Congressman quits over sexual harrassment

[NorthSideSox72]

This has happened before,with a Democrat, and he didn't get jail time either. In fact, he was re-elected 5 more times after the deed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerry_Studds

KInda ironic that Crane apologized for his deeds, and lost his election, while Studds did not, and was reelected again and again. Don't misread this, I think he should get jail time, especially considering his position in trying to stop this sort of thing, just wanted to share this with you all that strange things happen in politics.

Hey look - slime comes in both blue and red. I'm shocked.

[Texsox]

Did you hear Foley didn't use bookmarks? He prefered to bend over the pages . . .

 

Hey look - slime comes in both blue and red. I'm shocked.

 

What you are saying is sometimes Dems and Reps get on the same page . . .

[NorthSideSox72]

And the magic excuse is...

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061002/ap_on_...sman_e_mails_79

 

"I"m an alcoholic!"

 

Whatever. A**hole.

[southsider2k5]

And the magic excuse is...

 

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061002/ap_on_...sman_e_mails_79

 

"I"m an alcoholic!"

 

Whatever. A**hole.

 

Hmmm so alcohol makes you want to touch little boys. That is just pathetic.

[southsideirish71]

This is another sexual predator and my view on all sexual predators is the same. They are animals that dont deserve to be part of human society, there is no cure, there is no amount of rehabilitation that allows these creatures to be part of our society again. Now I am sure the American Psychiatric Society thinks a few shots of Prozac and some therapy and Mr. Pervert will be fixed, but lets say no and just warehouse them.

 

 

You either warehouse them in a max facility in general pop so they can be as popular as a sex predator can be in a prison.

 

Or you dig a hole in the back of the prison, toss pervert in the hole, and then toss dirt on pervert.

 

Either way is the only way to deal with these types of animals.

[Rex Kickass]

The official White House reaction from Spokesman Tony Snow.

 

Yes, look, I hate to tell you, but it's not always pretty up there on Capitol Hill. And there have been other scandals, as you know, that have been more than simply naughty e-mails.

[Jenksismyhero]

This is another sexual predator and my view on all sexual predators is the same. They are animals that dont deserve to be part of human society, there is no cure, there is no amount of rehabilitation that allows these creatures to be part of our society again. Now I am sure the American Psychiatric Society thinks a few shots of Prozac and some therapy and Mr. Pervert will be fixed, but lets say no and just warehouse them.

You either warehouse them in a max facility in general pop so they can be as popular as a sex predator can be in a prison.

 

Or you dig a hole in the back of the prison, toss pervert in the hole, and then toss dirt on pervert.

 

Either way is the only way to deal with these types of animals.

 

 

 

I agree with all of this, so long as we chop their sacks off before putting them there.

[Balta1701]

So, what do folks think is the appropriate way to deal with the key Republican leaders including Hastert and Boehner who seem to have at least known that something inappropriate was going on with Foley much earlier this year but yet took no action?

[southsider2k5]

So, what do folks think is the appropriate way to deal with the key Republican leaders including Hastert and Boehner who seem to have at least known that something inappropriate was going on with Foley much earlier this year but yet took no action?

 

It all depends on what they knew and when they knew it. If they knew "everything", and knew it early they deserve to be charges as accessories to the crime. Too bad we don't hold people to that standard, or the entire Catholic church leadership would be winding its way through criminal court right now, as they should be IMO.

[Balta1701]

It all depends on what they knew and when they knew it. If they knew "everything", and knew it early they deserve to be charges as accessories to the crime. Too bad we don't hold people to that standard, or the entire Catholic church leadership would be winding its way through criminal court right now, as they should be IMO.

So what happens if they knew some things, like knew that something inappropriate was going on (i.e. by having seen some of the less-suggestive emails months ago) but not knowing the full extent?

