DEM Primaries/Candidates thread

[mr_genius]

Watched the CNN debate last night. Hillary Clinton really bothers me.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Watched the CNN debate last night. Hillary Clinton really bothers me.

read my previous post. it pretty much sums up my opinions on her.

[mr_genius]

read my previous post. it pretty much sums up my opinions on her.

 

I read it and agree with you. She is the scummiest politician I've ever seen.

[kapkomet]

I read it and agree with you. She is the scummiest politician I've ever seen.

Yet, Democrats love her (or him, which bothers me even more because HE is not running for president, but he is, f***ing end around motherf***ers). I don't get it.

[BigSqwert]

Yet, Democrats love her (or him, which bothers me even more because HE is not running for president, but he is, f***ing end around motherf***ers). I don't get it.

Half of the Dems love her. The other half despises her. She epitomizes the word polarizing.

[Balta1701]

Half of the Dems love her. The other half despises her. She epitomizes the word polarizing.

It's actually slightly less than half, if you pay attention to polling data and votes. Something like 40%.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Clinton says Obama 'looking for a fight'

Wait? OBAMA is the one looking for a fight? If I remember right, the Clinton's started it with this whole Regan thiung and casually dropping the "drug us stuff".

[southsider2k5]

It's actually slightly less than half, if you pay attention to polling data and votes. Something like 40%.

Which one? Like or dislike?

[NorthSideSox72]

Edwards will have "secret" meetings with both candidates before this is over. He knows, as has been noted, that there is a good chance he goes to Denver and gets to choose the nominee. I'm betting he is shopping is options.

 

And having watched a few bits and pieces, I agree that Edwards was the clear winner of that debate the other night. Clinton looked the worst, and the audience reactions made that clear. Clinton is probably going to get hammered in SC, which means Obama will have a lead in earned delegates, and big mo going into Super Tuesday. Edwards will probably take some votes away from both as well, and make it clear he is still part of the race - all the better for Obama's hopes to stay in it.

 

[HuskyCaucasian]

Clinton looked the worst, and the audience reactions made that clear. Clinton is probably going to get hammered in SC, which means Obama will have a lead in earned delegates, and big mo going into Super Tuesday. Edwards will probably take some votes away from both as well, and make it clear he is still part of the race - all the better for Obama's hopes to stay in it.

I coudn't really tell if they were booing her or him. and I wasnt sure if a couple of those were boos or "ooooo"s.

I THOUGHT they were booing here, but i thought maybe that was wishful thinking.

[NorthSideSox72]

I coudn't really tell if they were booing her or him. and I wasnt sure if a couple of those were boos or "ooooo"s.

I THOUGHT they were booing here, but i thought maybe that was wishful thinking.

Caveat: I have only seen one long clip and a few soundbytes - I plan to watch the rest later from the web.

 

But what I saw, they were booing Hillary pretty clearly.

 

[HuskyCaucasian]

Which one? Like or dislike?

This was from late December...

http://www.iwf.org/iwfmedia/show/19981.html

The poll conducted by The Washington Times and Rasmussen Reports finds that 40 percent of Americans say they would vote to keep Senator Clinton (D-New York) from winning the presidency. More than half of the adult men younger than 40 surveyed said they would use their vote to keep the former first lady from returning to the White House. Pollster Scott Rasmussen tells Reuters that Mrs. Clinton is better known than any other presidential candidate -- and that she has "a lot of people who love her and a lot of people who hate her."

[BigSqwert]

But what I saw, they were booing Hillary pretty clearly.

You are correct. SC may be a lopsided loss for her.

[southsider2k5]

You are correct. SC may be a lopsided loss for her.

 

If the stories about half of the voters being black, black voters favoring Obama by and 80-20 margin, and white voters favoring Clinton by a 60-40 margin, are all true, Obama is going to kick Hillary's ass in SC.

[Reddy]

Agreed. He adds nothing to the campaign for the general election. Couldn't win his home state in 2004.

 

people don't vote for VP candidates, it's been well documented.

