An offseason of BAD choices

[VAfan]

So far, this offseason is not looking good for the Sox moving back to the top of the AL Central. I suppose the best news is that Liriano is out next year. But there don't appear to be good answers to any of the following questions:

 

1. Starting pitching. Everyone wants to trade at least one of our top 5 starters, but which one? Garcia? Well, for all his troubles, he went 17-9, and was probably our second most consistent starter behind Jon Garland. Sure, Jose had a better ERA and was lights out early, but he won only 13 games. Buehrle, on the other hand, ended with an ERA of almost 5, and Vazquez was a mental midget, breaking down in the 6th inning of EVERY game.

 

Meanwhile, Brandon McCarthy didn't exactly give me comfort that he would be a reliable and consistent replacement. Sure, he had one nice start once we shut Jose down for the year, but he also came in and surrendered the long ball too many times to count. That's always been his weakness. Plus, we still don't know if he can pitch 200 innings in a season without breaking down.

 

2. Left field. The universal opinion around here is that Scott Podsednik has to be done after last year. He couldn't hit lefties at all, couldn't get on base, and had only one decent stretch the entire season. Plus his defense, never great, went totally in the crapper. But who do we replace him with?

 

-- Juan Pierre?? No thanks. This guy never walks, gets caught stealing a ton, and is way overpriced.

-- Dave Roberts?? This guy is at the age where he's going to keep breaking down. He's not the answer.

-- Alfonso Soriano?? Great option, but not at the price he's going to demand.

-- Gary Matthews, Jr.?? Is he a one-year wonder?

-- Josh Fields?? Not even close to being ready yet.

-- Rob Mackowiak?? Should have spelled Pods last year, at least against righties. But he can't hit lefties at all.

-- Carl Crawford?? Will the Rays even trade him for McCarthy/Fields?? Would you make that deal?

-- Bobby Abreu?? I just put this in here b/c this is the guy we should have traded for last year.

-- Ryan Sweeney?? Can we afford Uribe/Anderson/Sweeney in the lineup?

 

I don't have the answer. Oddly enough, because the other options seem so bad to me, part of me is starting to think that with Pods' habit of alternating good/bad/good/bad seasons that next year he might put up another decent season. I'd take his World Series year again over just about any of the other options that have been put forth. 129 507 80 147 28 1 0 177 25 47 75 59 23 .290 .351 .349 .700

 

3. Bullpen. Neal Cotts for David Aardsma?? This doesn't exactly get me excited. What if Cotts comes anywhere close to reverting to his 2005 form?? It seems to me we will have 3 reliable arms in the bullpen -- Bobby Jenks, Mike MacDougal, and Matt Thornton. Behind them, it is a total crapshoot. I suppose Aardsma is seen as taking David Riske's spot without upgrading it. And we have a bunch of arms available: Charlie Haeger, Boone Logan, Sean Tracey, etc. But all we have right now are question marks.

 

4. Hitting lefties. This really killed us last year. This was our batting line against lefties last year. .262 .329 .413 .742. Against righties we hit .290 .349 .491 .841. And it wasn't just an overall problem. For most of the year, Iguchi couldn't hit lefties, yet Ozzie had Pods/Iguchi/Thome lined up so that teams could use their lefty out of the pen to mow down 3 guys in order late in ballgames. Plus, we had other right handers who couldn't hit lefties very well -- Uribe and Anderson -- and no reasonable sub for Pierzynski. By the end of the year, Thome slugged under .400 against lefties.

 

What is the solution? Again, it is not going to be an easy fix. We could use a left fielder and lead off hitter than can hit both lefties and righties, though the choices are not good. We can hope that Brian Anderson will hit better this season, and Uribe will finally learn to hit more consistently. We could swap Ross Gload's roster spot for a DH/1B sub that can kill lefties and use him to sit Thome down for 30-40 games. We need a right handed catcher who can hit. Trouble is, the guy we have in the system, Chris Stewart, can't hit at all.

 

I don't have any good answers here either.

 

5. Center field. Brian Anderson is ++ defensively. And if his were the ONLY bat that was weak, I would be happy to carry him again and hope his hitting comes around. But we also have too many other outs in the lineup, especially against lefties -- Pierzynski, Uribe, Pods, even Iguchi. And we can't afford the defensive drop-off that comes by using Rob Mackowiak to sub for him. One choice might be to bring up Sweeney and let them fight it out. At least Sweeney is less of a defensive drop off than Mack is. But can Sweeney hit big league pitching? Will platooning Anderson and Sweeney stunt both of them? Are we ready to make a trade of Anderson already, then watch him blossom as a hitter with a new team??

