Jim Thome

[Kyyle23]

Word......... Thome is country strong, and he never gets cheated while taking his swings, which is exactly the problem. But taking him out of the lineup means Pods, Anderson, and Uribe will need to be replaced with more productive hitters. I've said all along that I didn't like the Sox reliance on the HR. They need a more fluid offense that can put pressure on the basepaths.

 

I translate that into "Please let Kenny trade for Carl Crawford if possible"

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Sep 16, 2006 -> 04:19 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thats because I think stats are over-rated in tons of situations. But thats a whole other debate.

Ok, so how exactly would you like to conmpare and contrast two players? Switch eyeballs so we can both see through the same set of eyes?

 

QUOTE(BearSox @ Sep 16, 2006 -> 09:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Also, whoever thinks Dye and Konerko are having "career years" are way off. Jermaine Dye is finally healthy and at the top of his game. He would have been putting up numbers like he is this year 5 years ago if he didn't have all those injuries. And Konerko has always been a very good hitter, outside of that one year. He has been getting better year after year.

 

In fact, I am going to work on my "offseason plan" if I was the GM right now.

Hilarious how people think Thome is injured or talk about him being hurt, yet you think Dye has dealt with injuries his entire life. Dye gets to keep a spot on the roster, but a guy who has historically always had better numbers, and this year has numbers close to Dye's is too injured and shouldn't have a spot on the team. So is Dye more injury prone than Thome?

[Allsox]

Leave Thome alone. It's not his fault the entire pitching staff from top to bottom was consistently inconsistent for the entire yr. The guy carried them through April and May while the pitching stunk. He couldn't possibly do it all by himself for the next 4 months.

[TLAK]

As to standing pat, remember the White Sox would have had last year’s team PLUS 5 more months of Frank Thomas. As to bringing in Thome to compensate for a perceived weakness vs right handed starters the numbers from MLB Press Pass are:

 

2005

V RHS 76-43 = .637

V LHS 23-20 = .535

 

2006

V RHS 54-34 = .614

V LHS 30-29 = .508

 

I don’t see much improvement, they are 20 some points down from both sides.

 

What’s done is done. I had my say in the Evil Kenny Williams thread in the spring. In KW’s defense, nobody knew Big Frank would stay healthy and play so good, nobody knew Podsednik and Anderson would struggle, that Politte and Hermanson would get hurt. Rowand could have broken his ankle playing for the Sox too.

 

The bottom line is there are 14 games to go, and the White Sox are within 3 games of the playoffs. Another championship is within reach.

[elrockinMT]

Thome was acquired because we need a power lefty bat to hit right handed pitchers.

 

Has that train of thought suddenly changed all of a sudden?

 

Do we want to bring back the days of Crazy Carl Everett?

 

 

You don't trade Jim Thome. The idea of platooning him is awfully strage. Using that reasoning we would have PK sitting against righties and Gload playing 1stbase. We have a real good offensive team lacking at CF and LF and possibly SS. But the trade off is good defense in CF and SS. Six of one and half dozen of the other. Our problems this hyear have usually been from pitching. Starters not doing their job or relievers- it just seems to change from game to game or series to series.

[witesoxfan]

As to standing pat, remember the White Sox would have had last year’s team PLUS 5 more months of Frank Thomas. As to bringing in Thome to compensate for a perceived weakness vs right handed starters the numbers from MLB Press Pass are:

 

2005

V RHS 76-43 = .637

V LHS 23-20 = .535

 

2006

V RHS 54-34 = .614

V LHS 30-29 = .508

 

I don’t see much improvement, they are 20 some points down from both sides.

 

What’s done is done. I had my say in the Evil Kenny Williams thread in the spring. In KW’s defense, nobody knew Big Frank would stay healthy and play so good, nobody knew Podsednik and Anderson would struggle, that Politte and Hermanson would get hurt. Rowand could have broken his ankle playing for the Sox too.

 

The bottom line is there are 14 games to go, and the White Sox are within 3 games of the playoffs. Another championship is within reach.

 

Spose any of that had to do with a 3.61 team ERA last year, compared to the 4.52 ERA they've put up this year?

[Milkman delivers]

Has any player in baseball fallen off more in the second half of the season than Jim Thome? He's paid to hit homers (that's all he swings for, at least) and he's done very little of that this half.