 

plus, even if they did, Kerry didn't LET John speak his mind, he didn't want to lose the limelight to the more dynamic personality that was John Edwards

[NorthSideSox72]

I got a letter from Bill Richardson about his endorsement...

 

Dear Matt,

 

These last couple of weeks have been blessedly peaceful.

 

After living inside the tornado of a presidential campaign for 11 months, it has been so good to get back to New Mexico and the business of running this wonderful state I call home.

 

I've had a lot of calls from the media asking me which of the remaining Democratic candidates I'm going to endorse. And I thought you should be the first to hear my answer.

 

I'm not endorsing any of them -- at least not for now.

 

But I am endorsing the issues and priorities that were first raised by my campaign and which are now an accepted part of the discussion.

 

Watching the candidates debate in South Carolina last night, I couldn't help but be struck by how much their positions have come around to the positions that you and I hold dear.

 

It is now clear that ending this war and bringing our troops home will be a priority for any Democratic President. As will energy independence and universal health care -- issues we led the way on here in New Mexico.

 

And now all of them are talking about improving education and providing scholarships for public service.

 

It was like I was still in the debate!

 

So while we may not have been successful in electing me the Democratic candidate for President, we were very successful in influencing the Democratic platform in important ways.

 

I'm proud of that accomplishment. And you should be, too.

 

There's one last issue I still need your help on before I can officially end my presidential bid. Right now we still have an outstanding debt.

 

We spent that money in those last few frenzied weeks in Iowa and New Hampshire trying to capitalize on the fluid poll numbers. Given how high the stakes were, I'm sure we would do the same thing given the same situation again.

 

Will you please make one final contribution to my campaign so we can officially "zero out" that debt?

 

I recognize that it's a hard thing to do with the nomination no longer on the line. But I believe it is essential that the final act of our campaign is to meet every outstanding obligation.

 

And let me tell you one last time just how much your support has meant to me. Backing a presidential candidate is a serious, thoughtful act. And knowing that you considered all your options and chose me makes me very proud.

 

Thank you once again.

 

All the best,

 

Bill

 

Now, as time goes by, his endorsement means less and less. So the one thing I think can be said with fairly high confidence is that none of the remaining three have offered him a guaranteed spot that he wants. Other than that, it could mean a lot of things - could be he is soliciting offers, could be he is setting up for Domenici's Senate seat and wants to endorse only the winner, could be he has multiple offers on the table... hard to tell.

 

[NorthSideSox72]

And, I got a note from JFKerry - going after Clinton's tactics...

 

Dear Matthew,

 

I support Barack Obama because he doesn't seek to perfect the politics of Swiftboating -- he seeks to end it.

 

This is personal for me, and for a whole lot of Americans who lived through the 2004 election.

 

As a veteran, it disgusts me that the Swift Boats we loved while we were in uniform on the Mekong Delta have been rendered, in Karl Rove's twisted politics, an ugly verb meaning to lie about someone's character just to win an election. But as someone who cares about winning this election and changing the country I love, I know it's not enough to complain about a past we can't change when our challenge is to win the future -- which is why we must stop the Swiftboating, stop the push-polling, stop the front groups, and stop the email chain smears.

 

The truth matters, but how you fight the lies matters even more. We must be determined never again to lose any election to a lie.

 

This year, the attacks are already starting. Some of you may have heard about the disgusting lies about Barack Obama that are being circulated by email. These attacks smear Barack's Christian faith and deep patriotism, and they distort his record of more than two decades of public service. They are nothing short of "Swiftboat" style anonymous attacks.

 

These are the same tactics the right has used again and again, and as we've learned, these attacks, no matter how bogus, can spread and take root if they go unchecked.

 

But not this time -- we're fighting back.

 

And when I say "we," I mean that literally. I know Barack is committed to fighting every smear every time. He'll fight hard and stand up for the truth. But he can't do it alone.

 

We need you to email the truth to your address books. Print it out and post it at work. Talk to your neighbors. Call your local radio station. Write a letter to the editor. If lies can be spread virally, let's prove to the cynics that the truth can be every bit as persuasive as it is powerful.

