Bobby Jenks

[BearSox]

100% effective is the dominance Bobby is capable of. He has the stuff to be a top 3 closer in baseball. As of right now, he'll be a satisfactory closer and not much more. Without that fastball, he loses consistency, and last night is the perfect example of that. He did that multiple times last year too. The Cleveland game rings vividly in my mind - wasn't it like 4 straight doubles or something ridiculous like that?

 

With a fastball around 89-92, he'll be bad, with no further explanation really needed

With a fastball around 92-95, he'll be 3.50, 1.30, and a good K rate

With a fastball around 94-97, he'll be 2.70, 1.15, and a great K rate

With a fastball around 96-100, he'll be almost untouchable, only being hit on fastballs left low in the zone.

 

That last line is 100%, and that's pretty much what he was down the stretch in 2005. A pitch Boone hit that year was a fastball low (though I seem to recall Vizcaino having a good piece of hitting on the fastball up in game 2).

I pretty much agree with this whole post, except if he is only hitting 92-95, I think he will be more around a 4-4.5 ERA

[caulfield12]

I pretty much agree with this whole post, except if he is only hitting 92-95, I think he will be more around a 4-4.5 ERA

 

A veteran National League scout said Jenks' fastball topped out Tuesday at 95 m.p.h., a 2 m.p.h. increase from two weeks ago.

 

Jenks said his pitch selection was much better than Tuesday's. He got Mike Piazza on a grounder to start the ninth inning, then struck out Eric Chavez and Mark Ellis.

 

"Once I go to bed at night, I'm done being [upset]," Jenks said. "Today is a new day. That's the way I've looked at it since I've been in this role."

 

from chicagosports.com

[RockRaines]

Yeah, I realize Jenks has better stuff. He also has a screw in his elbow, and a more violent delivery.

 

Without a good fastball - ie 94-97 - Jenks will never be 100% effective, regardless of secondary stuff.

Ah, so now its not his stuff, its his elbow.

 

 

The guy is a top closer. His stuff is electric, and he will build up to the mid to high 90's. With that cutter and curve he will be sub 3 no problem

[caulfield12]

Ah, so now its not his stuff, its his elbow.

The guy is a top closer. His stuff is electric, and he will build up to the mid to high 90's. With that cutter and curve he will be sub 3 no problem

 

I think anything below 3.25 is VERY ambitious for Jenks, unless he gets his velocity back up.

[witesoxfan]

Ah, so now its not his stuff, its his elbow.

The guy is a top closer. His stuff is electric, and he will build up to the mid to high 90's. With that cutter and curve he will be sub 3 no problem

 

......?

 

His fastball is not hitting 96-100. It's not hitting 94-97. It might touch 95 occasionally, but he's sitting at 90-93 right now. That's the concern with Bobby right now, and that elbow, along with the shoulder tightness and hip problems he's had, are a major red flag. That's how the elbow relates.

 

And I really don't know how you know that velocity will come back. I recall him hitting mid to high 90s already at this point in the year last year, and every other reliever in the pen seems to have their velocity at 100%. Why doesn't Bobby? How is that not worrisome in the least?

 

Bobby, like every other reliever in the Sox pen, along with every other consistently good reliever in the majors, are successful because of their fastball. If his fastball is 5 MPH slower than it was last year, he is going to get rocked because he is going to rely too heavily upon his breaking stuff, and even his breaking stuff - as good as it is - will be hit eventually because no pitcher can rely entirely upon secondary pitches to be successful. You saw that in last night's game.

 

Point blank, Bobby without his fastball will be a mediocre to bad closer. The second half of last year is a perfect example. I just hope that hoping comes through and Bobby's velocity does indeed get back up to the 96-100 range, because if not, he's not a dominant closer, and he's not the best reliever on the Sox.

[caulfield12]

......?

 

His fastball is not hitting 96-100. It's not hitting 94-97. It might touch 95 occasionally, but he's sitting at 90-93 right now. That's the concern with Bobby right now, and that elbow, along with the shoulder tightness and hip problems he's had, are a major red flag. That's how the elbow relates.

 

And I really don't know how you know that velocity will come back. I recall him hitting mid to high 90s already at this point in the year last year, and every other reliever in the pen seems to have their velocity at 100%. Why doesn't Bobby? How is that not worrisome in the least?

