southsideirish71 Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 You dont have to blow up s***. Ditch Prancer, put someone in LF who has a pulse. Ditch Uribe, get someone who has a pulse. Ditch Garcia and his 86mph fastball. Invite Cora and Walker to a conference, when they show up, its just HR with some forms for them to fill out. Hire a hitting coach that preaches OBP and line drive swings, and being a tough out. Hire a 3rd base coach that isnt a pinwheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RibbieRubarb Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 (edited) I will always be amazed by the names and avatar "fans" use on this site... But, I agree with you Mike. Give this team a chance to rest and heal. Then we come back with a vengence. Edited September 19, 2006 by RibbieRubarb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Tizzle Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 QUOTE(SnB @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 02:12 PM) Balta, I see your point, but you have to also think that next year is possibly the best chance we're going to have at another championship for awhile. I'm all for going all out for next year and seeing where that takes us. You can only plan for the future so much, when the opportunity is there, which it will be next year, you gotta take advantage of it. If you believe next year is truly the last 'window of opportunity' available to this ballclub, what would be the limit to how far you'd go? Would you approve another Thome/Vazquez trade which basically involves the pillaging of top positional and/or pitching prospects? Honestly, I believe this season was our moment. Williams had in his possession a collection of starting pitchers -- VAUNTED, some might say -- which was upgraded with Vazquez's addition. No one questioned our talent. Look at us now. The entire rotation regressed. The one component which carried our ballclub this year -- and ultimately led to our removal from the playoffs -- failed. What exactly do I have to be hopeful with next season? That Buehrle magically returns to his career numbers? Contreras, and his 45, remain healthy for another season? It just amazes me to hear people continuely hold faith in our five starting pitchers. Even considering Garcia's impending removal. As it is now, it's not going to compete with those within our division. THIS is the key. Our window of opportunity was here, and guess what -- WE BLEW IT. Now is the time to trade whomever is necessary; whichever piece could lend us the greatest amount of talent in return. It's still possible to compete and rebuild, as Balta has indicated. Really, it comes down to this for me -- either put everything you have (money, prospects) into next season HOPING the rotation magically returns to 2005 form; or look beyond next season and realize the position we may be in concerning free agents. I'll always be a fan of the Whtie Sox, but I just don't believe they're in a good position next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baines3 Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 Why get rid of a team in which most of the players helped win the World Series? Granted we need more speed and more power in the outfield but I sure wouldn't break up the ball club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 Flash, I hate to do this, because right now it seems ridiculous...but would the Yankees win the AL Central? Mediocre starting pitching, mediocre bullpen up until the closer, and an amazing lineup. In my mind, that is a team that would win any division in baseball. Obviously, the Sox do not have an offense quite as good as the Yankees right now, but with just 1-2 big additions(in my mind, Crawford and Rollins), that lineup goes from inconsistent to one of the best in the league again, with more than one dimension, which apparently some people love, but also more potent than this year's lineup. Along the same lines, that allows for Sweeney and/or Fields...dependent upon the price to bring in Crawford/Rollins...to season a bit further in AAA, so if/when the Sox do blow it up, those two are ready to step onto the big league club and make a difference right away, instead of going through the Anderson struggle period(hopefully). And if they do struggle right away, so what, they're rebuilding. The problem of course is how to acquire those two, but the point remains the same that, in my mind, a rotation of Garland-Vazquez-Buerhle-Contreras-McCarthy would win a division with a lineup that can hit any and all pitching. It's just a matter of execution. When they blow it up, you see a Cleveland Indian/Florida Marlin blow-up, and any and all talent that is close to the majors is brought in and given a shot to contribute to the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 03:26 PM) You dont have to blow up s***. Ditch Prancer, put someone in LF who has a pulse. Ditch Uribe, get someone who has a pulse. Ditch Garcia and his 86mph fastball. Invite Cora and Walker to a conference, when they show up, its just HR with some forms for them to fill out. Hire a hitting coach that preaches OBP and line drive swings, and being a tough out. Hire a 3rd base coach that isnt a pinwheel. Agreed on all counts but Walker. He isn't perfect by any means, but he did take an offense that was bottom half last year and is top 5 this year. And that was not just the addition of Thome. Walker deserves SOME of the credit for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 02:00 PM) Agreed on all counts but Walker. He isn't perfect by any means, but he did take an offense that was bottom half last year and is top 5 this year. And that was not just the addition of Thome. Walker deserves SOME of the credit for that. Until the last month, I was becoming very happy with what Walker had done this year. Crede going from mediocre to dominant. Anderson learning how to actually hit. Konerko avoiding the bad slump to start off the season. It didn't work, but Uribe made some of the changes during the offseason he needed to make (spreading out his legs to keep his head more steady). AJ spending the whole first 2/3 of the season going the other way and hitting .330 in the process. Unfortunately, except for