 

I'm not ready to give up on Anderson. I think a trade would be a HUGE mistake. On the other hand, if we don't fix other spots in the lineup, we can't afford to carry BA's bat every game next year either.

 

6. Shortstop. Today's rumor is that we've offered Alex Gonzalez $15 million for 3 years. I hope not. He's Uribe without the power. My belief is we need to keep Juan through the length of his contract and work on his hitting. Like Crede, he has shown months where he has gotten it and been off-the-charts good. It took Crede quite a few years before he gained consistency. I sure want Juan on our team if he finds that same success. Still, I recognize that another year like last season is going to hurt us. But we do have Alex Cintron, who is a decent backup.

 

Well, that's enough for now. I think this has to be KW's most challenging offseason. Everything is overpriced again. There are a lot of tough choices, and not many good options.

[thedoctor]

might as well just cancel next season.

[spiderman]

So far, this offseason is not looking good for the Sox moving back to the top of the AL Central. I suppose the best news is that Liriano is out next year. But there don't appear to be good answers to any of the following questions:

 

1. Starting pitching. Everyone wants to trade at least one of our top 5 starters, but which one? Garcia? Well, for all his troubles, he went 17-9, and was probably our second most consistent starter behind Jon Garland. Sure, Jose had a better ERA and was lights out early, but he won only 13 games. Buehrle, on the other hand, ended with an ERA of almost 5, and Vazquez was a mental midget, breaking down in the 6th inning of EVERY game.

 

Meanwhile, Brandon McCarthy didn't exactly give me comfort that he would be a reliable and consistent replacement. Sure, he had one nice start once we shut Jose down for the year, but he also came in and surrendered the long ball too many times to count. That's always been his weakness. Plus, we still don't know if he can pitch 200 innings in a season without breaking down.

 

2. Left field. The universal opinion around here is that Scott Podsednik has to be done after last year. He couldn't hit lefties at all, couldn't get on base, and had only one decent stretch the entire season. Plus his defense, never great, went totally in the crapper. But who do we replace him with?

 

-- Juan Pierre?? No thanks. This guy never walks, gets caught stealing a ton, and is way overpriced.

-- Dave Roberts?? This guy is at the age where he's going to keep breaking down. He's not the answer.

-- Alfonso Soriano?? Great option, but not at the price he's going to demand.

-- Gary Matthews, Jr.?? Is he a one-year wonder?

-- Josh Fields?? Not even close to being ready yet.

-- Rob Mackowiak?? Should have spelled Pods last year, at least against righties. But he can't hit lefties at all.

-- Carl Crawford?? Will the Rays even trade him for McCarthy/Fields?? Would you make that deal?

-- Bobby Abreu?? I just put this in here b/c this is the guy we should have traded for last year.

-- Ryan Sweeney?? Can we afford Uribe/Anderson/Sweeney in the lineup?

 

I don't have the answer. Oddly enough, because the other options seem so bad to me, part of me is starting to think that with Pods' habit of alternating good/bad/good/bad seasons that next year he might put up another decent season. I'd take his World Series year again over just about any of the other options that have been put forth. 129 507 80 147 28 1 0 177 25 47 75 59 23 .290 .351 .349 .700

 

3. Bullpen. Neal Cotts for David Aardsma?? This doesn't exactly get me excited. What if Cotts comes anywhere close to reverting to his 2005 form?? It seems to me we will have 3 reliable arms in the bullpen -- Bobby Jenks, Mike MacDougal, and Matt Thornton. Behind them, it is a total crapshoot. I suppose Aardsma is seen as taking David Riske's spot without upgrading it. And we have a bunch of arms available: Charlie Haeger, Boone Logan, Sean Tracey, etc. But all we have right now are question marks.

 

4. Hitting lefties. This really killed us last year. This was our batting line against lefties last year. .262 .329 .413 .742. Against righties we hit .290 .349 .491 .841. And it wasn't just an overall problem. For most of the year, Iguchi couldn't hit lefties, yet Ozzie had Pods/Iguchi/Thome lined up so that teams could use their lefty out of the pen to mow down 3 guys in order late in ballgames. Plus, we had other right handers who couldn't hit lefties very well -- Uribe and Anderson -- and no reasonable sub for Pierzynski. By the end of the year, Thome slugged under .400 against lefties.

 

What is the solution? Again, it is not going to be an easy fix. We could use a left fielder and lead off hitter than can hit both lefties and righties, though the choices are not good. We can hope that Brian Anderson will hit better this season, and Uribe will finally learn to hit more consistently. We could swap Ross Gload's roster spot for a DH/1B sub that can kill lefties and use him to sit Thome down for 30-40 games. We need a right handed catcher who can hit. Trouble is, the guy we have in the system, Chris Stewart, can't hit at all.

