Bullpen update

[fathom]

MacDougal has tightness in his right shoulder, but thinks he'll be available to go on Friday. Personally, Ozzie has got to avoid pitching him more than one inning in an outing. Also, Jenks is getting tired of the velocity questions. The scary thing is how much his response sounds like Billy Koch a few years ago.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines

Edited September 14, 2006 by fathom

[Steve9347]

personally, I think Jenks will be fine... macdougals crazy arm motion scares me a bit... but let him throw his arm off this year if it gets us in the door.

[GoRowand33]

hmm as long as 2/3 between MacDougal/Jenks/Thornton stays healthy were fine

[SoxHawk1980]

hmm as long as 2/3 between MacDougal/Jenks/Thornton stays healthy were fine

That might be true if Ozzie both recognized that these three were his go to guys and relied on them exclusively in close/late game situations. However, what Ozzie will do, regardless of health status, is continue to give too many key innings to guys like Hermanson, Cotts, Logan, McCarthy, etc.

[elrockinMT]

hmm as long as 2/3 between MacDougal/Jenks/Thornton stays healthy were fine

 

The bullpen has not been a fun thing to watch. However, Thornton, McDougall and Jenks have been pretty good. I was a bit concerned about Jenks blowing 3 saves and when he gave up six straight hits over 2 games without an out I was really worried. But, he seems to have gotten back on track.

[Gregory Pratt]

That might be true if Ozzie both recognized that these three were his go to guys and relied on them exclusively in close/late game situations. However, what Ozzie will do, regardless of health status, is continue to give too many key innings to guys like Hermanson, Cotts, Logan, McCarthy, etc.

 

You can't rely on three guys "exclusively." You'd kill their arms!

 

Fact is, Black Mack and Hermanson will have to appear sometimes, as will Cotts and Logan.

[witesoxfan]

You can't rely on three guys "exclusively." You'd kill their arms!

 

Fact is, Black Mack and Hermanson will have to appear sometimes, as will Cotts and Logan.

 

I think that's obvious.

 

Soxhawk is basically saying limit them to as little as possible. If the Sox are up 2-1 in a tight game in the 6th, and the starter's on the ropes...go to Thornton/MackyD. Do not go to Cotts, BMac, Logan, or Hermanson.

[Gregory Pratt]

I think that's obvious.

 

Soxhawk is basically saying limit them to as little as possible. If the Sox are up 2-1 in a tight game in the 6th, and the starter's on the ropes...go to Thornton/MackyD. Do not go to Cotts, BMac, Logan, or Hermanson.

 

It's nice in theory, but it just won't work out. Sometimes, in close games, in earlier innings, the middle relievers/long relievers have got to come in, and that means that Black Mack and Cotts and Logan and Haeger and Hermanson will be there.

[SoxHawk1980]

It's nice in theory, but it just won't work out. Sometimes, in close games, in earlier innings, the middle relievers/long relievers have got to come in, and that means that Black Mack and Cotts and Logan and Haeger and Hermanson will be there.

True, but Ozzie has been and will continue to put in guys like Hermanson, Cotts, Logan, Haeger and McCarthy in close game situations in the 7th, 8th and 9th as well. He's been doing that consistently. There are key situations with the game on the line where we should only see MacDougal, Thornton or Jenks (unless they are completely unavailable) and Ozzie will continue to use lesser pitchers in many of those situations because Ozzie simply doesn't know how to handle the bullpen. He's shown that all season long.

[Gregory Pratt]

True, but Ozzie has been and will continue to put in guys like Hermanson, Cotts, Logan, Haeger and McCarthy in close game situations in the 7th, 8th and 9th as well. He's been doing that consistently. There are key situations with the game on the line where we should only see MacDougal, Thornton or Jenks (unless they are completely unavailable) and Ozzie will continue to use lesser pitchers in many of those situations because Ozzie simply doesn't know how to handle the bullpen. He's shown that all season long.