Anderson, by the time September has rolled around, almost all of those seem to have gone backwards. Konerko has stopped hitting the ball the other way, AJ is being the pull monkey and his average is plummeting, Uribe is back to his old "Swing at everything" habit. And we're right back to looking like we never have a game plan against a pitcher, when even in Mid August, there were plenty of games where we came out raking decent pitchers because we looked like we knew what we wanted to do. I'm not sure that anyone could have actually done better this season than Walker. It seems to me the guys who were willing to listen to him (Anderson, Crede) actually did a lot better, and the guys who were stubborn got back into all their bad habits at the end of the year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamTell Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 Don't blow it up, look at the Yankees. They won it all in 96 and didn't even make the playoffs in 97 but won it all in 98, 99, and 2000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LVSoxFan Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 Good point William Tell. The core is there. We just need some adjustments. But shipping out Paulie, Iguchi, etc.... that's radical amputation surgery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted September 19, 2006 Share Posted September 19, 2006 QUOTE(LVSoxFan @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 02:44 PM) Good point William Tell. The core is there. We just need some adjustments. But shipping out Paulie, Iguchi, etc.... that's radical amputation surgery. Shipping out Iguchi is not a radical move. Why? Because Iguchi is a FA at the end of 2007. If there were another option presented to us and a good deal in place for Iguchi, that would not be a radical move. QUOTE(WilliamTell @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 02:34 PM) Don't blow it up, look at the Yankees. They won it all in 96 and didn't even make the playoffs in 97 but won it all in 98, 99, and 2000. But there were significant changes between the 96 and 98 seasons for the Yankees. 96/98: C Joe Girardi/Jorge Posada 2B: Mariano Duncan/Chuck Knoblauch 3B: Wade Boggs/Scott Brosius Pitching staff: Andy Pettitte, Jimmy Key, Kenny Rogers, Dwight Gooden, David Cone, Ramiro Mendoza. Closer John Wetteland. 98: Orlando Hernandez, Hideki Irabu, Andy Pettitte, David Wells, David Cone. 3 of their 5 starters turned over in those 2 years. Closer: Mariano Rivera (setup man in 96). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoomSlowik Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 (edited) QUOTE(SinkingShip06 @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 03:23 PM) your idea of 2 out bleeders is EXECUTION. not breaks. if you say they didn't get any breaks this year, you haven't been watching. Whether or not a ball in play falls or not is largely a factor of luck. Even if you hit a screaming liner in the gap there's a chance that the outfielder will make a diving catch. Yeah, some balls are more likely to fall than others, but there are no guarantees unless you hit it out of the park. Getting a weak fly ball that drops or a weak grounder in the right spot isn't that dependent on exectution. Yeah, good contact hitters help, but that still only translates into a hit about 30% of the time on average. Again, what breaks are you speaking of? Outside of one stretch of errors by the other team against New York and Tampa and Liriano getting hurt I can't think of any massive breaks that we got. Hell, I'd bet we got more in the playoffs last year than we did all this season. Edited September 20, 2006 by ZoomSlowik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan99 Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 QUOTE(WilliamTell @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 04:34 PM) Don't blow it up, look at the Yankees. They won it all in 96 and didn't even make the playoffs in 97 but won it all in 98, 99, and 2000. The Yankees did make the playoffs in 97. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamTell Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 QUOTE(whitesoxfan99 @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 08:15 PM) The Yankees did make the playoffs in 97. Was it through the Wild Card then? But either way you are right, they lost to the Mariners, I remember that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan99 Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 QUOTE(WilliamTell @ Sep 19, 2006 -> 08:17 PM) Was it through the Wild Card then? But either way you are right, they lost to the Mariners, I remember that. Yes, and actually they lost to the Indians. They lost to the Mariners in 95. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 You dont have to blow up s***. Ditch Prancer, put someone in LF who has a pulse. Ditch Uribe, get someone who has a pulse. Ditch Garcia and his 86mph fastball. Invite Cora and Walker to a conference, when they show up, its just HR with some forms for them to fill out. Hire a hitting coach that preaches OBP and line drive swings, and being a tough out. Hire a 3rd base coach that isnt a pinwheel. Those are good suggestions. It's a must to deal Pods and Uribe. I'd rather ditch Vas than Fred, but one will go. Cora deserves to not return as 3b coach; he cost us big time. Walker can stay; hitters don't listen to hitting coaches We also need new middle relief. Our middle relief is without one real stud. We also need to dump Alomar and get a real backup catcher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted September 20, 2006 Share Posted September 20, 2006 QUOTE(greg775 @ Sep 20, 2006 -> 02:19 AM) Walker can stay; hitters don't listen to hitting coaches Why would a team waste money on them then? For show? Crede's not a good hitter because of hard work and maturity. He's a good hitter because he spent a s***load of time with Walker working on his mechanics in the 04-05 offseason. Frank Thomas, one of the best hitters of the past 25 years, constantly consulted with Walt Hrniak. It sure as hell wasn't because he was a hell of a psychologist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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