 

I don't have any good answers here either.

 

5. Center field. Brian Anderson is ++ defensively. And if his were the ONLY bat that was weak, I would be happy to carry him again and hope his hitting comes around. But we also have too many other outs in the lineup, especially against lefties -- Pierzynski, Uribe, Pods, even Iguchi. And we can't afford the defensive drop-off that comes by using Rob Mackowiak to sub for him. One choice might be to bring up Sweeney and let them fight it out. At least Sweeney is less of a defensive drop off than Mack is. But can Sweeney hit big league pitching? Will platooning Anderson and Sweeney stunt both of them? Are we ready to make a trade of Anderson already, then watch him blossom as a hitter with a new team??

 

I'm not ready to give up on Anderson. I think a trade would be a HUGE mistake. On the other hand, if we don't fix other spots in the lineup, we can't afford to carry BA's bat every game next year either.

 

6. Shortstop. Today's rumor is that we've offered Alex Gonzalez $15 million for 3 years. I hope not. He's Uribe without the power. My belief is we need to keep Juan through the length of his contract and work on his hitting. Like Crede, he has shown months where he has gotten it and been off-the-charts good. It took Crede quite a few years before he gained consistency. I sure want Juan on our team if he finds that same success. Still, I recognize that another year like last season is going to hurt us. But we do have Alex Cintron, who is a decent backup.

 

Well, that's enough for now. I think this has to be KW's most challenging offseason. Everything is overpriced again. There are a lot of tough choices, and not many good options.

 

Good post - I don't agree with some of your points - espeically that it's been a bad off-season (one week in with one move made), but can respect a thought out post.

 

I really hope the White Sox aren't the team interested in Gonzalez.....i know he's a stud defensively, but I don't want a guy tied up for 3 years who can't hit in an offensive league.

Edited November 17, 2006 by spiderman

[Felix]

Vazquez was a mental midget, breaking down in the 6th inning of EVERY game.

This is incredibly false.

Edited November 17, 2006 by Felix

[CanOfCorn]

So far, this offseason is not looking good for the Sox moving back to the top of the AL Central. I suppose the best news is that Liriano is out next year. But there don't appear to be good answers to any of the following questions:

 

So far? SO FAR? Jeez, who HAS done anything? Blue Jays have been the biggest splash so far with Frank Thomas, a 38-year-old base clogging DH. I think it's a little early to say the offseason isn't looking good. This team doesn't need much. Yes, some of your points are true, but that doesn't mean KW needs to make a wholesale change. Let's just sit back and see what Kenny has in his pocket before we fly off the handle.

[southsider2k5]

So far? SO FAR? Jeez, who HAS done anything? Blue Jays have been the biggest splash so far with Frank Thomas, a 38-year-old base clogging DH. I think it's a little early to say the offseason isn't looking good. This team doesn't need much. Yes, some of your points are true, but that doesn't mean KW needs to make a wholesale change. Let's just sit back and see what Kenny has in his pocket before we fly off the handle.

 

You beat me to it. Its NOVEMBER 17th. Save the overreactions for the new year at least, if not oh, say March.

[Steve9347]

yeah... its not March, its f***ing November. Calm down.

[GoSox05]

Way to be optimistic. Sox will probably only win 21 games this year.

[The Critic]

I'd be perfectly okay with the Sox adding a backup CF who can catch the ball and a new hitting coach.

 

They had two players whose approach at the plate never seemed to improve in Uribe and Anderson, and an entire team that was unprepared for even marginal left-handed pitchers for the entire season.

That, to me, falls on Walker's shoulders.

There was no noticable improvement in these areas over 162 games - why not?

I say, get a new voice and method in there.

I like the Sox's roster, even Podsednik if he could go back to doing the things he needs to do to be successful. (bunting, getting better reads on pitchers and flyballs)

[RockRaines]

Better title of this thread: Offseason of bad messageboard topics.

[jphat007]

I hope everybody just plays better next year, especially pitchers. That is the best move we can make.

[witesoxfan]

1. Starting pitching. Everyone wants to trade at least one of our top 5 starters, but which one? Garcia? Well, for all his troubles, he went 17-9, and was probably our second most consistent starter behind Jon Garland. Sure, Jose had a better ERA and was lights out early, but he won only 13 games. Buehrle, on the other hand, ended with an ERA of almost 5, and Vazquez was a mental midget, breaking down in the 6th inning of EVERY game.

