KW speaks about the offseason

[nitetrain8601]

Read here:

 

http://www.newsday.com/sports/printedition...ny-sports-print

You mean, in your opinioin AGonz>Uribe. Because Uribe ranks better than Gonz in zone rating, and was rated the best defensive shortstop in the AL by David Studes at The Hardball Times. So, in your unproven, non-fact based opinion, AGonz is better than Uribe defensively.

 

David Studes. You say something about me stating my opinion and use ZR and an article in which some guy gives his opinion to prove your point?

 

Give me these stats for this year:

http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:8NuEKh...lient=firefox-a

[CWSGuy406]

David Studes. You say something about me stating my opinion and use ZR and an article in which some guy gives his opinion to prove your point?

 

Give me these stats for this year:

http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:8NuEKh...lient=firefox-a

 

Yes, Studes is a respected enough man in the saber community (and, if you've been lucky enough to meet him, a real nice guy too) to deserve acknowledgement, seeing as he also went off of John Dewan's Fielding Bible along with ZR (among other things).

 

And, I'm not sure if I'm reading the chart correctly, but even there, Uribe's DER ranks higher and he has close to 90 more actual outs (albeit in more chances).

Edited October 1, 2006 by CWSGuy406

[nitetrain8601]

Yes, Studes is a respected enough man in the saber community (and, if you've been lucky enough to meet him, a real nice guy too) to deserve acknowledgement, seeing as he also went off of John Dewan's Fielding Bible along with ZR (among other things).

 

And, I'm not sure if I'm reading the chart correctly, but even there, Uribe's DER ranks higher and he has close to 90 more actual outs (albeit in more chances).

 

Like you said, also has 655 more chances. Think if AGonz played for CWS in 05 and Uribe played for FLA, the numbers would be the same? I don't.

[CWSGuy406]

Like you said, also has 655 more chances. Think if AGonz played for CWS in 05 and Uribe played for FLA, the numbers would be the same? I don't.

 

???

 

DER is a percentage of the chances, so it wouldn't matter if he had more chances. It's still a large enough sample size to make a judgement from it. So, Uribe ranks better in DER, zone rating, the Fielding Bible, and to Studes, yet Gonz is the better defender?

 

Hmm...

 

Along with being the better defender, he's pretty much Gonzalez' equal offensively, and is more than a year younger than AGonz.

 

Really, signing Gonzalez would be quite pointless, and I'm 100% certain Kenny wouldn't waste $3 million or so dollars.

[santo=dorf]

Get Iguchi lower in the order, don't put him at the very top.

Edited October 1, 2006 by santo=dorf

[Kalapse]

You also have to remember Gonzalez' serious health concerns he missed 120 games in 2002 followed that up with 2 pretty healthy seasons but then missed about 30 games in '05 and missed 50 games this year.

[Gene Honda Civic]

Get Iguchi lower in the order, don't put him at the very top.

Why do we need another sub 800 OPS guy hitting 6-7? We've already got AJ, who's pretty poor at driving in runs.

 

I'd prefer a lineup that goes something like this

 

285/350/425 Iggy

300/350/450 Fictional 800 OPS LFer

310/375/575 Dye

275/400/600 Thome

300/360/540 Kong

285/330/525 Crede

275/330/425 Pierz

260/325/425 Anderson

250/300/440 Uribe

 

to one that goes

 

295/330/395 Pierre/Roberts

285/350/425 Iggy

310/375/575 Dye

275/400/600 Thome

300/360/540 Kong

285/330/525 Crede

275/330/425 Pierz

260/325/425 Anderson

250/300/440 Uribe

 

or even

 

295/330/395 Pierre/Roberts

???/???/??? replacement SS/CF

310/375/575 Dye

275/400/600 Thome

300/360/540 Kong

285/330/525 Crede

285/350/425 Iggy

275/330/425 Pierz

260/325/425 or 250/300/440 Anderson/Uribe

 

Moving Iguchi from the top of the order makes more holes than it fills.

