And That's A White Sox Loss

[Leonard Zelig]

who would you pick to win: mid-Sept. '05 Sox vs. current '06 Sox?

 

I think Timo wins it in the 12th inning with a blooper into right. 1-0. Light it up!

 

1-0???? I think you've already lit it up.

[The Ginger Kid]

1-0???? I think you've already lit it up.

I know, low score. Which is not to say each team didn't have their opportunities. 14 GIDP recorded by each team. EACH. Konerko alone accounted for 10, seeing as how he bats for both teams.

[Guest JimH]

Ozzie will say its Still July, Weve got alot of games left against the Tigers and the Twins.

 

What exactly do you expect him to say? "We're going to trade every player, I'm going to talk to Kenny right now, that is after I talk to everyone at SoxTalk to see who we should trade. But we're keeping McCarthy and we're putting him in the rotation, even though he can throw a max of probably 50 pitches right now."

 

He was praising the Twins and basically saying they kicked the White Sox' butts. And I'm sure he will say other things to the team that he didn't say to the post game media.

[Hangar18]

who would you pick to win: mid-Sept. '05 Sox vs. current '06 Sox?

 

I think Timo wins it in the 12th inning with a blooper into right. 1-0. Light it up!

 

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAAHA. Ahhhh boy I needed that one too.

Mark Buehrle takes the field, he'll go against his counterpart Mark Buehrle.

We go to the top of the 4th, White Sox lead the White Sox 12-10, 24 hits already in the game

[Frankensteiner]

I'm at a point where we could even sweep the O's and Royals and I still wouldn't think very much of this team. We failed against the good teams. This team needs to prove itself against the AL's best for me to become optimistic about their chances.

[Steff]

What exactly do you expect him to say? "We're going to trade every player, I'm going to talk to Kenny right now, that is after I talk to everyone at SoxTalk to see who we should trade. But we're keeping McCarthy and we're putting him in the rotation, even though he can throw a max of probably 50 pitches right now."

 

He was praising the Twins and basically saying they kicked the White Sox' butts. And I'm sure he will say other things to the team that he didn't say to the post game media.

 

 

[southsideirish71]

I'm at a point where we could even sweep the O's and Royals and I still wouldn't think very much of this team. We failed against the good teams. This team needs to prove itself against the AL's best for me to become optimistic about their chances.

 

 

Well we need to sweep the Royals. And before someone pipes up with they are still a major league team, and they play better at home. No they are bad. Teams all over baseball are beating the ever living snot out of them.

 

Bedard will own us tomorrow night.

[Flash Tizzle]

Ozzie in the postgame....

 

No plans for bmac in the rotation. We wish the current pitchers get better.

 

Nice

Only way McCarthy would be in the rotation is if one of the current starters were traded. Williams has basically ruled out that option.

 

What irritates myself, and fans alike, is when an organization is reluctant to do something which EVERYONE whose familar with baseball can agree to. If Liriano were in our bullpen he'd still be rotting there. We're falling in the standings, and wouldn't you know; the starting pitching is responsible for our troubles. Yet we're not inserting McCarthy in the rotation? Is Guillen more concerned with losing the confidence of one player rather than helping his team win?

 

I'd rather take several losses with McCarthy pitching 4-5 innings if it means he'll be available in midAugust/September. Better option than leaving Freddy Maddux on the mound.

Edited July 26, 2006 by Flash Tizzle

[fathom]

What exactly do you expect him to say? "We're going to trade every player, I'm going to talk to Kenny right now, that is after I talk to everyone at SoxTalk to see who we should trade. But we're keeping McCarthy and we're putting him in the rotation, even though he can throw a max of probably 50 pitches right now."

 

He was praising the Twins and basically saying they kicked the White Sox' butts. And I'm sure he will say other things to the team that he didn't say to the post game media.

 

I don't know what people are expecting him to say in these postgame interviews. Barring a trade, we all now McCarthy isn't going into the rotation anytime soon. Some people expect an Ozzie rant where every other word is a swear. We don't need a rant....we need execution. Our pitchers can't get a crucial out to save their lives, and our hitters can't get a hit with 2 outs and RISP. It's comical, in a bad way, how the Twins scored all their runs with 2 outs today. They're playing great right now, and we suck. We could play them 10 straight games, and they'd probably beat us 8 times right now.

