McCarthy Traded to Texas

[LowerCaseRepublican]

I want a date.

Maybe he'll exchange numbers with you and all will be right in the world again.

[Gregory Pratt]

Ha

[shoota]

Reading this thread is really reminding me of some previous threads regarding trades.

 

And on that note, how goes Cooperstown's efforts to get Olivo's bust bronzed for his impending HOF ceremony?

 

I swear -- for many people on this board -- if KW walked on water, you'd complain about him not swimming.

 

We've still got a few months before spring training, let alone the start of the season. A trade or some FA work may still be possible. It's also amazing that McCarthy who has shown flashes of being very good but hasn't been able to put it together is automatically, again in many peoples' responses here, going to overtake Johan Santana in 2007 for the AL Cy Young. Take off the homer blinders and look at this pragmatically please.

 

Just like the Garcia trade to Philly. People thought we didn't get enough for him. Yet everybody here was joking about how bad Garcia was all last year (my favorite being Kalapse's Flamethrower Freddy with the 86 mph speed gun saying "Intimidation had a New Name") I'm personally amazed that we got something more than a sack of scuffed balls for him.

 

Never mind. Forget I said anything. Continue with the complaints that the sky is falling and the end of the world is at hand. Never mind that all the prospect trading over the past seasons might just mean that we may need to restock a little bit.

I'm not defending KW, I'm just pleading for a little reason here rather than emotional "OMG!!!11! WE'RE GONNA BE WORSE THAN DA ROYELS THIS YEAR!" knee-jerk responses.

 

No one has said that.

 

I guarantee Ozzie's dislike for McCarthy also played a role in this.

 

I also must admit that my interest in watching the Sox this year is fading more and more.

 

Yeah, I had the same thought soon after I learned of this trade.

 

I think it was Fathom who did a nice job breaking down Ozzie's bias against McCarthy and in favor of Vazquez, his golfing buddy.

 

go on and name a time KW...hell i'll even say the franchise has never been wrong about letting pitching go in the last 15 years. People were pissed when fernandez, alverez, kip wells, etc etc when those guys were traded, and really they didnt do ANYTHING. Trades like this cannot be determinded who "won and lost" right now.

 

Poor reasoning since the organization's past pitching decisions does not guarantee the success of all future decisions.

 

How long have you been at ISU?

[southsideirish71]

You got 360?

 

If so, BOOO. HopeHop on Rainbow 6: Las Vegas and then we're talkin'...

 

 

Thats all I have been playing lately. I just got Staff Sergeant rank last night.

 

I am warming up to the idea of having Danks and all. But still upset they had to burn bmac to get it.

 

One thing though, after loading up on all of this pitching talent. I cant wait to see how our minor league system ranks this year.

Edited December 24, 2006 by southsideirish71

[greg775]

It's apparent our front office panicked that our team is growing old and soon to lose all the

veteran pitchers to free agency.

So it appears we are going to keep our expensive everyday players and try to develop the

next Buehrle's, Contrerases through the stockpiling of young pitchers, figuring some will

pan out.

Interesting philosophy but the Royals have been trotting out young pitchers for years and all

it gets them is 100 losses. Even though their lineup of course isn't as

good as the Sox.

And the Yankees dont worry about prospects and they seem to

make the playoffs most of the time.

 

I'm just surprised the front office immediately changed philosophy.

[Gregory Pratt]

Trade-happy GM butchers rotation by dealing McCarthy

 

Oh Jay Mariotti. http://www.suntimes.com/sports/mariotti/18...T-jay24.article

[LowerCaseRepublican]

I don't mean to be rude, especially with the holiday season upon us, but are you serious with your posts??

Reading that post from him. I was just thoroughly reminded of the scenes from the film Major League where they have the fans talking about how the team is going to suck despite making the playoffs etc.

[greg775]

Of course I'm serious Tony and instead of wasting time saying that why don't you ask me what's

wrong with that post? Or ask a follow up?

Tony are you saying you don't see an obvious change in philosophy regarding the Sox wanting

to let the high priced pitchers walk? You don't see the Royals trot prospects out there every year

and the prospects suck?

And that the Yankees go with veterans over prospects every year?

Sorry in your world everybody doesn't agree with tony.

Edited December 24, 2006 by greg775

[Balta1701]

Of course I'm serious Tony and instead of wasting time saying that why don't you ask me what's

wrong with that post? Or ask a follow up?