[Hangar18]

Thome is one of KW's biggest deals. He won't trade Thome and he won't allow Ozzie to platoon Thome (Ozzie wouldn't think of doing it anyway) unless he is hurt. Thome might be an albatross around this team's neck next year. He might not be. But if he's injured next year and/or his skills are diminishing, he won't be helping this team a whole lot.

 

 

Thome was very Big Hurt-esque in April and part of May. He then regressed BADLY into an almost automatic out (barring a mistake pitch here and there). I havnt liked Jim Thome since June/July, especially in the 3 hole. Many rallies were stopped early on .........

 

 

Has any player in baseball fallen off more in the second half of the season than Jim Thome? He's paid to hit homers (that's all he swings for, at least) and he's done very little of that this half.

 

 

The Irony here, is Jim Thome is more suited to the 2003 team than the 2006 SOX. YES, I know its unfair to compare him to Thomas, because I do like the R/L/R combo, but he isnt a Contact/UseAllPartsoftheField guy like Thomas was. How many times did we need Thome to at least get the runner over, or drive him in with a Sac Fly? Boy could we use a Frank Thomas type player on our team.

[Heads22]

Because we all know Frank would have done exactly the same thing in Chicago. It's not like it's a totally different situation over there in Oakland or anything.

[MSHAWKS]

Because we all know Frank would have done exactly the same thing in Chicago. It's not like it's a totally different situation over there in Oakland or anything.

 

 

Well, I don't know what Frank would have done in Chicago this September. I do know that Thome has looked clueless down the stretch, but I'm sure the Jimmy-apollogists here will defend him anyway.

[spiderman]

Has any player in baseball fallen off more in the second half of the season than Jim Thome? He's paid to hit homers (that's all he swings for, at least) and he's done very little of that this half.

 

I have a feeling that after the season ends (yes, no playoffs), we're going to hear that Thome's wrist was more seriously injured than let on. Still, no excuses....he still gets on base often enough to score runs, but the hitting has been pretty bad in the 2nd half.

 

For next season, I think Ozzie has to limit Thome to about 120 games....I hate to rest the regulars as much as Ozzie has this season, but I think it's imperative to get Thome healthy this off-season, and get him 1 to 2 off days a week, especially against lefties.

 

It turns out that as well as he played in the 1st half, he just wasn't able to contribute much in the 2nd half, and as we've seen with the struggling offense, a top performance by Thome would have been huge in the 2nd half.

[witesoxfan]

but he isnt a Contact/UseAllPartsoftheField guy like Thomas was.

 

In 2003, the year you are comparing, I seem to remember almost every home run Thomas hit was pulled. Also, just so you're aware...

 

2002 - 115 K's

2003 - 115 K's

 

Hell of a contact hitter he was back in the day

[WinningUgly85]

If Kenny has Thome back next season. Has has got to find a right handed compliment to platoon against left handed pitching and spell for Jim every now and then.

 

Having Frank Thomas would have been nice.

[MSHAWKS]

In 2003, the year you are comparing, I seem to remember almost every home run Thomas hit was pulled. Also, just so you're aware...

 

2002 - 115 K's

2003 - 115 K's

 

Hell of a contact hitter he was back in the day

 

 

You're not really trying to say that Thome is a better contact hitter than Frank, are you?

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(Hangar18 @ Sep 18, 2006 -> 09:36 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thome was very Big Hurt-esque in April and part of May. He then regressed BADLY into an almost automatic out (barring a mistake pitch here and there). I havnt liked Jim Thome since June/July, especially in the 3 hole. Many rallies were stopped early on .........

The Irony here, is Jim Thome is more suited to the 2003 team than the 2006 SOX. YES, I know its unfair to compare him to Thomas, because I do like the R/L/R combo, but he isnt a Contact/UseAllPartsoftheField guy like Thomas was. How many times did we need Thome to at least get the runner over, or drive him in with a Sac Fly? Boy could we use a Frank Thomas type player on our team.

Jim Thome:

RISP: .327/.466/.701 61 RBI's in 107 At bats.

For the sac fly argument:

Man on 3rd, < 2 outs: .391/.459/.957 27 RBI's in 23 at bats. MORE RBI'S than AT BATS.