 

Well we need to sweep the Royals. And before someone pipes up with they are still a major league team, and they play better at home. No they are bad. Teams all over baseball are beating the ever living snot out of them.

 

Bedard will own us tomorrow night.

 

I've heard that Sweeney might be back for our series. Bedard and his damn food poisoning puts us in a hole for Friday.

[Dick Allen]

Anyone who thinks this team can catch Detroit is crazy. Maybe by the deadline the Sox will be 3 1/2 games out of the wildcard and KW will have a white flag trade or 2. I'm already prepared for when the Sox take on KC and the Royals put up "a big crooked number". Hawk will say, "Make no mistake about it, this is a good KC ballclub no matter what their record says". Pitching was the key to the White Sox success last year. The White Sox offense until recently had performed much higher than anyone's best case scenerio could have been, and they are now tied with a Minnesota team who was contemplating trading Torii Hunter as a salary dump not too long ago, and could be behind NY, a team playing without its 2 starting corner OFs. I don't see anyway they can improve the current rotation through trade right now, and Ozzie is too stubborn to give McCarthy a shot, so the Sox will continue to give up a ton of runs. The offense will bounce back a little, but its not going to be as consistent as it was in the first half, and it will be back to the drawing board for KW and crew. Hopefully a lesson will be learned. Since KW took over, his worst offensive team was the one which won the world championship. It also featured the best pitching of any team since he took over.

[Frankensteiner]

What exactly do you expect him to say? "We're going to trade every player, I'm going to talk to Kenny right now, that is after I talk to everyone at SoxTalk to see who we should trade. But we're keeping McCarthy and we're putting him in the rotation, even though he can throw a max of probably 50 pitches right now."

 

I'm so sick of hearing that. McCarthy would need like 3 starts to get stretched. You can 40 ---> 60 ---> 80 pitches in consecutive starts. We know what's going on though. Ozzie's playing favorites with his latin buddies.

[GreatScott82]

We scored 10 runs this series. And every run was via the long ball. Thats pathetic. If were going to get back in this race, we need some MORE PRODUCE!!!!!

 

[Soxpranos]

Nice Avatar... speaking of produce, them some good melons.

[GreatScott82]

Nice Avatar... speaking of produce, them some good melons.

thats jessica from laguna beach! She's a hotty with some nice melons

[Dick Allen]

How does everyone conclude McCarthy can only go a couple of innings? Didn't he make over 80 pitches in his one start? It wouldn't be long before he got that up to 100. I'd actually love to see Vazquez pulled after 80. Its like after midnight with him. Nothing good happens to Javier Vazquez after 80 pitches.

[Soxpranos]

Good to know... Jessica Alba now this one... man you got to be hot to have a name like "Jessica". Even Jessica Rabbit was hot for a damn caricature.

 

How does everyone conclude McCarthy can only go a couple of innings? Didn't he make over 80 pitches in his one start? It wouldn't be long before he got that up to 100. I'd actually love to see Vazquez pulled after 80. Its like after midnight with him. Nothing good happens to Javier Vazquez after 80 pitches.

 

 

They should tell Brandon to be ready whenever Javy pitches.. as soon as he is about to stumble.. you bring in McCarthy to finish the job. So, Javy goes 5 them McCarthy for 3-4 innings , depending on the situation.

Edited July 26, 2006 by Soxpranos

[fathom]

I'm so sick of hearing that. McCarthy would need like 3 starts to get stretched. You can 40 ---> 60 ---> 80 pitches in consecutive starts. We know what's going on though. Ozzie's playing favorites with his latin buddies.

 

Actually, McCarthy said it himself. He said it would take about 4 starts to get stretched out.

 

How does everyone conclude McCarthy can only go a couple of innings? Didn't he make over 80 pitches in his one start? It wouldn't be long before he got that up to 100. I'd actually love to see Vazquez pulled after 80. Its like after midnight with him. Nothing good happens to Javier Vazquez after 80 pitches.

