A-Rod, what's the asking price

[nitetrain8601]

A-Rod isn't coming to the White Sox folks. Get over it. Boras and KW don't like each other. I also can't see Ozzie and A-Rod getting along.

[Flash Tizzle]

For those who watched espn today, it seems that if the media has picked up on the ARod for Crede and a sp rumors.

I figure you watched this on PTI as well.

 

I have to imagine the starting pitcher the Yankees would be asking for is Brandon McCarthy. On that note, no deal. Realistically, we'd have to include him to beat the Angels offer. Not worth it.

[Rowand44]

I figure you watched this on PTI as well.

 

I have to imagine the starting pitcher the Yankees would be asking for is Brandon McCarthy. On that note, no deal. Realistically, we'd have to include him to beat the Angels offer. Not worth it.

I agree no deal if they insist on Brandon but like I've said before, I think there are ways to trade for Alex with out having to give up Brandon.

[GoodAsGould]

I dont see the Angels willing to part with the prospects to get A-Rod. So really, if he is on the market... I think we have the best shot to land him.

[BobDylan]

A-Rod isn't coming to the White Sox folks. Get over it. Boras and KW don't like each other. I also can't see Ozzie and A-Rod getting along.

 

Boras is an agent. Nothing more. If A-Rod wants to come here, he can come here. He already has a contract, and he's already locked up. And regardless, there is no way in hell A-Rod ever sniffs a 250 million dollar contract again.

[Balta1701]

I figure you watched this on PTI as well.

 

I have to imagine the starting pitcher the Yankees would be asking for is Brandon McCarthy. On that note, no deal. Realistically, we'd have to include him to beat the Angels offer. Not worth it.

I'll deal brandon if they give us Hughes back along with ARod.

[VAfan]

As much as I like A-Rod's in-season numbers, the idea of sending Joe Crede to the Yankees as part of an A-Rod deal just sickens me. They would teach him how to take enough pitches to walk. He already has very low strike out totals. And if Joe Crede ever learns how to take a walk, his offensive skills would finally match his defensive prowess. We all know he's a much better clutch and pressure player than A-Rod probably has EVER been, even before he went to NY.

 

Would you want to face the Yankees in the playoffs with Crede over there getting the clutch hits to win playoff games, while A-Rod goes into his shell again?

 

A-Rod/Fields is surely a lot better offensively than Uribe/Crede. Defensively, however, it is certainly a step down. I've never seen Fields play 3B, so I don't know how far of a step down it is.

 

So, it is not as if I can't see the positives. I'm just ambivalent about it.

[nitetrain8601]

People wouldn't give up Brandon McCarthy for A-Rod? Wow. This guy better turn out so good that they change the Cy Young Award into the Brandon McCarthy Award.

 

JMO, just another example of people way overrating Brandon McCarthy beyond belief.

[Balta1701]

People wouldn't give up Brandon McCarthy for A-Rod? Wow. This guy better turn out so good that they change the Cy Young Award into the Brandon McCarthy Award.

 

JMO, just another example of people way overrating Brandon McCarthy beyond belief.

If it was McCarthy straight up, and there was enough money included in the deal, I'd consider it.

 

But on the other hand, consider this. How good will the $200 million team be when their stockpile of young pitching finally appears? Think about facing this rotation next year: Matsuzaka, Wang, Philip Hughes, Brandon McCarthy, Randy Johnson, Mike Mussina, and maybe something resembling the unholy offspring of Jaret Wright and Carl Pavano. Suddenly their starting pitching goes from expensive, old, and broken, to young, fireballing, healthy, cheap, and deep.

 

They've already shown they have enough money to overcome any deficiencies on their offense, but the one place they haven't been able to do it is on their pitching staff, because the older pitchers who get paid the big bucks have a habit of breaking down after a lot of innings. If suddenly the Yankees got themselves a boatload of young pitching at the start of that rotation, which they're already on the verge of doing with Wang, Matsuzaka, and Hughes, then, well think about how the Tigers would have done this year if they had the Yankee offense.

 

Remember, even if we were to get ARod from the Yankees, we still have to beat the Yankees somewhere along the line. Yes, we can help ourselves here, but we shouldn't do it while simultaneously giving the Yankees the one thing they need to be even better: young quality starting pitching.

Edited October 13, 2006 by Balta1701

[ptatc]

If it was McCarthy straight up, and there was enough money included in the deal, I'd consider it.

 

But on the other hand, consider this. How good will the $200 million team be when their stockpile of young pitching finally appears? Think about facing this rotation next year: Matsuzaka, Wang, Philip Hughes, Brandon McCarthy, Randy Johnson, Mike Mussina, and maybe something resembling the unholy offspring of Jaret Wright and Carl Pavano. Suddenly their starting pitching goes from expensive, old, and broken, to young, fireballing, healthy, cheap, and deep.