 

Oh yeah, his second highest OPS in a month was in AUGUST.

 

Sac fly totals: Thome: 6, Thomas: 5

 

 

Apologist my ass. If you can't see how good Thome has been this year or think he's only been good for April/May, you're either a fishing fool, or a Cubs fan.

 

 

 

QUOTE(MSHAWKS @ Sep 18, 2006 -> 01:55 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You're not really trying to say that Thome is a better contact hitter than Frank, are you?

His point was clearly Thomas was not a "contact hitter" in the year Hangar mentioned.

Edited September 18, 2006 by santo=dorf

[NorthSideSox72]

Of all the things on this team which need changes, Jim Thome isn't even in the top 10. People here are comparing him to a miraculously healthy Frank Thomas. Except last year, our DH wasn't Thomas - it was Carl Everett, for the great majority of the season. And oh yeah, pretty much everyone (including the great majority on this board, all Sox medical staff, Frank's independent Doc, and others) was convinced pre-season that Thomas would be lucky to play half the year. Convenient how we all forgot that part.

 

Thome >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5 months of Everett and 1 month of Thomas

 

Thome isn't the problem.

[UC76]

I'm very, very, very scared of what we'll get from Thome in 2007. I fear the second half of this year is what we'll get all of next year. The guy is old and falling apart...and that isn't going to get better.

[Hangar18]

I have a feeling that after the season ends (yes, no playoffs), we're going to hear that Thome's wrist was more seriously injured than let on. Still, no excuses....he still gets on base often enough to score runs, but the hitting has been pretty bad in the 2nd half.

 

For next season, I think Ozzie has to limit Thome to about 120 games....I hate to rest the regulars as much as Ozzie has this season, but I think it's imperative to get Thome healthy this off-season, and get him 1 to 2 off days a week, especially against lefties.

 

It turns out that as well as he played in the 1st half, he just wasn't able to contribute much in the 2nd half, and as we've seen with the struggling offense, a top performance by Thome would have been huge in the 2nd half.

 

 

You might be onto something here, which would explain the dropoff ................

[NorthSideSox72]

I'm very, very, very scared of what we'll get from Thome in 2007. I fear the second half of this year is what we'll get all of next year. The guy is old and falling apart...and that isn't going to get better.

Old and falling apart? The guy has had just one season in his whole career that was limited by injury more than a few days here and there. That's a lot better record than Thomas has. Not to mention that, despite his size and age, he still runs better than a handful of our starters. Plus Thome is religious with staying in shape.

 

I'm a lot more worried about the health of Konerko, Dye, Crede and some of our pitchers than I am Thome.

[WilliamTell]

Old and falling apart? The guy has had just one season in his whole career that was limited by injury more than a few days here and there. That's a lot better record than Thomas has. Not to mention that, despite his size and age, he still runs better than a handful of our starters. Plus Thome is religious with staying in shape.

 

I'm a lot more worried about the health of Konerko, Dye, Crede and some of our pitchers than I am Thome.

 

Yeah I don't think Thome's the one to worry about on this team for next year. He started off great this season, hasn't done as well the 2nd half but I expect him to have another strong year next year.

[MSHAWKS]

Apologist my ass. If you can't see how good Thome has been this year or think he's only been good for April/May, you're either a fishing fool, or a Cubs fan.

 

 

If you can't see how unproductive he's been since July, then you're letting your crush on Jim cloud your judgement.

[NorthSideSox72]

If you can't see how unproductive he's been since July, then you're letting your crush on Jim cloud your judgement.

Yeah. That August OPS of 1.039 was really lousy. Worthless, really.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 18, 2006 -> 02:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah. That August OPS of 1.039 was really lousy. Worthless, really.

OR a 1.005 July OPS that conveniently gets swept under the rug like Frank's Timo-like April.

 

Who's the one being biased again?

Edited September 18, 2006 by santo=dorf

[WCSox]

First it was get rid of Ozzie. Now get rid of Thome??? You guys have lost your marbles...

[BigSqwert]

Yeah. That August OPS of 1.039 was really lousy. Worthless, really.

Although his August OPS was good did you really consider him a major threat at the plate? I sure didn't. Seems like clutch hits were few and far between in the 2nd half.