Tony are you saying you don't see an obvious change in philosophy regarding the Sox wanting

to let the high priced pitchers walk? You don't see the Royals trot prospects out there every year

and the prospects suck?

And that the Yankees go with veterans over prospects every year?

Sorry in your world everybody doesn't agree with tony.

The Yankees go with veterans over prospects every year? Wang, and soon to be Phillip Hughes would like to raise an issue with you.

 

And secondly, you're comparing the White Sox to the Royals? Well, let me fire this back at you. You don't see the Tigers, Twins, and Indians running their prospects out there and managing to find repeated success? That nice year of Verlander, Zumaya, Bonderman, Maroth, and all those other young guys didn't do anything for you?

[ShoeLessRob]

Reading that post from him. I was just thoroughly reminded of the scenes from the film Major League where they have the fans talking about how the team is going to suck despite making the playoffs etc.

 

Your avatar gives me nightmares.

[SoxFan1]

Oh Jay Mariotti. http://www.suntimes.com/sports/mariotti/18...T-jay24.article

And so, Mariotti comes out of hibernation.

[Cerbaho-WG]

And so, Mariotti comes out of hibernation.

 

And gave us this gem:

 

he peddled can't-miss McCarthy to the Texas Rangers for three pitching prospects who never have been in the majors

 

Masset pitched in September last year and unless Danks' left arm flies off, he'll be up next year. And how McCarthy is can't miss is beyond me. Typisch.

[aboz56]

Mariotti is a clueless prick.

 

He's got no idea what the hell he's talking about.

 

Danks>Mac, bottom line.

 

I believe some people wanted the BA scouting reports on Danks and Masset.

 

Here ya go:

 

1. John Danks, lhp Born: April 15, 1985 • B-T: L-L • Ht: 6-1 • Wt: 200

Drafted: HS--Round Rock, Texas, 2003 (1st round) • Signed by: Randy Taylor

 

Background: Throughout his career, Danks has been one of the youngest pitchers in his league and has started off each new stop by struggling against older competition. But every year, he makes adjustments, masters the level and advances to the next challenge. After he stumbled to a 7.15 ERA in April at Double-A Frisco, he went 4-0, 2.70 in his next eight starts to earn a promotion. He posted a 5.90 ERA in his first eight starts at Triple-A Oklahoma, then rallied to turn in a 2.32 ERA in his final six. Because he's lefthanded and has a deeper and more consistent repertoire, he has passed the other members of the DVD trio (Edinson Volquez, Thomas Diamond) to become the top pitching prospect in the system. The ninth overall pick in the 2003 draft, Danks comes from an athletic family. His father John played basketball at Texas, younger brother Jordan is a sophomore outfielder for the Longhorns and a possible first-rounder in the 2008 draft, and younger sister Emily is a standout high school volleyball player.

 

Strengths: Danks offers a rare package for a 21-year-old lefthander, with a polished three-pitch mix and a track record of success up through Triple-A. His tight 1-to-7 curveball rated as his best pitch coming out of high school, but since then his tumbling changeup has also become a plus offering. His changeup is now more reliable than his curveball. He also has a four-seam fastball that sits at 90-92 mph and tops out at 94. Danks added a two-seam version in 2006 to help him widen the strike zone. He has a clean arm action from a high-three-quarters slot and does a good job repeating his easy delivery. Danks has started to fill out his durable, athletic frame, and he could add a little more velocity. His baseball IQ is outstanding, and he has a better feel for pitching than most hurlers his age. He does a good job of holding runners, as nine of 21 basestealers (43 percent) were caught on his watch in 2006.

 

Weaknesses: At this point, it's just a matter of fine-tuning for Danks. He still needs to command his fastball better, because while he can throw it for strikes at any time, he gets punished sometimes when he leaves it up in the zone. His fastball is firm but not overpowering, so he needs to get ahead with it early in the count. Danks' command of his curveball comes and goes, though his changeup often bails him out. He'll need a more consistent curve in order to reach his ceiling as a No. 2 starter.

 

The Future: There was some sentiment that Danks could have started 2006 in the big leagues, but the Rangers were determined not to rush him and will continue to be patient. He'll have a chance to force his way into the big league rotation during spring training, but the more likely scenario is a return to Triple-A and a midseason debut in the majors. Once he settles in, Danks should pitch at or near the front of the Texas rotation for years to come.

