NYT discloses secret program to track terrorist finances.

[LowerCaseRepublican]

And Nuke, if you're really interested about "Ye Olde" newspapers covering wars, check out newspaper coverage during the French and Indian War (predates the US revolution for the non-history buffs out there...but Jefferson and Co. were alive)

 

http://www.earlyamerica.com/review/spring97/newspapers.html

 

Published in the Maryland Gazette on March 21 and 28, Washington's Journal gave newspaper readers a first-person account of his talks with Native American and French military leaders west of the Appalachians. Readers learned of French forts from New Orleans to Canada, a network of Native American alliances with the French, and how difficult moving supplies into the region would be for British fighting units.

 

So, they covered the war pretty damn closely and discussed war tactics/methods. For instance, take the British going after Louisbourg. Newspaper reports revealed the strategy for the taking of Louisbourg. First, British ships, including two hundred sail from Halifax, set up patrols from Boston throughout the North Atlantic to capture French ships or to keep them from reaching Louisbourg. While the ships patrolled the waters, transports carrying approximately eight thousand land troops headed for Halifax to strengthen the colonial militia and British regulars stationed there. The seige of Louisbourg began on May 22, newspapers reported, when 14,500 British regulars and colonial militiamen left Halifax. Following the departure of the troops, letters from citizens in Halifax and from soldiers provided the bulk of the information that newspapers printed about the actual seige.

 

Transports ferried the troops the two hundred miles from Halifax to Louisbourg where they stormed the beaches with fixed bayonets. On June 10, British troops had reached "the very Gates of Louisbourg" and "burnt all the Merchant Ships in the Harbour of Louisbourg," newspaper reports said. By June 24, a letter from an officer explained, Louisbourg was completely shut off from all outside communication and being continually bombarded by cannon and mortars.50 Because news from Louisbourg was so extensive and detailed, the New-York Mercury provided its readers with a woodcut of "the City and Harbour of Louisbourg," which explained the city's location, the location of English gun batteries, and the proximity of Cape Breton Island to Acadia or Nova Scotia.

 

--

The papers told the exact strategy used and guess what -- It still worked and there were no "OMG! WE MUST STOP TEH MEDIA!11!!!1! ELEVENTY!" chants.

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

The papers told the exact strategy used and guess what -- It still worked and there were no "OMG! WE MUST STOP TEH MEDIA!11!!!1! ELEVENTY!" chants.

 

 

OMG SOME OF US DONT REALIZE THAT THEY DIDN'T HAVE ACCESS TO INSTANT COMMUNICATION IN THOSE DAYS AND THAT ACCOUNTS OF THE BATTLES WERENT AVAILABLE UNTIL WELL AFTER THE FACT.

 

OMG WE MUST SAVE THE MEDIAS RIGHT TO PRINT CLASSIFIED WAR PLANS !11!!1!!11 ELEVENTY!!!!!

[Rex Kickass]

Nuke, have you read the article in question?

[Cerbaho-WG]

And herein lies the disconnect between us.

You simply have no clue whatsoever the consequenses of classified information reaching the wrong people. You simply have no idea what it is like to conduct a raid on a building and have the guys inside tipped off that you're coming. The NYT leaking this information to Al Qaeda is no different from some worm getting a sniff about an op we have laid on and telling the intended target about it. The price for such conduct is paid in blood.

 

Ok, you've posted five different analogies that have been blown out of proportion. We get it. This is not giving battle plans to the enemy, this is not leaking nuclear secrets to Russians, this is not sabotaging the War on Trrrr. Let's not be naive and use our brains for once: do you honestly think that terrorists organizations are so dumb that they're funneling money to buy RPGs and AK-47s out of major banks? Are you that myopic?

 

It's the same argument with the wiretapping going on. People are assuming that terrorist cells are just using landlines and cell phones to communicate with each other. These people aren't idiots, and I think we learned that five years ago.

 

You want to blame someone for outing this dirty little secret, blame your own damn government.

 

The Office of Foreign Assets Control ("OFAC") of the US Department of the Treasury administers and enforces economic and trade sanctions based on US foreign policy and national security goals against targeted foreign countries, terrorists, international narcotics traffickers, and those engaged in activities related to the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction.

 

f***ing Dept. of Treasury, WHY DO YOU HATE FREEDOM?

[minors]

And Nuke, if you're really interested about "Ye Olde" newspapers covering wars, check out newspaper coverage during the French and Indian War (predates the US revolution for the non-history buffs out there...but Jefferson and Co. were alive)

 

http://www.earlyamerica.com/review/spring97/newspapers.html

 

Published in the Maryland Gazette on March 21 and 28, Washington's Journal gave newspaper readers a first-person account of his talks with Native American and French military leaders west of the Appalachians. Readers learned of French forts from New Orleans to Canada, a network of Native American alliances with the French, and how difficult moving supplies into the region would be for British fighting units.