 

Bobby, like every other reliever in the Sox pen, along with every other consistently good reliever in the majors, are successful because of their fastball. If his fastball is 5 MPH slower than it was last year, he is going to get rocked because he is going to rely too heavily upon his breaking stuff, and even his breaking stuff - as good as it is - will be hit eventually because no pitcher can rely entirely upon secondary pitches to be successful. You saw that in last night's game.

 

Point blank, Bobby without his fastball will be a mediocre to bad closer. The second half of last year is a perfect example. I just hope that hoping comes through and Bobby's velocity does indeed get back up to the 96-100 range, because if not, he's not a dominant closer, and he's not the best reliever on the Sox.

 

Takatsu got away with being a non-fastball closer for awhile, but it didn't last.

 

Doug Jones and Trevor Hoffman also come to mind, although Jones does throw in the lower 90's.

 

But it's a rarity.

[SoxAce]

I recall him hitting mid to high 90s already at this point in the year last year

 

I don't.

[witesoxfan]

I don't.

 

He better as hell be able to hit 99 in a month then.

[badatbest]

I have no data to support this but i seem to recall his fastball being disapointingly slow in the first month last year. It seemed to improve slowly over that first month and reach top form in mid-May.

 

Could be making this up. Thats what i remember though.

[witesoxfan]

I have no data to support this but i seem to recall his fastball being disapointingly slow in the first month last year. It seemed to improve slowly over that first month and reach top form in mid-May.

 

Could be making this up. Thats what i remember though.

 

It's a possibility, and my memory has been shady before. However, he hit 99 on the gun on May 14 against the Twins last year, which is why I said he has to be there in a month.

 

And if it isn't there on back to back days, it isn't there and Ozzie needs to figure that out. That really appears to be the case, so hint to Ozzie, don't pitch him back to back days in extreme close games; or, if he does, have an option ready during the second game in a row. Jenks really shouldn't have been in the game to face Chavez last night, but I won't complain because I wouldn't have taken him out either and I wasn't suggesting it. Really, the best choice would have been going to Thornton right there, but that's hindsight.

 

I didn't see the game today, but I heard he didn't look good again today, and you can't just go by the box score, so I don't really know.

 

Really, all I'm saying is that Jenks without his velocity is mediocre, and with it he's dominant. This lack of velocity is scary, and I'm not sure there's a solution that will provide a great solution. His velocity has never been consistent throughout the course of the year, so I'm not sure starting him early will even do the trick.

[Kalapse]

I recall him hitting mid to high 90s already at this point in the year last year,

I checked the MLB.tv archives and according to Comcast's gun from April 10th/12th of last season vs Detroit, Bobby was sitting at 96-97 MPH so yeah at this time last year Bobby did have his good velocity.

[witesoxfan]

I checked the MLB.tv archives and according to Comcast's gun from April 10th/12th of last season vs Detroit, Bobby was sitting at 96-97 MPH so yeah at this time last year Bobby did have his good velocity.

 

thxmch, that helps my memory. I was trying to find it, but the earliest I found was that May 14th game.

 

His velocity does take a hit when he pitches back to back days, but if he's in the 90-93 range come May, I get concerned, and all Sox fans should too.

[caulfield12]

thxmch, that helps my memory. I was trying to find it, but the earliest I found was that May 14th game.

 

His velocity does take a hit when he pitches back to back days, but if he's in the 90-93 range come May, I get concerned, and all Sox fans should too.

 

"He pitched good; it's just his velocity is not there," said Guillen, who admitted he's worried about his closer. "I want to know if we're overusing him or if it's just not there."

 

At least we have no shortage of candidates.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if they even considered Adam Russell converting just for this season, but that would be a last-ditch, desperation move....and they would go to MacDougal, Thornton, Masset and Aardsma first. A lot of people have really been impressed with Aardsma, and it appears his velocity is increasing a little each week.

 

I don't see Sisco getting any serious consideration with all of his control issues and erratic performance.

 

Boone Logan and Dewon Day would be others in the mix right now. The biggest thing is we don't need to go out like the Reds last year and make a desperation move for a closer or set-up guy.

Edited April 14, 2007 by caulfield12

[JohnCangelosi]

That last line is 100%, and that's pretty much what he was down the stretch in 2005. A pitch Boone hit that year was a fastball low (though I seem to recall Vizcaino having a good piece of hitting on the fastball up in game 2).

