VAfan Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Anyone noticed that the Twins are now 45-35, having won 18 of 19? Or that we still trail the 56-26 Tigers? If our pitching doesn't find a way to improve itself, we could very easily finish third to these two clubs. In June, the Tigers ERA was 3.32. The Twins, with 2 automatic victories out of every 5 games when Santana or Liriano take the mound, was even better, at 2.76. Where was ours? 20th in baseball, at 4.74 runs a game. That's not counting the 15-spot the Cubs -- THE CUBS (who have the worst offense in baseball) -- laid on us yesterday, or the 6 they tallied the day before. Sure, we scored more runs in June than any team. 173 runs. That was 16 more than the Tigers, who came in second. But, because of the woeful pitching, we lost games 10-9 and 15-11 (the latter in July). That's not going to cut it for very long. It's hard to sustain winning streaks without solid starting pitching to sustain it. With Santana and Liriano penciled in for winning 4 out of every 10 games and the rest of the Twins starters capable of at least splitting the other 6 games, the Twins could win 100 games. (A 7-3 pace every 10 games actually would leave them at 102 or 103 wins.) After all, the Tigers went 55-25 in the first half. Why can't the Twins match that in the second half? (They may have the two best starters in baseball.) And, to win 100 games too, the Tigers need only go 44-36, which shouldn't be too hard if their pitching doesn't collapse. (Their offense can win them games too.) But can we win 100+ games without better pitching? I think it could be tough. We have 12 games against the Twins, 13 against Detroit, 12 against the Yanks and Boston, 6 in Oakland/LA, 3 at Toronto, 4 with Seattle and 7 more against Cleveland. That's 57 games against winning teams or teams that play us tough. We are still projecting last year's starters onto this year's team. But the June ERA's of our starters has been pathetic: Vazquez 7.50, Contreras 6.21, Garcia 4.81, Garland 4.50, Buehrle 3.89 (until yesterday's debacle). There isn't a single pitcher in there who would have a chance against the Twins or Tigers starters at the moment. A week ago, I said I wouldn't trade our guys for anyone else's guys. But after this latest spell of horrible pitching, I'm convinced we need a break. I wonder if Ozzie shouldn't have left Buehrle and Contreras off the AS team -- neither deserved the nods based on the way they have been pitching lately -- and just shut them down to get some rest. I'm not sure what else is going to work. We can't swap these guys out. And McCarthy can't sub for more than one of them, and even that would seem drastic. They are just going to have to suck it up and get it done. I'm not going to ever give up on these guys. GO WHITE SOX!! 2006 WORLD SERIES CHAMPS!!! Let's just say I'm concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 The sky is falling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoSox05 Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 I know im freaking out. We're only 25 games over .500. I think theres a chance that we can finsih last behing the Royals!! Sorry im just sick of the whole "im concerned" talk. Its never ending. I think the SOx could be undeafted right now and youd still here a coulpe of "i dont know, Are pitchers are 84-0, but you know the twins are kinda good" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkokieSox Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Wait... How does Contreras not deserve an AS spot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RibbieRubarb Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zach23 Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 I was hoping after going through the pressure of last year's postseason and seeing that this team can handle it, that more people would grow some balls. Too bad there are still so many that wet their pants so quickly during the season. f*** the Twins and Tigers. Let them and their fans wet their pants when they have to face the defending champs. Bring them on. If they really are that good then they deserve it. I thought Cleveland was supposed to be the big scary monster under the bed this season anyway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valponick Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 (edited) I'm not concerned about the Tigers, we've proven we can beat them, and those head to head games is where the division will be decided. The Twins 18-1 record over their last 19 is a bit misleading. They are playing well but they have beaten up on the same teams the White Sox and Tigers have. It is not just "bad luck" or a coincidence that they are still 10 games back after playing the best baseball they will play all year. After we get back to divisional play things will even themselves out and I expect the Sox to pull ahead. Edited July 3, 2006 by valponick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Hibbard Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 this thread is going to be some great comedy in about three months Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Yeah, grow some balls all of you pansies that are worried about 2 starters with ERA's over 5, another with a 4.65 ERA and no velocity, and two that have had a terrible June. f***ing pussies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxpride77 Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 I don't think VAfan is saying the sky is falling by any means. The truth is, our pitching has been really bad lately. The Tigers don't seem to be going anywhere, luckily they can't really seem to beat us. Just because this team won the World Series doesn't mean teams are going to run away from us. Right now, our offense is taking the focus off of our struggling pitching. Hopefully they can hold this up until the pitching gets on track. "To be blindly optimistic is not to be a Sox fan" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 QUOTE(soxpride77 @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 10:59 AM) I don't think VAfan is saying the sky is falling by any means. The truth is, our pitching has been really bad lately. The Tigers don't seem to be going anywhere, luckily they can't really seem to beat us. Just because this team won the World Series doesn't mean teams are going to run away from us. Right now, our offense is taking the focus off of our struggling pitching. Hopefully they can hold this up until the pitching gets on track. "To be blindly optimistic is not to be a Sox fan" You don't understand. There is no middle ground on Soxtalk. You're either completely optimistic 100% of the time in people's eyes, or you're completely negative 100% of the time. I'm very pessimistic admittedly, but a lot of other people catch tons of s*** just for mentioning one negative thing. Then, you get all the people saying they're overreacting or saying the sky is falling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonkeyKongerko Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxpride77 Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 I would say that I am mildly concerned at this point regarding our pitching staff. I just don't know how many more game-winning homeruns our offense can put up. "Holding the middle ground btween 100% optimistic and 100% pessimistic" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:19 AM) What a crock of s***. There are certain members on this site that spew negativity, and bring a very pessimistic view to most topics(you included) The only reason some think there is no middle ground on Soxtalk is because of people like you, who find ways to rip the team, and when someone refers to a positive aspect(lets say 2005 in general) you make the accusation of being an optimist. I purposely separated myself from the others in my post. I know I'm negative a whole lot more often than almost everyone, that's just how I am. I'm saying you get guys like VAfan who is only pointing out one negative fact, and he gets s*** on. I'm not pretending to be high and mighty. I fully understand that I'm negative/pessimistic, but it's gotten to the point on this site where anyone says something that's negative, and they're suddenly "one of them." The same thing goes for the optimistic ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zach23 Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Last year's mantra of the bed wetters: "Our pitching is great, but we keep winning only 2-1 and 1-0 and our offense isn't good enough to keep up with the big bad scary Indians. Sooner or later the pitching will fail and we will lose the division to them." This year's mantra of the bed wetters: "Our offense is great, but we keep winning games 10-9 and 11-8 with big comebacks. Our pitching isn't good enough to keep up with the big bad scary Tigers. Sooner or later the hitting will fail and we will lose the division to them." How do some people make it through life? When there is a little adversity or competition do you go running to hide from that too? Maybe the Tigers are the better team, but f*** them, they have to prove it over the long haul first. Come take it if you want it. Fear nobody. If you want to sit and piss your pants right now, then don't brag when the team does win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 QUOTE(zach23 @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:31 AM) Last year's mantra of the bed wetters: "Our pitching is great, but we keep winning only 2-1 and 1-0 and our offense isn't good enough to keep up with the big bad scary Indians. Sooner or later the pitching will fail and we will lose the division to them." This year's mantra of the bed wetters: "Our offense is great, but we keep winning games 10-9 and 11-8 with big comebacks. Our pitching isn't good enough to keep up with the big bad scary Tigers. Sooner or later the hitting will fail and we will lose the division to them." How do some people make it through life? When there is a little adversity or competition do you go running to hide from that too? Maybe the Tigers are the better team, but f*** them, they have to prove it over the long haul first. Come take it if you want it. Fear nobody. If you want to sit and piss your pants right now, then don't brag when the team does win. C'mon. Nobody is saying, "We're gonna lose the division, I'm gonna piss my pants, there's no hope for us." People simply point out what's wrong with the team that should be fixed. Teams don't slug their way to the WS anymore. If we want to win it all again, which we all do and that's the reason we're all concerned, we'll have to get better pitching from our starters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sin city sox