Pujols says MVP should be on playoff team

[GoodAsGould]

Is it too much to ask for an athlete to be outspoken and not be a poor sport/asshole at the same time? I remember Pujols whining about some crap was it either during the season late or post-season and now he is going on about how MVP should go to a playoff team even though his team had less wins.

[witesoxfan]

Is it too much to ask for an athlete to be outspoken and not be a poor sport/asshole at the same time? I remember Pujols whining about some crap was it either during the season late or post-season and now he is going on about how MVP should go to a playoff team even though his team had less wins.

 

The same team with more injuries and less talent.

 

Pujols should have been the MVP, because it was he, not Howard, who had the better offensive stats - superior numbers in everything BUT homers and RBI. You can't do much better than being the best offensive player in the your league.

[Chisoxfn]

I think the MVP (if the numbers are similar) should go to the guy that helps his team win and get into the playoffs (afterall, how valuable are you if your team doesn't get to the playoffs....the real goal).

 

You think your the best hitter, you get a silver slugger award or the AP Offensive player of the year award. The MVP is more than that and I was stunned when Howard won it cause Pujols should have won it.

[GoodAsGould]

The same team with more injuries and less talent.

 

Pujols should have been the MVP, because it was he, not Howard, who had the better offensive stats - superior numbers in everything BUT homers and RBI. You can't do much better than being the best offensive player in the your league.

 

Id say the Cardinals are better team than the Phillies. The Cardinals not by much had a better team era which helps.... Both teams had a lot of injuries during the season. The Cardinals lost Edmonds for a significant amount of time and Rolen missed a little time. The Phillies lost Aaron Rowand, they traded their starting 3B away, they traded their franchise player away, and than didnt Mike Lieberthal their starting C got hurt too? Both teams had their closers get hurt but of the 2 the Cardinals had much better pitching staff.

 

And the Phillies still managed more wins despite being in a tougher division too.... while the Cardinals in the worse division in baseball could only come up with 83 total. And isnt having more RBI's and HR's 2 of the more important stats when comparing the 2 for MVP?

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Nov 29, 2006 -> 11:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They were bad, they won 83 games in the NL Central. Injuries or not they still stucked.

 

Yeah, they sucked so bad that they won the World Series, beating one good team and the 2 best teams in baseball to do it. Please don't make that lame excuse about the Tigers making errors. Sure, but the Cards capitalized on them, much as the SOX won games by capitalizing on mistakes. Wins are wins, and there are no flukes. If you want to say they had bad stretches or sucked during a lot of the season, granted since they reside in the N.L. Central, but the Sox has a very ugly stretch in '05 and still won it all when almost NO ONE believed they could, so you sound hypocritical. The Cards proved they are a good team by getting to, and winning the World Series with a talented club that had did have struggles with various things, including injuries, which they overcame. If you want to put an asterik next to a team's name because of opponents' mistakes (which was only a vital factor in ONE of the 3 playoff series), frankly, that's your own absurd, inept preference. May as well alienate every single team that ever did it, including our own World Champion '05 Sox. Very ignorant statement made by you, sir.

Edited December 2, 2006 by TheBigHurt

[Jordan4life_2007]

Yeah, they sucked so bad that they won the World Series, beating one good team and the 2 best teams in baseball to do it. Please don't make that lame excuse about the Tigers making errors. Sure, but the Cards capitalized on them, much as the SOX won games by capitalizing on mistakes. Wins are wins, and there are no flukes. If you want to say they had bad stretches or sucked during a lot of the season, granted since they reside in the N.L. Central, but the Sox has a very ugly stretch in '05 and still won it all when almost NO ONE believed they could, so you sound hypocritical. The Cards proved they are a good team by getting to, and winning the World Series. If you want to put an asterik next to a team's name because of opponents' mistakes (which was only a vital factor in ONE of the 3 playoff series), frankly, that's your own absurd, inept preference. Very ignorant statement made by you, sir.

 

Dude, the Cards won a pathetic division in a pathetic league. They would've been swept by the Mets had they not lost damn near their entire rotation.