Vizcaino's hit was a LOW fastball (below the belt) that's the only way he got to it in game 2...this is what concerns me is his belt high heater is now a hittable pitch where before there was no chance...

[BigSqwert]

His save appearances are becoming Todd Jones-like in nature.

[elrockinMT]

I see today that even Ozzie is expressing some concern. If you are the closer you need to be able to shut the door and I don't see the consistency from Jenks in fact its his inconsistency that is too visible.

[whitesoxfan101]

He's obviously just lost it. Gave up a soft single on a 1-2 count to blow a save in a place where we are so awesome normally like Oakland, a mere 6 for 7 overall in saves, struck out Sheffield with a man on 3rd 2 outs last night.....get rid of him. If he can't hit 100 every pitch, he can't get people out.

 

Ok, back to reality. This is now the 2nd straight year everybody panicked about Bobby coming out of spring traning due to velocity. When he saves 40 plus again this year, will anybody besides me and a few others around here trust him coming out of camp next year, or must he throw 100 every pitch?

[BearSox]

what was Bobby throwing today according to the WGN gun today? I forgot to check.

[whitesoxfan101]

what was Bobby throwing today according to the WGN gun today? I forgot to check.

 

The guns on all 3 affiliates that broadcast Sox games are way off, which is part of why the panic over Bobby's velocity was silly. For instance, the gun never registed Zumaya over 99 today, and Hawk alone mentioned 3 pitches measured between 100-102 in the park that Zumaya threw.

[BearSox]

The guns on all 3 affiliates that broadcast Sox games are way off, which is part of why the panic over Bobby's velocity was silly. For instance, the gun never registed Zumaya over 99 today, and Hawk alone mentioned 3 pitches measured between 100-102 in the park that Zumaya threw.

I know. The guns seem to me to be 2-3 mph for the Sox games, and I would like to hear what the gun was saying Bobby was throwing, so I could add the difference.

[whitesoxfan101]

I know. The guns seem to me to be 2-3 mph for the Sox games, and I would like to hear what the gun was saying Bobby was throwing, so I could add the difference.

 

Yeah, I'm going to chart the pitch speed in the park at the game I go to coming up, tivo the game, and see what the difference is (since i'm a nerd, lol). I'll report my findings on here when I do so.

[witesoxfan]

He's obviously just lost it. Gave up a soft single on a 1-2 count to blow a save in a place where we are so awesome normally like Oakland, a mere 6 for 7 overall in saves, struck out Sheffield with a man on 3rd 2 outs last night.....get rid of him. If he can't hit 100 every pitch, he can't get people out.

 

Ok, back to reality. This is now the 2nd straight year everybody panicked about Bobby coming out of spring traning due to velocity. When he saves 40 plus again this year, will anybody besides me and a few others around here trust him coming out of camp next year, or must he throw 100 every pitch?

 

I still want to see how he handles the workload over the entire year. That is what killed his numbers on the year last year. A 5.72 ERA, 1.80 WHIP, BB/9 of 5.7 in the second half will not breed confidence.

[WCSox]

He's obviously just lost it. Gave up a soft single on a 1-2 count to blow a save in a place where we are so awesome normally like Oakland, a mere 6 for 7 overall in saves, struck out Sheffield with a man on 3rd 2 outs last night.....get rid of him. If he can't hit 100 every pitch, he can't get people out.

 

I don't agree with that. Bobby would be successful throwing 94-95 and being able to locate a mid-80's hook. Maybe not dominant, but still pretty good. He's getting hit now because he can't locate his offspeed stuff and the opposition are sitting on a hittable mid-90s fastball, not because he isn't throwing 99-100.

[BearSox]

I don't agree with that. Bobby would be successful throwing 94-95 and being able to locate a mid-80's hook. Maybe not dominant, but still pretty good. He's getting hit now because he can't locate his offspeed stuff and the opposition are sitting on a hittable mid-90s fastball, not because he isn't throwing 99-100.

You really underestimate how much better your breaking stuff can be if you can throw 100 consistantly, even if you have some bad location.

[witesoxfan]

I don't agree with that. Bobby would be successful throwing 94-95 and being able to locate a mid-80's hook. Maybe not dominant, but still pretty good. He's getting hit now because he can't locate his offspeed stuff and the opposition are sitting on a hittable mid-90s fastball, not because he isn't throwing 99-100.

 

He was being sarcastic as hell