Where are all you Erstad haters now?

[Y2HH]

I'm with Tex.

 

I'm a Sox fan first and foremost. I won't let my feelings towards one particular player supercede my hopes for the team. That means even if Mr. Prancer himself is getting the job done, I would be first in line to congratulate him, despite how I feel about his place on this team.

 

Erstad has had a good day or 2, lets not annoit him the Savior that Ozzie sees him as quite yet.

 

Savior, no...but Anderson isn't the savior everyone is making him out to be, either. I've liked what I've seen of this team as a "whole" the last week, so hopefully they can keep it up. I don't care who is in the starting lineup, whether that be Anderson or Erstad or Ozuna...whoever it is, I hope they play well.

[Texsox]

The Cubs can market some guy to the point that Cub fans love him (Shawn-O-Meter) regardless of performance. Cub fans will slurp it up.

 

Try that same stuff with Sox fans and we'll tell the guy to take a hike. We know silk from a sows ear. So Oz, tell us he's the best you got, tell us he'll come around, but don't, for the love of exploding scoreboards, try to convince us he's Ricky Henderson and important to the team.

[Controlled Chaos]

Wow only took 19 games for you to be able to make this thread.

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(Capn12 @ Apr 25, 2007 -> 07:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm with Tex.

 

I'm a Sox fan first and foremost. I won't let my feelings towards one particular player supercede my hopes for the team. That means even if Mr. Prancer himself is getting the job done, I would be first in line to congratulate him, despite how I feel about his place on this team.

 

Erstad has had a good day or 2, lets not annoit him the Savior that Ozzie sees him as quite yet.

 

 

 

He has been hitting the ball well for about a week - week and a half. The line drives were at people in the beginning but now they are becoming hits. Plus he plays a very good CF. What is not to like about this guy? Just because some people here have a love affair with Brian Anderson it seems that Erstad can do nothing right.

 

 

 

QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Apr 25, 2007 -> 08:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow only took 19 games for you to be able to make this thread.

 

How long did it take for Anderson last year?

[alk3kevin]

Erstad is still terrible on the season. Nice to see him play well, but Anderson needs AB right now and he needs them in CF. Erstad sorely needs to not get 600 PA so we're not paying six million for a lot of grindouts.

 

And Caulfield, this is not little league. We do not need to "set an example" for other players. Also, wasting outs early in games is f***ing stupid. Save that bulls***, overmanaging, "fundamentally sound" baseball for late innings. Doing it early will kill a team, especially ours. We're built for the longball, so we need guys who can actually get on base, not guys who grindout to the right side.

[AddisonStSox]

Brian Anderson's approach at the plate looked pretty good to me last night.

 

I love how major league hitters watch a straight-as-an-arrow fastball strike three go right down Broadway.

 

As Steve Stone has said, someone I trust a whole hell of a lot more than some of the fan-boys here, the problem with Brian Anderson is that, he not only gets beat on breaking pitches (which he could not hit to save his own mother), but, he also gets beat on the fastball--which, as Stone correctly asserted, is inexcusable for a major league ball player.

 

Oh, s***, this is a Darin Erstad thread--disregard this post.

 

Oops.

 

Maybe all he needs is a chance to play...

Edited April 25, 2007 by AddisonStSox

[NorthSideSox72]

Let's see. Even after today, here is a guy with an embarrasing .278 OBP, and he is our leadoff hitter. And oh yeah, he was the DESIGNATED FREAKIN' HITTER last night with his horrible numbers.

 

So to answer your questions, we're still here, and Erstad is still a joke to be starting on this ballclub. Now, if he is putting up solid leadoff hitter numbers (OBP of, say, .350) with decent defense (and is still healthy) around July, then I will gladly eat crow. But as of now, he can't even see a .300 OBP.

[caulfield12]

Erstad is still terrible on the season. Nice to see him play well, but Anderson needs AB right now and he needs them in CF. Erstad sorely needs to not get 600 PA so we're not paying six million for a lot of grindouts.

 

And Caulfield, this is not little league. We do not need to "set an example" for other players. Also, wasting outs early in games is f***ing stupid. Save that bulls***, overmanaging, "fundamentally sound" baseball for late innings. Doing it early will kill a team, especially ours. We're built for the longball, so we need guys who can actually get on base, not guys who grindout to the right side.

 

And so is Crede and AJ.

 

Since we advanced and scored runners less effectively than a Little League team in July, August and September, why do you think Ozzie sent them to "boot camp" and placed even more emphasis on it this spring?

