Don Cooper

[Wedge]

Lets not panic after two games. Things will look better soon, hopefully.

 

but we're White Sox fans... things never get better!

[CSF]

2 games, and coaches heads are already being called for.

 

Priceless.

[caulfield12]

This guy went from savior to now being on the verge of having his job in jeporady in a matter of a year and a half. Following the 2005 season his name was one of the hottest out there as far as pitching coaches are concerned. I can even recall hearing rumors that the Yankees were trying to get him. Well, last year he deserved some slack because the team was coming off a championship but this year I think there will be very little slack and if this pitching staff continues to struggle into the month of May and June I wouldn't be surprised to see Coop let go. It is hard to fathom a pitching staff that was so solid in '05 look so mediocre last year and potentially BAD this year. What happened? And again not all the blame can be placed on the pitching coach because the players still have to perform but it's never a good sign when your players are performing worse and worse each time out and no longer progressing

 

 

Sure the heat falls on Cooper and Walker before Guillen, how many hitting coaches did the White Sox go through over the last decade?

 

Did it really change the "3 run homer" philosophy of the ballclub that was imprinted in that 2000 season? Did Lee or Valentin ever progress beyond what they were (or were not)?

 

If Contreras doesn't feel 100% right and Garland's shoulder is iffy, there's not much Cooper can do. The main mark he can make with this team is the bullpen, Sisco/Aardsma/Masset.

 

Same thing with Jenks. Cooper can't fix physical problems. Being healthy is the best formula to get solid performance, Darin Erstad being the perfect example.

[Linnwood]

The twins also won by scoring 7 runs without a homer. Scrappy gap to gap hitting. Watch the final out of the sox game. We have men in scoring position, and Crede tries to lift and pull a pitch on the outter half. He is quoted as saying that with the wind he thought it was out. He was going for a dong, and we needed a single or a double. the minute our hitters figure out how to hit a single when we need it instead of trying to hit a 500 foot shot.

 

BINGO!

 

Crede's AB was entirely predictable. Too much reliance on the long ball.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

TEAM A

79-31 3.21 ERA

7-6 4.15 ERA

80-76 4.84 ERA

42-32 4.35 ERA

80-96 4.89 ERA

 

TEAM B

97-66 3.83 ERA

82-68 4.44 ERA

48-28 4.37 ERA

100-105 4.34 ERA

0-0 -- ERA

 

i have listed the starting staffs for two teams above and the career numbers of each member of the staff. team a certainly has a more dominant #1 starter but overall team b seems to have a deeper rotation based on these numbers with the possible expception of the unknown at the #5 starter since he is a rookie. as you have probably already guessed team a is the twins and team b is the sox. you cant tell me on paper that the sox don't have talent and the potential to be a very good starting rotation still. the numbers tell me they can. now all things considered if i had to pick between those staffs based solely on these numbers its a toss-up. so if you are telling me that the twins starting staff outperforms the sox starting staff by a whole run this year then there is certainly something wrong

[Allsox]

The only criticism I have of Coop and the Sox pitching right now is Cle's hitters are too comfortable up at the dish and they're not backing them off with inside pitches. Victor Martinez went 4 - 4 and looked so at ease at the plate he could have gone 6 - 6 if they went into extras.

 

One more thing, stop throwing high fastballs to Sizemore. The two HRs he's hit have come off high cheese so let's hope Buehrle busts him and the Indian lineup inside all day long today.

[GoSox05]

yeah after a 0-2 start he will be fired. Probably in a day or two. You just can't go 0-2. Not in a sport with such a short season.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

yeah after a 0-2 start he will be fired. Probably in a day or two. You just can't go 0-2. Not in a sport with such a short season.

i wish people would actually read the thread before they make comments like these. this whole thread is based off speculation and the assumption that the pitching staff continues on its recent performance (which includes the second half of last year, not just 2 games). it was never stated that he WILL be fired, big difference.

[LVSoxFan]

The twins also won by scoring 7 runs without a homer. Scrappy gap to gap hitting. Watch the final out of the sox game. We have men in scoring position, and Crede tries to lift and pull a pitch on the outter half. He is quoted as saying that with the wind he thought it was out. He was going for a dong, and we needed a single or a double. the minute our hitters figure out how to hit a single when we need it instead of trying to hit a 500 foot shot. We will be okay as a situational team.

 

On our pitching staff, throw strikes. We need to do that. If we throw strike and get ahead we will be fine.

 

You win the thread.

 

You're exactly right about the offense. And yes, Cleveland beat our asses by playing like... the 2005 Chicago White Sox.

 

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

You win the thread.

 

You're exactly right about the offense. And yes, Cleveland beat our asses by playing like... the 2005 Chicago White Sox.

