Alfonso Soriano signs w/ Cubs

[KevHead0881]

Can't wait to see what extra cool nickname Cubs fans have for him. The Fonz? Sori? The Trib marketing department has a lot of thinking and sleepless nights now.

 

Oh, so close.

[jackie hayes]

I'm sorry, but this is a tremendous move for the Cubs. We are talking about one of the premier offensive players in the game going to a team that needed offense and some talent at the top of the order. On top of it all they also got a very good base-stealer.

 

Sure its a lot of money but the Cubs can afford it. Great move by the Cubs (even though the deal is too long but who the hell knows what the economics of baseball will be 8 years from now anyway and I still think you can always find teams to take guys like this off your hands 4 or 5 years from now anyway.

Ummm...Soriano is an above average left fielder and I assume thats where he will play. And I have no doubt he'll continue to improve in LF. He has a good arm and good range.

This is a TERRIBLE move. He's had exactly one season where he's looked this good. And even this year, his obp and slg were below Ramirez's. (Although JUST BARELY, and his ops+ was somewhat above, playing in Washington. It was a very good year, just not one of the greatest seasons ever, as many seem to think.) But then, he's got speed. But as with Pods, it apparently doesn't help him steal bases. To sign this guy for 8 years at one of the League's highest salaries is hilarious.

 

They've said he'll play cf, fwiw.

[Chisoxfn]

Jason, they have him pegged as their starting CFer. Per ChicagoSports.com:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines

 

Tough, asking a 31 year old who's never played CF to play it at Wrigley. I can't see Soriano being anything better than average in CF, and there's the potential that he's really bad out there...

He won't stick in CF, imo. That said he's perfectly capable of playing it. And with his bat (yes he's one of the best hitters in baseball) its still acceptable for the most part.

 

I still think they move Murton but right now they know they have an opening in CF so if they say he's gonna play there they don't hurt Murton or anyone else's trade value.

 

Just my 2 cents. And I think its hillarious that people call this an awful deal just because of the money. Bottom line is this guy is a great hitter whose had tons of great seasons (yes this was his best ever, but even before you could make a case that he was the greatest offensive 2nd baseman ever...although Robbie Alomar is the greatest 2nd baseman of all time).

 

ya the money is a bit too much, but not drastically. The years are high but you know what, the Cubs aren't a small market team and they can afford higher payrolls so its not that big of a deal. When you need to make significant changes and you go out and add the best bat in FA than you know what, you've done pretty well.

 

They still have a lot left but I can't see how you can fault the Cubs for this move, I really can't. Its one thing if they were planning on having a 60 mill payroll, but they will likely be at or around the 100 mill mark and with that you can afford to spend money.

 

And no, the Cubs aren't going to let some other team offer Zambrano more money. Now if he leaves it will be because he decides another team offers him a better chance of winning (and that obviously could very well be the case) but it won't be because they signed Soriano to a huge contract.

 

Its like saying the BoSox were totally stupid for paying 52 million. SUre it may not have been the best investment or the most financially savvy on, but you know what, the Red Sox are still going to make money and they have the type of payroll where they can overpay for a need even if there are more financially responsible decisions out there.

[The Critic]

The part about this that should worry Cub fans is the fact that they will have to pay Zambrano soon, and they just boosted the salary level themselves.

With all the money they have tied up in Lee, Ramirez and Soriano, will they be able to match the ridiculous offers Zambozo will get if/when he tests the market?

 

BTW, how pissed must Artie Moreno be about now? He's lost out to Chicago teams on his last three "top priority" free agents (Konerko, Ramirez and Soriano).

[jackie hayes]

(yes this was his best ever, but even before you could make a case that he was the greatest offensive 2nd baseman ever...although Robbie Alomar is the greatest 2nd baseman of all time).

Don't agree with the rest either, but on this, you've got to be kidding. As bad as Morgan is as an announcer, there's no chance you put Soriano above him with the bat. Hornsby was an asshole and a Cub, but him too. Just the first two that come to mind, I'm sure there are more.

[Chisoxfn]

Don't agree with the rest either, but on this, you've got to be kidding. As bad as Morgan is as an announcer, there's no chance you put Soriano above him with the bat. Hornsby was an asshole and a Cub, but him too. Just the first two that come to mind, I'm sure there are more.

Well I think Morgan is over-rated as all get up. But those are other aspects, he couldn't hold Soriano's jock with the bat. Hell Jeff Kent is a better offensive 2nd baseman than Morgan, imo.

 

Alomar was a legend and in a total league of his own (best defensive and aside from run production numbers, best offensive one as well).

 

When all is set and done, you take his span of actually playing 2nd base and put up those stats with any 2nd baseman in the same span and you'll see that he was a truly legendary offensive 2nd baseman. Doesn't mean he's one of the greatest offensive players of all time or anything, but during his span he's one of the all time best offensive 2nd baseman (absolutely no doubt about it).

 

Of course I was saying this 2 and 3 years ago when everyone around seemed to slam him and think so lowly of him. I never understood why either cause the guy can flat out rake.

