No North Korea thread???

[Gregory Pratt]

Let me throw this in the mix.

 

NK doesn't take a s*** without China's blessing. Think about it.

 

NK is a China puppet state. Period.

 

/carry on

 

Eh, I don't think that's right at all. The Norkeans might seek China's blessing, but don't require it for action, really. During the Cold War, for instance, people talked about Kim Il Sung as Stalin's puppet, especially after the Korean War, but that wasn't the case. Sung lobbied and pushed and insisted on being given the green light and words of support in invading South Korea, but he was not a puppet then. He was the one who drove the invasion; similarly, I'd be stunned if China lobbied or pushed for North Korea to test these missiles. I'd imagine that it took a lot of hounding by the North Koreans to get the Chinese to agree, privately and with a wink/nod, not to join any American effort to punish Kim Jung Il's monstrous regime.

 

The North Koreans of today aren't a puppet, and they, indeed, have quite a few bargaining chips to play against the Chinese. China has much to lose by aggrevating North Korea, as any break in relations or tensions could lead the Koreans to cut down border security and let all sorts of refugees into China, which is a great fear of that overpopulated hellhole. They believe that it'd lead to a breakdown in their social order, that there's no room, and not enough food. They're probably right about that, and so they fear it.

 

I'd say NK is more like a wild dog on China's farm. The dog will do all kinds of crazy s***, but is still scared to death of China. I don't think China wags NK as a puppet state, though. At most, China probably smirks at NK's act, when it suits them in some way.

 

I think that's closer to reality than calling them a puppet, but North Korea is very much a pain in China's backside. They can't oppose the Norks because of said border issues, for one, but everytime Jung goes nuts, it puts increased diplomatic pressure on China in the rest of the world, especially America. Regardless, China can't afford to irritate Jung, and they get along because of it. There is no controlling party: they are friends by necessity, and that's about it. Neither likes to say no to the other, and there are no puppets here, IMO, just pawns and chess pieces.

[DBAHO]

Yikes this doesn't sound good;

 

NORTH Korean leader Kim Jong-Il has vowed not to make "even a tiny concession" to the United States and said Pyongyang was braced for "all-out war" after its missile tests, state television has warned.

 

"The general has declared that not even a tiny concession be made to the imperialist US invaders, our arch enemy," said a broadcast on North Korean state television, as monitored by South Korea's Yonhap news agency.

 

Kim warned that if the United States took "revenge," it would mean "all-out war."

 

"It is not empty talk for the DPRK (the Democratic People's Republic of Korea) to respond with revenge to any revenge by the enemy and with all-out war to an all-out war," the television said.

 

The bellicose remarks were the first attributed to Kim since the communist regime on Wednesday fired seven missiles including a new long-range Taepodong-2.

 

Kim mocked US assertions that his regime was on the verge of collapse.

 

"As the imperialists fussed loudly over our republic's collapse and attempting to plot against us, the General dealt them a blow by firmly declaring, 'Do not expect any change from me'."

 

"It is out of the General's conviction, desire and courage that we should respond to the enemy's knife with a sword and the enemy's gun with a cannon," the television said.

 

"With such conviction and will, the General is achieving a victory and protecting socialism in the fierce confrontation with the US imperialists."

 

State television did not say when Kim was speaking. The North Korean strongman rarely speaks in public with his own voice.

 

North Korea has repeatedly refused US demands to give up its drive for nuclear weapons and declared last year that it had an atomic arsenal to defend itself.

 

It has boycotted six-nation talks on ending its nuclear program since November to protest US financial sanctions.

 

The state television remarks come as US envoy Christopher Hill travels the region in hopes of building pressure on Pyongyang after its missile tests.

[Rex Kickass]

It never sounds good. But I can pretty much guarantee it means nothing.

[Gregory Pratt]

It never sounds good. But I can pretty much guarantee it means nothing.

 

Yeah, that's about right. It's important not to COMPLETELY disregard the threats, but it's highly doubtful that anything will come of them.

[Rex Kickass]

Real threats aren't made in public. This is the same bluster that North Korea has been spewing for the most of the last fifty years.

[Gregory Pratt]

Hitler made real threats in public.

So did China before the Korean War.

And so did North Korea, pre-invasion.

 

Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

I don't think Kim Jung Il is a Kim Il Sung, Hitler or a Chairman Mao, but it's important not to absolutely dismiss them.

[Rex Kickass]

I'm talking about this country in particular.

[Gregory Pratt]

Well, my statements still apply about Kim Il Sung before he invaded the South. He'd been talking about it forever, and no one took him serious. There is precedent for North Korea making public threats and doing good on them. Hell, that precedent is in Kim Jung Il's family.

[YASNY]

We should park a carrier in international waters off of Korea and shoot down every missile that they launch.

[Balta1701]

We should park a carrier in international waters off of Korea and shoot down every missile that they launch.

If that would work, we'd already be doing it. First problem; a carrier is not the ship you want.

[KipWellsFan]

We should park a carrier in international waters off of Korea and shoot down every missile that they launch.

 

Wouldn't a miss be a major embarassment?

[southsider2k5]

Wouldn't a miss be a major embarassment?

 

Not as much as a hit on Japan, SK, China, the US etc...

[KipWellsFan]

Not as much as a hit on Japan, SK, China, the US etc...

 

Well then why not just take it out before it has that chance? You think North Korea would invade the South over one missile being blown to s***.

 

I'm just parroting those Clinton-era Democrats that were and are urging action by the way.

Edited July 13, 2006 by KipWellsFan

[Buehrle>Wood]

We should park a carrier in international waters off of Korea and shoot down every missile that they launch.

We have three different spots right outside of North Korea that will take out anything that is deemed a threat to us.

[southsider2k5]

Well then why not just take it out before it has that chance? You think North Korea would invade the South over one missile being blown to s***.

 

I'm just parroting those Clinton-era Democrats that were and are urging action by the way.

 

Action would be nice... except the UN is dragging its feet as usual. Apparently shooting missles towards other nations doesn't really matter. Hmm maybe we should have used the same logic to excuse Iraq

 

And what I was referring to is that it would be more embarassing for a NK missle to blow up in SK while they were "testing" than for the US to try to shoot down a missle and miss.

[Rex Kickass]

You can make an argument that missile testing is a right of self-determination. We've done our share.

 

Not saying its right, but the argument is there.