Buehrle

[Jake]

Has anyone else noticed Buehrle's drop in velocity? He was never a hard thrower at all, but he was usually in the 87-90 range with his fastball and usually 77-79 with the change. In his last few starts, his fastball has been around 83-86 and his change is the same speed (He also threw several 81 mph cutters yesterday). Not only does this drop in velocity cause a smaller margin for error, there is a much smaller difference in speed between his fastball and change-up, which is ideally 9-12 mph slower than your fastball. Mix this with imperfect location, you get the Buehrle of the last month.

[southsideirish71]

Has anyone else noticed Buehrle's drop in velocity? He was never a hard thrower at all, but he was usually in the 87-90 range with his fastball and usually 77-79 with the change. In his last few starts, his fastball has been around 83-86 and his change is the same speed (He also threw several 81 mph cutters yesterday). Not only does this drop in velocity cause a smaller margin for error, there is a much smaller difference in speed between his fastball and change-up, which is ideally 9-12 mph slower than your fastball. Mix this with imperfect location, you get the Buehrle of the last month.

 

 

Location is killing Buerhle more than his velocity. He has survived with pinpoint control at below 90. His control is off, and worse is he is leaving pitches up.

[LVSoxFan]

My co-worker thinks Mark is injured and asked about his velocity.

 

When I saw him last Friday, he was hitting 88 with regularity on the gun, and I've never seen him top that when I've been at games (I know once in a while he'll get into the 90s), so I told him: it's not velocity.

 

You could make the argument with Freddy, but Mark? Naw, it's something else. But I have never seen a pitcher collapse so quickly after years of realiability.

 

Unless, as my co-workers says, those years of tons of innings are now coming crashing down on him.

[Jake]

Location is killing Buerhle more than his velocity. He has survived with pinpoint control at below 90. His control is off, and worse is he is leaving pitches up.

 

88 and 84 are vastly different. And as I said it makes his changeup more ineffective even when thrown correctly. Right now batters can guard the low part of the zone easily because they have plenty of time to adjust to the high pitches.

 

My co-worker thinks Mark is injured and asked about his velocity.

 

When I saw him last Friday, he was hitting 88 with regularity on the gun, and I've never seen him top that when I've been at games (I know once in a while he'll get into the 90s), so I told him: it's not velocity.

 

You could make the argument with Freddy, but Mark? Naw, it's something else. But I have never seen a pitcher collapse so quickly after years of realiability.

 

Unless, as my co-workers says, those years of tons of innings are now coming crashing down on him.

 

Yesterday's game he hit 87 only once. I don't know if it's the career innings or innings of late or even an injury or lack of effort, but he needs to make some kind of change. If he ends the year above 5 ERA, I don't expect the Sox to pick up his option.

[ZoomSlowik]

What gun are you basing this on? Many of them are very inconsistent. The TV ones rarely seem to be right. From what I've seen he's been right around where he normally, generally about 87-88 on his fastball.

[LVSoxFan]

Every game I've been to in the past three years Buehrle has consistently topped out at 88 MPH on the scoreboard gun. Almost like clockwork.

[GoSox05]

It seems to be more that for whatever reason hes been keeping his pitches up and his breaking pitches arent breaking so well.

[Jake]

What gun are you basing this on? Many of them are very inconsistent. The TV ones rarely seem to be right. From what I've seen he's been right around where he normally, generally about 87-88 on his fastball.

 

I was basing this off the TV gun that has his fastball and cutter slower, but his changeup the same speed, so I assumed his fastball must be slower.

[LVSoxFan]

I would love for somebody to do an ESPN-like video analysis of Buehrle and try and figure out what the hell is going on.

 

I've heard of players not having location, but for five starts in a row?

[southsideirish71]

88 and 84 are vastly different. And as I said it makes his changeup more ineffective even when thrown correctly. Right now batters can guard the low part of the zone easily because they have plenty of time to adjust to the high pitches.

Yesterday's game he hit 87 only once. I don't know if it's the career innings or innings of late or even an injury or lack of effort, but he needs to make some kind of change. If he ends the year above 5 ERA, I don't expect the Sox to pick up his option.

 

 

Below 89 its not that much different for a major league hitter. Its more about location and speed differential, adding subtracting of velocity that makes a pitcher successful below the 90 mark. A major leaguer can destroy an 88 mph fastball and an 84mph fastball. You take Mark Buerhle of last year. And if you took his control away and had the same control this year you would see a similiar effect.

 

Now Freddy Garcia is a different cat altogether. He is a guy who had a 93-94 mph fastball which ran down and had movemen. When you have that type of fastball you dont need to paint the black at the knees to be succesfull. That plus his breaking pitches made him very tough. This year he has poor location, plus a medicore fastball. Buerhle had a medicore fastball, but pinpoint control. Losing a few mph for Buerhle is not as bad as him losing a few inches in his control. Garcia never had the pinpoint control, so when he dipped below 90 he was meat.

[ZoomSlowik]

I was basing this off the TV gun that has his fastball and cutter slower, but his changeup the same speed, so I assumed his fastball must be slower.

 

There's our general problem. The TV gun has been very erratic this year. It has been up to 8 MPH off, and it generally seems to be slower. I forgot who it was against, but we were facing someone that consistently throws 94 and the gun kept showing it at 86. It's also not uncommon to see Jenks at 92 on obvious fastballs.