 

The Obama campaign has created a place where you can find the truth you'll need to push back on these smears and a way to spread the truth to all of your address book.

 

Take action here:

 

http://my.barackobama.com/factcheckaction

 

So when your inbox fills up with trash and the emails of smear and fear, find the facts, and help defeat the lies.

 

Barack Obama is committed to bringing our country together to meet the challenges we face, but he knows that power gives up nothing without a struggle -- and to win the chance to change America, we must first defeat the hateful tactics that have been used to tear us apart for too long.

 

With your help, we can turn the page on an era of small, divisive politics -- but only if next time you hear these attacks on Barack, you take action immediately:

 

http://my.barackobama.com/factcheckaction

 

The fight is just heating up -- we won't let them steal this election with lies and distortions.

 

Thank you,

 

John Kerry

 

 

[Balta1701]

And, I got a note from JFKerry - going after Clinton's tactics...

I got a rock...

 

(Well, that and I got a much more useful poll of the prize, California:)

1/14-20. Likely voters. MoE 5/2%. (December 2007)

 

Clinton: 39 (36)

Obama: 27 (22)

Edwards 10 (13)

Others: 4 (9)

Undecided 20 (20)

 

Clinton’s lead is largest among women, Latinos, lower income voters, non-college graduates, and seniors. Conversely, Obama is preferred among blacks, college graduates and Democratic primary voters with household incomes of $80,000 or more. Clinton and Obama run about even among men, liberals, and white non-Hispanics.

 

Both of the leading candidates are viewed by likely Democratic primary voters in a very positive light. Yet, Clinton is perceived by voters as holding a big advantage over Obama as being the candidate with the right experience and who has the best chance of winning in the November general election. Obama, on the other hand, is viewed by more voters as being the candidate who best represents change.

 

Clinton voters are much more likely to consider jobs/the economy as being the most important issue to them when deciding whom to support for President. By contrast, Obama supporters are more likely to view the war in Iraq and foreign policy as their top concerns.

[NorthSideSox72]

I got a rock...

 

(Well, that and I got a much more useful poll of the prize, California:)

So Hillary's lead in CA is down a bit, but not much. But that 20% undecided is interesting.

 

I wonder how SC and the press with it will effect that 20%. Or the debates in CA coming up later this month.

 

[HuskyCaucasian]

And, I got a note from JFKerry - going after Clinton's tactics...

You beat me to it! I just got it as well.

[Balta1701]

So Hillary's lead in CA is down a bit, but not much. But that 20% undecided is interesting.

 

I wonder how SC and the press with it will effect that 20%. Or the debates in CA coming up later this month.

Clinton needs to make a big mistake for it to matter, IMO. Like blaming all the wars in the world on the Jews, or something like that.

[HuskyCaucasian]

And, I got a note from JFKerry - going after Clinton's tactics...

I know expect Kerry to be the Obama attack dog now. He'll take on Clinton... Bill that is.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Clinton needs to make a big mistake for it to matter, IMO. Like blaming all the wars in the world on the Jews, or something like that.

what is it with you and the jews?

[HuskyCaucasian]

So Hillary's lead in CA is down a bit, but not much. But that 20% undecided is interesting.

 

I wonder how SC and the press with it will effect that 20%. Or the debates in CA coming up later this month.

Winning SC is a "publicity momentum" boost for Obama. THat paired with a good debate COULD give Obama a slight boost to at least keep it real close.

[Reddy]

Winning SC is a "publicity momentum" boost for Obama. THat paired with a good debate COULD give Obama a slight boost to at least keep it real close.

 

i do agree that clinton had it much more in the bag until last night - with record ratings (5 million viewers) she may have hurt herself a lot.

 

BUT

 

she wasn't trying to win SC last night - She was trying to win nationally - she was trying to get a boost in the Feb. 5 states. She's essentially conceded SC but knows she could kick some ass on Super Tuesday so THATS what she's going for. Why else would she be in NJ today?