Vazquez

[GoSox05]

Texas might be looking for a SP. Franciso Cordero in set up for the sox would be a nice move. Texas does have a nice bullpen that could absorb his loss

 

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dw...at.4658e98.html

 

 

I thought Cordero was having a real bad year? Didnt he lose his closer job? Id hope we'd be able to get more than that.

[winninguglyin83]

thought this might inspire some conversation.

 

I like the two mets guys. But hasn't Gordon said he doesn't want to be a setup guy?

 

New York Daily News - http://www.nydailynews.com

Sox-y offer to Mets

BY ADAM RUBIN

DAILY NEWS SPORTS WRITER

Friday, July 14th, 2006

 

CHICAGO - The Mets may have found a partner willing to deal a starting

pitcher after all, which could be even more pressing as Pedro Martinez

is about to miss his third straight start.

 

The White Sox have been calling around to clubs - including the Mets -

letting it be known that Javier Vazquez or Freddy Garcia would be

available. The price: top-notch relief help, which would allow the Sox

to fortify their bullpen leading to closer Bobby Jenks, sources told

the Daily News. Chicago has 23-year-old Brandon McCarthy ready to step

into its rotation.

 

 

The Phillies, also looking to add to their rotation in a thin market,

are willing to give up closer Tom Gordon in a deal with the Sox,

according to a source.

 

 

The Mets hold a 12-game lead in the NL East over second-place

Philadelphia as they open their second half against the Cubs today at

Wrigley Field. Adding a front-line starting pitcher would be done with

an eye toward October. It also would provide a hedge against any

continued health issues for Martinez.

 

 

Martinez, who has missed back-to-back starts with a balky right hip,

had been expected to return from the disabled list on Wednesday - the

fifth game after the All-Star break, when the Mets are in Cincinnati.

But Willie Randolph said yesterday that Martinez will have to be pushed

back from that scheduled assignment. The ace is weak and had been

unable to throw during the break because of a stomach ailment that was

possibly caused by food poisoning, the manager said. Martinez didn't

leave the clubhouse during yesterday's workout.

 

 

As a result of Martinez's condition, after rookie Mike Pelfrey pitches

Tuesday in the series opener against the Reds, the Mets are prepared to

skip Martinez and go back to today's starter, Steve Trachsel, on

Wednesday. Trachsel would be on standard rest because the Mets have an

off-day on Monday. John Maine will remain with the Mets and be

available in the bullpen for now, Randolph said. The manager described

Maine as a secondary option to Trachsel for Martinez's start.

 

 

"We're going to have to push him back a day or two, give or take, until

he gets on the mound," Randolph said about Martinez. "He's going to

have to build up his volume more than anything. He's been out awhile

(since June 28 at Boston), so you can't just throw him back in there."

 

 

Omar Minaya has long been fond of Vazquez and pursued the former Expo

last winter, before he was sent from the Diamondbacks to the White Sox

for current Met Orlando Hernandez as well as reliever Luiz Vizcaino and

outfield prospect Chris Young. He's 9-4 with a 5.07 ERA this season,

while Garcia is 10-5 with a 4.91 ERA.

 

 

Of course, the Mets have been hesitant to tinker with their bullpen,

going so far as to start Jose Lima during the last home stand so Darren

Oliver could maintain his long-relief role. A deal for either White Sox

starter would seem to have to include Duaner Sanchez or Aaron Heilman,

the primary setup men to Billy Wagner. The Mets could gamble on rookie

Henry Owens if they borrowed from their bullpen to address their

starting pitching.

 

 

The Mets also may look to address second base, with their eye remaining

on Tampa Bay's Julio Lugo. The Devil Rays just traded third baseman

Aubrey Huff to Houston and have announced plans to move shortstop

prospect B.J. Upton to third base, but it's still believed a persuasive

offer could pry away the free-agent-to-be Lugo.

[Dick Allen]

If other teams are willing to take on a headcase for their rotation in Weaver, then surely they are willing to bite on Garcia or Javy....though I'm not quite sure which I'd be more willing to move right now honestly...

The Angels are paying part of his remaining contract, which expires after this season, and gave up a 24 year old 47th round draft pick who started the season in A ball. A non-prospect. Makes the interest a little easier to understand. I hope if the Sox move one of these guys before the deadline, they move the other one next offseason.

Edited July 14, 2006 by Dick Allen

[iamshack]

I am not sure whether the NY Daily News report is reporting what is truly the actual situation. I am not doubting the accuracy of what they were told (although they do make things up purely out of thin air), this certainly isn't like Kenny to be so open and honest about things.

 

Secondly, this makes no sense whatsoever. Kenny was after Javy for years, and he pays a heavy price in El Duque, Vizcaino, and Chris Young, and now he is willing to give up on him after 17 starts for one top-notch reliever? I dunno, it just doesn't make any sense to me. Why make a rash decision like this when we are sitting pretty comfortably right now? We are not the Reds.