 

The Sox control Vazquez through 2008, and the last time I checked, actually had 4 months with an ERA below 4.00. And Garcia being consistent to you is Garcia being mediocre to below average until he put up an amazing September to bring his overall numbers to respectability. The hell with that.

 

And, FWIW, Contreras was always a mental midget too. I always like to throw that out there.

 

Meanwhile, Brandon McCarthy didn't exactly give me comfort that he would be a reliable and consistent replacement. Sure, he had one nice start once we shut Jose down for the year, but he also came in and surrendered the long ball too many times to count. That's always been his weakness. Plus, we still don't know if he can pitch 200 innings in a season without breaking down.

 

Who cares? He's the #5. He can put up an ERA of 5.25; so long as half his starts are quality starts, I won't care, and I'm not sure the team will either.

 

-- Bobby Abreu?? I just put this in here b/c this is the guy we should have traded for last year.

 

lolz

 

3. Bullpen. Neal Cotts for David Aardsma?? This doesn't exactly get me excited. What if Cotts comes anywhere close to reverting to his 2005 form?? It seems to me we will have 3 reliable arms in the bullpen -- Bobby Jenks, Mike MacDougal, and Matt Thornton. Behind them, it is a total crapshoot. I suppose Aardsma is seen as taking David Riske's spot without upgrading it. And we have a bunch of arms available: Charlie Haeger, Boone Logan, Sean Tracey, etc. But all we have right now are question marks.

 

The "what if" game? What if Aardsma is this year's Thornton, and he gives the Sox 75 innings if 3.00 ERA and 1.15 WHIP, 9 K/9 relief out of the pen? Then, as far as I'm concerned, f*** Cotts.

 

And I really don't think we can make an accurate statement regarding Aardsma until we've seen him. People b****ed about Thornton, pitched b****ed about MacDougal, so it's just a given that people will b**** about Aardsma. He gave us a World Series winner and has proven he is a great judge of talent and yet still people don't trust him. What a shame.

 

Really, the only thing one can really question in the Cotts trade is the actual value of Cotts himself, not what KW got in return. Perhaps KW felt, as he has shown he has in the past, that in some cases it's better to trade to replace a need rather than get max value out of a given player. Maybe, just maybe, this is one of those cases.

 

What is the solution? Again, it is not going to be an easy fix. We could use a left fielder and lead off hitter than can hit both lefties and righties, though the choices are not good. We can hope that Brian Anderson will hit better this season, and Uribe will finally learn to hit more consistently. We could swap Ross Gload's roster spot for a DH/1B sub that can kill lefties and use him to sit Thome down for 30-40 games. We need a right handed catcher who can hit. Trouble is, the guy we have in the system, Chris Stewart, can't hit at all.

 

I don't have any good answers here either.

 

Oh nos, the Sox don't have any answers to their LHP woes. WE ARE OF THE DICKED

 

...

 

Seeing as how you don't have any answers, and lefty mashers are quite literally EVERYWHERE, I'm glad you're not the GM. Otherwise our big offseason addition would have been made in July at the cost of Broadway and Fields.

 

 

And in conclusion, JUST F***ING RELAX...it's November 17th, and you're freaking out about the well-being of the White Sox roster. Just think about that.

 

Sit back and enjoy the offseason, because, other than if the Sox are in the playoffs, it's the funnest time of the year.

[LVSoxFan]

For what it's worth VAFan, you raise some excellent points.

 

I think it's too early to be concerned, and let's not forget that on PAPER, last year we were better than 2005, and look how that turned out.

 

But that was a good post.

[Flash Tizzle]

So far, this offseason is not looking good for the Sox moving back to the top of the AL Central. I suppose the best news is that Liriano is out next year. But there don't appear to be good answers to any of the following questions:

 

1. Starting pitching.

2. Left field.

3. Bullpen.

4. Hitting lefties.

5. Center field.

6. Shortstop.

 

Well, that's enough for now. I think this has to be KW's most challenging offseason. Everything is overpriced again. There are a lot of tough choices, and not many good options.

You're correct -- it's possible there may not be a 'good' answer to any of the concerns listed above. However, there are several areas which many are certain we'll receive upgrades; including myself.

 

Now, I base the following scenario off an unfounded rumor. Let's speculate Freddy Garcia + Broadway gives us Ervin Santana. You may plug in Mike Pelfrey in there as well. Immediately, we'll have a capable replacement for Garcia/whomever and a young pitcher placed alongside McCarthy in rotation. You may speculate whether the rotation has legitimately improved over last season, but I personally believe it couldn't be much worse than this season. We know it won't cost as much.

