McCarthy Traded to Texas

[AWhiteSoxinNJ]

I'd like to go back and see how many people said this about Thornton too.

 

Totally different situation. Your banking on a garbage pitcher to be in the top of your rotation to a middle reliever in a non high profile trade in Thornton.

[SoxFanForever]

well they were let go and people complained about that. I guess my point is that this franchise HAS had some very good talent "leave" and do nothing afterwords. so i guess i mean pitchers in general

Keith Foulke was pretty alright for a few seasons there

[RX Bandits]

It's a step back because you know Count is good for a DL stint or 2. Is MB going to rebound? Will Vaz every find his stuff back from his Montreal days? Will Garland even be on this team? Too many questions marks when you had a guy ready to step into the rotation with not much of a drop off.

but how do you know BMac can start?!?! I dont think he has enough different pitches to be a solid every 5th day starter. your argument is flawed because I can reverse all of those arguments into positives.

 

Keith Foulke was pretty alright for a few seasons there

that is the only name that comes to mind, but even when boston was on top, foulke was still kinda bad. I'll give you half credit for it, but Foulke was never very dominant for a long period of time after leaving

[LowerCaseRepublican]

It's a step back because you know Count is good for a DL stint or 2. Is MB going to rebound? Will Vaz every find his stuff back from his Montreal days? Will Garland even be on this team? Too many questions marks when you had a guy ready to step into the rotation with not much of a drop off.

Can I get a look in your crystal ball that you're certain that Contreras will be on the DL twice during the season?

 

It's amazing that you question if MB (a proven starter with 1-2 ability) will get it back but think that McCarthy is going to come into his own with zero to little growing pains as a starter for an entire season. That is such a chasm in logic, I can't even see the other shore from where you made that jump.

[GreatScott82]

It's a step back because you know Count is good for a DL stint or 2. Is MB going to rebound? Will Vaz every find his stuff back from his Montreal days? Will Garland even be on this team? Too many questions marks when you had a guy ready to step into the rotation with not much of a drop off.

something tells me KW is just going to continue to ship away the starters. look for Vazquez to be traded to the Mets while Garland might be shipped off as well. Can't win w/o pitching and it looks like we running out of quality+ starters by the day. Gavin Floyd is now listed as our 5th starter...YAY! I hope him and his 7.29 ERA can help contribute in 2007! Don't look now Sox fans but we have once agained walked into the BLACK HOLE also known as the 5th starter spot.

[Wanne]

Get out of here with that logic and reason!

 

You must not have gotten your invitation to McCarthy's Cy Young ceremony from now until his retirement and you're just bitter about that. That's gotta be it.

 

That and he snubbed my kid for an autograph this spring....BASTARD!

[Rowand44]

good to see another thinking white sox fan. I am so damn tired of people on this board falling in love with players. I call it Aaron Roawand disease. If people are worried about the 5th starter you need to find another hobby or something

Right, cause I'm one of the biggest Aaron Rowand fans around and I was so pissed when we traded him. People are allowed to be mad about a trade, I personally have been high on Brandon for a long time and think he's going to be a special pitcher, so I don't need to hear that I'm too attached to a player. I'm attached to Brandon cause I think he's going to be a very good pitcher.

Edited December 23, 2006 by Rowand44

[Dam8610]

your point helps me, because if our system has not produced anybody good, then that trend should continue on with mccarthy, and if that is the case, 3 pitchers > 1 pitcher

 

So 3 bad pitchers is better than 1 bad pitcher? That's great logic.

 

Anyway, McCarthy has done well when given oppurtunities to start at the ML level. Danks hasn't even seen the ML level yet, and didn't exactly light up the PCL last year, which leads to the question: How far away is he from big league action? That's not a good thing to be asking for a team that's trying to win now.

[RX Bandits]

Totally different situation. Your banking on a garbage pitcher to be in the top of your rotation to a middle reliever in a non high profile trade in Thornton.

you can use the same logic with the outcome of that deal though. Remember when borchard was an untouchable?! s*** you could have gotten a ton for him when he was a hot prospect. Moreover, even after trading a crappy Borcahrd Thornton stepped right in and the sox "fixed" him. whats not to say they can't do the same for the players they have recieved in the last 2 big trades?