 

It sure seems that Hastert et al. had knowledge to some extent of something going on. They had the same email that when Judicial Watch got their hands on it...they sent it to the FBI. 5 years ago a Republican staffer warned pages to watch out for Foley and “don’t get too wrapped up in him being too nice to you and all that kind of stuff.” (ABC news). A lot of these people seem to have had suggestions that there was a problem for months, maybe even years...but basically by just turning their backs and not asking anything else they probably didn't commit any specific crimes.

 

So what happens to them if what they did was basically sit on their hands and just expect it to go away, but without impeding any investigations?

[southsider2k5]

So what happens if they knew some things, like knew that something inappropriate was going on (i.e. by having seen some of the less-suggestive emails months ago) but not knowing the full extent?

 

It sure seems that Hastert et al. had knowledge to some extent of something going on. They had the same email that when Judicial Watch got their hands on it...they sent it to the FBI. 5 years ago a Republican staffer warned pages to watch out for Foley and “don’t get too wrapped up in him being too nice to you and all that kind of stuff.” (ABC news). A lot of these people seem to have had suggestions that there was a problem for months, maybe even years...but basically by just turning their backs and not asking anything else they probably didn't commit any specific crimes.

 

So what happens to them if what they did was basically sit on their hands and just expect it to go away, but without impeding any investigations?

 

Judicial watch sent it to the FBI, or the Repubs sent it to the FBI? Regardless if there wasn't a crime committed, there isn't much you can charge them with. Really it comes down to the court of public opinion at that point. What should they do unless there are actual accusations, I am not sure what they could do. Plus if there were actual allegations, and the FBI was called in to investigate, (and seemingly must not have found a reason to charge the guy with anything, because they didn't do anything before.) how far can you go before you get into slander/lible type areas?

[Balta1701]

Judicial watch sent it to the FBI, or the Repubs sent it to the FBI? Regardless if there wasn't a crime committed, there isn't much you can charge them with. Really it comes down to the court of public opinion at that point. What should they do unless there are actual accusations, I am not sure what they could do. Plus if there were actual allegations, and the FBI was called in to investigate, (and seemingly must not have found a reason to charge the guy with anything, because they didn't do anything before.) how far can you go before you get into slander/lible type areas?

Small mistake, it was CREW, not Judicial Watch.

 

Ok, so here's the story as I get it. The head of the NRCC (The guy running the Republican Congressional campaign committee) had seen the emails asking for a photo in early 2006. Boehner and Hastert had both seen them some time around the middle of 2006. CREW also got their hands on those emails at roughly the same time. CREW forwarded them to the FBI, thinking "this just can't be right" or something like that. Basically then nothing happened...the FBI did nothing, the Republicans in Congress did nothing, until ABC published the emails last week.

 

So basically, both the top Republicans in Congress and the FBI seem to have had emails from a Congressman to a 16 year old page asking what he wanted for his birthday and asking for a photograph by July of 06 at the very latest. Thus far, it seems nothing was done by either group until ABC published the emails and the IM's were found. (Not sure why the FBI did nothing).

 

So I'm just trying to figure out how to evaluate the behavior of the guys who had the emaisl and did nothing? About the only thing I can figure that would absolve them of any responsibility would be if they had gone to the FBI and asked and the FBI had said "stay out of it". But thus far, no one has given that explanation, and it'd be hard to make it fit with the fact that the FBI hadn't done anything in terms of starting an investigation.

 

So if nothing else...wouldn't it have seemed logical to take this to the Congressional Ethics committee? Or at least to the other Congressmen who run the Congressional Page program? Or the FBI? Or to do something with it?

[Jenksismyhero]

Did anyone catch Opie and Anthony this morning? They did a reading of a couple of IM conversations this guy had. He's a creep. Asking how the kid got off, asking for details about his junk, asking him what he liked/didn't like. The reading was hilarious because the kid said 'LOL' about a thousand times (which Jim Norton acted out...quite funny.

 

As for the Repubs who knew about it, I would hold them accountable as well, at least in terms of ethics and morals. As you guys mention I don't think there's any crime they can be charged for.