 

You can trade Mauer, Morneau, Cuddyer and Hunter for Thome, Konerko, Dye and Crede without any distinguishable difference. Of course, most would rather have the Twins' players because they are younger and cheaper, but, statistically, pretty similar in terms of average, homers and RBI's produced.

 

We simply need to get better execution from Iguchi, Mackowiak/Ozuna, Uribe, AJ and CF. And you've seen some signs of that in the last week or so. Iguchi's hitting to the right side (twice last night) to advance Erstad. Uribe's coming through with a runner on 3rd and less than 2 outs. Even Paulie is 6 for 8 in getting the runner home from 3rd with less than 2 outs. AJ hit a double to the opposite field. Anderson hit a single through the middle.

 

Why do you think Ozzie plays Erstad? Simply to get revenge on BA, at the expense of the rest of the ballclub? That's ridiculous. Ozzie has given every pitcher a chance in big situations, and he's always been that way...this philosophy with new and younger pitchers dates back to Marte and continues through Logan and Aardsma and Masset in the late innings Sunday. If you can consistently get the job done, then you have a place in the line-up.

 

BA has made errors in two consecutive games...one a mental one on Inge's ball Sunday, the other a physical error last night when the inning was falling apart on our relievers and we needed to keep the score tied. It's fine that he actually took a decent approach and hit a solid single up the middle, but he looks like Uribe up there usually, without the more consistent pop in his bat. Right now, his main responsibility is defense, and he's 0 for 2 in that category. With Pods out until at least June, it doesn't look like there's going to be an immediate move to send him down though, where he can play everyday and get a more positive mindset playing alongside Fields, Sweeney, Rogowski, Owens, etc.

 

Let's see. Even after today, here is a guy with an embarrasing .278 OBP, and he is our leadoff hitter. And oh yeah, he was the DESIGNATED FREAKIN' HITTER last night with his horrible numbers.

 

So to answer your questions, we're still here, and Erstad is still a joke to be starting on this ballclub. Now, if he is putting up solid leadoff hitter numbers (OBP of, say, .350) with decent defense (and is still healthy) around July, then I will gladly eat crow. But as of now, he can't even see a .300 OBP.

 

 

Erstad has a career BA of .299 as a leadoff hitter. If his OBP isn't .300 by June 1st, then by all means, play Anderson/Terrero everyday and-or make a trade.

 

The problem with that is that starting Mackowiak/Ozuna in the leadoff spot isn't exactly a great option either. Past history tells us that Erstad has been the most successful in that role of all the players on our team. Unless you want to gamble by bringing up Owens and putting him in CF, where he's not suited to play, just so we have a leadoff hitter to replace Erstad?

 

He's batting .300 with a .344 OBP this year as the leadoff hitter.

 

From 2004-2006 (including the injury-plagued 2006), he's still at .278 with a .330 OBP. Pods was at .351 in 2005 and .330 last year in terms of OBP. If Ozzie wants him to lead off, that's good enough for me.

 

Let's see. Even after today, here is a guy with an embarrasing .278 OBP, and he is our leadoff hitter. And oh yeah, he was the DESIGNATED FREAKIN' HITTER last night with his horrible numbers.

 

So to answer your questions, we're still here, and Erstad is still a joke to be starting on this ballclub. Now, if he is putting up solid leadoff hitter numbers (OBP of, say, .350) with decent defense (and is still healthy) around July, then I will gladly eat crow. But as of now, he can't even see a .300 OBP.

 

 

Who should have been the DH with Thome out due to injury and Mack already in LF against a RH pitcher?

 

Alex Cintron? That was the choice Ozzie had, and I don't think Cintron's 100% yet (fielding or hitting) since that surgery or Ozzie would be playing him more.

[RockRaines]

The jury's still out in my world on Darin Erstad. Nice game last night but one good game in the last two weeks still isn't cutting it.

So far this season.

 

Batting as a leadoff man:

 

.300 .344OBP

[RME JICO]

So far this season.

 

Batting as a leadoff man:

 

.300 .344OBP

He is much better in leadoff and leads the team in sacrifices and SBs.

 

Also, he is batting .333 with a +.370 OBP over the last week. Hopefully he continues his improved hitting. Lately he seems to be making better solid contact compared to all those earlier dribblers to 2B.

Edited April 25, 2007 by RME JICO

[alk3kevin]

How about how he hits in the two hole? Leadoff or second he is still in front of the big guys and needs to get the f***ing job done.

 

And Caulfield, please tell me what makes Ozzie so infallible. If Ozzie wants Erstad to leadoff, it is NOT fine for me. You don't put a terrible hitter in position to get the most AB.

