him! He's the next Hoyt Wilhelm!" or "We're trading him for WHO??!??!?! He's an amazing prospect, we need to be getting at least a Carl Crawford or Vernon Wells for him!!!"

 

Sox fans love to ignore the giant elephant in the middle of the room when "prospects" are involved in any situation that could be conceived as detrimental to their "progress." That giant elephant being that every pro scout not on the Sox payroll says that player a is a heap of dog doodie...

 

Anyway, the moral of the story is this, folks:

 

NO ONE OUTSIDE OF THE WHITE SOX ORGANIZATION CONSIDERS SEAN TRACEY TO BE A GREAT PROSPECT! You won't see him on any list of notable prospects.

 

Settle down! What we have here is either:

1) a non-prospect, unimportant minor league callup that thinks he doesn't have to listen to Ozzie

2) a non-prospect, unimportant minor league callup that is unable to plunk a 6'1" 200 lb target when he's really trying to

 

In either case, he's not worth worrying about and does not belong on a major league club, let alone one in contention. If Ozzie yelling at him makes him tear up like a little girl with a skinned knee, how could he ever handle the pressure of a playoff game? Sean Tracey is not worth worrying about and we now have the talented and proven Mr. Riske here to take his spot. Hopefully Kenny can work his magic and turn Tracey, under the guise of him being a "prospect" into a piece of a trade for another dependable relief arm around the deadline.

 

Sean Tracey...He Gawn!

Oh, and you need to stick around. Post more.

[gojimthome]

Oh, and you need to stick around. Post more.

 

Thanks. I plan on it. The mlb.com boards are too silly for me, so I intend to do all of my Sox-related-posting here.

 

[SoxFan1]

Thanks. I plan on it. The mlb.com boards are too silly for me, so I intend to do all of my Sox-related-posting here.

 

Actually, if that's you in the avatar, you can leave.

 

Welcome aboard.

Edited June 15, 2006 by SoxFan1

[BobDylan]

It didn't even get Padilla thrown out of the game, hows that for today's game?

 

That's the umpire's fault.

 

Vazquez would be put in a tight spot if he beaned back. The guy who retaliates ALWAYS gets in trouble. That's why kids always say, "But he started it!"?

Edited June 15, 2006 by BobDylan

[gojimthome]

Actually, if that's you in the avatar, you can leave.

 

Welcome aboard.

 

You know you look like that, too. Just ask any Cub fan. We're all mullet-headed meth addicts.

[SoxFan1]

You know you look like that, too. Just ask any Cub fan. We're all mullet-headed meth addicts.

[shoota]

He won't change. That's the Guillen we're going to have to deal with. He's a passionate Latin manager who -- more often than not -- crosses the boundaries.

 

I'm not surprised he did it. Honestly, I'm more upset Vazquez couldn't take it within himself to hit a batter. This is speculation on my part, but I believe he was more concerned with keeping Texas off base than retaliating for his catcher. Probably didn't have any confidence in himself and was unwilling to give TExas extra baserunners.

 

I hate that reasoning. Any time Ozzie's passion gets out of control he isn't responsible because that's just his personality? Bulls***. Wrong is wrong no matter what type of "flavor" a person has.

[Kalapse]

The general Sox fan internet population suffers from occasional bouts of temporary stupidity when "prospect" pitchers are involved. I submit the follwing for evidence (we've seen it time and again):

 

Sox fan hears Player a is being traded. Player a is a random mid-round pick from 4 years ago. He's 25 years old. He's a couple years older than his peers. He's never dominated in the minors to any degree, but the Sox of course call him a prospect. This is not suprising, because the Sox call all of their minor leaguers "prospects with great tools." To back this up they give Sox fans useful statistics like "in rookie league 2004, player a held left-handed hitters to an amazing .017 batting average in day games during the second week of July when no one was on base and a slight drizzle was falling sideways from a south-southeasterly direction."

 

Sox fans naturally reply with "Wow! We need him in our bullpen to get lefties out! No one can hit him! He's the next Hoyt Wilhelm!" or "We're trading him for WHO??!??!?! He's an amazing prospect, we need to be getting at least a Carl Crawford or Vernon Wells for him!!!"

 

Sox fans love to ignore the giant elephant in the middle of the room when "prospects" are involved in any situation that could be conceived as detrimental to their "progress." That giant elephant being that every pro scout not on the Sox payroll says that player a is a heap of dog doodie...

 

Anyway, the moral of the story is this, folks:

 

NO ONE OUTSIDE OF THE WHITE SOX ORGANIZATION CONSIDERS SEAN TRACEY TO BE A GREAT PROSPECT! You won't see him on any list of notable prospects.

 

Settle down! What we have here is either:

1) a non-prospect, unimportant minor league callup that thinks he doesn't have to listen to Ozzie

2) a non-prospect, unimportant minor league callup that is unable to plunk a 6'1" 200 lb target when he's really trying to

 

In either case, he's not worth worrying about and does not belong on a major league club, let alone one in contention. If Ozzie yelling at him makes him tear up like a little girl with a skinned knee, how could he ever handle the pressure of a playoff game? Sean Tracey is not worth worrying about and we now have the talented and proven Mr. Riske here to take his spot. Hopefully Kenny can work his magic and turn Tracey, under the guise of him being a "prospect" into a piece of a trade for another dependable relief arm around the deadline.

 

Sean Tracey...He Gawn!

He may not be a huge prospect nationally as in one of the best in the minors receiving major accolades from the mainstream media but when it comes down to the micro side of it he is still considered a top 10 prospect in the White Sox organization, he may not be a top of the line prospect with a giant upside but he is far from a non-prospect.

