Anderson sent down to AAA

[Rowand44]

You don't need more than two years to understand the value of a prospect.

 

Garza -- drafted #25 in 2005 -- has dominated minor league competition at every level, has power stuff, and happens to be in the right organization for pitching development. I don't need more than two years to figure that out.

And hasn't proven squat in the majors...

[WhiteSoxfan1986]

And hasn't proven squat in the majors...

 

Not to mention he was drafted out of college.

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Apr 29, 2007 -> 10:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You don't need more than two years to understand the value of a prospect.

 

Garza -- drafted #25 in 2005 -- has dominated minor league competition at every level, has power stuff, and happens to be in the right organization for pitching development. I don't need more than two years to figure that out.

.....and how exactly has he made an "impact" for Twins themselves?

 

How many of the thousands of players drafted over the past couple of seasons have even seen the big leagues?

 

Zimmerman is one of those "impact" players, Tulowitzki, Travis Buck and Alex Gordon are all up but haven't made an "impact."

 

How is it only the Sox are screwing up here?

[fathom]

No you can't. How much did the Sox pay El Duque, $4-6 million? El Duque gave the Sox 120 innings of a 5.10 ERA, not to mention what he did in the playoffs. What El Duque did for the Sox in 2005 was much better than the average fifth starter around the league.

 

My question is this -- when was the Sox lost a bidding war to a player that they realistically wanted? Then again, that's not really a fair question, either, because most of that is based on speculation, not real facts.

 

The Sox really wanted Pierre this offseason, but were basically eliminated as soon as Soriano got the monster deal from the Cubs. I thought El Duque signed like a 3 yr , 15 million dollar deal. He was so bad at the end of 2005 that he had to get removed from the rotation, and he wasn't going to be a starter in 2006 even if the trade never happened. Of course, he made up for any negatives with that one inning in the playoffs. However, I don't think KW believed he'd have to trade him after one season.

 

You are obviously setting a bias by asking about a specific dollar amount and you intentionally include the "not associated with our team" because Konerko was the obvious answer.

 

Well, I apologize for that then as I clearly meant to ask about free agents not associated with our team. I think the lack of answers either way shows that the Sox don't get into bidding wars for high priced talent.

[Heads22]

Fields would seem to be the logical choice, but a growing part of me envisions Terrero or Owens being called up.

 

Or, of course, a move for Timo.

[caulfield12]

The Sox really wanted Pierre this offseason, but were basically eliminated as soon as Soriano got the monster deal from the Cubs. I thought El Duque signed like a 3 yr , 15 million dollar deal. He was so bad at the end of 2005 that he had to get removed from the rotation, and he wasn't going to be a starter in 2006 even if the trade never happened. Of course, he made up for any negatives with that one inning in the playoffs. However, I don't think KW believed he'd have to trade him after one season.

Well, I apologize for that then as I clearly meant to ask about free agents not associated with our team. I think the lack of answers either way shows that the Sox don't get into bidding wars for high priced talent.

 

David Wells is the lone exception under KW. I don't know how many people we "beat" to get him for the 01 season, but I'm sure we weren't the only ones. His contract was around $9.5 million or something like that.

 

It hasn't been the big deal that has hurt the White Sox, in 2003, a little thing like spending $3-4 million on Kenny Rogers or having a legit closer the entire season (or not have Manuel as manager) would have put us in the playoffs.

 

Of course, there's Dye and AJ and Iguchi as well. If nothing else, KW proved he could find "undervalued" players and pay them less to play as well as "high priced/guaranteed contract" talent.

 

 

Back to an earlier point in the discussion about the Twins...where they have succeeded is in the patience with Morneau and Cuddyer, along with the "luck" of not having enough money to sign Prior. We'll never know if the Twins would have taken Prior over hometown "hero" Mauer, but it's interesting how quickly a negative turned into a net positive with the Twins on that one.

 

The White Sox, if they had a Morneau or Cuddyer, RECENTLY didn't have the luxury of playing them for 2-3 years before they developed...like the case of Crede and Rowand.

[max power]

People make fun of timo here but I remember him being pretty f***ing clutch

[caulfield12]

Fields would seem to be the logical choice, but a growing part of me envisions Terrero or Owens being called up.

 

Or, of course, a move for Timo.

 

 

I've heard they're looking at Armando Rios or Brian Daubach. Or should that be in green. Can you just imagine the press conference announcing the signing of that grinder John Mabry to save our offense?

 

People make fun of timo here but I remember him being pretty f***ing clutch

 

There were 4-5 games in his career here (against Benitez, against the Angels), but not enough to justify his overall suckiness as a player in general.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

Fields would seem to be the logical choice, but a growing part of me envisions Terrero or Owens being called up.