 

They've already shown they have enough money to overcome any deficiencies on their offense, but the one place they haven't been able to do it is on their pitching staff, because the older pitchers who get paid the big bucks have a habit of breaking down after a lot of innings. If suddenly the Yankees got themselves a boatload of young pitching at the start of that rotation, which they're already on the verge of doing with Wang, Matsuzaka, and Hughes, then, well think about how the Tigers would have done this year if they had the Yankee offense.

 

Remember, even if we were to get ARod from the Yankees, we still have to beat the Yankees somewhere along the line. Yes, we can help ourselves here, but we shouldn't do it while simultaneously giving the Yankees the one thing they need to be even better: young quality starting pitching.

 

Good angle. I hadn't thought about it that why. Giving them any starting pitching could be dangerous. Of course if we don't the LAA will. Either way if they trade him, they will be a better team because pitching wins championships.

[jackie hayes]

People wouldn't give up Brandon McCarthy for A-Rod? Wow. This guy better turn out so good that they change the Cy Young Award into the Brandon McCarthy Award.

 

JMO, just another example of people way overrating Brandon McCarthy beyond belief.

It's not that McCarthy is a better player than ARod. Besides helping the Yankees, there's just an issue of feasibility. Trade McCarthy for ARod, you add $16 mil. More realistically, throw in Crede, you add $10 mil (let's say). And we still haven't signed any bullpen help or a lf. We all know there's a limit somewhere not too far above this year's number. It gets awfully tough to slip under that line if we lose McCarthy.

[Kalapse]

There have been 3 team's mentioned in newspaper articles as possible trade partners with the Yankees, the Cubs, Giants and Marlins. None of the 3 make any sense really when you think about it. The Giants and Cubs just don't have the pieces to get the deal done unless the Cubs would be willing to give up Zambrano + some and all the Giants have left is Matt Cain and he alone is no where near enough. The Marlins makes zero sense, they thought about moving Willis midseason because he makes $4.35M why would they trade for a guy who made $10M more last season than the entire Marlins payroll combined?

[witesoxfan]

For those who watched espn today, it seems that if the media has picked up on the ARod for Crede and a sp rumors.

 

I am so taking credit for this

 

People wouldn't give up Brandon McCarthy for A-Rod? Wow. This guy better turn out so good that they change the Cy Young Award into the Brandon McCarthy Award.

 

JMO, just another example of people way overrating Brandon McCarthy beyond belief.

 

Crede and McCarthy for ARod puts the Sox at a payroll nearing $120+ million. That's why people aren't giving up McCarthy.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Oct 12, 2006 -> 06:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A-Rod isn't coming to the White Sox folks. Get over it. Boras and KW don't like each other. I also can't see Ozzie and A-Rod getting along.

Borass doesn't get along with Reinsy more than anything, and $cott has zero control over where A-Rod may wind up.

[beautox]

If it was McCarthy straight up, and there was enough money included in the deal, I'd consider it.

 

But on the other hand, consider this. How good will the $200 million team be when their stockpile of young pitching finally appears? Think about facing this rotation next year: Matsuzaka, Wang, Philip Hughes, Brandon McCarthy, Randy Johnson, Mike Mussina, and maybe something resembling the unholy offspring of Jaret Wright and Carl Pavano. Suddenly their starting pitching goes from expensive, old, and broken, to young, fireballing, healthy, cheap, and deep.

 

They've already shown they have enough money to overcome any deficiencies on their offense, but the one place they haven't been able to do it is on their pitching staff, because the older pitchers who get paid the big bucks have a habit of breaking down after a lot of innings. If suddenly the Yankees got themselves a boatload of young pitching at the start of that rotation, which they're already on the verge of doing with Wang, Matsuzaka, and Hughes, then, well think about how the Tigers would have done this year if they had the Yankee offense.

 

Remember, even if we were to get ARod from the Yankees, we still have to beat the Yankees somewhere along the line. Yes, we can help ourselves here, but we shouldn't do it while simultaneously giving the Yankees the one thing they need to be even better: young quality starting pitching.

 

I would rather deal Fields, Broadway and Garcia and possibly Cotts for Arod and Melky. Then turn Uribe and Pods into BP help / Prospects.

 

The yankees are going to have a young studly rotation starting in mid '07/08

 

Matz/Zito

Wang

Hughes

Clippard

_______ arm aquired in the arod deal.

[gosox41]

I am so taking credit for this

Crede and McCarthy for ARod puts the Sox at a payroll nearing $120+ million. That's why people aren't giving up McCarthy.

 

 

What about this?

 

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?sh...54893&st=90

 

I mention Crede and Garcia and I look on page 1 on the sports and whose pictures do I see?

 

 

Bob

[witesoxfan]

What about this?

 

http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?sh...54893&st=90

 

I mention Crede and Garcia and I look on page 1 on the sports and whose pictures do I see?

Bob

 

BUT I SAID IT FIRST

Edited October 13, 2006 by witesoxfan

[Gene Honda Civic]

Yeah, let's all fight about who came up with a deal that makes our team weaker.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Oct 12, 2006 -> 10:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah, let's all fight about who came up with a deal that makes our team weaker.

