Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 The solution is trade for KENNY LOFTON right f***ing now I said it in my first thread here......Kenny will definitely help this O and D Screw Willie and Rowand for now....let Borchard learn in the AAA :fyou kenny lofton.. we made that mistake once already......hes not welcome back here as far as im concerned.. the lazy asshole........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshPR Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 No interest in Kenny either. Don't want another Kenny around here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 For those of you that want to see Willie, I won't be shocked when it happens. He was shagging flies out in center on Saturday and was able to throw just fine (Or so it looked) and with his other arm he made some catches with his hand all the way up, which tells me the shoulder is fine. I'd look for him to be activated any day now and my guess would be that Joey B would go down, unless they decided to drop a pitcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI1020 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 Last winter, when I was new to this board, I expressed my doubts about Joe B, and I was roundly criticized. I still have those doubts. The kid looks great, runs great, throws great, but I have never seen a good major league hitter swing the way he does. Everyone is entitled to mistakes in the draft. If he doesn't make it, so what. Send him down and let him flounder at AAA. If he figures it out, we have a winner. Otherwise, let's stop the wishful thinking. He has to learn to hit before he comes to the show again. I would rather concentrate on some other option in center. I was one of those yelling for him to be brought up early in the year. Then I saw him play at home for the Knights. Our seats were great and as I watched him I realized that this guy is never going to hit major league pitching unless he seriously modifies his swing. I don't think he's ever going to do it, but would be more than glad to be wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 I agree with Brando Fan, BMR, Rex and others who say Borchard is not ready. And to others yes it seems we are screwed big time in CF at the moment. My question is why can't someone work with Joe on his swing. It was critiqued perfectly on this thread. Someone has to tell the guy that the swing has to change or else there is NO future for him in the bigs. Is he set in his ways and uncoachable? Joe from what I have seen and understand is anything but uncoachable. He is a brilliant young man who was attending the Harvard of the West in Stanford. They have been working with him and have already changed the plane of his swing and are working on shortening it up. It took them two years to get Joe Crede's swing ready for the big leagues and that is after Crede has been playing baseball all of his life. Borchard is a raw work in progress. Once again for everyone who is jumping off of bridges because of Borchard this guy is playing in only his SECOND FULL SEASON of baseball. His whole life he played football first then baseball. This kid is learning on the job. Giving up on him at this stage of his career is senseless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI1020 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 Joe from what I have seen and understand is anything but uncoachable. He is a brilliant young man who was attending the Harvard of the West in Stanford. They have been working with him and have already changed the plane of his swing and are working on shortening it up. It took them two years to get Joe Crede's swing ready for the big leagues and that is after Crede has been playing baseball all of his life. Borchard is a raw work in progress. Once again for everyone who is jumping off of bridges because of Borchard this guy is playing in only his SECOND FULL SEASON of baseball. His whole life he played football first then baseball. This kid is learning on the job. Giving up on him at this stage of his career is senseless. Like I said, I'd be happy to be wrong here. I've seen some good White Sox CFers in my lifetime. We need another in the tradition of Landis, Berry and Lemon. The sooner the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 Joe from what I have seen and understand is anything but uncoachable. He is a brilliant young man who was attending the Harvard of the West in Stanford. They have been working with him and have already changed the plane of his swing and are working on shortening it up. It took them two years to get Joe Crede's swing ready for the big leagues and that is after Crede has been playing baseball all of his life. Borchard is a raw work in progress. Once again for everyone who is jumping off of bridges because of Borchard this guy is playing in only his SECOND FULL SEASON of baseball. His whole life he played football first then baseball. This kid is learning on the job. Giving up on him at this stage of his career is senseless. I agree with you completely. Although I am not sure he is a true CF, but that is an argument for another time. From what I saw of Joe, he was great. I heard nothing but good things about him. Unfortunately, he has the albatross of a $5.3 million contract hanging over his head. Pay a guy that kind of money and people expect results. I am of the belief that Joe is not ready for the big leagues at this point. I have wondered aloud why he seems to have regressed since going to Charlotte. Perhaps it is a matter of taking a step or two back to be able to make a leap forward? It just concerns me that improvement is not evident, at least in his numbers. I also wonder why he did well under Gregg Ritchie, and not under Greg Walker. I may be reading into nothing, but it runs through my mind. I do hope Joe makes it and makes it big time and have not given up on him, but it is natural I think to wonder "what if?". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 I have never been a huge fan of Borchard's to begin with. I am a huge fan of plate disipline and believe it is a good way to measure a youngster and how much he is going to progress. There are rare occasions when players with terrible plate disipline(Soriano for example) suceed, but for the most part you have to have decent plate disipline to develop. I can live with a guy that strikesout a ton as long as he draws walks(ala Thome) and after Borchard's 1st year of pro ball it appeared that Borchard was going to be one of those players, however, he has since regressed over the past two year and it is no coinsidence that his overall numbers have also fallen. His swing needs some major work and that work should be done at AAA. I am also not sold on him being an everyday CF. I think he will be much better suited as a corner outfielder. I think Harris should be given a chance to start once he comes off the DL. You have to be doing something right to hit .420 for almost a month at AAA. He also has very good range in CF and is a better option defensively then Borchard. He would also add an element of speed to the lineup, which this one dimension power or nothing lineup needs. I say give Harris another month in CF and if he doesn't improve some, than give either Rowand or Borchard(whichever is performing better at AAA) another shot. Either way the Sox should be able to get more production from CF then they currently have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTC2784 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 I have never been a huge fan of Borchard's to begin with. I am a huge fan of plate disipline and believe it is a good way to measure a youngster and how much he is going to progress. There are rare occasions when players with terrible plate disipline(Soriano for example) suceed, but for the most part you have to have decent plate disipline to develop. I can live with a guy that strikesout a ton as long as he draws walks(ala Thome) and after Borchard's 1st year of pro ball it appeared that Borchard was going to be one of those players, however, he has since regressed over the past two year and it is no coinsidence that his overall numbers have also fallen. His swing needs some major work and that work should be done at AAA. I am also not sold on him being an everyday CF. I think he will be much better suited as a corner outfielder. I think Harris should be given a chance to start once he comes off the DL. You have to be doing something right to hit .420 for almost a month at AAA. He also has very good range in CF and is a better option defensively then Borchard. He would also add an element of speed to the lineup, which this one dimension power or nothing lineup needs. I say give Harris another month in CF and if he doesn't improve some, than give either Rowand or Borchard(whichever is performing better at AAA) another shot. Either way the Sox should be able to get more production from CF then they currently have. I always thought Joe B had good speed.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 I have never been a huge fan of Borchard's to begin with. I am a huge fan of plate disipline and believe it is a good way to measure a youngster and how much he is going to progress. There are rare occasions when players with terrible plate disipline(Soriano for example) suceed, but for the most part you have to have decent plate disipline to develop. I can live with a guy that strikesout a ton as long as he draws walks(ala Thome) and after Borchard's 1st year of pro ball it appeared that Borchard was going to be one of those players, however, he has since regressed over the past two year and it is no coinsidence that his overall numbers have also fallen. His swing needs some major work and that work should be done at AAA. I am also not sold on him being an everyday CF. I think he will be much better suited as a corner outfielder. I think Harris should be given a chance to start once he comes off the DL. You have to be doing something right to hit .420 for almost a month at AAA. He also has very good range in CF and is a better option defensively then Borchard. He would also add an element of speed to the lineup, which this one dimension power or nothing lineup needs. I say give Harris another month in CF and if he doesn't improve some, than give either Rowand or Borchard(whichever is performing better at AAA) another shot. Either way the Sox should be able to get more production from CF then they currently have. I always thought Joe B had good speed.... He takes a couple steps to get going. He has zero quickness and decent speed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 I have never been a huge fan of Borchard's to begin with. I am a huge fan of plate disipline and believe it is a good way to measure a youngster and how much he is going to progress. There are rare occasions when players with terrible plate disipline(Soriano for example) suceed, but for the most part you have to have decent plate disipline to develop. I can live with a guy that strikesout a ton as long as he draws walks(ala Thome) and after Borchard's 1st year of pro ball it appeared that Borchard was going to be one of those players, however, he has since regressed over the past two year and it is no coinsidence that his overall numbers have also fallen. His swing needs some major work and that work should be done at AAA. I am also not sold on him being an everyday CF. I think he will be much better suited as a corner outfielder. I think Harris should be given a chance to start once he comes off the DL. You have to be doing something right to hit .420 for almost a month at AAA. He also has very good range in CF and is a better option defensively then Borchard. He would also add an element of speed to the lineup, which this one dimension power or nothing lineup needs. I say give Harris another month in CF and if he doesn't improve some, than give either Rowand or Borchard(whichever is performing better at AAA) another shot. Either way the Sox should be able to get more production from CF then they currently have. I always thought Joe B had good speed.... He takes a couple steps to get going. He has zero quickness and decent speed. .....joes pretty fast from what i recall..........am i thinking of the wrong joe?