[caulfield12]

The jury's still out in my world on Darin Erstad. Nice game last night but one good game in the last two weeks still isn't cutting it.

 

 

If Anderson had 3 hits in a SINGLE game (like the game DE had against the Tigers), of ANY variety, half of this website would be clamoring for him to be reinstalled as the starter for the rest of the season...Erstad isn't a great player (by the way, you don't get drafted first overall without having some skills), but he is a GREAT fit for this team and the mindset Ozzie is trying to instill or inculcate in this ballclub.

 

Not only that, but Erstad has had two HUGE hits in two games, tying the game against Meche Monday and givig the White Sox (seemingly) the game winning RBI's last night. Not too shabby.

[RME JICO]

There are four players that are more of a concern than Erstad is at the moment:

 

Dye - .209 BA

Konerko - .214 BA (seems to be coming around)

Pierzynski - .215 BA

Crede - .230 BA

 

The Sox will be in more trouble if those guys don't produce compared to Erstad alone.

[BigSqwert]

I must admit I am shifting my devotion towards Erstad over Anderson. Anderson just looks so bad against any pitcher out there whether it's an ace or a scrub. Erstad started the season hitting poorly but so did the entire offense minus Pods. Batting him leadoff is another story. I'd rather see him hitting 7th through 9th.

[caulfield12]

How about how he hits in the two hole? Leadoff or second he is still in front of the big guys and needs to get the f***ing job done.

 

And Caulfield, please tell me what makes Ozzie so infallible. If Ozzie wants Erstad to leadoff, it is NOT fine for me. You don't put a terrible hitter in position to get the most AB.

 

The fact that we're playing well recently coincides with Erstad also starting to come around. Of course, it also has to do with the great starting pitching we've received (last night notwithstanding). The White Sox are tied with the Indians for the 7th best record in baseball despite playing the toughest schedule and having one of the five worst batting averages and being tied for the most blown saves during that time span. I would say that's pretty good.

 

Nobody ever said Guillen was a great strategic manager, but he's a very good manager of personnel/people/players. That's what you need in a 162 game season, because the "geniuses" of the game might win 2-3 games by themselves, but their personal styles are often so arrogant and off-putting that they end up losing their teams some games.

 

What did Leyland do that was so great last weekend? He beat us on a pitch-out. WOW. He used Rodney in a tie game when he was 1-3 and had an ERA of around 7 or 8. It's a lot easier to manage that Tigers' pen if you have Jamie Walker or Denys Reyes (versions 2006) than Jose Mesa, Jason Grilli and Aaron Ledezma as the key components.

 

Ozzie is giving Logan a chance to put up or shut up...and last night, hopefully, will be something that Boone can build upon.

[Balance]

There are four players that are more of a concern than Erstad is at the moment:

 

Dye - .209 BA

Konerko - .214 BA (seems to be coming around)

Pierzynski - .215 BA

Crede - .230 BA

 

The Sox will be in more trouble if those guys don't produce compared to Erstad alone.

Quoted for troof.

 

[southsideirish]

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Apr 25, 2007 -> 10:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My problem is this is the choice the Sox have to make. Erstad or Anderson.

 

Those being the only two real options just make me sad.

Who did you want the sox to get? Roberts? Pierre? Matthews? Who else was available that you would have wanted?

[Balta1701]

My problem is this is the choice the Sox have to make. Erstad or Anderson.

 

Those being the only two real options just make me sad.

I think the Sox did pretty darn well in setting up what they needed this season personally, I just think they aren't handling it the right way.

 

The price on all the out-of-house options was clearly through the roof, as the previous person pointed out. The thing the Sox needed last year was a backup, Lefty outfielder who could play good defense and give Anderson time to develop and hopefully work through the kinks. They found exactly that. That was good. Then, they decided to sit Anderson 80% of the games. That is the mistake.

 

To even make things better, the Sox went out and grabbed a guy who, although he's a bit older, put up a >.900 OPS in AAA for the D-Backs last year in Terrero, who also plays good defense. If we're not going to be a $200 million a year salary team, this is exactly how we should set ourselves up. We have a talented kid who struggled last season. We have a backup option from the other side of the plate. And we have another backup option who is not as much of a prospect, but who might well turn into a decent bench player if our youngest option needs to get sent back to AAA.

 

There are 2 ways that we should be doing this, and we're doing neither. If Erstad is the starting OF, then Brian Anderson should be in AAA and Terrero should be up as a platoon partner. If Anderson is the starting OF, then he should be on pace for 500 + at bats until either we give up on him completely and send him down or someone gets hurt.