 

After 75 pitches, he has something like 35 ER allowed in 30 innings.

[Flash Tizzle]

We know what's going on though. Ozzie's playing favorites with his latin buddies.

I know some people will begin their self-righteous replies of "OMG, how can you say that?" but I believe there's truth to such a statement.

 

Not that he prefers Latin ballplayers as a whole, but in this instance, Guillen is afraid of losing the respect of his Latin players.

 

Why else would we continue to leave McCarthy in the bullpen? Could someone explain? As I've already said, McCarthy pitching starts of 50/70/90 pitches and losing every one is still more vital to our season than Garcia or Vazquez continuing to get shelled. And no, Garcia's last start against Texas doesn't convince me of anything.

 

Even if McCarthy doesn't provide much improvement, atleast it was an attempt to "shake up" our ballclub. What's occuring right now doesn't assure me suddenly everything will turn around.

Edited July 26, 2006 by Flash Tizzle

[Guest JimH]

I'm so sick of hearing that. McCarthy would need like 3 starts to get stretched. You can 40 ---> 60 ---> 80 pitches in consecutive starts. We know what's going on though. Ozzie's playing favorites with his latin buddies.

 

He's playing favorites with his Latin buddies?

 

The conspiracy theories on this site are getting more and more humorous.

 

I'd like to ask, why is everyone so rock solid certain that Brandon would automatically be lights out as a starter, seeing as he's only been moderately successful in his bullpen role? And not the usual stock answer "well he's better than we have now", I would like to know how people on SoxTalk are able to ascertain with absolute certainty that he'd be better than what's in the rotation now. And no I am not happy with their current results, not one bit. Why is McCarthy the savior though? Sounds like the backup QB syndrome to me.

 

As for what you're so sick of hearing, well, that's the way it goes. There are lots of things I'm sick of hearing too.

[Balta1701]

I'd like to ask, why is everyone so rock solid certain that Brandon would automatically be lights out as a starter, seeing as he's only been moderately successful in his bullpen role? And not the usual stock answer "well he's better than we have now", I would like to know how people on SoxTalk are able to ascertain with absolute certainty that he'd be better than what's in the rotation now. And no I am not happy with their current results, not one bit. Why is McCarthy the savior though? Sounds like the backup QB syndrome to me.

As I pointed out in the game thread, Brandon has been more than Moderately successful when he's given a bullpen role. 3 months this season he has pitched regularly out of the bullpen, April, June, and July. His ERA's in those months are 3.38, 3.2, and 2.7. In 1 month, he did not get regular work out of the bullpen, made 1 spot start, and went at least a week and a half between appearances. That month, his ERA is over 6.

 

When he has had a firm role in the bullpen, he has been successful. When he's been screwed around with, not gotten opportunities to pitch, or been shifted around for single starts and then gone over a week without pitching, he was off, like most pitchers would be.

[southsideirish71]

Mark Buerhle ERA in July 11.39

Vazquez 6.48

 

 

Somehow I think Bmac might be better than that right now. But then again Felix Diaz/Danny Wright/Munoz had similiar numbers to these guys. Maybe we gave up on Jason Grilli to early also.

[Frankensteiner]

He's playing favorites with his Latin buddies?

 

The conspiracy theories on this site are getting more and more humorous.

 

I'd like to ask, why is everyone so rock solid certain that Brandon would automatically be lights out as a starter, seeing as he's only been moderately successful in his bullpen role? And not the usual stock answer "well he's better than we have now", I would like to know how people on SoxTalk are able to ascertain with absolute certainty that he'd be better than what's in the rotation now. And no I am not happy with their current results, not one bit. Why is McCarthy the savior though? Sounds like the backup QB syndrome to me.

 

As for what you're so sick of hearing, well, that's the way it goes. There are lots of things I'm sick of hearing too.