[AWhiteSoxinNJ]

but how do you know BMac can start?!?! I dont think he has enough different pitches to be a solid every 5th day starter. your argument is flawed because I can reverse all of those arguments into positives.

that is the only name that comes to mind, but even when boston was on top, foulke was still kinda bad. I'll give you half credit for it, but Foulke was never very dominant for a long period of time after leaving

 

By what you just said, what if McCarthy wins 20 games and Denks never makes the big leagues. Turn a negatives into positives. And yes I know McCarthy can start because he's start for this team. If we were going to trade McCarthy, this wasn't the right time to do it.

[SoxHawk1980]

So, besides the fact that BMAC started for us at the end of 2005, Ozzie didnt want to start him. And when we had no openings in the rotation this year, Ozzie didnt like him. And when Texas came knocking on our door offering two nice prospects for BMAC, Ozzie decided to pull the trigger?

 

You couldnt possibly be that retarded could you? I hope its an act.

Enough with your insults and ceaseless defenses of KW and Ozzie. It is just foolish. I hope you know that Ozzie has a great deal of influence with KW on personnel matters.

[phiteinphils]

whats not to say they can't do the same for the players they have recieved in the last 2 big trades?

 

Because Floyd is hopeless.

[Wanne]

Totally different situation. Your banking on a garbage pitcher to be in the top of your rotation to a middle reliever in a non high profile trade in Thornton.

 

No...point being a lot of people thought Matt Thornton was total crap...as well as people in the Mariners orginization and fanbase...having the same opinion of Thornton that you do of Floyd. That's the point I was making.

[RX Bandits]

Right, cause I'm one of the biggest Aaron Rowand fans around and I was so pissed when we traded him. People are allowed to be mad about a trade, I personally have been high on Brandon for a long time and think he's going to be a special pitcher, so I don't need to hear that I'm too attached to a player. I'm attached to Brandon cause I think he's going to be a very good pitcher.

I never said people cant have the opinion that I don't, however, my ARow point is that ARow really wasn't that good, he is just a guy. Hell I think hes a great guy, I would buy him a beer if I ever saw him at a bar. But my point is that KW does not get attched to players that end up screwing him over. I think that is a quality characteristic of a GM. I guess what I am trying to say is that Brandon has a great spring training, and last year he looked real bad out of the bullpen for a while.

[AWhiteSoxinNJ]

No...point being a lot of people thought Matt Thornton was total crap...as well as people in the Mariners orginization and fanbase...having the same opinion of Thornton that you do of Floyd. That's the point I was making.

 

Having watched Floyd pitched since he was drafted by the Phillies and living in the area, I've seen enough to make that decision, like a lot of scouts have, as well to the point that he was a throw-in player in a trade now.

 

I never said people cant have the opinion that I don't, however, my ARow point is that ARow really wasn't that good, he is just a guy. Hell I think hes a great guy, I would buy him a beer if I ever saw him at a bar. But my point is that KW does not get attched to players that end up screwing him over. I think that is a quality characteristic of a GM. I guess what I am trying to say is that Brandon has a great spring training, and last year he looked real bad out of the bullpen for a while.

 

Doesn't make up the fact that we get hosed in this deal, you can get more for McCarthy then this.

Edited December 23, 2006 by AWhiteSoxinNJ

[RX Bandits]

Sounds to me like you jumped on the bandwagon in 2005.

 

If we had a 4th starter in 01-04, we make the playoffs at least a few times.

woh, lets not go there. 01-04 the pitching was just not as good. hell we didn't have an "outstanding" 5th starter by any stretch of the imagination, how is this any different?

 

Because Floyd is hopeless.

and freddy is a fat pitcher who cant keep his weight down who lost a ton of velocity on his fastball.

[SoxFanForever]

but how do you know BMac can start?!?! I dont think he has enough different pitches to be a solid every 5th day starter. your argument is flawed because I can reverse all of those arguments into positives.

that is the only name that comes to mind, but even when boston was on top, foulke was still kinda bad. I'll give you half credit for it, but Foulke was never very dominant for a long period of time after leaving

Ok, how about Scott Eyre, Chad Bradford, Bobby Howry, Roberto Hernandez?

