Ozzie's thoughts on Brian Anderson

[Heads22]

Jenks talent was never in question. It was the fact that he was a total headcase.

[shoota]

now provide me an example of how BA was picked on.

 

How 'bout the problem Ozzie has evaluating players. Ozzie doesn't think Brandon McCarthy is better than any of the starting pitchers, and grossly undervalues Brian Anderson. Also, OG has a distorted view that a player cannot both hit for power and have speed.

 

In 2005, OG evaluated Damaso Marte as being a better pitcher than Brandon McCarthy, going with Marte in both playoff rosters.

 

He's locked in to a belief that speed is a more important asset in a leadoff hitter than OBP. He greatly overvalues speed.

Edited September 6, 2006 by shoota

[kapkomet]

Look, this is a good thread - let's keep away from the sideshow. I just cleaned it up... let's all move on. Thanks.

[WHarris1]

And Ozzie has nothing to do with that, but everything to do with poor play like this year, right? You're right, my fault.

 

Jose Contreras was awful until last year. Bobby Jenks was let go by the Angels. He had a team of misfits and made them a world championship team. I am not saying it was all Ozzie, but it wasn't all the players either. It was a combination.

No actually Ozzie had nothing to do with Jenks success, and was not the main force behind Jose's turnaround.

 

And who said Ozzie is not responsible for last year, but totally responsible for this year?

 

Last year's team won the World Series because of incredible starting pitching, how is that Ozzie's doing?

 

Maybe a combination of around 95-5 proportion.

[kapkomet]

He overvalues the talent of a leadoff hitter, believing speed is a more important factor than OBP.

Do you really see that? I don't.

 

I think he things that once you raise your OBP, your speed is invaluable.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Sep 6, 2006 -> 04:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No actually Ozzie had nothing to do with Jenks success, and was not the main force behind Jose's turnaround.

 

And who said Ozzie is not responsible for last year, but totally responsible for this year?

 

Last year's team won the World Series because of incredible starting pitching, how is that Ozzie's doing?

 

Maybe a combination of around 95-5 proportion.

 

so then what is his doing this year? what is his portion this year?

 

 

QUOTE(shoota @ Sep 6, 2006 -> 04:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How 'bout the problem Ozzie has evaluating players. Ozzie doesn't think Brandon McCarthy is better than any of the starting pitchers, and grossly undervalues Brian Anderson. Also, OG has a distorted view that a player cannot both hit for power and have speed.

 

In 2005, OG evaluated Damaso Marte as being a better pitcher than Brandon McCarthy, going with Marte in both playoff rosters.

 

He overvalues the talent of a leadoff hitter, believing speed is a more important factor than OBP.

 

You get that from this article? Where does Ozzie state this? I don't get it. I really don't.

[WHarris1]

so then what is his doing this year? what is his portion this year?

I am of the belief that a manager can hurt a team much more than he can help, especially in this case of a veteran laden team. Probably around 85-15, it is not like a quantifiable science. But I do know that he has handled Brian Anderson and BMac like s*** this year.

Edited September 6, 2006 by WHarris1

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Sep 6, 2006 -> 04:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am of the belief that a manager can hurt a team much more than he can help. Probably around 85-15.

 

So then you think 20 games over .500 is having a bad season? Or you're not even giving credit for him having a good season at all?

 

Managers have a 5% effect on all wins and a 15% effect on all loses? That is interesting. So the manager is pretty useless then? OK.

[WHarris1]

So then you think 20 games over .500 is having a bad season? Or you're not even giving credit for him having a good season at all?

 

Managers have a 5% effect on all wins and a 15% effect on all loses? That is interesting. So the manager is pretty useless then? OK.

How much do you think a manager impacts a team?

[StrangeSox]

Why is it so hard for people to understand that Anderson has dramatically improved at the play.

 

hey, guess what, he's a ROOKIE! A ROOKIE IMPROVED AFTER HIS FIRST COUPLE OF MONTHS! WHAT A MINDJOB THAT ONE IS!!!!

 

So looking at his SEASON BA is pretty retarded to make statements about what to do with him NOW. He is clearly much, much better at the plate now than he was in April and May. If you're too dense to understand that and insist on including the first two months, don't ever try to be a baseball scout.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Sep 6, 2006 -> 04:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am of the belief that a manager can hurt a team much more than he can help, especially in this case of a veteran laden team. Probably around 85-15, it is not like a quantifiable science. But I do know that he has handled Brian Anderson and BMac like s*** this year.

 

To you he has. From someone that is not around the team and watching from his couch he has. I would rather know this opinion from someone within the organization or that is around the organization. To be honest I don't trust your judgement on either of those situations because you frankly don't know s*** about either of them. Neither do I, so we are in the same boat as far as that goes.

[Balta1701]

How much do you think a manager impacts a team?