 

Well, considering McCarthy was basically our savior last year, there's some form of precedent there. As we've seen in 2005, the guy has the ability to be a very good starter in this league and is being wasted in the bullpen. There's no certainty there, but I'm willing to gamble on McCarthy outperforming Vaz/Garcia down the stretch, especially given how hard they've been hit throughout the season. So we're gambling with the "unknown" (despite evidence of last year's success) in favor of two "known" spiffty quantities. You tell me which is better.

[Guest JimH]

I know some people will begin their self-righteous replies of "OMG, how can you say that?" but I believe there's truth to such a statement.

 

Not that he prefers Latin ballplayers as a whole, but in this instance, Guillen is afraid of losing the respect of his Latin players.

 

Why else would we continue to leave McCarthy in the bullpen? Could someone explain? As I've already said, McCarthy pitching starts of 50/70/90 pitches and losing every one is still more vital to our season than Garcia or Vazquez continuing to get shelled. And no, Garcia's last start against Texas doesn't convince me of anything.

 

Even if McCarthy doesn't provide much improvement, atleast it was an attempt to "shake up" our ballclub. What's occuring right now doesn't assure me suddenly everything will turn around.

 

Well at least you tried to answer the question Flash.

 

There's a reason he's not in the starting rotation, they have him groomed at this point, for this year, to be a reliever. Stretching him out is not a huge problem, it's not as simple as everyone makes it sound, but it's not a major hangup. They want to be careful with his arm though. And I can understand why. They think very highly of him as everyone here knows.

 

As for conspiracy theories, that's total uneducated BS. If Guillen didn't like him he would be in Charlotte.

 

Which is exactly the mistake they made IMO. Why did they try to pigeonhole this guy into a reliever slot when he's always been a starter, just to have him on the team. He should be in Charlotte starting and should have been all year. That way he's 100% prepared in case of injury. I can understand why they'd stick with the same starters after a championship and I also understand why they'd get a veteran to help defend the championship. It hasn't worked out great thus far but the season isn't over and I understand why they did it. They should have brought in a reasonably capable long relief guy, let him have the role, and prep McCarthy for starting at Charlotte.

 

As for a shake up, if this team needs a veteran starter to be benched to shake them up then they wouldn't win this season anyways. They have not performed well vs. good hitting teams and Guillen will now have to shorten the game for them. That's why I think they very well may go with 12 pitchers after the deadline.

 

All of this will mean nothing to people who insist that McCarthy is the savior but so be it. At this point I'm an advocate of having 12 pitchers, getting another guy in here who can throw 2-3 innings, make a run for it and see what happens. If Minny and Detroit keep playing this well it won't matter anyways.

[Baines3]

At this point I would put Bmac in the starting rotation and put Vazquez in the bullpen. We'd have nothing to lose.

 

[Flash Tizzle]

He's playing favorites with his Latin buddies?

 

The conspiracy theories on this site are getting more and more humorous.

 

Considering all you know of Guillen, would it honestly surprise you if he were reluctant to insert McCarthy into the rotation out of concern he may lose the respect of Latin ballplayers? He rather leave in a struggling starter to earn a victory than help his own ballclub earn a victory, yet, this scenario is absurd? We're not talking about Tony LaRussa or Bobby Cox here. It wouldn't suprise me in the least.

 

I'd like to ask, why is everyone so rock solid certain that Brandon would automatically be lights out as a starter, seeing as he's only been moderately successful in his bullpen role? And not the usual stock answer "well he's better than we have now", I would like to know how people on SoxTalk are able to ascertain with absolute certainty that he'd be better than what's in the rotation now. And no I am not happy with their current results, not one bit. Why is McCarthy the savior though? Sounds like the backup QB syndrome to me.

 

I'm not certain in the least. What I know is what's happening right now isn't working. We're tailing into third place rather quickly, and unless a significant trade occurs which immediately improves our ballclub, such changes need to occur within the ballclub. Bullpen failures don't necessarily translate to rotation failures. He rarely uses his curveball, for example, and the feel for a changeup appears nonexistent. I'd rather lose down the stretch with McCarthy in the rotation than Garcia or Vazquez. Even with his mediocre results out of the bullpen.