beck72 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 Cowley looks at the bullpen. Sounds like Cotts will be shopped to gauge his value. He probably won't go anywhere. But if a team is willing to overpay, the sox would have to consider it with Thornton going so well. http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/wh...T-sox09.article sounds like the sox will add three new guys [with Cotts staying on]--one via trade, one via free agency, and one via the farm system, IMO. 1] Free agency--a reliable RH like Justin Speier 2] Trade--another reliable RH like Chad Qualls 3] Farm--Charlie Haeger Thoughts on your 3 additions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 (edited) If they add three, that would make the Bullpen have 7 Relievers, I doubt that will happen. It will probably be only 2 additions. RHP- Mike MacDougal LHP-Matt Thornton LHP-Neal Cotts CL-Bobby Jenks Haeger has a good shot, and Riske might be brought back. Speier would be a great FA pickup at the right price. 2007 Bullpen RHP- Mike MacDougal RHP- Justin Speier RHP- Charles Haeger LHP-Matt Thornton LHP-Neal Cotts CL-Bobby Jenks I love the idea of going from a Starting pitcher to someone like Haeger to fireballers like Mac, Thornton, and Jenks. That is some huge adjustments for hitters to make at every AB. Edited October 9, 2006 by RME JICO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beautox Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(beck72 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 05:05 AM) Cowley looks at the bullpen. Sounds like Cotts will be shopped to gauge his value. He probably won't go anywhere. But if a team is willing to overpay, the sox would have to consider it with Thornton going so well. http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/wh...T-sox09.article sounds like the sox will add three new guys [with Cotts staying on]--one via trade, one via free agency, and one via the farm system, IMO. 1] Free agency--a reliable RH like Justin Speier 2] Trade--another reliable RH like Chad Qualls 3] Farm--Charlie Haeger Thoughts on your 3 additions? I too am seeing the FA being Justin Speier, and Haeger taking over McCarthys role, i wouldn't be supprised if Cotts is part of a bigger deal or if he his retained. How does everyone here feel about keeping Hermanson with a incentive laiden deal using his buy out for '07 of .5mil as the base? so then we only need Speier. What do you think it would take to get somone like Qualls or Lidge? Lidge has two years of Arb left and would make the back end of our BP even better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beck72 Posted October 9, 2006 Author Share Posted October 9, 2006 (edited) QUOTE(beautox @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 10:45 AM) I too am seeing the FA being Justin Speier, and Haeger taking over McCarthys role, i wouldn't be supprised if Cotts is part of a bigger deal or if he his retained. How does everyone here feel about keeping Hermanson with a incentive laiden deal using his buy out for '07 of .5mil as the base? so then we only need Speier. What do you think it would take to get somone like Qualls or Lidge? Lidge has two years of Arb left and would make the back end of our BP even better. Hermanson's situation is kind of like Big Frank in 2006. The sox need a sure thing rather than an injury risk. I like Hermanson. But I'm not sure if his injuries are behind him. Qualls or Lidge--I'd rather go with Qualls--would have to be part of a deal for Freddy. I knew Speier threw a sinker. But I didn't know how much of a flyball pitcher he was. The sox need a guy who can keep it in the park, and induce DP's with runners on. I'm not so sure on Speier. Chad Bradford's healthy again. I could see him and Haeger being a nice bridge to the fireballers. Bradford only allowed 1 HR this yr and always has had a high GB/ FB ratio. Though the sox trade may make him a little sour on signing a FA deal with them. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?playerId=3854 Edited October 9, 2006 by beck72 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 I do think Chuck Haeger will be our swingman out of the pen next year, filling in with a Scot Shields/Tim Wakefield kind of a role. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSoxfan1986 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 I'd like to get get a good setup guy. I would like to have somebody that I can trust in case Bobby goes down or is ineffective. I don't know about Bobby's long term value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 I really want the Red Sox to go after J.C. Romero to be a lefty specialist.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo's Drinker Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(redandwhite @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 10:42 AM) I really want the Red Sox to go after J.C. Romero to be a lefty specialist.. Well woopdy freaking doo for the red sox..