[southsideirish71]

There's our general problem. The TV gun has been very erratic this year. It has been up to 8 MPH off, and it generally seems to be slower. I forgot who it was against, but we were facing someone that consistently throws 94 and the gun kept showing it at 86. It's also not uncommon to see Jenks at 92 on obvious fastballs.

 

I go by the one at the park. Mark was at 86/87 in the last start I was at hitting 88 a bunch of times also.

 

Then in Garcias last start against baltimore, he was 86 most of the time, dialing it up to 88 a few times and then popped on in at 90. The same radar gun in the next inning woudl have Bedard at 93/94 consistantly.

[Jake]

Whatever the real speed was, it still bothers me the closeness of velocity between his change and fastball. Whether they are 88 and 83 or 84 and 79, that takes away a lot of the effectiveness of the pitch. Although I do agree a large part of his problem is due to inconsistent control as well.

[Hatchetman]

my guess is that buehrle is hurt or tipping his pitches.

[kevo880]

88 and 84 are vastly different. And as I said it makes his changeup more ineffective even when thrown correctly. Right now batters can guard the low part of the zone easily because they have plenty of time to adjust to the high pitches.

Yesterday's game he hit 87 only once. I don't know if it's the career innings or innings of late or even an injury or lack of effort, but he needs to make some kind of change. If he ends the year above 5 ERA, I don't expect the Sox to pick up his option.

 

no matter what happens the rest of the season i dont see any way the sox dont pick up his option.

[ZoomSlowik]

I go by the one at the park. Mark was at 86/87 in the last start I was at hitting 88 a bunch of times also.

 

Then in Garcias last start against baltimore, he was 86 most of the time, dialing it up to 88 a few times and then popped on in at 90. The same radar gun in the next inning woudl have Bedard at 93/94 consistantly.

 

The one at the park definitely seems to be more accurate, though it will occasionally be really far off on a pitch here and there. It registered one of MacDougal's fastballs at 76 on Tuesday.

[LVSoxFan]

LOL. Yeah, sometimes it comes up with weird ones. Like 30 mph.

 

I think that's the catcher throwing back to the pitcher.

[Punch and Judy Garland]

I couldn't be less worried about Mark. He'll be just fine

[Jordan4life_2007]

I couldn't be less worried about Mark. He'll be just fine

 

0-5, 26.2 IP, 47 H, 34 ER, 11.48 ERA, 1.92 WHIP, .392 BAA.

 

Those are his numbers for the month of July. That's vintage Sidney Ponson for ya. I wasn't worried about Mark after the Cubs debacle. Heck, I wasn't even worried about Mark after getting lit up by the Yankees. But I'm defintely worried now.

[Jake]

I couldn't be less worried about Mark. He'll be just fine

 

Does anyone else find it funny someone who's name is Judy Garland is saying Buehrle will be fine?

[Gregory Pratt]

It seems to be more that for whatever reason hes been keeping his pitches up and his breaking pitches arent breaking so well.

 

His breaking pitches have been flat as hell.

 

My friend Scott and I were hanging out yesterday, and we were talking baseball (he's a Cub fan, but loves baseball and a lot of the guys on the Sox). I told him I was worried about Vazquez and Garcia, and he said, "You know who I'm worried about? Buehrle!" and I said, "He'll be all right, I think, he just needs a little bit of time," and he said, "Well, he had already given up a homer on another flat breaking pitch in the first today when I left the house."

 

I cursed.

 

But his offspeed stuff, his breaking pitches -- they've been off.

[SoxHawk1980]

I couldn't be less worried about Mark. He'll be just fine

I think there are some things to be worried about:

 

1. His strikeout rate this season is an extremely low 4.03 K/9. That is considerably lower than any other season of his major league career. The last two seasons it was 6.05 and 5.67 respectively.

 

2. He has become extremely hittable. Opposing batters are hitting .306 against him. That is much, much worse than any other season in his career. The last two seasons it was .271 and .262 respecitvely. His OPS against is .828. His previous high was .738.

 

If you're giving up a lot of hits and can't strike guys out, you're going to fail big time. This isn't just a slump, it is a horrible season. Maybe it is the huge number of innings and pitches he's thrown over the past 6 years, but he has definitely become a different pitcher this year.

[ZoomSlowik]

He's basically just had one awful month. His ERA for the first three was 2.57, 3.18, and 3.89. It's amazing how a few brutal starts can kill your numbers. Given his track record and his performance earlier in the year, I gotta think he's going to come out of it at some point.

Edited July 27, 2006 by ZoomSlowik

[Jordan4life_2007]

He's basically just had one awful month. His ERA for the first three was 2.57, 3.18, and 3.89. It's amazing how a few brutal starts can kill your numbers. Given his track record and his performance earlier in the year, I gotta think he's going to come out of it at some point.

 

He better. If not, no playoff baseball in Chicago this year.

[LVSoxFan]

I love Buehrle and I have to say the most rattling thing about this whole slump has been seeing him getting lit up like that.

 

It's like watching your dad get beat up in a bar brawl.

 

Freddy and Garland we've been through this before, but Buehrle's always been our rock.