fan Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Liriano and Santana won't lose the rest of the year??? Give me a break....they MAY win 75% of their starts but every pitcher in this game is beatable and does lose games. Furthermore, Santana has a proven past....but there's a good chance that Liriano may be a flash in the pan. A few good months does not make a superstar....we need to remember this whether we are talking about the White Sox or our opponents. The Twins will not win 100 games....I think 85-88 is more realistic and we should easily be able to outperform them. The Tigers should be a challenge for the division title....but as someone said in an earlier post, there's a lot of games left between the two teams and this will decide the division. Detroit has played at nearly 100% of their capablities for the first half of the season while we've probably realized 70% of our potential in 2006. If these roles reverse after the break, the Sox will win the division by 5-10 games....count on it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sox It To Em Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 We're halfway through the season and our ERA has rose like nearly one point since last year. So yes, I don't see it as being overly pessimistic to be concerned about our starting pitching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 Unless the starting pitching begins to improve I don't like our chances of repeating. And lets face it, the Sox are not known to be a great 2nd half team in recent years. Even in their championship year they dropped off considerably in the 2nd half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:40 AM) Unless the starting pitching begins to improve I don't like our chances of repeating. And lets face it, the Sox are not known to be a great 2nd half team in recent years. Even in their championship year they dropped off considerably in the 2nd half. Chicken Little Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RibbieRubarb Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 (edited) QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:35 AM) C'mon. Nobody is saying, "We're gonna lose the division, I'm gonna piss my pants, there's no hope for us." People simply point out what's wrong with the team that should be fixed. Teams don't slug their way to the WS anymore. If we want to win it all again, which we all do and that's the reason we're all concerned, we'll have to get better pitching from our starters. QUOTE(Sox It To Em @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:37 AM) We're halfway through the season and our ERA has rose like nearly one point since last year. So yes, I don't see it as being overly pessimistic to be concerned about our starting pitching. I think EVERYONE thinks our pitching needs to be better. But when you have the second best record in MLB and you are only one win off last year at this time. It's hard to see the reasoning behind the "We'll be in third place and not make the playoffs" rationale. Edited July 3, 2006 by RibbieRubarb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:42 AM) Chicken Little If the starting pitching can get close to their potential then I think we are a lock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxin' Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 VAfan, do you honestly think the Tigers and Twins can continue their 14 of 15 and 18 of 19 winning paces? There is absolutely no way. We went 14-4 against the National League and suddenly the sky is falling? Our record in June was 19-8, that is a .704 winning percentage. If we kept that pace up all year, we would win 114 games. If you want to look at the 19-8 record as a glass half empty and tell me, well take out the 8 game winning streak and we were only 11-8, or a .579 winning percentage. If we played that way the rest of the year, in our final 81 games, we would win 47 more games and finish with 100 wins. Even if we go just .500 the rest of the year, we would have 94 wins, and in a League where the Wild Card is coming from a three horse race in two divisions, 94 wins might just be enough. Calm down, enjoy a season series victory over the Cubs, 6 (possibly 7) All-Stars, and a 6-game lead in the Wild Card. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 QUOTE(RibbieRubarb @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:43 AM) I think EVERYONE thinks our pitching needs to be better. But when you have the second best record in MLB and you are only one win off last year at this time. It's hard to see the reasoning behind the "We'll be in third place and not make the playoffs" rationale. Well, I have to admit that the idea of finishing in third is a little ridiculous, but it is very plausible that we don't even make it back to the WS if our starters continue to be as bad as they have been. QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:43 AM) If the starting pitching can get close to their potential then I think we are a lock. Without a doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted July 3, 2006 Share Posted July 3, 2006 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jul 3, 2006 -> 11:46 AM) Not even the WORLD SERIES? Boy we are spoiled. Those are the expectations for this year. Sorry if that sounds so ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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