Fields would seem to me to be a very illogical choice. He's clearly not ready, off to a bad start at the plate, and has been said to be looking "lazy" in the field. Why start his arbitration clock running so soon, especially just to sit on the bench for two weeks?

[Heads22]

The problem is, every hitting prospect we have is sucking major balls.

[caulfield12]

Fields would seem to me to be a very illogical choice. He's clearly not ready, off to a bad start at the plate, and has been said to be looking "lazy" in the field. Why start his arbitration clock running so soon, especially just to sit on the bench for two weeks?

 

 

I'm guessing they will have to bring back Eduardo Perez.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

Maybe KW will do something bold and wild & crazy: Sign Rickey Henderson!

[Flash Tizzle]

.....and how exactly has he made an "impact" for Twins themselves?

 

How many of the thousands of players drafted over the past couple of seasons have even seen the big leagues?

 

Zimmerman is one of those "impact" players, Tulowitzki, Travis Buck and Alex Gordon are all up but haven't made an "impact."

 

How is it only the Sox are screwing up here?

He hasn't made an immediate impact, but if you're willing to overlook Garza's minor league statistics because it hasn't helped the Twins immediately then it's obvious "impact" in your mind only applies to someones value in the majors.

 

Alex Gordon and Tulowitzki have quality minor league statistics to fall back upon. If their past is any indication, they'll gradually improve. What does it matter if their impact is immediate or several years in the future?

 

The White Sox screw up by selecting Lance Broadway and Kyle McCulloch two consecutive drafts. They screw up by failing to develop hitting talent without the same swing deficiencies. And, most importantly, they fail to compensate for low draft positions by improving their position among international scouting. You think our low-round drafting has been atrocious? Just try and spin our lack of success overseas. We haven't produced as much as a Neifi Perez clone since Ordonez and Lee.

Edited April 30, 2007 by Flash Tizzle

[greg775]

Our scouts need to go. How could anybody draft a guy who bats like BA No. 1?

He looks like a pitcher at the plate.

What round was Jeremy Reed?

We need new scouts.

[max power]

There were 4-5 games in his career here (against Benitez, against the Angels), but not enough to justify his overall suckiness as a player in general.

4-5 games for a bench player is enough for me. I can't think of any bench players in the two years after timo left that did that.

[Flash Tizzle]

Our scouts need to go. How could anybody draft a guy who bats like BA No. 1?

He looks like a pitcher at the plate.

What round was Jeremy Reed?

We need new scouts.

2nd -- 59th overall.

[BearSox]

Jeremy Reed was round 2 greg.

 

I wouldn't mind Owens being called up. He has been doing good.

[caulfield12]

4-5 games for a bench player is enough for me. I can't think of any bench players in the two years after timo left that did that.

 

 

Mackowiak did that last year, although he took away 3-4 wins defensively (not his fault for being played out of position). Cintron won 2-3 games last year (two against DET when Uribe was out) at least.

 

Our scouts need to go. How could anybody draft a guy who bats like BA No. 1?

He looks like a pitcher at the plate.

What round was Jeremy Reed?

We need new scouts.

 

 

Reed was a great pick. He was an overachiever who became Minor League player of the year, which allowed him to have enough "cache" to get the M's to take him for Garcia as the centerpiece of that deal, along with Olivo.

 

Reed was always going to be limited defensively, not being either a power or speed player. He's actually an ideal 4th/5th outfielder who can also play 1B, the role many want for Erstad but one we can't afford, since DE is currently our best hitter and has been for the last two weeks, along with 4-5 huge clutch hits that put us in the lead or tied the game.

 

Jeremy Reed was round 2 greg.

 

I wouldn't mind Owens being called up. He has been doing good.

 

 

I think Ozzie said he had a nagging injury. Terrero will be the call-up apparently.

[Heads22]

Let's hope Cunningham develops, I suppose.

 

We need to get a bat that finally pans out in this years draft. We can skip getting an arm this year.

[max power]

You guys are right, Timo was terrible. Not just a little terrible. Jeez. I just looked at his stats. It was frightening, I guess I didn't follow stats so closely back then, or listen to you bunch of pessimists(sometimes realists).

[santo=dorf]

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Apr 29, 2007 -> 11:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

He hasn't made an immediate impact, but if you're willing to overlook Garza's minor league statistics because it hasn't helped the Twins immediately then it's obvious "impact" in your mind only applies to someones value in the majors.

