Sox offer arbitration to Crede & Cintron

[nitetrain8601]

My question is what are we going to do with Uribe? Isn't he a FA at the end of the year? Also his agent is Scott Boras IIRC. How much do we overpay for him?

[Rowand44]

My question is what are we going to do with Uribe? Isn't he a FA at the end of the year? Also his agent is Scott Boras IIRC. How much do we overpay for him?

He is indeed a fa after this season but his agent is no longer Scott Boras. He fired Boras before he signed his first contract extension here.

[Kalapse]

He is indeed a fa after this season but his agent is no longer Scott Boras. He fired Boras before he signed his first contract extension here.

The team holds a $5M option for the 2008 season, so if Juan has an above average season in 2007 that option will likely be picked up. And you are correct Juan fired Scott Boras in 2003.

[Rowand44]

The team holds a $5M option for the 2008 season, so if Juan has an above average season in 2007 that option will likely be picked up. And you are correct Juan fired Scott Boras in 2003.

I some how missed that when looking up his contract.

[Texsox]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clients_of_Scott_Boras

[Milkman delivers]

The team holds a $5M option for the 2008 season, so if Juan has an above average season in 2007 that option will likely be picked up. And you are correct Juan fired Scott Boras in 2003.

 

The fact that Juan dropped Boras as his agent and then signed an extension with the Sox shows that he cared more about playing here than making more money. And yet, Joe Crede still has Boras as his agent...and some people still believe Crede when he says he won't let his agent get in the way of re-signing with the Sox.

[Leagalize13]

The fact that Juan dropped Boras as his agent and then signed an extension with the Sox shows that he cared more about playing here than making more money. And yet, Joe Crede still has Boras as his agent...and some people still believe Crede when he says he won't let his agent get in the way of re-signing with the Sox.

Oh come on, theres a logical explination for that. Crede is full of s***!

[ChiSox9]

In regards to Boras and Joe's comments about how he wont let his agent get in the way of re-signing. A-Rod (I have to reference) stated in the off-season prior to the '01 season that he wanted to go to a younger competitive team and money was not the issue (I can not find the exact quote) he came from Seattle who had won the wild card in 2000 and ended up winning the division in 2001. He chose the Rangers: because they were younger? Somewhat, their average age for 01 was 29.8... Seattle's was 31.1 which was after A-Rod left. Texas was a competitor? Hardly 4th in 2000 and still 4th in 2001. So, what was the main reason for the signing with texas? They offered him THE largest contract in Baseball. Do you really think A-Rod wanted to go to a Texas team that was not even thought of to be a competitor? Nah, he wanted the money and they had the best on the table!

 

So when Crede says he wont let his agent get in the way of re-signing? I am going to go with my gut feeling and say that Crede is full of s***! Money talks so Crede walks!

[YASNY]

In regards to Boras and Joe's comments about how he wont let his agent get in the way of re-signing. A-Rod (I have to reference) stated in the off-season prior to the '01 season that he wanted to go to a younger competitive team and money was not the issue (I can not find the exact quote) he came from Seattle who had won the wild card in 2000 and ended up winning the division in 2001. He chose the Rangers: because they were younger? Somewhat, their average age for 01 was 29.8... Seattle's was 31.1 which was after A-Rod left. Texas was a competitor? Hardly 4th in 2000 and still 4th in 2001. So, what was the main reason for the signing with texas? They offered him THE largest contract in Baseball. Do you really think A-Rod wanted to go to a Texas team that was not even thought of to be a competitor? Nah, he wanted the money and they had the best on the table!

 

So when Crede says he wont let his agent get in the way of re-signing? I am going to go with my gut feeling and say that Crede is full of s***! Money talks so Crede walks!

 

You may be right, but what happened with ARod has no bearing whatsoever on what will happen with Crede. None.

[ChiSox9]

You may be right, but what happened with ARod has no bearing whatsoever on what will happen with Crede. None.

 

YASNY, I do realize that ARod and Crede has no bearing whatsoever but I used the example of things players say, ie Joe saying his agent will not get in the way of him signing, that are completely disregarded when a issue of money comes up... hence why i referenced A-Rod and his comments prior to his FA signing.

 

There are some players that would do it for the love of the game (Konerko taking a home town discount to stay with the sox) and their are some that are more intent on the money (Arod negating his comments and going with the most bang for the buck). Only time will tell what column Crede falls into. The thing with Baseball these days is that outside of the season players at times forget about loyalty and those that gave them a chance. Those that are typically loyal to their teams become the face of that team for years to come... people like Damon who WAS the face of the BoSox lost all respect when his agent lied to the Sox about other offers on the table, he also stated he would never play for the Yanks... he's wearing the pinstripes now. All I am saying is in this day and age it is difficult to take any players words for face value!

[rowandrules83]

YASNY, I do realize that ARod and Crede has no bearing whatsoever but I used the example of things players say, ie Joe saying his agent will not get in the way of him signing, that are completely disregarded when a issue of money comes up... hence why i referenced A-Rod and his comments prior to his FA signing.