[fathom]

This lineup already has dangerous hitters, it needs more consistancy. A consistant hitter is better than some guy who's going to have a crazy 3 weeks of the season. Also AGon > Uribe defensively. Uribe only has the arm and he gets very wild with it.

 

Outside of about 5 throws this year, Uribe has had the most accurate arm of any player I've seen in baseball over the past 3 years. He went through a little slump for about 3 weeks in the field, but he was fine after that.

[santo=dorf]

I think by moving Iguchi down in the lineup he will hit for more power increasing his SLG% and having an OPS > .800

 

For me the leadoff postion would be the LF platoon of Mack/Gload/Right handed hitter (Byrnes)

#2 would be Omar Vizquel, or if push came to shove, Uribe (did well there in 2004.) Omar may not have a high enough SLG%, but he can bunt, steal bases, move along runners, and he tends to walk more than he strikes out.

[beck72]

Pierre's post-ASB OBP was .339. So, Pierre at his best is a .340 OBP guy? But at least he'll be super-fly on the bases, right?

Well, if you like leadoff hitters with OBPs of less than .330, than I guess that's your thing. I like to aim a little bit higher, mmkay? We don't need a leadoff man who can run real fast. We need a guy who can get on-base at an acceptable rate, so when Thome and Dye and Konerko launch their homers, it's not just a solo shot.

 

You do realize that next August, Pierre will be 30 years old, ie in the end of his peak years? And you do realize that once Pierre starts to lose speed, he'll be a completely useless player, yes? And you do realize that Pierre will probably get a four year deal for close to $30 million because apparantly there are still GMs out there under your dilusional impression that speed is more important than having a good OBP, yes?

He's already on the team. Tad Iguchi.

 

He's going to finish the seaso with an OBP right around .350. He won't have to hit behind Scotty anymore, so I could see him posting an OBP closer to .360. Plus, we won't have to give up anything to get him.

 

BTW, Beck, I should add that I'm not totally against your ideas; I do like the idea of buying low on Crisp.

 

But, there's also a situtation arising in New York, where Milledge is being "outted" by some of his teammates. I'd love to see Kenny swoop in and (a semi pipe dream) tag Milledge along with a pitching prospect for Garcia.

 

I'm not completely sold on Pierre. Not for his numbers, which 2005 was his off yr [and the start of this yr]. But his style of play fits in with what Ozzie and this team needs [someone who can make contact, put the ball in play and get bunt and infield hits [Pods number of IF and bunt hits in 2006 were far off his 2005 numbers], put pressure on the defense while batting and on the bases] If his price tag wasn't going to be so high, I'd say go for him. He's probably too expensive

 

Crisp though would fit in nicely. He could play LF and CF with BA getting most time in CF. I could see Owens possibly in LF vs RHP, with Crisp moving over. While not the ideal leadoff guy, his defense and style of play would seem a good fit. There aren't many other options for top of the order help at the only realistic spots the sox could upgrade--LF, SS and CF. The price in terms of talent or long term salary would probably be too high.

 

Your plans for Iguchi in leadoff would have been tried already if was going to happen in 2007. With Pods in a platoon much of the year, Iguchi was never once tried there. Tad is many things. But not a leadoff hitter. He K's too much for one. While he can steal a base now and then, the sox would be looking for more speed.

 

I'm trying to go by Ozzie's philosophy and public statements. Tad may stick at #2. Or hit lower. But he's not going to hit higher than 2.

[beck72]

Which is why Walt Hriniak would make much much more sense than Greg Walker as hitting coach.

Walker isn't the problem. He doesn't try to change hitters like Hriniak does. It's the hitters. If they have weaknesses to their game--a lot of K's, inability to hit to the opposite field, poor bunters--etc a hitting coach isn't going to change a pro who has been playing that way for yrs.