Only from a financial standpoint if we're talking about Crede + Sweaty Freddy.

[witesoxfan]

Yeah, let's all fight about who came up with a deal that makes our team weaker.

 

 

You know you want to fight too.

[Gene Honda Civic]

Only from a financial standpoint if we're talking about Crede + Sweaty Freddy.

If you've got Fields>Arod>Iguchi>Konerko around the horn, you might have a below average defensive player at every infield position, including catcher. There's no denying that A-Rod has been bad at 3B the last 2 seasons, maybe even the worst 3B in the league this year. I don't think it's a stretch to say that he's lost a step defensively, and that he won't be the fielder that he once was in Seattle and Texas.

 

Fields is crapshoot*, but you've never heard his defense described as anything more than adequate. Plus he still needs another year to develop the bat at AAA. He might run into a few more HRs than Anderson, but he's going to look worse in more ABs than BA.

 

If you trade Freddy + Crede for Arod, you've weakened the left side of your infield defensively on a pitching staff that has declining strikeout rates and is allowing more balls to be put in play. Fields will not be able to match Crede's output, which will negate the perceived huge jump in offense from your SS..

 

Let's not forget that adding ARod would likely mean that we've got LF-CF combo of Sweeney-Anderson which, while stronger defensively than the '06 unit, is not exactly going to light up the scoreboards. I'd like to avoid having 2 Rookies in the lineup along with Anderson if at all possible.

 

Also, by not acquiring any pitching in the trade for one of our starters, you've weakened our overall pitching depth... Which means that Lance Broadway is our #6, and penciled into the '08 rotation.

 

Any deal for A-Rod that includes both a starter and Crede is a loss for the Sox.

 

 

*crapshoot -- not bloodly likely to be a good player.

[whitesoxfan101]

Here's my thoughts. Any deal involving 2006 Crede and a starter probably makes us weaker. The question is, will 2005 Crede be Crede the rest of his career, or was this a career season. I think Crede is between what he did in 2006 and what he did in 2005. No way he will be 2006 good the rest of his career, but he will be a plus player and great defender. Is is worth giving up him and a starter to get one of the best players ever, and get him motivated since he wants a ring and would be out of New York? I say yes, but I see both sides of the debate.

Edited October 13, 2006 by whitesoxfan101

[witesoxfan]

If it means anything at all, I had Uribe pencilled into SS in an ARod trade that were to involve Crede.

 

But yeah I've kinda cooled off on the whole Crede and SP for ARod.

Edited October 13, 2006 by witesoxfan

[SoxFan562004]

FWIW, Gammons was on Mike and Mike today and A-Rod to the Cubs possibility came up, basically no rumors, just speculation if Pinella is hired as their manager.

 

Sox connection is that Gammons basically said the Cubs really wouldn't have a fit for a trade, since the Yankees won't have to do a money dump and the Cubs don't have the players to make it happen. (Saying it would be silly to trade Zambrano for him and they wouldn't take Prior). Gammons said the Sox are a better fit, but even that is hard with the whole Boras thing. (But someone made a good point earlier that A-Rod's deal is done, and if Crede is involved it would thrill Boras)

[Chisoxfn]

If you've got Fields>Arod>Iguchi>Konerko around the horn, you might have a below average defensive player at every infield position, including catcher. There's no denying that A-Rod has been bad at 3B the last 2 seasons, maybe even the worst 3B in the league this year. I don't think it's a stretch to say that he's lost a step defensively, and that he won't be the fielder that he once was in Seattle and Texas.

 

Fields is crapshoot*, but you've never heard his defense described as anything more than adequate. Plus he still needs another year to develop the bat at AAA. He might run into a few more HRs than Anderson, but he's going to look worse in more ABs than BA.

 

If you trade Freddy + Crede for Arod, you've weakened the left side of your infield defensively on a pitching staff that has declining strikeout rates and is allowing more balls to be put in play. Fields will not be able to match Crede's output, which will negate the perceived huge jump in offense from your SS..

 

Let's not forget that adding ARod would likely mean that we've got LF-CF combo of Sweeney-Anderson which, while stronger defensively than the '06 unit, is not exactly going to light up the scoreboards. I'd like to avoid having 2 Rookies in the lineup along with Anderson if at all possible.

 

Also, by not acquiring any pitching in the trade for one of our starters, you've weakened our overall pitching depth... Which means that Lance Broadway is our #6, and penciled into the '08 rotation.

 

Any deal for A-Rod that includes both a starter and Crede is a loss for the Sox.

*crapshoot -- not bloodly likely to be a good player.

Which is why I think the only way we make the deal is if it involves a starter (and I'm willing to trade any of our starters not named Bmac), and Josh Fields (if we give up more, we maybe get a minor piece in return) for Arod. Financially it doesn't add a whole lot and we now have Uribe and Pods to deal (which once they are moved for some cheap pieces, we are talking about a financial wash).