GASHWOUND Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't wait to hear the lame excuse Jerry the f***er uses on why he took out Colon, that b**** ass motherf***er MANUEL!!!! All the hits Colon gave up were barely hit as it is!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You can't AT LEAST let Colon start the inning and see how he does?!?!?!? He probably could've had a 1-2-3 inning, but we'll never know cause the f*** train of thought was "Ohh, Marte hasn't pitched in a couple days, OH, I have to get him in ths game, DOOHHH" s***!!! You have to let COLON go through that inning!!!! Koch and Gordon were pretty much used up..what, you were gonna pitch Marte goes 2 innings?!?!? Cause I know you weren't bringing in Koch in a 1 run game...s***..I'm rambling f*** JERRY!!!! :fyou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molto Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 not to jump on Manuel's side, but there was growing concern last season and the past few weeks on the arm status of Colon. He was killed in the ninth against the Giants that one start because he supposedly was tired despite a low pitch count. last start, he had a slight shoulder problem. some have been thinking he should be eased up a bit, now that he gets pulled after giving up two singles, people get mad. you could've EASILY of left him in, but pulling him didn't lose us the game. since when is Damaso Marte a bad guy to go to? I also like it how soo many people apparently expect us to win without our pen. whether we like it or not, if we are gonna go anywhere, we need a pen, we can't avoid that by avoiding it. I would've kept him in, but think either way is a good decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 No, the person (You) said his ERA was deceiving. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't -- When you blow 5 games and have a loss or two through first 70 games, I don't care how good your ERA is....the key word is clutch and in department Marte is not the same as he was last year. And I agree with you that Marte blew it...read better next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASHWOUND Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 not to jump on Manuel's side, but there was growing concern last season and the past few weeks on the arm status of Colon. He was killed in the ninth against the Giants that one start because he supposedly was tired despite a low pitch count. last start, he had a slight shoulder problem. some have been thinking he should be eased up a bit, now that he gets pulled after giving up two singles, people get mad. you could've EASILY of left him in, but pulling him didn't lose us the game. since when is Damaso Marte a bad guy to go to? I also like it how soo many people apparently expect us to win without our pen. whether we like it or not, if we are gonna go anywhere, we need a pen, we can't avoid that by avoiding it. I would've kept him in, but think either way is a good decision. Let Colon start the damn inning..if he gets into trouble, then bring in MArte..but our pen was pretty used up...were we gonna pitch Marte 2 innings??? who was gonna close the 9th if mArte had trouble in that inning?? Do we really want Koch out there with a 1 run lead? I would rather have Marte pitch the 9th inning rather than the 8th...Let Colon start the inning and see how he does....Manuel is saying he was a bit tired, but let him try Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 No way. Colon had 3 hits against when taken out. Additionally, the sCrUBS aren't the goddamn Giants. The Giants actually have some talent. Explain to me how taking out a pitcher who was DOMINATING the opposition at the time is a good move before the inning even starts? Just because Colon got rocked against SF he'll get rocked against the sCrUBS? I don't f***ing buy it. JM and Marte f***ed up. Thanks alot guys :fyou Get over it man. Colon just gave up two hits the inning before (albeit not rockets). If Manuel leaves him in and the Cubs score two, you are making this same argument from the other side. Or if you aren't, someone else is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molto Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 yep. although Manuel has made bad moves, this one is not one of them. questionable? yes, but it isn't clear cut. whether Marte or Colon, I liked our chances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 Get over it man. Colon just gave up two hits the inning before (albeit not rockets). If Manuel leaves him in and the Cubs score two, you are making this same argument from the other side. Or if you aren't, someone else is. Amen. Marte and bad luck (Groodzie's blooper after the umps's mistake call? WTF?) aside, this loss is squarely on the shoulders of our once mighty O. Leave Manuel out of it, Colon was far from perfect on pitch-by-pitch basis after the 5th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molto Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 agreed, Colon was pitching good, but far from lights out. and like I said, if we can't trust Marte and the pen to finish this game, then we are never going to go anywhere anyway. Marte hasn't pitched in a few days, and although he's been off of late, he was fresh, while Colon has come off two rough starts: One where he lost it in the ninth and another where he felt shoulder pain, although minimal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GASHWOUND Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 :fyou Asshole! Die of syphillis you stupid, no managing, misusing the BP ALL THE f***ING TIME or NOT USING IT SOON ENOUGH , sleepwalking through a game Colon had no business being taken out of STUPID MOTHERf***ER!!!!! :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou KISS MY ASS IN HELL YOU STUPID SON OF A b****! CUBS SHOULD THANK YOUR NO BUSINESS MANAGING A MLB TEAM ASS FOR THE WIN! STUPID DICKHEAD! :fyou Die of syphillis you stupid hey, how come killa wishes death on manuel and no one says anything, i wish Jerry to get struck by lightning and I get jumped on..I'm being discriminated against I tell ya.