 

The twins draft those type of players/ hitters to begin with and they come up through the system. The Twins don't change the way their young players hit once they get the bigs. The sox should draft or trade for the type of hitters they need that compliment their big hitters.

[beck72]

More public statements that the sox would love to have Tad hit lower, not higher or #2. And Iguchi has made comments of being more comfortable down in the order.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-baseball-print

[Dick Allen]

I think by moving Iguchi down in the lineup he will hit for more power increasing his SLG% and having an OPS > .800

 

For me the leadoff postion would be the LF platoon of Mack/Gload/Right handed hitter (Byrnes)

#2 would be Omar Vizquel, or if push came to shove, Uribe (did well there in 2004.) Omar may not have a high enough SLG%, but he can bunt, steal bases, move along runners, and he tends to walk more than he strikes out.

Byrnes isn't Eric Byrnes, career .322 obp is it? Weren't you the guy saying Michael Young can't hit away from Texas and his road obp is .333, so he should not be an option for KW as a lead-off man?

[DBAHO]

Byrnes isn't Eric Byrnes, career .322 obp is it? Weren't you the guy saying Michael Young can't hit away from Texas and his road obp is .333, so he should not be an option for KW as a lead-off man?

Yeah I'd certainly look at other options such as Roberts and Dave Dellucci before Eric Byrnes (who's been hitting in the cleanup spot for the D-Backs hasn't he?)

[beck72]

For me the leadoff postion would be the LF platoon of Mack/Gload/Right handed hitter (Byrnes)

#2 would be Omar Vizquel, or if push came to shove, Uribe (did well there in 2004.) Omar may not have a high enough SLG%, but he can bunt, steal bases, move along runners, and he tends to walk more than he strikes out.

 

That would be ugly having any of those 3 guys leading off. That's something a team like Pittsburgh would do, not a playoff team.

[TaylorStSox]

One thing that people forget about Uribe is that he's an impact player. He's got huge balls. He plays hard and he's not scared of s***. He's always on the attack. He'll lollygag the occasional ball, but EVERY SS in the league does. He can be painful at the plate, but he's also talented enough to carry a team for a week at a time. In the past, he's always been good at getting strong AB's in clutch situations (3rd/less than 2 outs). IMO, he's a keeper. If we can get some speed at SS or deal for a super prospect that's hiding behind a good big leaguer, then do it. If not, he's our SS.

[Flash Tizzle]

One thing that people forget about Uribe is that he's an impact player. He's got huge balls. He plays hard and he's not scared of s***. He's always on the attack. He'll lollygag the occasional ball, but EVERY SS in the league does. He can be painful at the plate, but he's also talented enough to carry a team for a week at a time. In the past, he's always been good at getting strong AB's in clutch situations (3rd/less than 2 outs). IMO, he's a keeper. If we can get some speed at SS or deal for a super prospect that's hiding behind a good big leaguer, then do it. If not, he's our SS.

Your post is one giant cliche.

 

Really, I agree he'll ultimately be our starting shortstop next season unless a legitimate backup is found.

 

It's impossible to guess what Williams is looking at, but browsing across the list of available SS FA's there's none I'd consider breaking bank and replacing Uribe for.

[TaylorStSox]

Your post is one giant cliche.

 

Really, I agree he'll ultimately be our starting shortstop next season unless a legitimate backup is found.

 

It's impossible to guess what Williams is looking at, but browsing across the list of available SS FA's there's none I'd consider breaking bank and replacing Uribe for.

 

 

Sure, the idea of an "impact player" has been cliched. That doesn't mean it doesn't have merit. Sabr nerds don't understand that intangibles are important. They look at Uribe's OPS and say he's a s***ty player. I look at the package and it proves that he's a ball player. Then again, the Sabr nerds haven't won s***, except that one team that with the $130 Mil payroll in 04.

