The Greg Walker Lynch mob thread

[caulfield12]

I stand by my statement that changing coaches in mid season is risky and a final act of desperation by a team. Perhaps it is desperation time. I'm guessing that come Monday, it will be all right, but if not, Walker may be having a very unhappy meeting with K-Dub and Oz.

 

But the problem goes well beyond Walker, the organization for the past couple decades has preached long ball. Which has me amazed we've done that without at least one poster boy for steroids. Players coming into the organization have to notice what gets rewarded on the 25 man roster.

 

But bringing in someone new, and if he starts wholesales changes, we could be throwing in the towel quickly. If all it takes is a tweak, Walker is the guy to do it. If we need a sledge hammer and time, start waving the flag and have Spring Training II only when the results count for real.

 

 

I think the best way to be competitive is to build around our pitching staff and move the fences back to their original dimensions or beyond...the only sluggers we'll still have on the team for next year would be Konerko and Thome, and Thome's contract expires after the 08 season.

 

Let's be realistic...players like Sweeney and Anderson are gap hitters. If you take away the idea they have to hit 15-20 homers and just be "players" (which they would have to be in Tigers Stadium), then you might see some results instead of everyone (including Josh Fields) adopting the "lift and pull" approach.

 

 

 

The White Sox led major league baseball in batting average with RISP last year. Well over .300. Not bad considering Walker was the hitting coach. Watching last night's game, the players seem less than enthused to be out on the field. I know Grinderstad was supposed to bring that extra intesity, but I really don't see it. Maybe they are resigned to the fact that they aren't very good right now, but they must keep battling. To be fair, if Walker must be fired, so should Cooper and so should Ozzie. Joey Cora too.

 

 

And who do you get to replace Guillen in mid-season? Bobby Valentine? Buck Showalter? Cito Gaston?

 

Seriously, Jerry Manuel was given three full seasons before the knives came out, and he wasted a great team in the second half of 2003 that had the ability to win the World Series.

 

This White Sox team is obviously not as good as the 03 team. I think Ozzie and KW would relish the challenge of rebuilding this team from essentially the ground up. They've delivered one World Series to Chicago...and everyone who watched intently in August and September knew this club was dead man walking.

 

If anything, I would rather fire KW than Guillen, but neither one is going to happen...heck, I doubt they're even discussing a Walker firing at this point. KW does not do things to pacify the fans. I see him being stubborn and arguing until the end that Walker's methods are sound.

[Dick Allen]

People have to get off the misconception that Greg Walker has his players swinging for the fences. Besides AJ, who swings for the fences that really had not until getting with Walker? AJ is 240 pounds. As guys like that get older they tend to become guys who will swing for the fences more, besides you get paid at a much better rate when you put the ball into the seats. Bringing in another hitting coach is not going to make the White Sox predominantly gap hitters. If the personnel doesn't change the offense and its approach will stay the same. The offense will not remain this weak the entire season. You can only hope they don't put themselves in a hole they cannot get out of before they breakout. The White Sox offense was terrible until the end of May in 1983 but then they picked it up. Carlton Fisk was hitting worse than Konerko is right now and he almost was the MVP that season.

[caulfield12]

People have to get off the misconception that Greg Walker has his players swinging for the fences. Besides AJ, who swings for the fences that really had not until getting with Walker? AJ is 240 pounds. As guys like that get older they tend to become guys who will swing for the fences more, besides you get paid at a much better rate when you put the ball into the seats. Bringing in another hitting coach is not going to make the White Sox predominantly gap hitters. If the personnel doesn't change the offense and its approach will stay the same. The offense will not remain this weak the entire season. You can only hope they don't put themselves in a hole they cannot get out of before they breakout. The White Sox offense was terrible until the end of May in 1983 but then they picked it up. Carlton Fisk was hitting worse than Konerko is right now and he almost was the MVP that season.

 

 

I think the biggest question marks are around Crede and Brian Anderson, but what is the offensive philosphy of Uribe, or Iguchi, for that matter? Mackowiak and Cintron? Thome and Konerko are not going to change, obviously, nor is Jermaine Dye.

 

Maybe Tadahito is confused with all these line-up shifts and whether the Sox want him to hit for power or sacrifice himself for the team, like in 2005.

[Dick Allen]

I think the biggest question marks are around Crede and Brian Anderson, but what is the offensive philosphy of Uribe, or Iguchi, for that matter? Mackowiak and Cintron? Thome and Konerko are not going to change, obviously, nor is Jermaine Dye.

 

Maybe Tadahito is confused with all these line-up shifts and whether the Sox want him to hit for power or sacrifice himself for the team, like in 2005.

