Mark Buehrle on the Score

[Dick Allen]

If we buy the extra playoff games as the reason the pitching staff sort of sucked last season, shouldn't we also assume if the White Sox make the playoffs in 2007, not turning over pretty much the entire pitching staff will make 2008 a dissappointment? FWIW, Buerhle claimed in the interview that he wasn't injured or tired in 2006.

[maggliopipe]

So he said if it came down to the Cardianals and Sox offering the same contract he'd pick this Sox? Talk about spin, I never expected the guy to sign with the Cardinals anyway, I expect him to sign with the highest bidder on the open market which in all likely hood would not be the Sox or Cards.

 

I didn't hear the interview, but from the sounds of it he was explicitly asked about the Cards, and that's all he was addressing. It's hard to blame him for not laying his cards on the table and saying that he'd sign with the Sox on the Sox' terms and ignoring more lucrative offers. That wouldn't be very smart with respect to bargaining.

 

It's good to hear something like this out of his mouth. You're right, it's not big news, but I'm still happy to hear it.

[YASNY]

We've sure got some jaded mofo's on this site.

 

Regarding Mark's performance, sure he had a s***ty 2nd half to '06. But, if you take a discerning look at his overall body of work throughout his career, Mark's been one of the most valueable pitchers in the majors. Except for a couple of bad streaks, he's been as dependable as anyone. Not great. Not the best. But very solid.

 

I for one have never had a problem with Mark being a Cards fan. I understand what it's like to be a fan. I won't comment on those that do have a problem with this. Just wanted to put my position out there.

 

Then you get into the money issue. Well, wake the f*** up folks, it's a business. And for the players, its a finite business. They happened to blessed with a unique ability that in today's society allows them to make millions of dollars. Because of this set of circumstances, they can financially set up their decendants for generations to come. How many of you fathers out there wouldn't love to have that kind of opportunity? Step back and look at the big picture. Whether it hurts your feelings if he leaves for more money is not part of the equation.

[Kalapse]

We've sure got some jaded mofo's on this site.

 

Regarding Mark's performance, sure he had a s***ty 2nd half to '06. But, if you take a discerning look at his overall body of work throughout his career, Mark's been one of the most valueable pitchers in the majors. Except for a couple of bad streaks, he's been as dependable as anyone. Not great. Not the best. But very solid.

 

I for one have never had a problem with Mark being a Cards fan. I understand what it's like to be a fan. I won't comment on those that do have a problem with this. Just wanted to put my position out there.

 

Then you get into the money issue. Well, wake the f*** up folks, it's a business. And for the players, its a finite business. They happened to blessed with a unique ability that in today's society allows them to make millions of dollars. Because of this set of circumstances, they can financially set up their decendants for generations to come. How many of you fathers out there wouldn't love to have that kind of opportunity? Step back and look at the big picture. Whether it hurts your feelings if he leaves for more money is not part of the equation.

I'm having trouble finding the posts by the 'jaded mofo's' in this thread. I thought most everyone was taking a pretty realistic point of view regarding the Buehrle situation. Your post makes it sound like we have people calling Buehrle greedy which I'm just not seeing.

[beck72]

From Mark's point of view, he should be well compensated next yr. He's been one of the most consistent SP's in baseball. He looks around the league and sees crap pitchers getting over 5 yr $55 mill deals, why shouldn't he look for the best deal out there for him and his family. A normal, good yr in 2007 should net Mark at minimum a 4, 5 yr deal worth $60-75 mill.

 

The sox should ante up--provided he returns to form this yr. Which IMO, he will. Yet they shouldn't get too crazy in terms of money or length beyond what I suggested above.

[spiderman]

From Mark's point of view, he should be well compensated next yr. He's been one of the most consistent SP's in baseball. He looks around the league and sees crap pitchers getting over 5 yr $55 mill deals, why shouldn't he look for the best deal out there for him and his family. A normal, good yr in 2007 should net Mark at minimum a 4, 5 yr deal worth $60-75 mill.

 

The sox should ante up--provided he returns to form this yr. Which IMO, he will. Yet they shouldn't get too crazy in terms of money or length beyond what I suggested above.

 

Why should the White Sox ante up if they feel their prospects can carry the load?

 

Doesn't that defeat the purpose of acquiring all these young arms ?

 

I'd love to have Buerhel here long-term, and I think the Whie Sox probably do as well, but I don't see them bending very much considering they are so high on their prospects, and KW has spoken at length about how out of control the market is.

[CanOfCorn]

Why should the White Sox ante up if they feel their prospects can carry the load?

 

Doesn't that defeat the purpose of acquiring all these young arms ?

 

I'd love to have Buerhel here long-term, and I think the Whie Sox probably do as well, but I don't see them bending very much considering they are so high on their prospects, and KW has spoken at length about how out of control the market is.