 

8. Nick Masset, rhp Born: May 17, 1982 • B-T: R-R • Ht: 6-4 • Wt: 190

Drafted: St. Petersburg (Fla.) CC, D/F 2000 (8th round) • Signed by: Ray Jackson

 

Background: Masset has possessed tantalizing stuff ever since his high school days, when Tommy John surgery as a senior hurt his draft stock. Signed as a draft-and-follow for $225,000, he appeared on the verge of big things after his breakout 2004 season, but got crushed in 2005 and was inconsistent in 2006. He finished the season in the majors before dominating as a closer in the Mexican Pacific League.

 

Strengths: Masset throws his fastball at 89-95 mph as a starter but ran it up to 97-98 in bullpen in Texas and Mexico. His hard 85-86 mph curveball with sharp downward bite rates as a plus pitch. His changeup and cutter/slider are at least average and help him against lefthanders.

 

Weaknesses: Erratic command spoiled Masset's 2005 season and still makes him more hittable than he should be. Despite his impressive array of four pitches, he has yet to locate them well enough to be a reliable starter. He showed plenty of moxie to bounce back from 2005 but must prove he can sustain success.

 

The Future: Masset may have pitched his way into the big league bullpen role with his strong winter. He still has the stuff and frame to be a durable, effective starter if he can master his command.

 

IF they have a chance to still make revisions before the BA Prospect Handbock goes to press, which I am guessing they will, Danks will now be our No. 1 in my opinion, followed by Sweeney, Fields and then most likely Gio.

[Jordan4life_2007]

So valued was McCarthy, Williams said no when the Washington Nationals demanded him in a possible deadline deal for Alfonso Soriano, who, at the very least, could have been a history-changing, three-month rental on the South Side.

 

My favorite part of the article. History-changing? And the idiot doesn't even realize he answered his own question.

[NorthSideSox72]

When you going down?

Not sure yet, flexible. Don't want to derail the thread though - let me know if/when you have specific dates in mind.

 

Went last year for the first time - had a blast.

Edited December 24, 2006 by NorthSideSox72

[Texsox]

So Mariott agrees with 90% of the posters here that the trade sucks, and he's still and idiot

[Buehrle>Wood]

Danks>Mac

I smell a new potential handle.

[greg775]

Mariotti is a moron, but I have to admit I thought that column was right-on,

probably only because I agreed with him for once.

He's always too over the top, but he is right about the fact Kenny was working

too hard over the holidays. He should have waited a few days before pulling

the plug on that bad trade.

[mr_genius]

this trade blows

 

i'm pissed

[mr_genius]

I wouldn't push it. Looks like he has some sort of Ultimate Fighter in his avatar, looks tough.....

 

 

everyone that watches ultimate fighting is obviously a TOTAL badass

 

everyone.

[RibbieRubarb]

And the next time you call me out like this, we'll exchange phone numbers and arrange a meeting......

 

May I suggest the Pink Palace motel in Bedford Park? Ask for the "Space Shuttle" room!

[greg775]

Danks>Mac, bottom line.

 

And how in the world do you deduce that?

Here's Rogers' take. Good stuff.

 

By Phil Rogers

Chicago Tribune

chicagosports.com

 

CHICAGO — Hey, Brandon McCarthy. Danks for the memories.

Sorry. That’s the office-party eggnog talking. Or maybe it’s just a case of being punch-drunk from White Sox general manager Ken Williams’ ultra-aggressive, shop-till-you-drop (even if you don’t need anything) trades.

Say this for the man: He’s certainly swinging for the fences this winter, trading known quantities for pitchers with big upsides but no guarantees.

The five-player swap that sent McCarthy to Texas for left-hander John Danks and right-hander Nick Masset carries huge risk. But Williams concluded that the potential reward in adding two power arms for one polished workhorse was worth a roll of the dice. Good luck on that.

Texas GM Jon Daniels expressed the situation well.

“I don’t have any doubts about John’s ability,” Daniels said of the highly regarded Danks. “But until you do it in the major leagues, there is always some uncertainty.”

It’s surprising the Sox would trade a 23-year-old with the potential to win 15 to 18 games every year. It’s not shocking, however, with veterans Jose Contreras, Jon Garland, Mark Buehrle and Javier Vazquez still in the rotation.