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandwhite Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(Jimbo @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 09:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well woopdy freaking doo for the red sox..... Shut up. Offer something to thread or don't say anything at all. You know full well that I was suggesting the White Sox look after him as Cotts replacement. Pathetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 Charlier Haeger has already earned himself at least a bullpen spot next year, if not a starting spot depending on what deals KW makes. I wouldn't be totally surprised if Tracey wound up in the big leagues also, if he has a good spring training. I could very easily see KW signing a bunch of righties (maybe including Hermanson) to minor league deals this offseason, tossing them into ST, and seeing who comes out on top, as he did with the lefties last year. Or he could also wind up as the top backup/bullpen guy if we decide to carry 12 pitchers, which is always a possibility. I do think we need to find 1 reliable, moderately experienced righty setup man. Otherwise, we'll be down to Haeger and the lefties coming out of the bullpen any day that MMac can't go. I also have a sneaking suspicion that we may see Cotts gone and Logan starting the year with the big league squad next year, but that's another matter. QUOTE(WhiteSoxfan1986 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 08:27 AM) I'd like to get get a good setup guy. I would like to have somebody that I can trust in case Bobby goes down or is ineffective. I don't know about Bobby's long term value. Mike MacDougal and Matt Thornton say hi. QUOTE(redandwhite @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 08:42 AM) I really want the White Sox to go after J.C. Romero to be a lefty specialist.. Man, those are some of the most ridiculous lefty/right splits I've ever seen. V. Lefties: .202 .298 .303 .601 V. Righties .382 .455 .578 1.033 On a different team, as a pure Loogy, that'd be tolerable...but with Ozzie, you just know he wouldn't be used to face only lefties, he'd be given full innings, and he'd wind up being lit up. We've seen for 3 years how Ozzie uses pitchers...we may as well accept that and find pitchers that work well with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwolf68 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 The Phillies have a couple middle relievers I like a lot. I like Matt Smith as a lefty setup guy a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 12:07 PM) I wouldn't be totally surprised if Tracey wound up in the big leagues also, if he has a good spring training. If he's in our pen, you'll know right off the bat that the pen is weak. Tracey can't throw strikes and his delivery is horrible. Plus we already know he's not high on Ozzie's list. I'd say the chances he's in the big leagues next year are about, well, ZERO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo's Drinker Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(redandwhite @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 10:56 AM) Shut up. Offer something to thread or don't say anything at all. You know full well that I was suggesting the White Sox look after him as Cotts replacement. Pathetic. um no i had no clue what your saying......you said red sox, i assume red sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RME JICO Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 12:07 PM) Charlier Haeger has already earned himself at least a bullpen spot next year, if not a starting spot depending on what deals KW makes. I wouldn't be totally surprised if Tracey wound up in the big leagues also, if he has a good spring training. I could very easily see KW signing a bunch of righties (maybe including Hermanson) to minor league deals this offseason, tossing them into ST, and seeing who comes out on top, as he did with the lefties last year. Or he could also wind up as the top backup/bullpen guy if we decide to carry 12 pitchers, which is always a possibility. After the failed experiments in the pen this year, there is no way Tracey and Haeger start the year there. One of the two is definitely possible, but not both of them. Haeger brings a whole new dimension to the pen compared to Tracey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(RME JICO @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 10:07 AM) After the failed experiments in the pen this year, there is no way Tracey and Haeger start the year there. One of the two is definitely possible, but not both of them. Haeger brings a whole new dimension to the pen compared to Tracey. After the way he pitched out of the pen to finish the year, I think it's going to be pretty darn hard for Haeger to not land himself one of those bullpen spots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 A couple of thoughts... -Look for Oneli Perez to get a chance at making the bullpen. His combined totals between Kanny, WS, and Birmingham were (these are all approxomations): ~78 IP, ~0.80 ERA, ~11 Ks/9. The Sox have shown very little hesitation to promote guys directly from Birmingham, and Perez is arguably the Sox' best 'arm' down on the farm (judging by his Ks/9). -I think Boone Logan will turn out to be a reliable lefty in the Sox' pen despite his late season struggles, because there was absolutely no resemblance between the pitcher Boone was in September, and the pitcher he was