[ZoSo]

One thing that people forget about Uribe is that he's an impact player. He's got huge balls. He plays hard and he's not scared of s***. He's always on the attack. He'll lollygag the occasional ball, but EVERY SS in the league does. He can java script:emoticon(':bringit', 'smid_7')

:bringitbe painful at the plate, but he's also talented enough to carry a team for a week at a time. In the past, he's always been good at getting strong AB's in clutch situations (3rd/less than 2 outs). IMO, he's a keeper. If we can get some speed at SS or deal for a super prospect that's hiding behind a good big leaguer, then do it. If not, he's our SS.

 

Agreed, Taylor. And I really doubt there are any better options out there with a realistic chance of coming here. KW said without him, they wouldn't have the rings.

 

Look at the 9th inning of Game 4. Without Uribe, we don't get out number 2 on the foul ball and we don't get get the 3rd out without Uribe's gun. If you plug in just an average SS in that inning, there's a good chance the Astros win in walkoff fashion forcing a Game 5.

 

Just a hypothetical there, but you just can't measure the importance of defense. Uribe's always going to be streaky, but as long as Anderson hits his weight next year, we won't have the two holes at the bottom of the order and thus we won't have a problem.

[Flash Tizzle]

Just a hypothetical there, but you just can't measure the importance of defense. Uribe's always going to be streaky, but as long as Anderson hits his weight next year, we won't have the two holes at the bottom of the order and thus we won't have a problem.

Brian will have to hit better than 215. Even if he miraculously limits stretches of poor AB's and has an average around .250, it may not be enough for Guillen. Remember, he doesn't appear to acknowledge defense -- a strong component of Anderson's game.

 

His AB against Nathan earlier was atrocious, and served as a reminder to anyone penciling him in for immediate improvement next season. It was as if he's never seen a ball move downward. When I witness pathetic matchups against elite pitchers -- especially within our division -- I imagine patience is growing thin.

 

Winterball will be very important for Anderson. He'll probably have to hit .350 for Guillen's views to dramtically change. Sweeney, however, has been showered will praise and can do anything he wants; as we've seen with people who Guillen supports.

[Dick Allen]

Before anyone writes off Anderson, please remember he was a rookie. I'm not saying he's going to be just like my example, but Derrek Lee was a pretty bad hitter his first 300 games in the major leagues. Nathan makes a lot of hitters, great veteran hitters at that, look very silly. BA obviously needs some work, but I would be shocked if he turns out to be a bust.

[GoodAsGould]

If Anderson has another s***ty season than i might start get a little down on him, but right now i have him penciled in as our CF for next season.

[nitetrain8601]

Walker isn't the problem. He doesn't try to change hitters like Hriniak does. It's the hitters. If they have weaknesses to their game--a lot of K's, inability to hit to the opposite field, poor bunters--etc a hitting coach isn't going to change a pro who has been playing that way for yrs.

 

The twins draft those type of players/ hitters to begin with and they come up through the system. The Twins don't change the way their young players hit once they get the bigs. The sox should draft or trade for the type of hitters they need that compliment their big hitters.

 

You don't think Walker is the problem? All he has the players doing is pulling and lifting which is why we have hard times hitting the ball the opposite way. Greg Walker is a huge problem. He changes hitters which is why this team since he's been here has a hardass time hitting pitches low and away. If I'm making a move to the offense, the first thing I do is fire Greg, Homerun Happy, Walker. Hriniak has a great philosophy. Don't worry about homeruns, just key in on the ball, and hit it where it's pitched. Sure, we may not hit 200 HR's, but we'd be alot more consistant and we'd go way more in line with what Ozzie wants.

[GoodAsGould]

Im not blaming greg walker.... you want a slap hitting team than sign slap hitters....

[TaylorStSox]

Im not blaming greg walker.... you want a slap hitting team than sign slap hitters....

 

 

Well said. A hitting coach can only maximize a hitter's strengths. We have a bunch of pull hitters. I don't want a hitting coach that's trying to change everyone's approach to fit their idea of what a good hitter should be.