 

It just amazes me these people we 'normal' folk respect (at least for their position) turn out to be people like this. It would be nice if we, the people, could muster up enough support to make an example out of this guy. But like anyone with money he's gonna get off....no pun intended.

[Balta1701]

Did anyone catch Opie and Anthony this morning? They did a reading of a couple of IM conversations this guy had. He's a creep. Asking how the kid got off, asking for details about his junk, asking him what he liked/didn't like. The reading was hilarious because the kid said 'LOL' about a thousand times (which Jim Norton acted out...quite funny.

I think This one might be worse than that one.

[Kyyle23]

I think This one might be worse than that one.

 

The people in the user comments trying to discredit Brian Ross are what get me. Who really cares that it was a republican that was outed. Who really cares that it is instant messages and not emails. The point of this whole situation is that a senator is getting away with being a pedophile in plain view of many people he worked with and in plain view of the public, and blaming it on alcoholism and behavioral issues. Take Foley out of his position as Senator, and put him in ANY other job in America and right now he would be sitting in a jail cell waiting to see a judge. This whole situation sickens me, the people spinning it sicken me.

[NorthSideSox72]

Just to throw this out there, in regards to the "pedophile" discussion... If the page was 16, depending on where this occurred (DC, Virginia, elsewhere), there may have been no violation of law. In some states, 16 is consensual across the board.

 

Now, its still creepy as hell for all sorts of reasons. The age difference, the position of authority, the fact that this is a guy who is on that board for missing and exploited children, the fact that he is married with kids... the guy doesn't belong in any position of authority. So now he is gone. Good. And I hope DC or federal laws make it illegal, so that this guy can go to jail for a while.

 

Just want to put that out there - he may be allowed to go scott free (aside from losing his place in the house), which is awful. And there isn't much legally to be done about it.

 

Here is a suggestion, though, to make it clear that people in such positions should be held to a higher standard... make the holding of an elected office a factor of aggravation for any sex-related crime. In other words, if a sexual assault occurs (for example, adult with minor), if the adult is in an elected office, it automatically becomes aggravated sexual assault (which carries much stiffer penalties). This could be done at the state level as it usually would be, or, a blanket federal requirement could be issued by Congress.

[Rex Kickass]

You beat me to it.

 

He appears to be a sexual predator, and definitely one that uses his power and influence for sexual favors which is really despicable. But he doesn't appear to be a pedophile.

[Balta1701]

Just to throw this out there, in regards to the "pedophile" discussion... If the page was 16, depending on where this occurred (DC, Virginia, elsewhere), there may have been no violation of law. In some states, 16 is consensual across the board.

On the other hand though, there's a wierd quirk to the laws as written by Congress. Yes, states can set their own ages of consent, and in many cases, that age may be under 18.

 

However, the Federal Goverment has written the laws regarding indecent behavior using the internet. Specifically I think the Protection of Children From Sexual Predators Act of 1998 may be the law most noteable. When Congress writes these bills, they have always done so using the age of 18 as a line. So there's this wierd quirk...where if a judge interprets the laws exactly, it might be legal for a 16 year old and a 54 year old to actually meet and have sex, but if they go home and talk online afterwards, the online part could be illegal.

[Balta1701]

Matt Drudge...unable to comprehend that a Republican Congressman could in fact be the bad guy...decides the bad guy is the teenage boy.

DRUDGE: Well, I don't know if I said that. I'm just saying from reading these instant messages, this wasn't coerced. I mean, this wasn't somebody -- the kid was having fun with this. These LOLs throughout the entire conversation, these "laugh out louds."

 

...

DRUDGE: And if anything, these kids are less innocent, these 16- and 17-year-old beasts. And I've seen what they're doing on YouTube, and I've seen what they're doing all over the Internet. Oh yeah. And you just have to tune into any part of their pop culture. You're not going to tell me these are innocent babies. Have you read the transcripts that ABC posted going into the weekend of these instant messages, back and forth? The kids are egging the congressman on! The kids are trying to get this out of him. We haven't got the whole story on this.