 

So, they covered the war pretty damn closely and discussed war tactics/methods. For instance, take the British going after Louisbourg. Newspaper reports revealed the strategy for the taking of Louisbourg. First, British ships, including two hundred sail from Halifax, set up patrols from Boston throughout the North Atlantic to capture French ships or to keep them from reaching Louisbourg. While the ships patrolled the waters, transports carrying approximately eight thousand land troops headed for Halifax to strengthen the colonial militia and British regulars stationed there. The seige of Louisbourg began on May 22, newspapers reported, when 14,500 British regulars and colonial militiamen left Halifax. Following the departure of the troops, letters from citizens in Halifax and from soldiers provided the bulk of the information that newspapers printed about the actual seige.

 

Transports ferried the troops the two hundred miles from Halifax to Louisbourg where they stormed the beaches with fixed bayonets. On June 10, British troops had reached "the very Gates of Louisbourg" and "burnt all the Merchant Ships in the Harbour of Louisbourg," newspaper reports said. By June 24, a letter from an officer explained, Louisbourg was completely shut off from all outside communication and being continually bombarded by cannon and mortars.50 Because news from Louisbourg was so extensive and detailed, the New-York Mercury provided its readers with a woodcut of "the City and Harbour of Louisbourg," which explained the city's location, the location of English gun batteries, and the proximity of Cape Breton Island to Acadia or Nova Scotia.

 

--

The papers told the exact strategy used and guess what -- It still worked and there were no "OMG! WE MUST STOP TEH MEDIA!11!!!1! ELEVENTY!" chants.

 

 

Wow this really made me laugh. Communication took upwards up a week back then. By the time that they recived these reports the army could be 500 miles away. That is why in 1815 we fought the battle of New Orleans even though a peace treaty was signed a month before!

 

:headshake

[Rex Kickass]

Minors, have you read the article in question?

[minors]

Yep and I agree this isn't selling secrets, But I am responding to LCR who seems to think it would be OK even if they were selling secrets. I agree with you though on this one Rex

[Rex Kickass]

So you're saying that this isn't treason?

 

It's not what you said it was three pages ago?

 

This type of behavior is also like lets say the NYT got the Plans for the Manhattan project and posted them on the newspaper and gave a copy to Japan.

 

What is it then? It looks to me like political posturing. Deflecting your shortcomings by scapegoating something printed in a newspaper. I seem to recall someone else doing that a few months ago.....

[LowerCaseRepublican]

So you're saying that this isn't treason?

 

It's not what you said it was three pages ago?

What is it then? It looks to me like political posturing. Deflecting your shortcomings by scapegoating something printed in a newspaper. I seem to recall someone else doing that a few months ago.....

ISN'T THIS A MEDIA WATCH THREAD?

 

C'mon Rex, do your job!

[minors]

So you're saying that this isn't treason?

 

It's not what you said it was three pages ago?

What is it then? It looks to me like political posturing. Deflecting your shortcomings by scapegoating something printed in a newspaper. I seem to recall someone else doing that a few months ago.....

 

 

All I said that it wasn't selling secrets the first time I read it I though it said selling secrets. I still don't like the fact they are spreding this info in their bid to sell more papers.

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

Wow this really made me laugh. Communication took upwards up a week back then. By the time that they recived these reports the army could be 500 miles away. That is why in 1815 we fought the battle of New Orleans even though a peace treaty was signed a month before!

 

:headshake

 

 

You said it better than I did.

 

 

LOL!!!

 

 

 

So you're saying that this isn't treason?

 

It's not what you said it was three pages ago?

What is it then? It looks to me like political posturing. Deflecting your shortcomings by scapegoating something printed in a newspaper. I seem to recall someone else doing that a few months ago.....

 

 

What are you talking about?! Its you that has no answer for comparisons between this treason and the hypotheticals we have talked about here.

[Rex Kickass]

All I said that it wasn't selling secrets the first time I read it I though it said selling secrets. I still don't like the fact they are spreding this info in their bid to sell more papers.

 

They are reporting the news. And they were the third paper to report on it.

 

You said it better than I did.

LOL!!!

What are you talking about?! Its you that has no answer for comparisons between this treason and the hypotheticals we have talked about here.

You have no answer to the question if you've read the article? Clearly, you haven't. So why should I bother arguing about it with someone who won't scratch deeper than Tony Snow's talking points?