Crede had a big year last year and was a key element to the championship. That was long after most of this board, myself included, gave up on him. Anderson is a question mark, but to blame Walker for his troubles would be ridiculous. Uribe is what he is. He's a guy who is going to swing hard. You can only hope he becomes more selective, but a gap to gap hitter is something he never will be no matter who you have as a hitting coach. Ozzie wanted to move Iguchi down in the order so he would hit more home runs. Mackowiak had the highest batting average of his career last year with Greg Walker the hitting coach. Cintron had a typical year for him last year. This year its a different story for both of them so far, but Mack is notoriously streaky and Cintron's surgery appears to have had a negative effect on his ability thus far.

[caulfield12]

Crede had a big year last year and was a key element to the championship. That was long after most of this board, myself included, gave up on him. Anderson is a question mark, but to blame Walker for his troubles would be ridiculous. Uribe is what he is. He's a guy who is going to swing hard. You can only hope he becomes more selective, but a gap to gap hitter is something he never will be no matter who you have as a hitting coach. Ozzie wanted to move Iguchi down in the order so he would hit more home runs. Mackowiak had the highest batting average of his career last year with Greg Walker the hitting coach. Cintron had a typical year for him last year. This year its a different story for both of them so far, but Mack is notoriously streaky and Cintron's surgery appears to have had a negative effect on his ability thus far.

 

If you moved back the fences (like Detroit's original dimensions), Uribe, AJ, Cintron, Sweeney, Mackowiak, Iguchi and Anderson would have to concentrate more on putting the ball in play and less on homers.

 

Yeah, the White Sox had faith in Crede and Rowand, but, after a World Series, there's just not as much patience with White Sox fans, especially with the Cubs seemingly competitive because of the money they went out and invested in their team. KW didn't do anything at the break last year (except MacDougal) and he didn't obviously improve our line-up for 2007, except for the bullpen.

 

I don't even know if that's possible to move back the fences again, without doing major reconstruction of the bleachers, bullpen, Bullpen Sports Bar, picnic area and/or losing lots of seats....

[caulfield12]

The fences are not moving back. Not only would it involve major construction, but the Sox already took our more than enough seats back in 04. There is just no room for them to be moved back. Not going to happen.

 

 

Then you can move home plate back and push back the distance a little down the lines especially...345, like original Comiskey Park.

[knightni]

He's right. Its funny all the Walker has to go people didn't have much to say about Cooper when the best rotation ever assembled stunk up the place last season, and the defending world champs finished 3rd in the division. Way too much blame is being put on Walker. What do you expect an offense to be like when your leadoff man is a below average OBP guy. When AJP is batting 3rd or 4th. When you use Alex Cintron and Brian Anderson as a DH? The offense's lack of production is just as much KW and Ozzie's fault as anyone elses. How often do the Sox hit and run when they have someone on first, rather than try and put 2 runs on the board?

Cooper gets a pass because of late 2005.

 

The Sox won in spite of Walker in late 2005.

[Hawkfan]

nice mob yall got here

[Heads22]

I think the best way to be competitive is to build around our pitching staff and move the fences back to their original dimensions or beyond...the only sluggers we'll still have on the team for next year would be Konerko and Thome, and Thome's contract expires after the 08 season.

 

Let's be realistic...players like Sweeney and Anderson are gap hitters. If you take away the idea they have to hit 15-20 homers and just be "players" (which they would have to be in Tigers Stadium), then you might see some results instead of everyone (including Josh Fields) adopting the "lift and pull" approach.

And who do you get to replace Guillen in mid-season? Bobby Valentine? Buck Showalter? Cito Gaston?

 

Seriously, Jerry Manuel was given three full seasons before the knives came out, and he wasted a great team in the second half of 2003 that had the ability to win the World Series.

 

This White Sox team is obviously not as good as the 03 team. I think Ozzie and KW would relish the challenge of rebuilding this team from essentially the ground up. They've delivered one World Series to Chicago...and everyone who watched intently in August and September knew this club was dead man walking.

 

If anything, I would rather fire KW than Guillen, but neither one is going to happen...heck, I doubt they're even discussing a Walker firing at this point. KW does not do things to pacify the fans. I see him being stubborn and arguing until the end that Walker's methods are sound.

 

 

They'd look at Razor Shines, that's for sure.

[Texsox]

Cooper gets a pass because of late 2005.

 

The Sox won in spite of Walker in late 2005.

 

And somehow he continues to fool the entire Sox organization.

[beck72]

Bringing in another hitting coach is not going to make the White Sox predominantly gap hitters. If the personnel doesn't change the offense and its approach will stay the same. The offense will not remain this weak the entire season. You can only hope they don't put themselves in a hole they cannot get out of before they breakout.

 

Well said. The sox have veteran hitters. No hitting coach in the world is going to change these guys. Walker or any hitting coach can only hope to make slight adjustments to their mechanics. If a hitting coach has to make wholesale changes to their swings in season, that player is in deep trouble. No matter how terrible some of these guys look now, I bet few sox players are in need of dramatic changes.