 

Because, Mark Buehrle is 28 years old. He's just comign into his prime. He doesn't throw hard or with a lot of torque on his arm. He doesn't deserve 7 years, $126 million, but then again, no pitcher does. If the Sox could give him 4-5 years for maybe $14 - $16 mil per...I think that would be good. If he turns it down...he turns it down...but I think the Sox should try. He isn't 38, he's 28 people.

[spiderman]

Because, Mark Buehrle is 28 years old. He's just comign into his prime. He doesn't throw hard or with a lot of torque on his arm. He doesn't deserve 7 years, $126 million, but then again, no pitcher does. If the Sox could give him 4-5 years for maybe $14 - $16 mil per...I think that would be good. If he turns it down...he turns it down...but I think the Sox should try. He isn't 38, he's 28 people.

 

OK, that sounded great, but back to how the White Sox do business, specifically in regards to pitchers.

 

Do we really expect the White Sox to offer him a 4 or 5 year deal given that they don't do that currently for pitching contracts ?????

 

If you read my previous post, I'm in agreeance with you - I also want Buerhle back, but someone's going to have to bend, and considering the White Sox contract length policy (or restrictions) to pitchers, what they will be willing to pay, and the stock of young arms in the minors, I think Burrhle would have to take a contract in the White Sox mold, probably a 3 year deal in the 35 million range.

[southsider2k5]

Mark Buehrle said the perfect thing. He said if the Sox and another team offer me the same contract... well he is smart enough to realize that the Sox aren't going to match a one hundred million dollar contract, so he isn't going to have to ever stand up to those words. Get used to it folks, this is Mark's last year as a member of the Chicago White Sox.

[shawnhillegas]

I just cant understand why you wouldnt sign 1 guy to anchor the staff. Yeah the market sucks, but pay out the big bucks for 1/5th of the rotation and develop the rest through intelligent trades and better scouting. But if there is a man to sign, its Mark (provided he rebounds).

[spiderman]

I just cant understand why you wouldnt sign 1 guy to anchor the staff. Yeah the market sucks, but pay out the big bucks for 1/5th of the rotation and develop the rest through intelligent trades and better scouting. But if there is a man to sign, its Mark (provided he rebounds).

 

I'm on board with you, but the White Sox have, what they believe to be, valid reasons for not overpaying (in their belief) for starting pitching, and, I think in a lot of cases, I think they are right.

[SkokieSox]

I just cant understand why you wouldnt sign 1 guy to anchor the staff. Yeah the market sucks, but pay out the big bucks for 1/5th of the rotation and develop the rest through intelligent trades and better scouting. But if there is a man to sign, its Mark (provided he rebounds).

 

The Sox can afford to pay big money for 1/5th of their rotation. If they are to do it though, is MB the guy? If I'm going to shell out a **** load of money, it isn't to MB. I'd pay a considerable amount to keep him, but no where near Zito money.

[LosMediasBlancas]

Mark Buehrle said the perfect thing. He said if the Sox and another team offer me the same contract... well he is smart enough to realize that the Sox aren't going to match a one hundred million dollar contract, so he isn't going to have to ever stand up to those words. Get used to it folks, this is Mark's last year as a member of the Chicago White Sox.

 

Ding, ding, ding ding.

[RockRaines]

Ding, ding, ding ding.

We'll see.

[beck72]

Why should the White Sox ante up if they feel their prospects can carry the load?

 

Doesn't that defeat the purpose of acquiring all these young arms ?

 

I'd love to have Buerhel here long-term, and I think the Whie Sox probably do as well, but I don't see them bending very much considering they are so high on their prospects, and KW has spoken at length about how out of control the market is.

I said the sox should ante up a deal as high as 5 yrs and $75 mill. More than that and it's crazy money.

 

The sox acquired arms to give them options. I'm sure they'd like to re-sign Mark to a air, reasonable contract. But not at Zito type money and length.

[Soxfest]

MB knows he is getting BIG money from someone so he put the ball in Jerry's I do not sign pitchers to longterm deals court. MB knows how to play the game.

Edited January 7, 2007 by Soxfest

[spiderman]

I said the sox should ante up a deal as high as 5 yrs and $75 mill. More than that and it's crazy money.

 

The sox acquired arms to give them options. I'm sure they'd like to re-sign Mark to a air, reasonable contract. But not at Zito type money and length.

 

Prepared to be disapointed if you think the White Sox are going to give any pitcher a 5 year deal.

 

The most they will give is 3 years, and I think their definition of bending is a team option on a 4th year.

[bigruss]

I believe that the Sox will probably offer a good deal to MB, but not the outrageous types being handed out to mediocre pitchers, he'll walk from us and the Cards and land a deal like Zito most likely, and really i cant argue with that descision if he goes in that direction, if you were in his shoes, wouldnt you accept the most money to support your family for the future? the only reason i see him staying is if he has another down year and the offer from other teams really isnt that much better than the Sox's

 

plus, with all of these young guys with such large ceilings we may just find a guy who surprises everbody and replaces him with pretty good numbers (and about 15 mill or more cheaper) and then we could use that money on deals like the one we gave to JD a couple of years back, anyone remember the Mags fiasco? i believe we came out on top on that one

[TheBigHurt]

QUOTE(YASNY @ Jan 6, 2007 -> 07:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We've sure got some jaded mofo's on this site.

