FBI admits breaking law for domestic surveillance

[Balta1701]

So, a little summary of this mornin's news. The Patriot Act gave the FBI the ability to use something termed "National Security Letters". Basically, they allow the FBI to take action in the classic "Ticking clock" type scenario; in the event of an emergency, the FBI is allowed to get their hands on phone records, internet records, and so on, without having to go through the process of getting a warrant. Here's a summary of what they do from the WaPo.

A national security letter cannot be used to authorize eavesdropping or to read the contents of e-mail. But it does permit investigators to trace revealing paths through the private affairs of a modern digital citizen. The records it yields describe where a person makes and spends money, with whom he lives and lived before, how much he gambles, what he buys online, what he pawns and borrows, where he travels, how he invests, what he searches for and reads on the Web, and who telephones or e-mails him at home and at work.

Of course, this morning, in something that should have come as a surprise only to people who have been in suspended animation for the last 6+ years...it turns out that the FBI has been misusing the new authority. Issuing NSLs without proper authority, failing to record and report thousands of NSL's to the government, and so forth.

 

Interestingly though, what only a few folks have noticed this morning is that what the FBI has been doing is not only expressly prohibited by the law, it's also exactly what Mr Bush said he would do when he signed the Patriot Act reauthorization a year or so ago. Bush said he'd be willing to defy parts of the law requiring the FBI to report on NSL usage to oversight agencies, and voila, the FBI turns out to be defying those same parts of the law.

 

So, in other words, here we go again.

[Controlled Chaos]

I always feel like...somebodys watching meeee....and I have no privacy.

[southsideirish71]

So, a little summary of this mornin's news. The Patriot Act gave the FBI the ability to use something termed "National Security Letters". Basically, they allow the FBI to take action in the classic "Ticking clock" type scenario; in the event of an emergency, the FBI is allowed to get their hands on phone records, internet records, and so on, without having to go through the process of getting a warrant. Here's a summary of what they do from the WaPo.

Of course, this morning, in something that should have come as a surprise only to people who have been in suspended animation for the last 6+ years...it turns out that the FBI has been misusing the new authority. Issuing NSLs without proper authority, failing to record and report thousands of NSL's to the government, and so forth.

 

Interestingly though, what only a few folks have noticed this morning is that what the FBI has been doing is not only expressly prohibited by the law, it's also exactly what Mr Bush said he would do when he signed the Patriot Act reauthorization a year or so ago. Bush said he'd be willing to defy parts of the law requiring the FBI to report on NSL usage to oversight agencies, and voila, the FBI turns out to be defying those same parts of the law.

 

So, in other words, here we go again.

 

Who cares. Just assume that everything you do electronically is an open book and you are fine. I spend my time assuming that once the traffic leaves my firewall, unless its encrypted its open season. The minute the phone call leaves my PBX the same thing. If you think that your phone conversations are private and privy only to you, then I suggest you never experienced crosstalk where another conversation appears on your line, or you can hear another conversation. The minute you experience spyware such as a trojan or keylogger, you are experiencing the same level of information leakage, infact more than if the FBI is tapping your upstream connection. If you really want to keep something secret, use military grade encryption and memorizes the cipher.

 

OMG THE GOVERNMENT CAN HEAR ME GETTING THE GROCERY LIST FROM THE WIFE. WHERE ARE MY FREEDOMS.

[NorthSideSox72]

Who cares. Just assume that everything you do electronically is an open book and you are fine. I spend my time assuming that once the traffic leaves my firewall, unless its encrypted its open season. The minute the phone call leaves my PBX the same thing. If you think that your phone conversations are private and privy only to you, then I suggest you never experienced crosstalk where another conversation appears on your line, or you can hear another conversation. The minute you experience spyware such as a trojan or keylogger, you are experiencing the same level of information leakage, infact more than if the FBI is tapping your upstream connection. If you really want to keep something secret, use military grade encryption and memorizes the cipher.

 

OMG THE GOVERNMENT CAN HEAR ME GETTING THE GROCERY LIST FROM THE WIFE. WHERE ARE MY FREEDOMS.

Ah yes, the "I have nothing to hide" argument.

 

Whenever I see that, I always think of:

 

When they came for the Communists...

[southsideirish71]

Ah yes, the "I have nothing to hide" argument.

 

Whenever I see that, I always think of:

 

When they came for the Communists...

 

Well when we found a keylogger on one of our main developers machines, we checked and it wasnt the FBI listening in on the conversation. It was the payload of some trojan that he picked up, when visiting a website. The device was sending things back to mainland china to some ISP.

 

Remember, its not just the big bad boogyman FBI agent trying to spy on you. Everyone is so worried about this, when I would be more worried about other countries and individuals that will impact your privacy more than the government ever will.

[Rex Kickass]

I think the problem is that the government is doing this for no good reason. We gave the FBI the right to use it in specific circumstances and the law has simply been ignored.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(Rex Kicka** @ Mar 9, 2007 -> 03:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think the problem is that the government is doing this for no good reason. We gave the FBI the right to use it in specific circumstances and the law has simply been ignored.

I have no faith that our Government is spying on us for 100% good reasons. You just KNOW there's some jealous bastard looking up his ex-wife's new hubby. Even if it's just one case, it's still illegal and morally wrong.

[StrangeSox]

Give government a power and they will surely abuse it. This comes as no surprise at all.

Edited March 11, 2007 by StrangeSox

[NorthSideSox72]

Well when we found a keylogger on one of our main developers machines, we checked and it wasnt the FBI listening in on the conversation. It was the payload of some trojan that he picked up, when visiting a website. The device was sending things back to mainland china to some ISP.

 

Remember, its not just the big bad boogyman FBI agent trying to spy on you. Everyone is so worried about this, when I would be more worried about other countries and individuals that will impact your privacy more than the government ever will.

People with nefarious intent are doing it, so we shouldn't worry about the FBI doing it? I guess I'm concerned with both. One doesn't make the other OK for me. I am sure ultimately that the great majority of spying on data and calls is not governmental, as you point out. But its illegal for NGO's to do it. Why is it OK for the FBI to do it illegally, improperly and/or without just cause?

[kapkomet]

I hope you enjoy the FBI reading all of your posts. I know I do.