 

There are some players that would do it for the love of the game (Konerko taking a home town discount to stay with the sox) and their are some that are more intent on the money (Arod negating his comments and going with the most bang for the buck). Only time will tell what column Crede falls into. The thing with Baseball these days is that outside of the season players at times forget about loyalty and those that gave them a chance. Those that are typically loyal to their teams become the face of that team for years to come... people like Damon who WAS the face of the BoSox lost all respect when his agent lied to the Sox about other offers on the table, he also stated he would never play for the Yanks... he's wearing the pinstripes now. All I am saying is in this day and age it is difficult to take any players words for face value!

 

You talk about players showing loyalty, but here's a hypothetical. What if Crede signed a long-term, hometown discount contract here, but then completely crapped the bed after he signed it? How much loyalty do you think sox fans would be showing him if he was back to the Crede of '03-'04, with a .250 or so average and consistently popping the ball up on the first pitch?

 

Loyalty is a 2-way street. Many fans expect players to be loyal to the fans and the team, but if they struggle the fans are usually the first ones to forget about loyalty.

[YASNY]

YASNY, I do realize that ARod and Crede has no bearing whatsoever but I used the example of things players say, ie Joe saying his agent will not get in the way of him signing, that are completely disregarded when a issue of money comes up... hence why i referenced A-Rod and his comments prior to his FA signing.

 

There are some players that would do it for the love of the game (Konerko taking a home town discount to stay with the sox) and their are some that are more intent on the money (Arod negating his comments and going with the most bang for the buck). Only time will tell what column Crede falls into. The thing with Baseball these days is that outside of the season players at times forget about loyalty and those that gave them a chance. Those that are typically loyal to their teams become the face of that team for years to come... people like Damon who WAS the face of the BoSox lost all respect when his agent lied to the Sox about other offers on the table, he also stated he would never play for the Yanks... he's wearing the pinstripes now. All I am saying is in this day and age it is difficult to take any players words for face value!

 

That's strange. I thought that when you said Crede was full s*** and money talks Crede walks that you intended a correlation between the two.

[RibbieRubarb]

You talk about players showing loyalty, but here's a hypothetical. What if Crede signed a long-term, hometown discount contract here, but then completely crapped the bed after he signed it? How much loyalty do you think sox fans would be showing him if he was back to the Crede of '03-'04, with a .250 or so average and consistently popping the ball up on the first pitch?

 

Loyalty is a 2-way street. Many fans expect players to be loyal to the fans and the team, but if they struggle the fans are usually the first ones to forget about loyalty.

 

Your analogy is somewhat flawed since we are not paid by the organization to perform. We pay them, so it is within our rights to be critical.

[ChiSox9]

YASNY, I said that my gut feeling is that Crede is full of s***. You dont hire and agent like Boras to give a hometown discount, to not have him negotiate for you, to market you. Boras is the king of marketing his players and a hell of a negotiator.

 

The A-Rod to Crede was just an example of how some players say things but do the exact opposite. Sorry that I referenced A-Rod but it was the first thing that came to mind. The fact of the matter is taking a player's words for what the are worth.

[YASNY]

YASNY, I said that my gut feeling is that Crede is full of s***. You dont hire and agent like Boras to give a hometown discount, to not have him negotiate for you, to market you. Boras is the king of marketing his players and a hell of a negotiator.

 

The A-Rod to Crede was just an example of how some players say things but do the exact opposite. Sorry that I referenced A-Rod but it was the first thing that came to mind. The fact of the matter is taking a player's words for what the are worth.

 

Boras has been Crede's agent from the beginning if I have my facts straight. He was a kid when he signed with Boras. He's not a kid now. He may ... MAY ... dictate the way things are going to go.

[WCSox]

It's quite simple as to why the Sox would make such a move - it's a negotiation tactic used to devalue a player. It's no surprise that the White Sox would want to retain Crede long term, bad back or not, because he's a pretty good all-around 3Bman.

 

I don't understand how de-valuing a player that you have no intention of re-signing in a good negotiation tactic. If you're not going to re-sign him, the other option is to trade him. And you certainly want to de-value a player that you're trying to shop.

[ptatc]

Again, if the team doesn't want to spend that much, they don't have to. A GM could just as easy say, "Wow, the Cardinals are offering that? Congratulations, that seems like a great deal for your player". What is Boras going to do when they walk away?

Oh wait, maybe we're the only ones that have figured out that Boras may be lying about the comp offers, and the other GMs are stupid?

 

This is true. The owners are going to pay what they think they can afford. They can always turn down offers. Owners are doing this to themselves. But that doesn't make his tactics right. Boras is the best at doing this. However that doesn't make the practice ethical. He is doing nothing illegal because lying is not against the law (unless it's under oath see Bill Clinton and Barry Bonds). He may be immoral which is why many teams do not draft his players or negotiate with him. If your philosophy is Maceveelian and "the ends justifies the means" you most likely agree with his tactics.

 

this is where "he is a scumbag" comes from and I happen to fall in line with that idea.