Also, WS beat reporter had this to say this morning:

 

"I don't think it's out of reach to see either Jon Garland or Vazquez move to the bullpen if there's an off-day and one of them gets skipped in the rotation. It could be cheaper than acquiring relief help. But my gut feeling is that Kenny Williams will make a deal. I can't see Javier Vazquez getting demoted to the bullpen on a permanent basis. Kenny likes him too much. "

 

This is just one of those things that doesn't smell right. I could understand Freddy, as his stuff has totally changed from last year to this year and he seems set on being an off-speed pitcher now, but Javy? Despite his struggles, I just can't see Kenny giving up on him unless he is part of something much bigger than a reliever. Especially considering the timing of Hermanson possibly coming back.

 

And again, as for Vazquez's salary, he makes $11.5 million this season, and $12.5 million next season. The White Sox are on the hook for ALL of that, however, they did receive roughly $5 million from the DBacks to help defray his salary. Any trade of Vazquez puts the receiving team on the hook for his entire salary, not any reduced amount that other teams have transferred in the past.

Edited July 14, 2006 by iamshack

[DBAHO]

I thought Cordero was having a real bad year? Didnt he lose his closer job? Id hope we'd be able to get more than that.

Cordero's had a 2.05 ERA in 30 2/3 innings since the beginning of May. So after he lost his closer job to Otsuka, he's done pretty well.

 

Problem is, his contract has a very expensive option for next season, which wouldn't be worth picking up unless he's the closer.

[Capn12]

After reading his info again, it is indeed the case. We don't get the Yankees part of Javys contract...so if we split it between this year and next year for argumentative purposes, Javy costs us the same as Garcia.

 

If either of the 2 are moved, I'd expect and REALLY hope for it to be Garcia.

[iamshack]

I can't see Kenny risking getting burned in the WS by one of our former starters just for the sake of acquiring a reliever.

[DBAHO]

Merging with the Vazquez thread.

[Rowand44]

Also, remember that one of the big reasons Kenny pulled the trigger for Javy is the fact that he was signed passed 06 and at the time we only had 3 starters including Mac signed for 07. With JC and Garland signing extensions it makes it much easier for Kenny to pull a trade with Javy and that might answer your question about why Kenny would go after Javy so hard and then trade him just a half a season later, iamshack.

[quickman]

I can't see Kenny risking getting burned in the WS by one of our former starters just for the sake of acquiring a reliever.

 

 

I would take my chances of getting burned by one of our pitchers who has a 5 ERA and can't hold runners on base. The mets would need to make it for one, we would need to make it for two and getting a Reliever and a prospect (assuming) would be the right price. In addition, an assumption might be made that we would be done trading which I do not think would be the case.

 

actually I think the Sox would be doing damage control in the locker room today. I am sure KW will be in there saying "now don't you believe everything in those newspapers"

Edited July 14, 2006 by quickman

[iamshack]

Also, remember that one of the big reasons Kenny pulled the trigger for Javy is the fact that he was signed passed 06 and at the time we only had 3 starters including Mac signed for 07. With JC and Garland signing extensions it makes it much easier for Kenny to pull a trade with Javy and that might answer your question about why Kenny would go after Javy so hard and then trade him just a half a season later, iamshack.

 

Rowand,

I agree, having Garland and Jose signed really makes it easier to deal any of your starters. But Kenny has been drooling over Vazquez since 2003/2004. This is one of "his guys." I understand the $ situation, but this just doesn't seem to me to be something which would need to be addressed NOW. It seems like something that could be dealt with in the offseason, especially if the return on any deal right now is a reliever.

 

Let me ask you this. With what Kenny dealt to acquire Thornton and Riske, do you honestly see him dealing an innings-eating starting pitcher with Javy's kind of stuff, for 1 reliever? Now?

 

I just can't fathom that.

 

I could understand a Freddy trade possibly, and maybe to the Mets, since I don't think that the organization would hang Freddy out to dry by sending him to some schlep team (considering what he did for the org and his ties to the org now), but still. Read every quote Kenny has made in the past year or so and tell me that you think he would deal one of our starters for a reliever right now.

[daa84]

I would take my chances of getting burned by one of our pitchers who has a 5 ERA and can't hold runners on base. The mets would need to make it for one, we would need to make it for two and getting a Reliever and a prospect (assuming) would be the right price. In addition, an assumption might be made that we would be done trading which I do not think would be the case.

 

actually I think the Sox would be doing damage control in the locker room today. I am sure KW will be in there saying "now don't you believe everything in those newspapers"

yeah ken rosenthall seems to think that garcia would be a good possibility for a proven reliever and a starting pitcher who would be ready by 08....