 

I'm not a huge Erstad fan, but I'll tolerate him succeeding if it helps the team. But what really bugs me about this situation is how the White Sox are dealing with their young guys. We are simply not going to remain competitive in the next few years if we can not keep subbing in some of our young guys to free up salary. Sweeney, Anderson, Owens, Fields...some of those guys need to become regulars. We just don't have the salary freedom to put in a $10 mil + guy at every position. We need to develop some of these guys. Anderson is a prime candidate to turn into a Crede...a guy who struggles at first offensively but grows into the role. But he is not going to do that in 100 at bats. Either play him every day, or send him down and give Terrero a shot...there's at least a non zero chance that Terrero could turn into a very good OF as well.

[Heads22]

Brady Clark woulda been neato.

[WilliamTell]

As one who has disliked Erstad, let me say, nice game.

Please keep it up.

 

And if we haters are fickle, think of the Yankee fans who booed ARod on opening day

then later that day had him take a curtain call.

I think we haters want Erstad to do well, we just fear he is an automatic out.

Hope he proves me wrong.

I want the Sox to win.

 

I agree with everything you said, I'm not an Erstad hater. Many may fear that Erstad is an automatic out, but I fear that Anderson is an automatic out.

[Controlled Chaos]

I think the Sox did pretty darn well in setting up what they needed this season personally, I just think they aren't handling it the right way.

 

The price on all the out-of-house options was clearly through the roof, as the previous person pointed out. The thing the Sox needed last year was a backup, Lefty outfielder who could play good defense and give Anderson time to develop and hopefully work through the kinks. They found exactly that. That was good. Then, they decided to sit Anderson 80% of the games. That is the mistake.

 

To even make things better, the Sox went out and grabbed a guy who, although he's a bit older, put up a >.900 OPS in AAA for the D-Backs last year in Terrero, who also plays good defense. If we're not going to be a $200 million a year salary team, this is exactly how we should set ourselves up. We have a talented kid who struggled last season. We have a backup option from the other side of the plate. And we have another backup option who is not as much of a prospect, but who might well turn into a decent bench player if our youngest option needs to get sent back to AAA.

 

There are 2 ways that we should be doing this, and we're doing neither. If Erstad is the starting OF, then Brian Anderson should be in AAA and Terrero should be up as a platoon partner. If Anderson is the starting OF, then he should be on pace for 500 + at bats until either we give up on him completely and send him down or someone gets hurt.

 

I'm not a huge Erstad fan, but I'll tolerate him succeeding if it helps the team. But what really bugs me about this situation is how the White Sox are dealing with their young guys. We are simply not going to remain competitive in the next few years if we can not keep subbing in some of our young guys to free up salary. Sweeney, Anderson, Owens, Fields...some of those guys need to become regulars. We just don't have the salary freedom to put in a $10 mil + guy at every position. We need to develop some of these guys. Anderson is a prime candidate to turn into a Crede...a guy who struggles at first offensively but grows into the role. But he is not going to do that in 100 at bats. Either play him every day, or send him down and give Terrero a shot...there's at least a non zero chance that Terrero could turn into a very good OF as well.

 

My sentiments exactly.

[quickman]

Brian Anderson's approach at the plate looked pretty good to me last night.

 

I love how major league hitters watch a straight-as-an-arrow fastball strike three go right down Broadway.

 

As Steve Stone has said, someone I trust a whole hell of a lot more than some of the fan-boys here, the problem with Brian Anderson is that, he not only gets beat on breaking pitches (which he could not hit to save his own mother), but, he also gets beat on the fastball--which, as Stone correctly asserted, is inexcusable for a major league ball player.

 

Oh, s***, this is a Darin Erstad thread--disregard this post.

 

Oops.

 

Maybe all he needs is a chance to play...

 

 

can't wait until anderson and his surf board leaves this town, then i can see some college kids tag line with his stats posted everyday batting 179. Good riddance, unfortunately nobody wants this two bit outfielder. maybe if he stops looking at his hair in the mirror and practices harder he could hit 220.

[Heads22]

can't wait until anderson and his surf board leaves this town, then i can see some college kids tag line with his stats posted everyday batting 179. Good riddance, unfortunately nobody wants this two bit outfielder. maybe if he stops looking at his hair in the mirror and practices harder he could hit 220.

 

 

[quickman]

 

 

he is not a dead horse until he is gone. But I love the thought of putting him out of his misery. Nice science project though.

Edited April 25, 2007 by quickman

[AddisonStSox]

he is not a dead horse until he is gone. But I love the thought of putting him out of his misery. Nice science project though.

 

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