maggsmaggs Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 What about Matt LeCroy? seriously, he can hit lefties very well and its not like our pitchers hold runners on anyways, so they were inevitabley gonna steal. Actually, i am being semi-sarcastic, cause he really can't catch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash Tizzle Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 I'm not going to entirely blame Guillen here. I didn't hear anyone questioning Toby Hall at 1B during the inning. What's important is, how much experience has Hall had at 1B? Not just major league AB's, but in general; from the minor leagues through spring training. It he knows how to field the position, Guillen can't be blamed. If he had no idea how to field the position, or the proper technique, and was just going out for extra ABs -- it won't look good for Ozzie. With Dye two years ago at SS, it proves to me he is willing to mix and match. Perhaps without much concern to how they field it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted March 26, 2007 Author Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(wsgdf2 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 01:57 PM) Blaming Ozzie for Hall's injury is ludicrous. yeah, we should blame the other guy who filled out the lineup card. oh wait, that's not possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(Kalapse @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 01:59 PM) Yeah bulls***. If you really think I disagree with every move Guillen has made then you're not reading my posts. I just commended Ozzie for picking Danks as the 5th starter but no, that's completely overlooked right? Yeah I thought so. I was picking more on the theme here than any one person. Anytime something bad happens, there is a 10 page thread with the usual supspects blaming Ozzie for everything in the world up to global warming, with the usual suspects taking up the other side where Ozzie can do no wrong. Its like there can be no middle ground, and it makes for terrible threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ginger Kid Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 I'm a vocal supporter of Ozzie's decisions on Anderson, Pods, Erstad and many other topics, but in this case he f***ed up, and if you don't think so just look at his quotes after yesterday's game -- he was scrambling to cover his ass because he knew it too. Hall could've been a huge spark on days when AJ takes a rest, and a solid bat off the bench late in games and in NL parks. f***!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 07:00 PM) I'm not going to entirely blame Guillen here. I didn't hear anyone questioning Toby Hall at 1B during the inning. What's important is, how much experience has Hall had at 1B? Not just major league AB's, but in general; from the minor leagues through spring training. It he knows how to field the position, Guillen can't be blamed. If he had no idea how to field the position, or the proper technique, and was just going out for extra ABs -- it won't look good for Ozzie. With Dye two years ago at SS, it proves to me he is willing to mix and match. Perhaps without much concern to how they field it. When I was watching him on the first batter Russell faced, I was worried that he pulled something on the awkward stretch that he took. However, I didn't put that in the thread, so I can't quote it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:00 PM) How often does a catcher have to dive for a ball? Thus, is it safe to say that maybe Hall isn't used to having to dive? Now you're just picking. You know darn well that catcher is a position more apt to injuries of various kinds than 1B, and that was my point. And catchers have to move around all over the place in all sorts of awkward ways. Do they dive for ground balls? Obviously not. They do all sorts of other risky things, though. Playing a guy at 1B to see if he can play there, in ST, is not like putting him in traffic. with his hands and feet tied up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maggsmaggs Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 01:58 PM) No, a freak injury (how often does a 1B tear something diving?) lost us an integral part of the team. And he's had more than 2 AB's as a 1B this spring so far, so it seems Ozzie was considering him as a backup plan there. Finding out if he could be useful there is the sort of thing you are supposed to do in ST. I'm as pissed as anyone else he is hurt, but blaming Ozzie just doesn't make any sense. We got like 4 deep b4 Hall at 1st base. Paulie, Mack, Perez, Ozuna. I dont know why Toby ever would have needed to play 1st base. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoSox05 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 (edited) QUOTE(Steve9347 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:00 PM) yeah, we should blame the other guy who filled out the lineup card. oh wait, that's not possible. Maybe he should wrap all his players in bubble wrap so they never get hurt. Its baseball, Its a sport. Players get hurt in all different ways. You cant blame a coach for playing his players. Edited March 26, 2007 by GoSox05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 Looks like Ozzie failed Fathom's #1 rule of managing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo's Drinker Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 better the backup catcher than a starting pitcher...lets no freak out people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(GoSox05 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:04 PM) Maybe should he wrap all his players in bubble wrap so they never get hurt. Its baseball, Its a sport. Players get hurt in all different ways. You cant blame a coach for playing his players. This isn't the X-Box or PS3. Hall would never be used at 1B all season so why throw him out there now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 I'm not an Ozzie guy, but I'm not going to blame him for Hall's injury. Guys actually play first to avoid injury. It was a fluke. At least it happened to the back-up catcher. Personally, I don't think Hall was going to make the huge difference against guys like Sabbathia and Santana. Everyone seems to struggle against them. It is a blow, but not as huge as it would have been if it were a regular or Contreras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 07:03 PM) Now you're just picking. You know darn well that catcher is a position more apt to injuries of various kinds than 1B, and that was my point. And catchers have to move around all over the place in all sorts of awkward