 

My problem with Ozzie + the Pen is twofold: McCarthy should never pitch unless it's LONG relief. He blows out of the pen and is VERY prone to the longball.

 

Second: he should let them rest a lot more. Like Garland's game v. Cleveland, seven runs in one inning because he put in the minor leaguers. I agreed with Black Jack that, in games like that, you rest the pen.

 

I like his handling of the team so far, so that's where this ends.

I do think it's fair enough to complain about it, though, and that's your right.

[Harry Chappas]

Guillen uses guys to see what they are made of. I think for the remainder ofthe season it will be the big three.

 

If the Sox make the playoffs they need to know who they can trust, Cotts, Hermanson, Riske, McCarthy etc.

[CanOfCorn]

Guillen uses guys to see what they are made of. I think for the remainder ofthe season it will be the big three.

 

If the Sox make the playoffs they need to know who they can trust, Cotts, Hermanson, Riske, McCarthy etc.

 

 

We have a winner!

[SoxHawk1980]

Guillen uses guys to see what they are made of. I think for the remainder ofthe season it will be the big three.

 

If the Sox make the playoffs they need to know who they can trust, Cotts, Hermanson, Riske, McCarthy etc.

This isn't Spring Training. The Sox can't afford to have Ozzie keep trotting not-the-best-pitcher-for-the-situation out there so Ozzie can evaluate them. He has had all season for that. The Sox couldn't afford this since the ASB. They couldn't afford it in August. They certainly couldn't afford it in September. And yet Ozzie continues to put Hermanson, Cotts, McCarthy in crucial game on the line situations when better relievers are available. If Ozzie is "seeing what they are made of" he doesn't understand that the #1 priority is winning, not talent evaluation.

[Soxbadger]

You see what guys are made of in April, May, June, July, August.

 

You play to win in September and October.

 

Ozzie has to realize this.

[Damen]

You see what guys are made of in April, May, June, July, August.

 

You play to win in September and October.

 

Ozzie has to realize this.

 

Nope, you need to see what Cotts has alll the way until the end of September. Then Ozzie will have enough to think about until the evaluation starts from scratch next March. By the time Cotts retires, Ozzie will have a decent idea of "what he's made out of."

[Harry Chappas]

This isn't Spring Training. The Sox can't afford to have Ozzie keep trotting not-the-best-pitcher-for-the-situation out there so Ozzie can evaluate them. He has had all season for that. The Sox couldn't afford this since the ASB. They couldn't afford it in August. They certainly couldn't afford it in September. And yet Ozzie continues to put Hermanson, Cotts, McCarthy in crucial game on the line situations when better relievers are available. If Ozzie is "seeing what they are made of" he doesn't understand that the #1 priority is winning, not talent evaluation.

 

Your missing the point. The other night when McDougal was not available his pre-September options were Riske, Cotts, or McCarthy. We have seen that movie before. He wanted to see if Hermanson is worth anything. He needs to use the pen and see what is out there. Other than McDougal, Thorton and Jenks, there is nobody. Guillen is hoping Hermanson can get him something. The pen will be fine if they make the playoffs but they need to get there and they need some help. A starter goes out there for the playoffs to fill in this gap. I get the feeling McCarthy is done for this season, playoffs included.

[gosox41]

Your missing the point. The other night when McDougal was not available his pre-September options were Riske, Cotts, or McCarthy. We have seen that movie before. He wanted to see if Hermanson is worth anything. He needs to use the pen and see what is out there. Other than McDougal, Thorton and Jenks, there is nobody. Guillen is hoping Hermanson can get him something. The pen will be fine if they make the playoffs but they need to get there and they need some help. A starter goes out there for the playoffs to fill in this gap. I get the feeling McCarthy is done for this season, playoffs included.

 

 

I agree with you that they need the expanded pen to get to the playoffs, but based on some recent performance by guys that would be on the playoff roster, how can you be so sure the pen will be fine?

 

 

Bob