But it would have seemed more logical to use McCarthy as a chip that would bring back a significant outfielder, like Tampa Bay’s Rocco Baldelli or Toronto’s Alex Rios. To trade your one young starter after you’ve just seemed to have opened a spot in the rotation for him, and to get back only unproven players, well, that takes chutzpah.

Williams still could use the surplus of pitching prospects he has created to pull off a trade that brings immediate improvement to one of three positions: left field, center field or shortstop. But the reality is he has now made four trades since November without addressing his most glaring needs.

On the surface, the McCarthy deal is another part of the Williams/Jerry Reinsdorf plan to replace, rather than re-sign, Buehrle, Garland and Vazquez (along with the recently departed Freddy Garcia) before the 2009 season. This is a despicable plan, not just because it puts economics ahead of competitiveness but because it guarantees that guys who brought a World Series parade to Chicago are going to be leaving town too soon, maybe still in their primes.

When this organizational strategy was revealed this month, I used the word “arrogant” to describe it. Williams, however, believes he is merely being “prudent” and “forward-thinking” to get ahead of a pitching market that is throwing big four- and five-year contracts at No. 3 and No. 4 starters.

It’s going to be fascinating to see if Williams and Ozzie Guillen can get the Sox back to the playoffs while substantially changing a rotation that has led the majors in innings pitched the last two years. If they can, Williams will be worth his weight in World Series rings to Reinsdorf.

All we can say now is that he is rounding up talent.

Danks, a 21-year-old Texan who was the ninth pick in the 2003 draft, is the fifth first-round pitcher the Sox have traded for since last March. He follows Matt Thornton, Mike MacDougal, David Aardsma and Gavin Floyd. Left-handers Gio Gonzalez (a compensation pick after the first round) and Andrew Sisco (a second-rounder) just miss this list. And even 20-year-old right-hander Jacob Rasner, seemingly just a body in the McCarthy trade, is a project with a high ceiling.

Danks, Masset, Floyd, Gonzalez and Sisco arrive at a time when the farm system is short on power pitchers. They join knuckleballer Charlie Haeger, Heath Phillips (a bargain-basement Buehrle) and low-90s right-hander Lance Broadway to give Guillen and Williams an array of possibilities.Danks is generally considered to have the highest ceiling in this group. The Sox will sell him as a future ace, and no one doubts he can be a No. 2 or 3 starter.

In his 26 starts between Double A and Triple A last season, Danks showed a plus curveball and a fastball that was generally 90 to 92 m.p.h. but could spike to 94. He’s only 6 feet 1 inch, but some scouts believe he has room to add strength and gain a little velocity.

Masset is an even harder thrower. His fastball was generally 95 to 96 last season as a starter and reliever while skipping between Double A, Triple A and Texas, but reports have had him at 97 to 98 in Mexico this winter. His most impressive numbers there were 22 strikeouts and only two walks, as he’s sometimes had trouble finding the strike zone.

Of the eight pitchers the Sox have added this winter, Masset and Aardsma have the best chance to contribute in 2007. They join Bobby Jenks, MacDougal and Thornton in a potentially eye-popping bullpen.

McCarthy, as candid as he was consistent in a quick rise through the farm system, will be missed. The Rangers paid heavily to get him because Daniels felt he could safely project him into the third spot in the rotation, or fourth if he signs Barry Zito.

Few professional athletes are as open, honest and friendly as McCarthy, and that might have scared Williams a little. He is a guy who will say what is on his mind, and that made him something of a square peg for the Reinsdorfian round hole.

It’s true that he was inconsistent and sometimes confused in his 2006 stint as a bullpen guy and a starter-in-waiting. But don’t forget McCarthy went 7-1 with a 1.88 ERA in 16 starts between Triple A and the big leagues in the second half of 2005, including wins at Texas and Boston that helped keep the Sox’s wheels on the tracks. During that stretch, there wasn’t a pitcher in baseball as consistently good.

He’ll be a star for the Rangers if he pitches half that well. The Sox continue to amass quantity, but only time will tell about the quality.

[Balta1701]

So Mariott agrees with 90% of the posters here that the trade sucks, and he's still and idiot

Even a broken clock is right twice a day...

[greg775]

Forget Mariotti though.

Rogers is more rational and he is also questioning this trade big time and the direction

the team has headed, calling it unwise and "arrogant."

[NCsoxfan]

Another sign that mediocre SP's are getting paid a fortune: Jeff Suppan signs a 4yr 42m contract

 

The same Jeff Suppan that was unwanted a few years back...