 

It's like you're being fed outrage over something you don't understand the context of... didn't that happen somehwere else a few months ago? I don't think it was in the US.... but somewhere.... oh where was that again?

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

Yep and I agree this isn't selling secrets, But I am responding to LCR who seems to think it would be OK even if they were selling secrets. I agree with you though on this one Rex

 

 

The difference between selling secrets to Al Qaeda directly and printing them in a newspaper where Al Qaeda can see them and doing it for profit is mighty thin.

 

While we're talking about it I wouldn't be surprised if half of the editorial staff and managers at the NYT weren't above selling secrets to Al Qaeda if they came to be in possession of them.

[minors]

You said it better than I did.

LOL!!!

What are you talking about?! Its you that has no answer for comparisons between this treason and the hypotheticals we have talked about here.

 

That's right, While I don't think they are selling them directly to the terrorists it is still treason to publish this stuff to sell a paper. Rex do you really think there in this for the 1st amendment no they are in it to sell a paper.

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

The NYSlimes were the 'exclusive', supposedly, and the other papers copied it.

 

 

Bumped

 

That's right, While I don't think they are selling them directly to the terrorists it is still treason to publish this stuff to sell a paper. Rex do you really think there in this for the 1st amendment no they are in it to sell a paper............and pursue their radical leftist agenda.

 

 

Fixed for ya.

[minors]

Bumped

Fixed for ya.

 

NUKE

[Rex Kickass]

The L.A. Times article ran Friday.

 

The New York Times article ran Friday too.

 

Bumped

Fixed for ya.

Nuke, have you read the article in question?

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

Ok, you've posted five different analogies that have been blown out of proportion. We get it. This is not giving battle plans to the enemy, this is not leaking nuclear secrets to Russians, this is not sabotaging the War on Trrrr. Let's not be naive and use our brains for once: do you honestly think that terrorists organizations are so dumb that they're funneling money to buy RPGs and AK-47s out of major banks? Are you that myopic?

 

It's the same argument with the wiretapping going on. People are assuming that terrorist cells are just using landlines and cell phones to communicate with each other. These people aren't idiots, and I think we learned that five years ago.

 

Uhh. Yes they are stupid enough to use commercial banks ( not that they have much choice ). They just set up shell companies or "charity" organizations to launder their money like any other criminal organization would. This is evidenced by the number of terrorists who have been captured or killed by tracing their money.

 

 

You want to blame someone for outing this dirty little secret,

f***ing Dept. of Treasury, WHY DO YOU HATE FREEDOM?

 

Fixed

 

The L.A. Times article ran Friday.

 

The New York Times article ran Friday too.

Nuke, have you read the article in question?

 

 

Yes...........and?

Edited June 27, 2006 by NUKE_CLEVELAND

[Gregory Pratt]

Guys,

 

Are you genuinely telling me that you think that al-Qaeda had no idea that we've been monitoring bank transactions, and that this has given them the tip that, hey, the Americans might be watching your money trail?

 

Give me a break.

Besides, in Price of Loyalty it's revealed that Paul O'Neill had been taking actions similar to this, except that there was no mention of the database. It's not as if this program -- this tool in the "War on Terra" -- is some huge secret unknown before today.

 

And Kap, you say they've got "blood on their hands." Do tell me who was killed because the New York Times leaked this, specifically and not in the abstract.

[Rex Kickass]

What's so bad about the article? What did it reveal that was so wrong? What was so surprising about it?

[Gregory Pratt]

What's so bad about the article? What did it reveal that was so wrong? What was so surprising about it?

 

I don't know, but apparently it's killed some people.

[Rex Kickass]

Newspapers don't kill people. People kill people.

[Gregory Pratt]

Newspapers don't kill people. People kill people.

 

I think you're overlooking the cases of people killing people with newspapers.

Maybe al-Qaeda terrorists are beating hostages with this article, rolled up?

 

Ye Gads, stop the presses -- FOREVER!

[FlaSoxxJim]

Guys,

 

Are you genuinely telling me that you think that al-Qaeda had no idea that we've been monitoring bank transactions, and that this has given them the tip that, hey, the Americans might be watching your money trail?

 

Yes. Shocked. SHOCKED I say.

 

And Kap, you say they've got "blood on their hands." Do tell me who was killed because the New York Times leaked this, specifically and not in the abstract.

 

A good question. kap?

[NUKE_CLEVELAND]

I don't know, but apparently it's killed some people.

 

 

The fact that a program of this type was outed in the level of detail it was will cause terrorists to rethink how they move money and that will make it harder to track...........and that will mean that it takes longer to run them down...........and that means that more people will die.

 

Get it now?