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2006 @ Dec 2, 2006 -> 01:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dude, the Cards won a pathetic division in a pathetic league. They would've been swept by the Mets had they not lost damn near their entire rotation.

 

Dude, did you:

 

1. Read my entire post?

 

2. Know that they won the pennant and the WS, too?

 

3. Get drunk before you posted?

 

Again, to claima team was bad when they won the WS, in which they beat the 2 best teams in baseball, is obtuse. And to claim it as meaningless because of errors made by an opposing team (even though that was the case in ONE series) is hypocritical. So, just how many of you have lost your damn minds? You and Kalapse sound so obtuse, you're like Cub fans.

[Jordan4life_2007]

Dude, did you:

 

1. Read my entire post?

 

2. Know that they won the pennant and the WS, too?

 

3. Get drunk before you posted?

 

Again, to claima team was bad when they won the WS, in which they beat the 2 best teams in baseball, is obtuse. And to claim it as meaningless because of errors made by an opposing team (even though that was the case in ONE series) is hypocritical. So, just how many of you have lost your damn minds? You and Kalapse sound so obtuse, you're like Cub fans.

 

A Cubs fan? C'mon now. Why insult me just because I disagree with you? And yes, I am drunk. LOL.

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2006 @ Dec 2, 2006 -> 01:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A Cubs fan? C'mon now. Why insult me just because I disagree with you? And yes, I am drunk. LOL.

 

It's evident since you're disagreeing with facts. Come back when you're sober.

[Jordan4life_2007]

It's evident since you're disagreeing with facts. Come back when you're sober.

 

Look, I realize the Cards won the title. Props to them. I'm actually glad they did. It adds to the neverending suffering for Cub fans. However, the Cards are beyond a shadow of a doubt the worst World Series winning team of the last 20 or so years. Nobody can deny that. Should they apologize? Of course not. But it's pretty much a fact.

[GoodAsGould]

Yeah, they sucked so bad that they won the World Series, beating one good team and the 2 best teams in baseball to do it. Please don't make that lame excuse about the Tigers making errors. Sure, but the Cards capitalized on them, much as the SOX won games by capitalizing on mistakes. Wins are wins, and there are no flukes. If you want to say they had bad stretches or sucked during a lot of the season, granted since they reside in the N.L. Central, but the Sox has a very ugly stretch in '05 and still won it all when almost NO ONE believed they could, so you sound hypocritical. The Cards proved they are a good team by getting to, and winning the World Series with a talented club that had did have struggles with various things, including injuries, which they overcame. If you want to put an asterik next to a team's name because of opponents' mistakes (which was only a vital factor in ONE of the 3 playoff series), frankly, that's your own absurd, inept preference. May as well alienate every single team that ever did it, including our own World Champion '05 Sox. Very ignorant statement made by you, sir.

 

The Sox won 99 games last season and the Cards won 83 games this season.... how do they compare? And how did he ignore any of the facts you stated. The Padres werent a good team, the mets were an injury riddled team, and Detroit played bad... So yes props to them they won the WS... but in the AL Central they would only be ahead of KC probably...

[IlliniKrush]

http://www.progressiveboink.com/dugout/

 

Kind of a nice point made here, for all you people in love with interpreting the word value:

 

InTheMidnightHoward: The idea that MVPs should only come from the good teams is the most ass-backwards s*** ever. I made three-hunned thousand dollars last year and almost hit 60 homeruns.

 

InTheMidnightHoward: You made fote-teen million dollars and did the same.

 

InTheMidnightHoward: You pay fitty dollars for a hot dog that's the best f***in' hot dog in the got damn world, right, but if you pay a dolla for the same dog, that's value

 

most value

Edited December 2, 2006 by IlliniKrush

[witesoxfan]

Yeah, they sucked so bad that they won the World Series, beating one good team and the 2 best teams in baseball to do it.

 

So are you telling me that the DRays, Royals, or Cubs couldn't get hot for a stretch of 11 games? Afterall, the Cards only went 7-4 in their way to the World Series. None of those teams mentioned above could have gone 7-4 against the Padres and Mets? If you say no, I'll just simply have to beg to differ.

 

The Cards proved they are a good team by getting to, and winning the World Series with a talented club that had did have struggles with various things, including injuries, which they overcame.