 

come on guys does it really matter how you score the runs? whether its via long ball or slap-happy twins style 7 runs is 7 runs. i agree that the appraoch and lack of exectution at the end of the game was poor from the offensive standpoint but, really, how many times can we expect the offense to cover for crappy pitching? i mean the offense puts us up 3-0 in the first and the next inning we are already down 4-3. then the offense puts us up 7-5 and in a matter of a couple innings we are losing again. at some point in the game the pitching needs to get it done and hold a damn lead. and anybody that thinks the twins offense is a bunch of slap hitting singles and doubles hitters better think again. they have guys that can drive the heck out of the ball and guys like morneau, hunter, and cuddyer come to mind immediately. heck, i think mauer is going to start putting up some decent power numbers too as he gains more experience. i hate the twins as much as any other sox fan, but i respect the hell out of them at the same time

[StrangeSox]

There's a big difference between the consistency of a long-ball or slap-happy offense. A long-ball offense might put up 12 runs one day and spread out 4 hits over the next 2 games. A slap-happy offense is less likely to do that. They will also be better at driving in crucial runs one or two at a time and taking advantage of opportunities. A long-ball club is just going to try and pull everything into the stands and hope that someone managed to get on base ahead of them.

 

 

The slap-happy offense also won't get mowed down by bad pitchers who just go low-and-away the entire game.

[LVSoxFan]

Yes there is a HUGE difference between spreading hits around the lineup and relying on three guys to jack one to save our asses.

 

REMEMBER? This is how we pretty much played first half of 2005. Sure we hit tons of homers but we were not RELIANT on them for offense.

 

If somebody pulls the stats for '04 or second half last year you can see what percentage of our runs came from homers... and that's not what we want.

 

Sure a run is a run, but it's the difference between being a piranha or living on feast-or-famine, which I never want to go back to.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

There's a big difference between the consistency of a long-ball or slap-happy offense. A long-ball offense might put up 12 runs one day and spread out 4 hits over the next 2 games. A slap-happy offense is less likely to do that. They will also be better at driving in crucial runs one or two at a time and taking advantage of opportunities. A long-ball club is just going to try and pull everything into the stands and hope that someone managed to get on base ahead of them.

The slap-happy offense also won't get mowed down by bad pitchers who just go low-and-away the entire game.

that is probably one of the most overrated theories in the game of baseball. just for kicks i went back and compared the twins "slap happy" offense of 2006 and the "long ball" offense of the chicago white sox in 2006. For a quick and dirty evaluation of consistency with a given offense i chose 5 runs as a benchmark. every game that the white sox and twins scored 5 runs or more last year i kept a tally.

 

white sox-85

twins-77

 

so...the white sox scored 5 or more runs in 52.5% of their games while the twins scored 5 or more runs in 47.5% of their games

and AGAIN why did the twins win the division and the white sox finish third? PITCHING and DEFENSE, the two most important aspects of the game of baseball

 

Yes there is a HUGE difference between spreading hits around the lineup and relying on three guys to jack one to save our asses.

 

REMEMBER? This is how we pretty much played first half of 2005. Sure we hit tons of homers but we were not RELIANT on them for offense.

 

If somebody pulls the stats for '04 or second half last year you can see what percentage of our runs came from homers... and that's not what we want.

 

Sure a run is a run, but it's the difference between being a piranha or living on feast-or-famine, which I never want to go back to.

i bet the percentage of runs scored off homers last year was very comparable to the percentage of runs scored off homers in 2005. on top of that we scored alot MORE runs last year compared to 2005. and once again, what was the difference between those two teams?

[StrangeSox]

that is probably one of the most overrated theories in the game of baseball. just for kicks i went back and compared the twins "slap happy" offense of 2006 and the "long ball" offense of the chicago white sox in 2006. For a quick and dirty evaluation of consistency with a given offense i chose 5 runs as a benchmark. every game that the white sox and twins scored 5 runs or more last year i kept a tally.

 

white sox-85

twins-77

 

so...the white sox scored 5 or more runs in 52.5% of their games while the twins scored 5 or more runs in 47.5% of their games

 

 

and AGAIN why did the twins win the division and the white sox finish third? PITCHING and DEFENSE, the two most important aspects of the game of baseball

i bet the percentage of runs scored off homers last year was very comparable to the percentage of runs scored off homers in 2005. on top of that we scored alot MORE runs last year compared to 2005. and once again, what was the difference between those two teams?

 

 

To prove anything, you'd have to do a more complex statistical analysis than that. Standard deviation would be pretty interesting.

 

Yeah, the Sox pitching sucked and that's a big reason. They also didn't have timely hitting and their runs weren't spread out very well.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

Just off the top of my head, what about what he did with Thronton?

like i said yesterday im not quite ready to anoint thornton as a huge success until he has another good year this year. masset looked awesome though and thats great to see he should be a huge bonus to this bullpen.

[witesoxfan]

You're exactly right about the offense. And yes, Cleveland beat our asses by playing like... the 2005 Chicago White Sox.

 

really disagree with that last statement. The won by playing like the 2006 Chicago White Sox - good enough pitching and slugging the hell out of the ball.