Hypotheticals:

 

Where would the Tigers be this season if they had Alan Trammel instead of Jim Leyland?

 

Where would the White Sox be in 2005 if they had Jerry Manuel instead of Ozzie Guillen?

 

Where would the Marlins have been in 2003 without Jack McKeon? (under .500 before he was there, best team in the league after switching managers).

 

Where would the Angels have been in 02 without Scoscia?

Edited September 6, 2006 by Balta1701

[Gene Honda Civic]

Do you really see that? I don't.

 

I think he things that once you raise your OBP, your speed is invaluable.

Pablo Ozuna entered the season with a career .307 OBP

 

Scott Podsednik entered with a career .345 OBP

 

They've combined to post a .277 OBP in the second half. They've combined for just a .200 OBP in the first inning since the break.

 

They've gotten every start this season in LF and, before tonight, every start of the year in the leadoff position.

[WHarris1]

Hypotheticals:

 

Where would the Tigers be this season if they had Alan Trammel instead of Jim Leyland?

 

Where would the White Sox be in 2005 if they had Jerry Manuel instead of Ozzie Guillen?

 

Where would the Marlins have been in 2003 without Jack McKeon? (under .500 before he was there, best team in the league after switching managers).

1. I would guess fighting for the Wild Card, so he had a solid impact. Where would they be with Jason Johnson instead of Kenny Rogers? Where would they be without Zumaya and Jones in the pen, who they haven't had int he past? How about if Magglio was still injured? Would Leyland have the same impact?

2. Where would the 2005 White Sox be without Jose Contreras, Neal Cotts, or Cliff Politte? This is what I'm trying to say, who deserves the credit? I personally would give the vast majority of it to the players out there actually winning the games.

3. McKeon is an incredible case. Also I would say they were playing closer to where they should with McKeon compared to Torborg, that team was incredible talented.

Edited September 6, 2006 by WHarris1

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Sep 6, 2006 -> 04:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How much do you think a manager impacts a team?

 

I think he can impact it a great deal either negatively or positively. I am just in the belief that if you are going to give someone the credit for the bad times you better be giving them the credit for the good. I know for a fact the 2005 team is not winning with Jerry Manuel, Terry Bevington, or Gene Lamont.

[kapkomet]

Different teams respond to different tactics. This year's Sox is different then last year's. I don't understand why that's not being talked about either.

[shoota]

Do you really see that? I don't.

 

I think he things that once you raise your OBP, your speed is invaluable.

 

Then why does Ozzie keep starting Podsednik--who's known for his speed--at leadoff instead of Mackowiak--who has a higher OBP?

[kapkomet]

Pablo Ozuna entered the season with a career .307 OBP

 

Scott Podsednik entered with a career .345 OBP

 

They've combined to post a .277 OBP in the second half. They've combined for just a .200 OBP in the first inning since the break.

 

They've gotten every start this season in LF and, before tonight, every start of the year in the leadoff position.

That's true... are you agreeing with what I'm saying?

 

Then why does Ozzie keep starting Podsednik--who's known for his speed--at leadoff instead of Mackowiak--who has a higher OBP?

If you go back to BA's case, he wants to see a higher OBP. And his speed on the basepaths needs to be utilized. Someone else mentioned 30-30 in this thread, and it's possible, if he works hard enough.

[shoota]

That's true... are you agreeing with what I'm saying?

If you go back to BA's case, he wants to see a higher OBP. And his speed on the basepaths needs to be utilized. Someone else mentioned 30-30 in this thread, and it's possible, if he works hard enough.

 

I haven't heard or read Ozzie stating that.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Sep 6, 2006 -> 04:53 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Pablo Ozuna entered the season with a career .307 OBP

 

Scott Podsednik entered with a career .345 OBP

 

They've combined to post a .277 OBP in the second half. They've combined for just a .200 OBP in the first inning since the break.

 

They've gotten every start this season in LF and, before tonight, every start of the year in the leadoff position.

 

Ok, who on this team is a better canidate?

[Balta1701]

Ok, who on this team is a better canidate?

Rob Mackowiak. Ross Gload.

[kapkomet]

Ok, who on this team is a better canidate?

BMac?

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(shoota @ Sep 6, 2006 -> 04:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I haven't heard or read Ozzie stating that.

 

or not stating that. He wants him to get better. Does Ozzie love speed? Yes, you can tell that. He wants BA to go to winer ball and work on things and get better. What is so hard to understand.

[kapkomet]

I haven't heard or read Ozzie stating that.

Yea, but if you read between the lines, he wants BA on base, and then to utilize that talent (speed) there as well.

[Balta1701]

or not stating that. He wants him to get better. Does Ozzie love speed? Yes, you can tell that. He wants BA to go to winer ball and work on things and get better. What is so hard to understand.

Why he puts Mackowiak in CF for 1/2 of the games in the 2nd half, then complains that Anderson doesn't have enough at bats?