 

Regarding Mark's performance, sure he had a s***ty 2nd half to '06. But, if you take a discerning look at his overall body of work throughout his career, Mark's been one of the most valueable pitchers in the majors. Except for a couple of bad streaks, he's been as dependable as anyone. Not great. Not the best. But very solid.

 

I for one have never had a problem with Mark being a Cards fan. I understand what it's like to be a fan. I won't comment on those that do have a problem with this. Just wanted to put my position out there.

 

Then you get into the money issue. Well, wake the f*** up folks, it's a business. And for the players, its a finite business. They happened to blessed with a unique ability that in today's society allows them to make millions of dollars. Because of this set of circumstances, they can financially set up their decendants for generations to come. How many of you fathers out there wouldn't love to have that kind of opportunity? Step back and look at the big picture. Whether it hurts your feelings if he leaves for more money is not part of the equation.

 

For the most part, I agree. One of the most sensible posts I've seen in a while.

[witesoxfan]

People want to see if Buehrle will rebound before even contemplating offering him a contract extension, but what has seemingly gone unrealized is that if he does in fact rebound to a 17 win, 3.50 ERA, 1.15 WHIP, 240 IP season, the negotiations start at 6/$96.

 

If he has a bad year...say 12, 5.00, 1.40, 200...and he is probably getting 4/$52. If the Sox were to make such a signing, they'd be investing $52 million into a pitcher who'd put up an ERA of 5.00 two seasons in a row.

 

Bit of a catch-22 this situation is.

[Texsox]

The Sox already have made their starting pitchers the highest salaries on the team behind Kong. 2-6 were the starting rotation. How much more can they go? I don't know. I guess I would rather have 5 Garlands than a Buerhle, Garland, and 3 AAAA. No matter what happens, I think Mark, for a four or five year stretch has been one of the best pitchers I have seen in a Sox uniform. Perfect record in the playoffs and a bonus All-Star win to boot.

 

I've always liked the enthusiasm he brings to the game and his work ethic. Every year you could pencil him in for a 16-8 season and probably be correct. A generation ago, he'd have been a Sox player for life. I thought Frank was going to be the last HoF player to remain with one team for his entire career, so I guess anything could happen.

[Allsox]

It's a good question as to what a fair deal is for Mark if he turns in a typical Buehrle yr in '07 (15 Ws, 3.50 ERA, 220 IP). He certainly doesn't deserve what Zito got (Not sure what is for a guy that works 35 days a yr) but the market for mediocrity was established at 10 mil this offseason and I'm not sure if that'll go down.

 

And since we know the Sox don't pay for a pitcher beyond 3 yrs, I'd start with 3 yrs, 33 mil with performance bonuses that can make the contract worth 38 mil. But I'm sure the Yankees, Red Sox or Texas would be dumb enuff or desperate enuff to go 5 yrs, 75 mil so I don't see Mark being here past '07. If the Sox are tanking, he'll be gone sooner.

[southsider2k5]

It's a good question as to what a fair deal is for Mark if he turns in a typical Buehrle yr in '07 (15 Ws, 3.50 ERA, 220 IP). He certainly doesn't deserve what Zito got (Not sure what is for a guy that works 35 days a yr) but the market for mediocrity was established at 10 mil this offseason and I'm not sure if that'll go down.

 

And since we know the Sox don't pay for a pitcher beyond 3 yrs, I'd start with 3 yrs, 33 mil with performance bonuses that can make the contract worth 38 mil. But I'm sure the Yankees, Red Sox or Texas would be dumb enuff or desperate enuff to go 5 yrs, 75 mil so I don't see Mark being here past '07. If the Sox are tanking, he'll be gone sooner.

 

With today's market, 5/75 isn't even a starting point for a guy like Buehrle unless he has a terrible 07. We are talking about AT LEAST 6/96 if not more years and dollars. And trust me, someone will pay it.

[Controlled Chaos]

I want MB here. I love his work ethic and his do whatever you need me to do attitude. I do think he would give a hometown discount and stay here for a few million less...however, the security is in the years of his contract. The Sox don't give pitchers long term deals which leads me to believe he is gone. I wish MB was the one exception, but I doubt it.

[chiguy79]

I agree with a wait and see approach by the Sox, if MB post a 4.5+ ERA the first half it doesn't make much sense to give him a huge contract, at the same time his trade value diminishes as the season progresses. If we are going to give out huge contracts we might as well try to trade for Santana or Zambrano.

 

I think the current market is off-kilter, the reality is that half of the teams in the league can't even afford to pay their ace $15mm/year.