from late June through August. I'd like to get get a good setup guy. I would like to have somebody that I can trust in case Bobby goes down or is ineffective. I don't know about Bobby's long term value. WTF are Thorton and MacDougal for? I'd say our late inning relief is among the best in baseball (top 5). Past that, however, we have a bunch of unreliable arms. We need at least two guys who can safely bridge the game from the sixth and seventh to the 8th, where Mac/Thorton/Bobby can finish the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 knuckleballers out of the pen scare me -- too many walks and if that floater don't drop...see ya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 10:48 AM) knuckleballers out of the pen scare me -- too many walks and if that floater don't drop...see ya I would have said the exact same thing before we saw Haeger succeed quite well out of the bullpen in September. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 12:52 PM) I would have said the exact same thing before we saw Haeger succeed quite well out of the bullpen in September. And top that off with the rest of the guys out of the back of the pen being hardthrowers, and it makes for a real good contrast, which will make it hard to adjust to Haeger. Think about it, the possibility exsists of seeing MacDougal, Haeger, and then Jenks in a game. What a difference of speed, tempo, and movement! I think if you throw in Thornton you see the back three guys all as hardthrowers, and a change of tempo guy in there could make them almost unhittable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 10:52 AM) I would have said the exact same thing before we saw Haeger succeed quite well out of the bullpen in September. I wouldn't mind seeing him get some starts this spring. You never know... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 11:05 AM) I wouldn't mind seeing him get some starts this spring. You never know... If we're going to pencil him into the bullpen, he should stay in the bullpen. Don't dick around in the spring...if we're following the BMac path with him, then start him off in the bullpen, work him out of the bullpen, and give him enough innings out of the bullpen. If we're going to trade away 2 starters and pencil him in for a role in the rotation, that's different. If someone gets hurt, we have another backup option at AAA already in Broadway who we can call up next year if we wind up needing him. If we start him in the bullpen, he pencils in as the 7th starter, not the 6th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 11:15 AM) If we're going to pencil him into the bullpen, he should stay in the bullpen. Don't dick around in the spring...if we're following the BMac path with him, then start him off in the bullpen, work him out of the bullpen, and give him enough innings out of the bullpen. If we're going to trade away 2 starters and pencil him in for a role in the rotation, that's different. If someone gets hurt, we have another backup option at AAA already in Broadway who we can call up next year if we wind up needing him. If we start him in the bullpen, he pencils in as the 7th starter, not the 6th. I have very high hopes for Senor Broadway, too. If Haeger does shine this spring then maybe a late trade wouldn't be a bad option. It's just so damn hard to judge pitching down in Tucson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 01:28 PM) I have very high hopes for Senor Broadway, too. If Haeger does shine this spring then maybe a late trade wouldn't be a bad option. It's just so damn hard to judge pitching down in Tucson. Maybe one that gets Haeger off the team, not into the rotation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Oct 9, 2006 -> 11:28 AM) I have very high hopes for Senor Broadway, too. If Haeger does shine this spring then maybe a late trade wouldn't be a bad option. It's just so damn hard to judge pitching down in Tucson. IMO, it seems like a very, very bad idea to judge Haeger as rotation-ready out of Spring Training. There is only 1 reason why we should consider Haeger as a possible 5th starter next year - someone offered us something damn good for 2 of our starters, something we couldn't pass up. And under no realistic circumstances other than severe injury should Haeger start ST thinking he'll be in the bullpen and wind up having to re-adapt to the rotation. If we're going to use him in the bullpen next year, then he should spend ST getting used to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHITESOXRANDY Posted October 9, 2006 Share Posted October 9, 2006 I like Haeger's future a lot and I hope that the Sox hold onto him. But, I think he needs one more year in AAA to get more innings in. I could see him being a swingman in 2008. Atleast we could have him in Charlotte in case we need him. I would keep Jenks, Mac, Thornton and Cotts. Add 2 more serious relievers. I mean a RH flamethrower or quality veteran or somebody with a funky delivery. I believe every spot in the bullpen is key - even the 6th inning guy. We can't afford to have a weak spot in the pen - especially in this division. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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