What the hell did you think your quote was reffering to? Of course they are talking about the majors otherwise it doesn't mean a damn thing. I remember Jon Rauch having some solid years in the minors. I guess he's an impact player (at the minor league level) too.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Apr 29, 2007 -> 11:03 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Alex Gordon and Tulowitzki have quality minor league statistics to fall back upon. If their past is any indication, they'll gradually improve. What does it matter if their impact is immediate or several years in the future?

The White Sox screw up by selecting Lance Broadway and Kyle McCulloch two consecutive drafts. They screw up by failing to develop hitting talent without the same swing deficiencies. And, most importantly, they fail to compensate for low draft positions by improving their position among international scouting. You think our low-round drafting has been atrocious? Just try and spin our lack of success overseas. We haven't produced as much as a Neifi Perez clone since Ordonez and Lee.

Are you kidding me? Seriously? It's related directly to the quote in your sig. How is it that it doesn't matter when other teams' prospects make an "impact," yet you keep counting the current and last couple of years against the Sox? How is OK to assume those guys will make an impact in the future yet we can't do that with Lance Broadway or Egbert? Total hypocrisy.

[caulfield12]

What the hell did you think your quote was reffering to? Of course they are talking about the majors otherwise it doesn't mean a damn thing. I remember Jon Rauch having some solid years in the minors. I guess he's an impact player (at the minor league level) too.

 

Are you kidding me? Seriously? It's related directly to the quote in your sig. How is it that it doesn't matter when other teams' prospects make an "impact," yet you keep counting the current and last couple of years against the Sox? How is OK to assume those guys will make an impact in the future yet we can't do that with Lance Broadway or Egbert? Total hypocrisy.

 

 

Rauch has STILL made an impact as one of the best middle relievers (statistically), but he would have been a very good starter if not for the labrum injury.

 

Rauch has STILL made an impact as one of the best middle relievers (statistically), but he would have been a very good starter if not for the labrum injury.

 

 

"And, most importantly, they fail to compensate for low draft positions by improving their position among international scouting. You think our low-round drafting has been atrocious? Just try and spin our lack of success overseas. We haven't produced as much as a Neifi Perez clone since Ordonez and Lee."

 

Iguchi and Takatu had quite an impact, I would say. We just signed a Korean pitcher for $300,000. There was the Anderson Gomes deal. You won't see an immediate payoff from all of those moves, but it's a step in the right direction. We're not going to go out and outspend the Yankees or Red Sox for top talent internationally, but progress is being made.

 

If you want Neifi Perez clones, you can take Andy Gonzalez or Pedro Lopez.

 

Or maybe you would prefer the White Sox be the worst team in the American League for 2-3 consecutive years so we can rebuild with high draft picks. It's amazing the White Sox remained competitive (up with the Braves and Yankees, two teams with much bigger budgets over the last 15 years) for such a long time, without bottoming out. That's a testament to scouting at the major and minor league levels...sometimes the "development" is lacking on the minor league side, but we've always done a good job of maintaining a .500 or better team.

[Controlled Chaos]

Finally a smart decision. BA has the opportunity to get his swing back. At least now the ball is in BA's court. He controls his own destiny and I hope he takes the challenge head on. Up here we could blame Ozzie for not getting him any AB's and it's a valid complaint, but down there the accountability is on him.

[TitoMB345]

Bye Bye BA. I will miss your flowing, golden locks roaming CF at the Cell. I will miss you're awesomeness in not caring what people think of you. I will miss your will to actually improve. Bye Bye Brian Anderson, I love you.

 

Have fun where ever you end up, and good luck.

 

Edited April 30, 2007 by TitoMB345

[Jeremy]

This is the smartest thing the team has done with the outfield in a long time. Burrying a 25 year old player who was a high level prospect a year ago on the bench was unconscionable. I still have no idea why KW and Ozzie thought it was an acceptable decision. Even if we lose an extra game or so because Terrero is a poor backup, we're still better off in the long term by trying to salvage things with BA.

 

I know we could really use Young and his .192 batting average. Man, imagine him and Jeremy Reed batting back to back. Wow.

 

I'm pretty amazed by the complete disregard of sample sizes in this thread. Anderson is a bust because he's had 400 poor major league at bats? Take a look at Paully's first 400 major league at bats. It's not pretty but he turned out pretty well because two teams gave up on him when his value was at its lowest. Here's hoping we don't make the same mistake with Anderson. Even worse is forming conclusions based on less than 100 plate appearances or in the case of BA 19 (!). Let's look back at Konerko. He's hitting below .200. Does that mean we should cut him because the season's lost? I'd say not so I would form conclusions about BA, Young, BMac, or anyone else based solely on this season.