 

They also proved they were a good team by winning 83 games in the regular season... :rolleyes

 

Don't give me the injury excuse. They played in, by far, the worst division in baseball...any other division, and they finish 3rd.

 

If you want to put an asterik next to a team's name because of opponents' mistakes (which was only a vital factor in ONE of the 3 playoff series), frankly, that's your own absurd, inept preference.

 

Just curious...who said anything about an asterik or about them being the worst World Series winner ever? As far as I can tell.....especially after reading your post defending them being better than the worst World Series winner ever.....the worst World Series winning team is a completely arbitrary opinion; thus, no asterik should be put next to the title, even though it is quite apparent who the worst World Series winning team is.

 

May as well alienate every single team that ever did it, including our own World Champion '05 Sox. Very ignorant statement made by you, sir.

 

worst.concept.evar.

 

Alienate every single team?

 

NO OTHER TEAM HAS EVER WON 83 GAMES AND WON THE WORLD SERIES. NO OTHER TEAM HAS EVER WON THE WORLD SERIES WHEN THE OTHER TEAM MADE ERRORS IN 5 STRAIGHT GAMES.

 

Why is that hard to alienate?...just curious of course

 

The Cardinals got great pitching from pitchers who were mediocre or worse in the regular season, outstanding results from a bullpen who was about as experienced combined as Augustin Montero, and timely hits from an offense that was mediocre. lucky.as.f***.

 

You wanna talk about ignorant...jesus tap dancing christ

 

 

 

(of course, no offense to any Cards fans on here...love what they did, and I'm glad as hell they did it. I'll just argue that they were lucky, and seeing as how you have the trophy, I'm not sure you guys care.)

Edited December 2, 2006 by witesoxfan

[YASNY]

Being the worst WS winning team ever is still much better than being the greatest non-WS winning team... to put things in the proper perspective.

[DrunkBomber]

While it does sound like Pujols is just whining. I do think the MVP should come from at least a playoff team. MVP can have so many different meanings.

 

Things like being clutch, making players around you better or helping your team win all should be factors.

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Dec 2, 2006 -> 04:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So are you telling me that the DRays, Royals, or Cubs couldn't get hot for a stretch of 11 games? Afterall, the Cards only went 7-4 in their way to the World Series. None of those teams mentioned above could have gone 7-4 against the Padres and Mets? If you say no, I'll just simply have to beg to differ.

 

 

 

They also proved they were a good team by winning 83 games in the regular season... :rolleyes

 

Don't give me the injury excuse. They played in, by far, the worst division in baseball...any other division, and they finish 3rd.

 

 

 

Just curious...who said anything about an asterik or about them being the worst World Series winner ever? As far as I can tell.....especially after reading your post defending them being better than the worst World Series winner ever.....the worst World Series winning team is a completely arbitrary opinion; thus, no asterik should be put next to the title, even though it is quite apparent who the worst World Series winning team is.

 

 

 

worst.concept.evar.

 

Alienate every single team?

 

NO OTHER TEAM HAS EVER WON 83 GAMES AND WON THE WORLD SERIES. NO OTHER TEAM HAS EVER WON THE WORLD SERIES WHEN THE OTHER TEAM MADE ERRORS IN 5 STRAIGHT GAMES.

 

Why is that hard to alienate?...just curious of course

 

The Cardinals got great pitching from pitchers who were mediocre or worse in the regular season, outstanding results from a bullpen who was about as experienced combined as Augustin Montero, and timely hits from an offense that was mediocre. lucky.as.f***.

 

You wanna talk about ignorant...jesus tap dancing christ

(of course, no offense to any Cards fans on here...love what they did, and I'm glad as hell they did it. I'll just argue that they were lucky, and seeing as how you have the trophy, I'm not sure you guys care.)