 

[...]

 

DRUDGE: You could say, "Well, Drudge, it's abuse of power. This is a congressman abusing these impressionable, young 17-year-old beasts. Talking about their sex lives with a grown man, on the Internet." Because you have to remember, those of us who have seen some of the transcripts of these nasty instant messages. This was two ways, ladies and gentlemen. These kids were playing Foley for everything he was worth. Oh yeah. Oh, I haven't -- you know, they were talking about how many times they've masturbated, and oh, they didn't do it with their girlfriends this weekend. All this -- all these things and these innocent children. And this poor congressman sitting there typing about, "Oh, am I going to get any?" You know?

 

Tonight on ABC News...

 

BRIAN ROSS: So far, Foley is the only member whose overt sexual approaches have been documented. Charlie?

 

CHARLES GIBSON: The only one to be documented, but are there other shoes to drop?

 

ROSS: We’re hearing quite a bit from former pages. They’re sending us all sorts of messages about possible other members.

[Texsox]

I believe it's a legal matter. If the party knew that law enforcement was alerted, I would not hold them responsible.

[EvilMonkey]

CREW also got their hands on those emails at roughly the same time. CREW forwarded them to the FBI, thinking "this just can't be right" or something like that.

Yeah, I am sure that is whatthey were thinking. Probably more like "Hot dog! It must be Christmas! " Not exactally a non-partisan group as it claims, is it? The executive director regularly is on Air America as well as worked for both Shumer and Biden, the deputy director worked for MEdia Matters, Soros is a major contributor, and a look at their history shows that the only Democrat it has criticized was Jefferson, and then only after it was obvious that he was a crook. I wonder how long they sat on this before they turned the info in?

[Rex Kickass]

Newt's new excuse for the GOP to try. They didn't want to be seen as "gaybashers."

 

http://mediamatters.org/items/200610010003

 

So, banning gay marriage isn't gaybashing but outing a sexual predator is. Note taken!

[Texsox]

Newt's new excuse for the GOP to try. They didn't want to be seen as "gaybashers."

 

http://mediamatters.org/items/200610010003

 

So, banning gay marriage isn't gaybashing but outing a sexual predator is. Note taken!

 

 

The GOP should not have to be spinning this. There are bad people in both parties. It sickens me when the good people feel like they are shamed by someone like this. Some criminals are able to hide stuff better than others. Most people are always looking for the good in people and it is difficult to believe the worse. If someone in Montana is now going to vote for a Dem because of this, that is just stupid in my book.

[EvilMonkey]

 

There are bad people in both parties. It sickens me when the good people feel like they are shamed by someone like this.

You know Tex, I think that this statement fits alot of the posters here at Soxtalk in the Filibuster. I know I have found myself on occasion wanting to defend something a dumbass conservative did just because somehow I think it makes me look bad by comparison. This guy is a creep, and just because he shared some of my political values doesn't make me a bad guy. I may be an Evil Monkey, but I am not a bad guy. All of us here should stop taking personal offense when someone from a party that we belong to or identify with does something bad. Probably not gonna happen, but I try. In cases like this, I just try to bring the rhetoric down to something reasonable. I can see a few on here ready to lynch the whole Republican partyfor this, and being so close to elections, there are some people just soiling themselves over the possible political ramifications. This is a sad situation for all involved, but is more an inditement of Congress and the political climate as a whole than any one party. I hate politics.

[Texsox]

At some point in time, the parties instilled an us or them mentality which is great for them and bad for us. I do believe the GOP was much better at this. Any bad news is shrugged off as liberal media bias, write a bill that is unconstitutional, blame it on activist judges. We've become obsessed fans, not critical consumers of "leadership".

 

We will see some improvements when Dems clean up their party and the GOP faithful clean up theirs. The Dems can't clean up the GOP and the GOP can't clean up the Dems.