[jackie hayes]

Well I think Morgan is over-rated as all get up. But those are other aspects, he couldn't hold Soriano's jock with the bat. Hell Jeff Kent is a better offensive 2nd baseman than Morgan, imo.

 

Alomar was a legend and in a total league of his own (best defensive and aside from run production numbers, best offensive one as well).

 

When all is set and done, you take his span of actually playing 2nd base and put up those stats with any 2nd baseman in the same span and you'll see that he was a truly legendary offensive 2nd baseman. Doesn't mean he's one of the greatest offensive players of all time or anything, but during his span he's one of the all time best offensive 2nd baseman (absolutely no doubt about it).

 

Of course I was saying this 2 and 3 years ago when everyone around seemed to slam him and think so lowly of him. I never understood why either cause the guy can flat out rake.

I'm sure he'll be above average, but imo he won't crack top 10. And he'll be FAR from the best hitter of the bunch.

[witesoxfan]

Of course I was saying this 2 and 3 years ago when everyone around seemed to slam him and think so lowly of him. I never understood why either cause the guy can flat out rake.

 

My only beefs with Soriano are his defense and his inability to draw a walk. It just leads to inconsistency on offense, and there's no guarantee if you'll get a .270 25/25 .330/.500/.820 or .290 40/40 .340/.560/.900.

[Baines3]

Didn't Soriano hit something like 46 homeruns this past season? He won't turn the Cubs into World Champions over night, it will take more than him. Yet I don't think any of us will ever live to see the Cubs win the World Series!

[WilliamTell]

If he wants to lose at least he'll be happy with the money he makes.

[Chisoxfn]

I'm sure he'll be above average, but imo he won't crack top 10. And he'll be FAR from the best hitter of the bunch.

Alright, name 10 2nd baseman that had better offensive careers up until this stage of Soriano's career?

[The Critic]

I don't want to speak for other people, but I think why alot of see this as a bad deal is not only the years and $$, but what the needs are for the Cubs.

 

Any team wants/needs a guy that can steal 40 bags and hits 40 HR's. That an obvious. HOWEVER, it's very, very obvious that there are more pressing needs on the Northside, the starting rotation being very high on the list. The Cubs have alot of money to play with, but at the same time, they aren't the Yanks. The cash only goes so far. The rotation right now for the Cubs looks something like

 

Zambrano

Hill

Prior

Marshall/Miller

Cotts/Guzman/O'Malley?

 

Not exactly world beaters. Now I understand Hendry still has alot of time to get some deals done, and he will, but it just seems like negligence on the Cubs part to really address the biggest need.

That seems to be the pattern on the Northside.

2 years ago, they needed a leadoff hitter more than anything and they didn't get one.

Last year, they needed depth at starting pitching and they didn't get it.

This year, they AGAIN (as of yet) haven't addressed the rotation, which is even weaker than last offseason, since Prior was expected to be there on Opening Day, Woody and Wadey were expected back by June, and they still had Maddux.

Hendry's been living off the Hundley deal and the generosity of the Pirates organization for a long time now, although the bullpen signings and the deals this winter have been decent, if overpaid.

[CWSGuy406]

Alright, name 10 2nd baseman that had better offensive careers up until this stage of Soriano's career?

 

I'm no baseball historian, but...

 

-Biggio (arguable, but check out his age 25-30 seasons. Average OPS+ of better than 125 while playing MUCH better defense than Soriano at 2B).

 

-Robbie Alomar

 

-Joe Morgan

 

-Rogers Hornsby

 

-Jeff Kent (Kent exploded in his 30s, so no, up until age 30 he wasn't as good as Soriano has been. That being said, I would be willing to wager a LARGE amount of cash that Soriano won't be nearly as good as Kent was. Kent also played 2nd base well into his 30s, while Soriano isn't playing 2B at age 30.)

 

There's five, three of which are clearly above Sori, two of which are debatable, and I'm sure someone can scrounge up another five.

 

But this is tough; Soriano is done as a 2nd-baseman, whereas all these guys played at second well into their 30s. So in essence we're now comparing an OFer, or a bad defensive 2nd-baseman, to guys who were good enough to stick at 2nd for a majority of their careers.

[jackie hayes]

I'm no baseball historian, but...

 

-Biggio (arguable, but check out his age 25-30 seasons. Average OPS+ of better than 125 while playing MUCH better defense than Soriano at 2B).

 

-Robbie Alomar

 

-Joe Morgan

 

-Rogers Hornsby

 

-Jeff Kent (Kent exploded in his 30s, so no, up until age 30 he wasn't as good as Soriano has been. That being said, I would be willing to wager a LARGE amount of cash that Soriano won't be nearly as good as Kent was. Kent also played 2nd base well into his 30s, while Soriano isn't playing 2B at age 30.)

 

There's five, three of which are clearly above Sori, two of which are debatable, and I'm sure someone can scrounge up another five.

 

But this is tough; Soriano is done as a 2nd-baseman, whereas all these guys played at second well into their 30s. So in essence we're now comparing an OFer, or a bad defensive 2nd-baseman, to guys who were good enough to stick at 2nd for a majority of their careers.