 

Some of you are sounding idiotic. They won the World Series, and they beat the 2 best teams in babseball. PERIOD. END OF STORY. How can you say they sucked? It makes ZERO sense. What I am saying about the asterik is that that appears to be what kalapse and some of you are doing, otherwise you wouldn't be saying that the World Champions suck. f*** the bad record. They still won it all. How good did the Sox look in September of '05? They still won. So the '05 Sox team sucked then, too? Bottom line: the Cards beat the 2 best teams in baseball in the playoffs and won the World Series. They are a good team. What, are you trying to say that the fact they DID beat the 2 best teams in baseball and won it all doesn't count because they only got 83 wins? f*** the division, they went far and beyond that. You all make them sound piss poor just because they were ina bad division. Apaarently I need to say it again: there were three series that were played after that, and the Cards won all three, became World Champions. Lol. What a lack of common sense in this topic. We got drunk people posting in here and everything else.

Edited December 3, 2006 by TheBigHurt

[Jordan4life_2007]

Some of you are sounding idiotic. They won the World Series, and they beat the 2 best teams in babseball. PERIOD. END OF STORY. How can you say they sucked? It makes ZERO sense. What I am saying about the asterik is that that appears to be what kalapse and some of you are doing, otherwise you wouldn't be saying that the World Champions suck. f*** the bad record. They still won it all. How good did the Sox look in September of '05? They still won. So the '05 Sox team sucked then, too? Bottom line: the Cards beat the 2 best teams in baseball in the playoffs and won the World Series. They are a good team. What, are you trying to say that the fact they DID beat the 2 best teams in baseball and won it all doesn't count because they only got 83 wins? f*** the division, they went far and beyond that. You all make them sound piss poor just because they were ina bad division. Apaarently I need to say it again: there were three series that were played after that, and the Cards won all three, became World Champions. Lol. What a lack of common sense in this topic. We got drunk people posting in here and everything else.

 

That would be me. However, drunk or sober, the Cards were still garbage.

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2006 @ Dec 3, 2006 -> 01:09 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That would be me. However, drunk or sober, the Cards were still garbage.

 

Again, ignorant. How many times does I have to state the facts? Why do you people keep ignoring these facts? Stop looking for reasons to judge a team. They won the World Series, in which they beat the two best teams in baseball to get that title. Stop making excuses for the other teams or whatever. They won. They are a good team. There is no argument. Is ist that some of you are the type who think stats are all that matters? Well, how are THESE stats: Cards vs. San Diego - W. Cards vs. New York - W. Cards vs. Detroit - W. This is the only stat that matters. So they had the worst record of any WS winning team. So what? They still managed to do it. As I said, they aren't the only team to have struggles and win the WS. AGAIN as I said, so did our Sox. They are a good team. I absolutely CANNNOT stand people that s*** on teams that win the freaking World Series over s*** that ultimately does not matter. It's stupid.

[witesoxfan]

Again, ignorant. How many times does I have to state the facts? Why do you people keep ignoring these facts? Stop looking for reasons to judge a team. They won the World Series, in which they beat the two best teams in baseball to get that title. Stop making excuses for the other teams or whatever. They won. They are a good team. There is no argument. Is ist that some of you are the type who think stats are all that matters? Well, how are THESE stats: Cards vs. San Diego - W. Cards vs. New York - W. Cards vs. Detroit - W. This is the only stat that matters. So they had the worst record of any WS winning team. So what? They still managed to do it. As I said, they aren't the only team to have struggles and win the WS. AGAIN as I said, so did our Sox. They are a good team. I absolutely CANNNOT stand people that s*** on teams that win the freaking World Series over s*** that ultimately does not matter. It's stupid.

 

Stop looking for reasons to judge a team? Are you f'ing serious? What's a better way to judge a team than by their regular season record? A stretch of 16 games? If that's the case, let's crown the f***ing DRays or Royals champions. JFC...

 

BTW, you wanna talk about ignorant, way to f***ing completely ignore every other fact that is being thrown at you, and instead making this into an argument based completely upon the postseason and nothing else. Pretty much every team has struggles in the regular season, but no other World Series winners have ever struggled to the tune of 83 wins. How are you even debating that?

 

They were the worst World Series winner ever, and I'm not sure there's really any argument against it. I don't think anyone here is by any stretch of the imagination suggesting they shouldn't have won it.

[YASNY]

2006 World Series Champion St. Louis Cardinals.

 

That says it all.