[BMac Attack]

I would tend to agree - mechanically most of our hitting isn't too terribly far off. What I worry about is the approach the Sox take to the plate - they just don't seem to have a clear intent when they get to the plate that I see in watching some other teams. They just don't seem to be thinking as much about what they want to do with the ball, and instead of hitting it anywhere in particular, it becomes lift/pull again, pretty much regardless of situation. I don't think that's true for many other teams. Perhaps that's total BS, but it's an opinion I've had for a while, and that's only been interrupted in 2005. Is that directly related to Walker? Couldn't tell you, but this team's in need of a spark somewhere on the offensive side, and soon, or this season's gotta be junked.

[Texsox]

I was just thinking, and two lazy to research, but how have players like Rowand, Olivo. etc. done after they leave Walker's tutelage? I'm trying to think of the position players who have left. If Walker sucks, theory states the players should show the immediate improvement that some of y'all think will happen.

[witesoxfan]

Rowand was mediocre in 2005, and then was mediocre last year. He's lit the world on fire thus far this year.

 

Miguel Olivo sucked in 2005 but was good in limited time with San Diego and resurfaced last year in Florida and hit lefties very well. However, he walked 9 times.

[SoxFan1]

Walker became hitting coach in 2003. The top set is the player's BA with Walker as hitting coach, the bottom is their BA after they left the Sox.

 

Carlos Lee with Walker: .298

Carlos Lee post Walker: .282

 

Miguel Olivo with Walker: .237

Miguel Olivo post Walker: .239

 

Aaron Rowand with Walker: .289

Aaron Rowand post Walker: .319

 

Jose Valentin with Walker: .226

Jose Valentin post Walker: .240

 

Frank Thomas with Walker: .252

Frank Thomas post Walker: .264

 

Magglio Ordonez with Walker: .304

Magglio Ordonez post Walker: .316

 

I'm bored.

[SoxFan1]

Contrarily, here are players who are currently on the Sox who came on from different teams:

 

AJ Pierzynski pre Walker: .293, 37 HR (9 HR/year)

AJ Pierzynski with Walker: .254, 38 HR (17 HR/year)

 

Juan Uribe pre Walker: .264, 24 HR (8 HR/year)

Juan Uribe with Walker: .248, 64 HR (20 HR/year)

 

Scott Podsednik pre Walker: .279, 21 HR (11 HR/year)

Scott Podsednik with Walker: .284, 4 HR (2 HR/year)

 

Jermaine Dye pre Walker: .260, 161 HR (17 HR/year)

Jermaine Dye with Walker: .295, 81 HR (37 HR/year)

Edited May 7, 2007 by SoxFan1

[Texsox]

mixed bag. I thought rowand sucked last season.

[caulfield12]

mixed bag. I thought rowand sucked last season.

 

 

Not to mention the fact that he was injured.

 

That Victorino kid always does something to impress you...stolen base, he had an amazing throw from RF to nail a runner at the plate earlier in the week...extra base hits, I know he also had a homer tonight as wel.

 

The Phils' outfield is VERY similar to ours right now:

 

Burrell=Dye

Rowand=Estad

Sweeney=Victorino

[SoxFan1]

mixed bag. I thought rowand sucked last season.

Only reason for Carlos Lee's decline in average is because he is solely a long-ball hitter now. Notice how everyone's power numbers skyrocketed when coming to the Sox. AJ's numbers are astounding. He hit 37 HR's in 7 season before joining the Sox. In 2 seasons + 1 month, he has 38. His average is WAY down too.

Edited May 7, 2007 by SoxFan1

[BigSqwert]

Reifert's reply to a letter from the mailbag on the Sox site:

 

Here is one thing the White Sox categorically should not do: get rid of Greg Walker. This man just might be the best hitting coach in all of baseball, in regard to his knowledge, work ethic and tight bond formed with the players. It amazes me to hear some people believe this change would solve the problems.

[southsideirish71]

Reifert's reply to a letter from the mailbag on the Sox site:

 

God the sox drink their own koolaid. Rudy from Texas is considered the best hitting coach in baseball. By pretty much most of the teams outside of the whitesox.

[Dick Allen]

God the sox drink their own koolaid. Rudy from Texas is considered the best hitting coach in baseball. By pretty much most of the teams outside of the whitesox.

But the Rangers are hitting .241 as a team. If you were a Ranger fan, you would be calling for his head.

[TLAK]

Reifert's reply to a letter from the mailbag on the Sox site:

Thats Scott Merkin, not Reifert. Like all the MLB com reporters, he can shill with the best of them, but he's not a VP of the White Sox.

[LVSoxFan]

Question: What's the difference between me and the White Sox offense?

 

Answer:

 

[knightni]

Question: What's the difference between me and the White Sox offense?

 

Answer:

 

 

I doubt that you could hit major league pitching consistant enough to have a good batting average.