 

#10 on Baseball America's Top 10 Sox Prospects

 

#7 on Futuresox.com's List of Top 10 Sox Prospects

 

I hate that reasoning. Any time Ozzie's passion gets out of control he isn't responsible because that's just his personality? Bulls***. Wrong is wrong no matter what type of "flavor" a person has.

IT'S JUST OZZIE BE'IN OZZIE!

 

*laughtrack*

[gojimthome]

He may not be a huge prospect nationally as in one of the best in the minors receiving major accolades from the mainstream media but when it comes down to the micro side of it he is still considered a top 10 prospect in the White Sox organization, he may not be a top of the line prospect with a giant upside but he is far from a non-prospect.

 

#10 on Baseball America's Top 10 Sox Prospects

 

#7 on Futuresox.com's List of Top 10 Sox Prospects

IT'S JUST OZZIE BE'IN OZZIE!

 

*laughtrack*

 

#10 in the White Sox organization (which is usually ranked in the middle fo the pack)= #250 or so in the country = Nothing

 

When you rank below Jerry Owens in 2006, you have issues.

Edited June 15, 2006 by Contreras' Crew

[whitesoxfan101]

#10 in the White Sox organization (which is usually ranked in the middle fo the pack)= #250 or so in the country = Nothing

 

When you rank below Jerry Owens in 2006, you have issues.

 

So we should treat players in accordance with their organizational standing? You are aware that goes against all this organization stands for with it's "no superstar, treat everybody with the same disclipline and respect" attitude right? No you aren't, so please get a clue and get a new argument if you want to defend the organzation here.

[Balta1701]

#10 in the White Sox organization (which is usually ranked in the middle fo the pack)= #250 or so in the country = Nothing

 

When you rank below Jerry Owens in 2006, you have issues.

Sometimes, the position a prospect projects to can impact where they rank in those. A left fielder might be ranked higher than a middle relief pitcher, for example, even though you need both.

[Flash Tizzle]

I hate that reasoning. Any time Ozzie's passion gets out of control he isn't responsible because that's just his personality? Bulls***. Wrong is wrong no matter what type of "flavor" a person has.

Accept it. He's responsible for his actions, obviously, just don't expect a transformation in personality. He's said in numerous interviews from the Chicago Tribune to Outside the Lines he's not going to change. I'm not professing "Ozzie being Ozzie," I just don't care. It's that simple. I watch baseball for baseball, not a manager's comments. Show up the entire fanbase for all I care. Just make the correct managerial decisions on the field when it counts.

[shoota]

Accept it. He's responsible for his actions, obviously, just don't expect a transformation in personality. He's said in numerous interviews from the Chicago Tribune to Outside the Lines he's not going to change. I'm not professing "Ozzie being Ozzie," I just don't care. It's that simple. I watch baseball for baseball, not a manager's comments. Show up the entire fanbase for all I care. Just make the correct managerial decisions on the field when it counts.

 

Your post doesn't necessarily conflict with mine, the one you quoted. So what specific part(s) of my post do you disagree with? Here it is again:

 

I hate that reasoning. Any time Ozzie's passion gets out of control he isn't responsible because that's just his personality? Bulls***. Wrong is wrong no matter what type of "flavor" a person has.

[Flash Tizzle]

Your post doesn't necessarily conflict with mine, the one you quoted. So what specific part(s) of my post do you disagree with? Here it is again:

 

I hate that reasoning. Any time Ozzie's passion gets out of control he isn't responsible because that's just his personality? Bulls***. Wrong is wrong no matter what type of "flavor" a person has.

You're right. More than answering your post directly I was citing Kalapse's "Ozzie being Ozzie" phrase. It's more a quote used for his apologists who support everything he says regardless of content.

 

To address your post directly, he is responsible for his personality. I'm certain the White Sox organization wishes he would tone down his attitude. I just don't care what he says. Offensive or not, I don't place much creedence in any manager's comments. Whether it's Guillen, Baker, or Cox.

 

I don't intend for anyone to believe I'm condoning what he says. He'll continue using foul language in interviews and insulting opposing players/managers when he deems fit. Whenever the next controversy abrupts and people are once again complaining, I'll look past it. Unless it happens to directly affect the product on the field.

Edited June 16, 2006 by Flash Tizzle

[Heads22]

Ozzie Guillen Kills Man; Expected to use "Ozzie being Ozzie" defense in Court

[gojimthome]

http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/7577/1975/1600/tracey.jpg

[YASNY]

Great thread guys. Here's my take on iyt, but almost everything has already been said. I don't think Ozzie did anything wrong here. He brought in Tracey as the sacrificial lamb to drill Blalock. Tracey didn't get it done. Even if he 'tried' to hit him twice, he was damn sure tentative about it or he would have thrown 4 straight high and tight fastballs. If Tracey doesn't have the gonads to drill a hitter when told, he doesn't have the gonads to be a ML pitcher. At least, not yet.

 

The one thing I didn't see mentioned in this thread is the fact that MLB needs to scrap this damn warning system and let the game police itself. It worked for 100 years or so, and would work again. The current system let's things remain unfinished which leaves lingering resentment to build and fester. One of these days, somehow, somewhere, someone's going to really blow a gasket and ruin a career or two. Call off the umps and let's players take care of what needs to be taken care of.

[southsider2k5]

#10 in the White Sox organization (which is usually ranked in the middle fo the pack)= #250 or so in the country = Nothing

 

When you rank below Jerry Owens in 2006, you have issues.

 

Do me a favor and dig out where Mark Buehrle ranked on those lists over the years, and try to explain to me how much they really matter in the long run.