I agree with all these, then add Eddie Collins (who really should be the first name off any Sox fan's tongue, shame to me), Jackie Robinson, Napoleon Lajoie, Lou Whitaker, and, by the time Soriano's done, Chase Utley. I think Sandberg is better, too. Personally, I'd put more ahead of him, but those are the ones who seem the most obvious. If you really think, after looking through all these players, that Soriano is better than all of them, I'd love to know why. He doesn't get on base more, hit for a better average, or hit (regularly) with more power. He strikes out a ton and despises walks. What a prize...

[witesoxfan]

He doesn't get on base more, hit for a better average, or hit (regularly) with more power. He strikes out a ton and despises walks. What a prize...

 

He has a tendency to not play defense too

[SoxFan562004]

If you add a quality offensive player like Soriano to your line-up it can't be horrible. But with that said, the Cubs need pitching badly, and I don't mean just adding Jake Westbrook.

[Hangar18]

I hope and pray that 3 years into this deal, the Cubs are forced to eat the rest of his contract.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHHAHAHAHA

[KevHead0881]

I don't want to speak for other people, but I think why alot of see this as a bad deal is not only the years and $$, but what the needs are for the Cubs.

 

This is exactly the problem with the move. The move makes the Cubs better. Anybody who denies that is kidding themselves. How much better, is up for debate. And looking at their current staff, you can argue that it might give them a good shot a 3rd place. Granted, they are still shopping for pitching, but if this deal means that the Cubs have to settle for the Gil Meche's of the world, then I think they took a completely misguided approach to improving their team...when there are starters out there that would make a much bigger difference.

 

The eight years is rediculous, but as somebody has pointed out, Hendry and the Trib most likely wont be around for half of that, so why would they care? In the end, the stupidity of this deal comes in the amount of money spent on a guy whose impact, in the minds of many around here including myself, will be minimal. Their pitching and defense are essentially the same at the moment, and unless they find some guys who will be a significant upgrade in those departments, they'll only be a marginally better team then last year.

[RockRaines]

Alright, name 10 2nd baseman that had better offensive careers up until this stage of Soriano's career?

WHo cares? He is a corner OF'er now, and as far as they go, he is not one of the best. Also he received the 5th highest contract in MLB history, I wouldnt even consider him in the top ten players in the MLB now. Alot of people for get that most of those ridiculous long term contracts that were higher than Sori's were signed by players in their 20's about to hit their prime. Soriano is neither 20 nor ready to hit his prime.

 

Oh, and there is a reported no-trade clause in the deal as well. So so much for unloading that salary.

[Cerbaho-WG]

Oh, and there is a reported no-trade clause in the deal as well. So so much for unloading that salary.

 

Yup, no-trade clause is being reported by ESPN. Still waiting on the clarification over option years to crown this the stupidest move possible for the Cubs.

[southsideirish71]

Bruuuuce Levine is about go have a an orgasm over the signing.

 

He can do something that not other baseball player can do...

 

give me a break bruce.

 

 

Most telling comment of the interview so far.

 

Bruce says that the cubs are a big big market team and should be spending more like the Boston Redsox and not like they are the Chicago Whitesox.

 

 

Our payroll is near the top of the AL Bruce stop acting like we are the royals. Nice comment Bruce.

Edited November 20, 2006 by southsideirish71

[southsider2k5]

Bruuuuce Levine is about go have a an orgasm over the signing.

 

He can do something that not other baseball player can do...

 

give me a break bruce.

Most telling comment of the interview so far.

 

Bruce says that the cubs are a big big market team and should be spending more like the Boston Redsox and not like they are the Chicago Whitesox.

 

Nice comment Bruce.

 

You mean the Chicago White Sox who had a higher payroll than the Cubs despite having much lower revenues? Hmm, no thanks, I will be happy with the organization who doesn't make a profit off of its fans, thank you very much.

[AbeFroman]

Doesn't Soriano seem a little bit like Corey Patterson? Both are fast, Both strike out a lot, Both have crappy OBP.

 

The Cubs (and their fans) ran Corey Patterson out of town... They couldn't wait to get rid of him. Soriano is basically Corey Patterson with more power and a crappier glove.

 

I think Soriano is an unbelievable talent (and I always though Patterson had a boatload of talent). He certainly makes the much maligned Cubs much better, and puts them in World Series Competitor category. But Corey Patterson is 5 years younger than Soriano, costs 110 million dollars less, and is a natural outfielder. It strikes me that the Cubs might be better off with Patterson and Zito and Schmidt than with Soriano and nothing.

Edited November 20, 2006 by AbeFroman

[RockRaines]

They are reporting that the Cubs are now looking to bring in Cliff Floyd to play LF for them. Which will make the OF: Floyd, Soriano, Jones, and could be the worst defensive OF in the NL, maybe the MLB.

[AbeFroman]

They are reporting that the Cubs are now looking to bring in Cliff Floyd to play LF for them. Which will make the OF: Floyd, Soriano, Jones, and could be the worst defensive OF in the NL, maybe the MLB.

 

Who is they?

 

btw... great avatar