 

Thereafter, another starting pitcher is delt for a collection of prospects. These prospects are then shipped off to Tampa Bay for Carl Crawford. With Crawford's bat in the lineup, suddenly Anderson and Uribe's troubles are less noticeable.

 

Whether it goes exactly like this, I personally believe the ideal situation is trading two starters and receiving one major leauge ready arm and Crawford. Additional pitching prospects held on would only be an added benefit. Second choice of mine would be to trade one starter for young pitching arms and simply hold onto them.

Edited November 17, 2006 by Flash Tizzle

[VAfan]

I'm not writing off the offseason, contrary to the reactions of some. Really, I'm looking for some good answers to some thorny issues. So far, those answers haven't clearly emerged. That's all I'm saying.

 

By all means, please offer some great fixes for the Sox' significant issues.

 

The biggest overall problem as I see it is that we basically have to hope our guys pitch like it is 2005 again, because even if we trade out one starter, we aren't going to trade out the whole staff. If we pitch well, we will be in the thick of it again. If we don't, we won't. That's why I posted a thread when we were out of it proposing that we just roll the dice with our starting 5 again. After all, which one is going to be our best pitcher next year?? You could make a case for just about anyone but Vazquez. Trade the wrong one and we could have screwed ourselves.

 

Anyway, I'm not really as pessimistic as the post sounds. I just think there are no easy answers and there is quite a lot of risk.

[iWiN4PreP]

I agree theres not much options this offseason. word.

[whitesoxin']

How did the offseason before 2005 go? What about this past offseason? Enough said. All the offseason does is allow for predictions. The only thing that matters is what happens on the field next year.

[ShoeLessRob]

We should just forfeit the season before it begins and prepare for '08.

 

I have more faith in OUR GM then anyone else, after all he helped us get a ring.

[SoxFan1]

Way to be optimistic. Sox will probably only win 21 games this year.

Who wins more games: 2006-07 Chicago Bulls or 2007 Chicago White Sox?

[The Critic]

Who wins more games: 2006-07 Chicago Bulls or 2007 Chicago White Sox?

Who wins more games: 2006-7 Chicago Blackhawks or 2007 White Sox?

 

...I couldn't bring myself to type that without the green...

[Mr. Showtime]

Who wins more games: 2006-7 Chicago Blackhawks or 2007 White Sox?

 

...I couldn't bring myself to type that without the green...

 

How about this season's Hawk win total + next season vs. 07 Sox?

[VAfan]

I'm curious what folks think in answer to this question:

 

Would the White Sox win more or fewer games, make or miss the playoffs, if we essentially stood pat this offseason?

 

Given the fact that the Twins will be without Liriano for the year, I believe we would win more games and make the playoffs with essentially the same team, with the only adjustments coming from within. The reason we would be better? Our starting pitching. With added rest and a proper spring training next year, we should bounce back closer to 2005 levels and come close to matching the Tigers' pitching.

 

I'm sure KW will NOT stand pat. But I hope he doesn't hurt the team making moves just to make moves.

[ptatc]

How about this season's Hawk win total + next season vs. 07 Sox?

 

How about the 06-07 Blackhawks (we'll go with points even not wins) + 06-07 Bulls vs. the 2007 Sox?

[southsider2k5]

I would guess we would win at least 5 more games next year, simply from having the much improved bullpen all year, plus I think the majority of the starting pitching is going to have bounceback years, big ones in the cases of Garcia and Buehrle.

 

How about the 06-07 Blackhawks (we'll go with points even not wins) + 06-07 Bulls vs. the 2007 Sox?

 

Heck at the rate the Hawks are going, the Sox EASY.

[Jordan4life_2007]

I'm curious what folks think in answer to this question:

 

Would the White Sox win more or fewer games, make or miss the playoffs, if we essentially stood pat this offseason?

 

Given the fact that the Twins will be without Liriano for the year, I believe we would win more games and make the playoffs with essentially the same team, with the only adjustments coming from within. The reason we would be better? Our starting pitching. With added rest and a proper spring training next year, we should bounce back closer to 2005 levels and come close to matching the Tigers' pitching.

 

I'm sure KW will NOT stand pat. But I hope he doesn't hurt the team making moves just to make moves.

 

That's a legitimate question. I still can't believe a team with the talent we had underachieved so badly. However, we still did win 90 games. I think it's atleast a 50/50 chance that our current starters could rebound next year. They'll obviously have a full off-season to rest and recuperate. But even if they do all rebound, we're not going anywhere without a legitimate bullpen. And that's something we just never had in 2006. Say what you want about the starting pitching in 2005, it was legendary, but our bullpen was just as important to winning that title as our starters were.

Edited November 20, 2006 by Jordan4life_2006