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clujer420 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 Joe was AWESOME in BP, but that was about it. He's not ready to be in the majors, and he's not much more than a rally killer at this point. I don't know who we should have out there (Rowand?), but JB's clearly not ready. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 i have said all along hes not ready .. he himself has said he wasnt ready......but a situation came up and he was needed, he hasnt been very bad for a rookie but he hasnt actually had a stellar performance either like everyone expected out of him.........im all for bringing rowand back up and let joe go with ritchie for a while to work on his swing.............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 I still like JB and think he will be fine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 i have said all along hes not ready .. he himself has said he wasnt ready......but a situation came up and he was needed, he hasnt been very bad for a rookie but he hasnt actually had a stellar performance either like everyone expected out of him.........im all for bringing rowand back up and let joe go with ritchie for a while to work on his swing.............. If I were a betting man (and I am), I 'd bet you will get that wish soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rafacosta Posted June 9, 2003 Share Posted June 9, 2003 Manuel said there's a reason why he continues to start rookie center fielder Joe Borchard despite his .184 average. "Joe Borchard is a guy that not only probably has concerns about himself, but has concerns about the team," Manuel said. "He's the type of guy that if we win the game, he's really satisfied. That's what's important to him. He has great leadership potential, as far as teammates. I really see that in him." The other attribute Manuel has noticed is Borchard always seems to be in the middle of a Sox rally. That was the case Sunday. Borchard reached on an error and scored in the Sox's five-run fifth inning. "When he gets it right, he's going to be special," Manuel said. "If you've watched us lately, when we've needed a hit, he seems to get it. Even though he's in a slump, he seems to be in the middle of (rallies)." I like what JM said in here...Joe B will be the future of the Sox and not Aaron and RIos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 If I were a betting man (and I am), I 'd bet you will get that wish soon. maybe you should have laid odds on it?????? lol......too late now....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 maybe you should have laid odds on it?????? lol......too late now....... Would I have had any takers? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Would I have had any takers? im sure maury would have taken you up on it.. he is a part of the dorn fan club......lol.... maybe showtime too??? you missed a chance to gain a few bucks mr. gambler lol........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 im sure maury would have taken you up on it.. he is a part of the dorn fan club......lol.... maybe showtime too??? you missed a chance to gain a few bucks mr. gambler lol........ Maybe next time I am feeling clairvoyant! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hotsoxchick1 Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Maybe next time I am feeling clairvoyant! next time i should just give ya a heads up...........lol..........hmmm my next wish is..............(to be continued)......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 I agree that Borchard isn't ready. But then again, neither is Harris or Rowand. I keep hearing how fast Harris is - yes, he's fast as diarrhea coming from a stomach patient. However, you can't steal 1st base. If we're going to struggle in CF with an underperforming loser who can't hit the Medoza Line - I'd rather it be with our "hot prospect" instead of two minor-league borderline players. However, read on. Actually, if I had my total druthers, I wouldn't play any of those three losers on the parent club - I would find a cheap-ass CF like Tom Goodwin to just fill in the spot until one of the 3 young losers gets a clue and decides that a bat is for hitting a ball - not just a customary part of the uniform when you go to the plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Showtime Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 im sure maury would have taken you up on it.. he is a part of the dorn fan club......lol.... maybe showtime too??? you missed a chance to gain a few bucks mr. gambler lol........ I'm not that stupid Michelle. If Rex says Dorn is coming up I know it to be true. Don't get me started on that whole "left the bats in B-Ham story" he gave us earlier this year. :finger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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