Iraq in Miserable State, Ambassador Memo says

[jackie hayes]

It absolutely will take time, and Americans do not have the guts for it to work over the amount of time it will take to really make it.

Even if we do, there's nothing to suggest that "time" alone will do anything. The factions in Iraq aren't just going to forget their differences if we wait them out. But I've heard nothing but platitudes about resolving these differences, nothing that we would actually do in any length of time.

[kapkomet]

Even if we do, there's nothing to suggest that "time" alone will do anything. The factions in Iraq aren't just going to forget their differences if we wait them out. But I've heard nothing but platitudes about resolving these differences, nothing that we would actually do in any length of time.

Let me rephrase. Americans won't have the guts to wait for the factions in Iraq to co-exist. I know, they've been fighting for thousands of years. I get it.

[jackie hayes]

Let me rephrase. Americans won't have the guts to wait for the factions in Iraq to co-exist. I know, they've been fighting for thousands of years. I get it.

I'm not trying to be preachy, I know you "get it". (And I never said anything about "thousands of years" -- sometimes it just takes one generation.) Let me put it as a question -- What does the administration plan to do while waiting to make coexistence happen? If nothing more than hold elections (which is all I see), is it just a question of having the guts to wait it out? If we wait 20 years, would everyone get along by then? 50 years?

 

I just don't think guts has anything to do with it.

[kapkomet]

I'm not trying to be preachy, I know you "get it". (And I never said anything about "thousands of years" -- sometimes it just takes one generation.) Let me put it as a question -- What does the administration plan to do while waiting to make coexistence happen? If nothing more than hold elections (which is all I see), is it just a question of having the guts to wait it out? If we wait 20 years, would everyone get along by then? 50 years?

 

I just don't think guts has anything to do with it.

By extension, how long do we wait for the Pali's and Isreal to 'co-exist'? It's sort of the same thing. Americans are too wishy-washy to stomach any sticky political situation, as exhibited by damn near everything that's happening in politics in this country. No one wants to "give-in" because they're always right. It's a sad commentary of humanity.

[Rex Kickass]

Important development in Iraq, I fear.

 

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/06/24/...main/index.html

 

BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- U.S. forces released a revered 70-year-old Sunni cleric on Saturday hours after detaining him, Iraqi officials said.

 

Crowds earlier gathered to denounce the early morning raid on the Tikrit home of Sheik Jamal Abdul Karim al-Dabban. The raid was described as "outrageous" by a key political party.

 

U.S. forces told Iraqi authorities that bad intelligence led to the raid and detention of al-Dabban and two of his sons, officials from Salaheddin province said.

 

The officials said that the U.S. military apologized to al-Dabban and to the provincial governor and the head of the provincial council.

 

Earlier, the largest and most powerful Sunni Arab political party issued a statement denouncing the raid in Saddam Hussein's hometown of Tikrit, about 100 miles (160 kilometers) north of Baghdad.

 

"The foolishness of U.S. troops has reached its limit," the Iraqi Islamic Party said. "These outrageous violations are only going to worsen the security situation in the country."

 

Hundreds of people responded to calls over mosque loudspeakers to gather in front of the governor's office to protest the detention, said local official Sheik Yahya Ibrahim al-Atwani, The Associated Press reported.

 

Iraqi officials later said a banquet would be held at the Tikrit Grand Mosque on Saturday evening to celebrate the sheik's release.

 

The deputy governor of Salaheddin province, Abdullah Hussein Ajbara, said earlier that the Salaheddin provincial council and other government institutions suspended work to protest the detention.

 

"He is against terrorism and sectarianism," Ajbara said of al-Dabban, whom he described as a very revered, moderate senior leader of Iraq's Sunni Muslim community. "There was no reason for U.S. forces to detain him."

 

The U.S. military on Saturday referred to the detention of a "senior sheik" in a statement about a raid and detentions in Tikrit. But the statement did not say whether an apology was issued nor did it disclose the sheik's name.

 

"One of the detainees was later determined to be a senior sheik in the area, and coalition forces have since released him. The security forces did not know it was a senior sheik's house when they conducted the assault," the statement said.

 

The military said "five suspected terrorists" -- including the sheik -- were detained during the raid, after receiving intelligence following the recent airstrike on the safehouse near Baquba that killed Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the leader of al Qaeda in Iraq.

 

"One of the suspects was directly associated with several senior-level al Qaeda members and reportedly plays an important role in the network between Baquba and Tikrit," the statement said.

 

The sheik's release left four people in custody, the military said.

[jackie hayes]

By extension, how long do we wait for the Pali's and Isreal to 'co-exist'? It's sort of the same thing. Americans are too wishy-washy to stomach any sticky political situation, as exhibited by damn near everything that's happening in politics in this country. No one wants to "give-in" because they're always right. It's a sad commentary of humanity.

Maybe so, but we're not going to change "humanity".

 

As for the Palestinian-Israeli conflict, imo, we've basically given up on coexistence. As Bush has said, the US goal is to have two separate states, something that isn't politically palatable in Iraq.