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 agreed, Colon was pitching good, but far from lights out. and like I said, if we can't trust Marte and the pen to finish this game, then we are never going to go anywhere anyway. Marte hasn't pitched in a few days, and although he's been off of late, he was fresh, while Colon has come off two rough starts: One where he lost it in the ninth and another where he felt shoulder pain, although minimal. agreed, Colon was pitching good, but far from lights out. If you compare how he was pitching against Ray Durham, Galarraga and Barry Bonds until the 9th versus how he was pitching against Sosa, Alou and Karros today...no comparison, he constantly fell behind and threw a couple of meatballs he is lucky Cubs didn't crush. He had a few tough DPs made behind him, had only one more K than BBs and more than 40% of his pitches were balls. The only difference between a typical Colon start and this is that htis time he managed not to give up a couple of homers. Yes, he was better than Garland and Burly, but I bet Cubs would kick his ass if not in the 8th then in the 9th for sure. It didn't help that Maggs didn't get a good jump on lanek's pop up... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molto Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 I think wishing either upon a person is stupid, especially one you know little about, and it is concerning SPORTS. how can you wish death upon a baseball manager? very classless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 I think wishing either upon a person is stupid, especially one you know little about, and it is concerning SPORTS. how can you wish death upon a baseball manager? very classless. especially considering it wasn't Manuel's fault- he went with his best reliever and he simply didn't get it done against weak hitters. Blame Lee, Maggs, Crede and Jimenez instead. Blame Marte. Blame umps and luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedPinStripes Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 Bottom line is we have a weak bullpen and get pissed off in any close game situation. Marte has been good all year, but has struggled latly. I obviouly didnt like the move partially because i dont trust teh pen after Colon pitched lights out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spiff Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 re: marte's last outing against boston where he went 1 2/3 scoreless. boston hit about four line drives off of him that happened to be caught. i think magglio had a sliding catch, willie had the one up against the wall where he bounced off, and carlos caught one about a foot away from the wall. something is up with damaso but i don't second guess manuel's decision to bring him in. we were up two against the giants late and colon let it slip and manuel caught hell. it's like he's in a no-win situation. marte is supposed to be the setup guy, and today he didn't set up anything but a cubs win. if this game had been against oakland or toronto etc i doubt people would be this upset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 Marte has been good all year, but has struggled latly He had 4 blown saves and a loss coming into this game....if that's good, then what do you call Rocky Biddle? Smoltz? Fooulke? Gagne? If Sox execute at a reasonable rate a serious contender should be expected....we are up 3-0 or 4-0 coming into the 8th inning, it's a totally different game flow and Cubbies are probably shut out. We didn't come through, didn't do the little things....and at the end 1 pop up Maggs couldn't get to, 1 umpiring mistake and 1 less than perfect relay throw were enough to put the bastards on top. Manuel, Colon and even Marte should have never been in yet another do-or-die position...story of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrandoFan Posted June 22, 2003 Share Posted June 22, 2003 re: marte's last outing against boston where he went 1 2/3 scoreless. boston hit about four line drives off of him that happened to be caught. i think magglio had a sliding catch, willie had the one up against the wall where he bounced off, and carlos caught one about a foot away from the wall Good point, last season Marte was a clutch force; this season he has been padding his stats, creating hanging ropes all over the place Rick White-style... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox247 Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 I disagreed with his moves in that SF game, but JM did everything right regarding the bullpen today. I don't care if your starter is throwing a no-hitter, if he tells you that he isnt feeling too well and isnt getting easy outs, you have to take him out for your best reliever. Admit it, if Colon was left in to blow the game, every one of you would be jumping on JM. As clujer said, Marte just plain chocked and our offense was its usual self. JM still should be hanged, but he had nothing to do with this loss. Just one two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 A 1-0 game is nothing to tinker with imo. They couldnt hit s*** off him all day . As soon as Manuel came out, I told Ian and told him this game was f***ed. This was my thought exactly. Colon was out there in the 8th after allowing three infield hits and ending the 7th with a DP. I thought that even if O'Leary was a good hitter against Colon that Bart could take him and at the worse it would have been a runner on and still 1-0 or a tie game. Marte and Koch have been struggling and Colon is our big stud. LET HIM PITCH JERRY, BUT NOOOOOOOOOOOO, JERRY HAS TO TAKE HIM OUT AND LOOK WHAT HAPPENED JERRY. I HAD MY BROOM READY AND NOW ALL I CAN DO IS CLEAN THE FLOOR WITH IT. Oh well, maybe we can sweep the Twins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted June 23, 2003 Share Posted June 23, 2003 I didn't knock JM for leaving Colon in against SF, because I thought that was the right move... and I did not think it was right to remove him against the Cubs. O'Leary was hitting .324 career vs. Colon. BFD... He still gets him out 68% of the time! And if he doesn't, odds are its a single. He could have always pitched around him and maybe walked him.... maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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