 

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5782994

 

 

Read every quote Kenny has made in the past year or so and tell me that you think he would deal one of our starters for a reliever right now.

Kenny has said that McCarthy will be in the rotation in 07. Someone will be gone if not at the deadline than at the end of the year, I think most of us believe that is the case. I think since so many teams will be desperate for pitching at the deadline, that the deadline is the time to do it instead of the offseason. I also feel like Brandon will be able to do a better job than Garcia in the rotation, and that a guy like heilman or sanchez would be every bit as good as bmac was in the pen...so no real loss.

[Frankensteiner]

Whether or not these deals happen remains to be seen, but I am happy (if not surprised) KW's appearantly not satisfied with our starting rotation. The two discussed trades (for Sanchez or Gordon) would be good for us, imo. I do worry about Brandon making the transition back to starting this late in the year. Jason Schmidt, assuming McCarthy isn't used in the trade, would look really good in a Sox uni.

[YASNY]

Whether or not these deals happen remains to be seen, but I am happy (if not surprised) KW's appearantly not satisfied with our starting rotation. The two discussed trades (for Sanchez or Gordon) would be good for us, imo. I do worry about Brandon making the transition back to starting this late in the year. Jason Schmidt, assuming McCarthy isn't used in the trade, would look really good in a Sox uni.

 

I don't think it would take BMac more than 3 starts to get his endurance to where it needs to be. The bullpen would have to handle the load for a litle bit, but if we supplement that in the trade, it shouldn't be a problem.

[iamshack]

Kenny has said that McCarthy will be in the rotation in 07. Someone will be gone if not at the deadline than at the end of the year, I think most of us believe that is the case. I think since so many teams will be desperate for pitching at the deadline, that the deadline is the time to do it instead of the offseason. I also feel like Brandon will be able to do a better job than Garcia in the rotation, and that a guy like heilman or sanchez would be every bit as good as bmac was in the pen...so no real loss.

 

Yeah, I don't doubt that Brandon will be there, I just doubt whether a reliever is enough to get it done right now, especially considering the Mets are a possible WS foe.

 

I agree with the Rosenthal suggestion, I suppose. I could much more see something like Garcia to the Mets for a reliever and a prospect (Sanchez and Humber) maybe? I don't know. Omar probably doesn't know whether or not to pay Peter or Paul right now, considering the situation of his rotation and farm system right now.

[gojimthome]

For the folks that were arguing about what we're paying Javy...

 

Arizona is paying 5 mil of the 24 mil left on Javy's contract. The remainder of the money from the Yankees...They get to keep.

 

We're paying Javy 19 mil for 06 and 07. You guys have to pay more attention when these things go down.

[beck72]

I thought Cordero was having a real bad year? Didnt he lose his closer job? Id hope we'd be able to get more than that.

 

See DBAHO. Cordero's back on track, going through a nice run after a tough start. He's had a lot of blown saves as a closer. But Tex. seems set with te guy they got from SD.

[beautox]

Milledge ain't being traded.

 

He's like a young Carl Everett though.

 

Loud, a bit of a hot dog and iffy defense.

 

 

lol how can you say that? hes got youthful exuberance, and at least he believes in dinosaurs.

[daa84]

See DBAHO. Cordero's back on track, going through a nice run after a tough start. He's had a lot of blown saves as a closer. But Tex. seems set with te guy they got from SD.

hows garcia for cordero and thomas diamond sound....

 

that could be too much to ask for, but if texas thinks cordero is toast maybe not

Edited July 14, 2006 by daa84

[beck72]

hows garcia for cordero and thomas diamond sound....

 

that could be too much to ask for, but if texas thinks cordero is toast maybe not

It sounds good. With so many teams in need of SP, the sox should get a really good deal on Freddy [better than Olivo, Reed and Morse .] that fills the sox need this yr and something for the future.

[gojimthome]

It sounds good. With so many teams in need of SP, the sox should get a really good deal on Freddy [better than Olivo, Reed and Morse .] that fills the sox need this yr and something for the future.

 

Nothing is better than Jeremy Reed. We gave up Reed? Oh, my God! We have no future! Boooooooooooooo!

[GoodAsGould]

I think the Rangers would be much more interested in Garland or even Vazquez than Garcia... especially in their park.

[southsideirish71]

Garcia/Vaz will get traded to the NL. Either will not be facing us in a series before the world series. So if anyone is going to be a trade partner think NL.

[RockRaines]

Garcia/Vaz will get traded to the NL. Either will not be facing us in a series before the world series. So if anyone is going to be a trade partner think NL.

Garcia is done, but I would rather keep him for his clutch performances. The guy is lights out in the playoffs.

[Balta1701]

I think the Rangers would be much more interested in Garland or even Vazquez than Garcia... especially in their park.

Garland still has that no trade clause this season, so get back to us after the year.