ways. Do they dive for ground balls? Obviously not. They do all sorts of other risky things, though. Playing a guy at 1B to see if he can play there, in ST, is not like putting him in traffic. with his hands and feet tied up. I'm not picking at anything. When you have to do something you're not familiar with, you're just increasing your chance at injury. It's similar to how pitchers can never slide when they're forced to run the bases. I was an infielder all my life, but when you go out to take flyballs in the outfield, the style of diving is completely different. When a catcher lunges after a ball, they're not exposing their shoulder to the ground, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 LMAO! Who knew first base was such an incredibly tough postion to play? Seriously, this is all killing me. First we hear about incredibly important Toby Hall is going to be to hitting all of the tough lefties we are going to face. Then when we try to figure out another way to get him into the line up, its the dumbest thing ever, even though we are putting him at the easiest fielding position know to mankind. It was a freak accident. Nothing more, nothing less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IamPabloOzuna Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 out for the season is a stretch, i have a torn labrum myself, and with a solid month to two months of rehab he should be fine. Mark Teahen played a portion of last season with a torn labrum and he was fine, its more of a long term issue that needs to be addressed in the off season. Take Dwyane Wade for example, he is going to just wait for the playoffs to come back but he could definitely come back sooner if he wanted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 07:05 PM) I'm not an Ozzie guy, but I'm not going to blame him for Hall's injury. Guys actually play first to avoid injury. It was a fluke. At least it happened to the back-up catcher. Personally, I don't think Hall was going to make the huge difference against guys like Sabbathia and Santana. Everyone seems to struggle against them. It is a blow, but not as huge as it would have been if it were a regular or Contreras. Who do you want to see as our back-up now? Hopefully they find a way that he can rehab this and only miss a few months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(maggsmaggs @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:03 PM) We got like 4 deep b4 Hall at 1st base. Paulie, Mack, Perez, Ozuna. I dont know why Toby ever would have needed to play 1st base. Unless, as was discussed earlier, Perez doesn't make the team (he still hasn't played since he got hurt, I believe). And Mack can't really hit lefties well. Therefore, he makes sense as an occasional start over there against LHP, if he can defend the position (which I honestly don't know if he can or not). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoSox05 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(BigSqwert @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:05 PM) This isn't the X-Box or PS3. Hall would never be used at 1B all season so why throw him out there now? Because we don't have a 100 % back up first baseman. I think it was worth giving Hall a look at. It sucks he got hurt but im not blaming anyone for it. I'm sure hes not either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 07:06 PM) LMAO! Who knew first base was such an incredibly tough postion to play? Seriously, this is all killing me. First we hear about incredibly important Toby Hall is going to be to hitting all of the tough lefties we are going to face. Then when we try to figure out another way to get him into the line up, its the dumbest thing ever, even though we are putting him at the easiest fielding position know to mankind. It was a freak accident. Nothing more, nothing less. Yep, I can't wait to see Sandy or Wiki face C.C., Johan, and company. Also, first base is not the easiest fielding position. That would be left field....but that's something that doesn't need to be debated right now. I wish someone Tivo'd the game yesterday so they can see how awkward Hall looked at 1B on that first play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSqwert Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(GoSox05 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:08 PM) Because we don't have a 100 % back up first baseman. I think it was worth giving Hall a look at. It sucks he got hurt but im not blaming anyone for it. I'm sure hes not either. Well now we don't have a 100% backup catcher which IMO is more important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 07:07 PM) Unless, as was discussed earlier, Perez doesn't make the team (he still hasn't played since he got hurt, I believe). And Mack can't really hit lefties well. Therefore, he makes sense as an occasional start over there against LHP, if he can defend the position (which I honestly don't know if he can or not). Perez played the last two days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(maggsmaggs @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:03 PM) We got like 4 deep b4 Hall at 1st base. Paulie, Mack, Perez, Ozuna. I dont know why Toby ever would have needed to play 1st base. Erstad should be second actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthSideSox72 Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 QUOTE(fathom @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:07 PM) Who do you want to see as our back-up now? Hopefully they find a way that he can rehab this and only miss a few months. If it is in fact a torn labrum, its a scope and about 3 months of recovery and PT, then some time getting stretched out and back to normal after that. And you can't start throwing really until the end of that 3 month period. Plus it takes some time to get 100% of your strength back. That was my experience anyway. That puts him in minor league rehab in maybe July, and if things go well, back to the team August-ish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlaCWS Posted March 26, 2007 Share Posted March 26, 2007 In no way am I blaming Ozzie for this injury, but I am just curious why we needed to play Hall at 1B when we have about a bunch of utility players (Ozuna, Mackowiack, Perez, even Cintron) who could've filled in for an inning. This hurts because Hall would've been a nice bat off the bench, but at the end of the day the backup catcher is not making or breaking the Sox' season. I can live with Wiki playing once or twice a week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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