 

By the way, I agree with you for the mostpart. We really haven't traded away anyone that turned into something special. However, we have had our fair share of trades that didn't go all that great.

[GreatScott82]

Okay what are the odds one of the following contribute and have a successfull 2007 season with the white sox?

Floyd, Gonzales, Danks, Masset or Rasner?!? KW now needs to go out there and find a 5th starter. Floyd is NOT ready yet. How about taking a risk and signing Mulder to a respectable 2 year deal?

[RX Bandits]

Doesn't make up the fact that we get hosed in this deal, you can get more for McCarthy then this.

you cant prove that until 3 years down the line. hell i'll give you my AIM sn which is ooorxbanditsooo and you can IM me in 3 years if im wrong. hell i'll even give you my phone number

[SoxFanForever]

Okay what are the odds one of the following contribute and have a successfull 2007 season with the white sox?

Floyd, Gonzales, Danks, Masset or Rasner?!? KW now needs to go out there and find a 5th starter. Floyd is NOT ready yet. How about taking a risk and signing Mulder to a respectable 2 year deal?

Mulder will probably get more money than he is worth from someone else.

[LowerCaseRepublican]

By what you just said, what if McCarthy wins 20 games and Denks never makes the big leagues. Turn a negatives into positives. And yes I know McCarthy can start because he's start for this team. If we were going to trade McCarthy, this wasn't the right time to do it.

McCarthy has not started for an entire season for the Sox. Assuming that the tolls of the 162 game season as a starter wouldn't possibly hurt him (a DL stint), who's to say that he'd suddenly turn all that untapped potential you see into his supposed ace material?

 

You question that the other starters are going to be able to carry the ball (despite having proven over entire seasons that they can) yet with no sample size from which you can cite, you demand for us to take the leap in over a chasm of logic to believe that just imputting McCarthy into the rotation is automatically going to mean that he'll have it all put together.

 

And this is just as feasible as the situations you thought up -- what if McCarthy puts up an ERA the wrong side of 5 for the entire season? He got traded while he still had an upside and we got a lot for him. Although I really thought the Cardinals would have bitten at the McCarthy for Pujols straight up deal.

[RX Bandits]

Ok, how about Scott Eyre, Chad Bradford, Bobby Howry, Roberto Hernandez?

 

By the way, I agree with you for the mostpart. We really haven't traded away anyone that turned into something special. However, we have had our fair share of trades that didn't go all that great.

roberto hernandez was never as dominanent after he left the white sox. bradford, eyre, howry, now thats scraping the barrel. ill give them to you, but i think you understand the point im trying to make.

[soxfan3530]

speechless. i am without speech.

[Bubba Philips]

In a dec 7, article, phil rogers said that there would be a dimantling of our '06 staff with a younger pitchers taking their roles. I believe we are loading up with quality sp and rp some nearly ready with some ready.. I often wondered why every year 2 or three members of a teams starting rotation is replaced by trades free agents etc. Minnesota, who I loathe manages to develop pitchers and other position players through their system.. We can too. We are now deep in talent one to two years away has KW taken a ready player and traded him for player whose time is a year away. I trust Kenny. I have no choice. I also believe there are more trades of pitchers and other position players developing.

[AWhiteSoxinNJ]

McCarthy has not started for an entire season for the Sox. Assuming that the tolls of the 162 game season as a starter wouldn't possibly hurt him (a DL stint), who's to say that he'd suddenly turn all that untapped potential you see into his supposed ace material?

 

You question that the other starters are going to be able to carry the ball (despite having proven over entire seasons that they can) yet with no sample size from which you can cite, you demand for us to take the leap in over a chasm of logic to believe that just imputting McCarthy into the rotation is automatically going to mean that he'll have it all put together.

 

And this is just as feasible as the situations you thought up -- what if McCarthy puts up an ERA the wrong side of 5 for the entire season? He got traded while he still had an upside and we got a lot for him. Although I really thought the Cardinals would have bitten at the McCarthy for Pujols straight up deal.

 

I was going off his extreme post that McCarthy would be nothing and that everything is okay with the Sox, when it is not.