[Milkman delivers]

Again, ignorant. How many times does I have to state the facts? Why do you people keep ignoring these facts? Stop looking for reasons to judge a team. They won the World Series, in which they beat the two best teams in baseball to get that title. Stop making excuses for the other teams or whatever. They won. They are a good team. There is no argument. Is ist that some of you are the type who think stats are all that matters? Well, how are THESE stats: Cards vs. San Diego - W. Cards vs. New York - W. Cards vs. Detroit - W. This is the only stat that matters. So they had the worst record of any WS winning team. So what? They still managed to do it. As I said, they aren't the only team to have struggles and win the WS. AGAIN as I said, so did our Sox. They are a good team. I absolutely CANNNOT stand people that s*** on teams that win the freaking World Series over s*** that ultimately does not matter. It's stupid.

 

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Dec 3, 2006 -> 05:16 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Stop looking for reasons to judge a team? Are you f'ing serious? What's a better way to judge a team than by their regular season record? A stretch of 16 games? If that's the case, let's crown the f***ing DRays or Royals champions. JFC...

 

BTW, you wanna talk about ignorant, way to f***ing completely ignore every other fact that is being thrown at you, and instead making this into an argument based completely upon the postseason and nothing else. Pretty much every team has struggles in the regular season, but no other World Series winners have ever struggled to the tune of 83 wins. How are you even debating that?

 

They were the worst World Series winner ever, and I'm not sure there's really any argument against it. I don't think anyone here is by any stretch of the imagination suggesting they shouldn't have won it.

 

Who gives a big, fat s***? YOU people are ignoring the only fact that MATTERS: The Cards beaat the 2 best teams in baseball to WIN THE WORLD SERIES, which happens to be the ultimate prize, you know?.\ How does what they did in the regular season matter if they managed to overcome it and win it all (kind of like how the SOX did in '05, which none of you seem to understand)? They are a good team. GET OVER IT.

 

After this display of supreme ignorance, you guys have made this place feel like a Cubs board to me. Thanks A LOT for proving that some Sox fans can be just as idiotic as Cubs fans.

Edited December 3, 2006 by TheBigHurt

[GoodAsGould]

How did the Cards beat the 2 best teams in baseball? The Mets were down 2 SP's in the playoffs.... a team with that bad SP is not one of the "best teams" and I know your not talking about the Padres. And the Tigers were the wildcard team so I dont understand what makes them the "best team" either.

 

The Cards won a WS, no one is taking it away from them. But that doesnt change the fact that in any other division they might of not even of been 2nd and Pujols shouldnt be whining when Howard's team had 2 more wins than the Cardinals.

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Dec 3, 2006 -> 02:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How did the Cards beat the 2 best teams in baseball? The Mets were down 2 SP's in the playoffs.... a team with that bad SP is not one of the "best teams" and I know your not talking about the Padres. And the Tigers were the wildcard team so I dont understand what makes them the "best team" either.

 

The Cards won a WS, no one is taking it away from them. But that doesnt change the fact that in any other division they might of not even of been 2nd and Pujols shouldnt be whining when Howard's team had 2 more wins than the Cardinals.

 

What thought process are you using? The Mets and the Tigers were the best teams all season long. Who in your estimation were the best teams? Sorry, but the best teams are those that make the playoffs and go farther.

 

As far as Pujols, I don't have much of an opinion on the MVP. Should it be to a member of the winning team or simply the best player all year? A matter of opinion I guess. But I'm getting really amused by all of this Cardinals bashing simply because of whatever falws they had. How many WS winning teams had big flaws (that they managed to overcome)? They won the World Series, they are the best team. Talking about flukes, opponent's mistakes, etc. to try and s*** on a team that won it all and make them sound bad is biiter bulls***.

 

BTW, anyone who says Pujols is who lead the Cards to a WS title has absolutely no idea what they are talking about.

Edited December 3, 2006 by TheBigHurt

[GoodAsGould]

Ummm the Tigers were the wildcard team in the AL... so how do they qualify as the best team? And the Mets were down multiple starters.... they were forced to use Oliver Perez, john maine, and Steve Traschel for the first 3 games.