Top 50 players to build a team around (MVPs)

[sox-r-us]

 

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/base...ifth/index.html

[TitoMB345]

No. 43. Chris B. Young, CF, Diamondbacks, Age 23 (46)

On his way to recovering from a slow start at the plate, Young often gets compared to Mike Cameron, but the better comparison might be a young Andruw Jones (his No. 8 PECOTA comparable). Like Jones, Young is probably not a candidate to be a .300 hitter, but everything else is just about perfect, including power, plate discipline, speed and center field defense. If nobody in your fantasy league has heard of the "other" Chris Young, the time to make the move for him is right now.

 

:P:P

[ZoomSlowik]

There is a serious emphasis on youth here. I'm sorry, but no way I take Bradley McCann #9 even if he is only 23, and Chris Young needs a lot more than a month of mediocre at best performance to make the list. The same goes with Alex Gordon at #23, only he's been awful early (and there are a few others as well)...

Edited May 8, 2007 by ZoomSlowik

[CWSGuy406]

There is a serious emphasis on youth here. I'm sorry, but no way I take Bradley McCann #9 even if he is only 23, and Chris Young needs a lot more than a month of mediocre at best performance to make the list...

 

Brian McCann had an equal year to Joe Mauer last season. I can see your gripe with Young -- he hasn't done anything for a prolonged time in the majors -- but McCann deserves that nine spot. He's 23 and is already a career 130 OPS+ hitter at the catcher spot. You don't seem to realize just how hard it is to find such a good hitting catcher. He's as valuable, if not moreso, than Grady Sizemore.

[ZoomSlowik]

Brian McCann had an equal year to Joe Mauer last season. I can see your gripe with Young -- he hasn't done anything for a prolonged time in the majors -- but McCann deserves that nine spot. He's 23 and is already a career 130 OPS+ hitter at the catcher spot. You don't seem to realize just how hard it is to find such a good hitting catcher. He's as valuable, if not moreso, than Grady Sizemore.

 

Haha, whoops, got the DPBL league on the brain.

 

I'm aware that it's hard to find a good catcher, but even the people who wrote the article said that they don't really know if you're getting the next Johnny Bench or the next Kevin Neilssen with him. Mauer at least has a bit more than two full seasons behind him and is a very solid defensive catcher, McCann has a little over one full year to his name so far, and I seriously doubt that he hits .333 with 24 homers again this year. If he does it again, then fine, put him up there, but no way I take ahead of a whole lot proven All-Star caliber players until he has a bit more of a track record.

Edited May 8, 2007 by ZoomSlowik

[Balta1701]

no way I take ahead of a whole lot proven All-Star caliber players until he has a bit more of a track record.

Brian McCann (coming into this season)

 

Minor League, 5 seasons: .275 .334 .462 796, 36 home runs, 1082 at bats. Highest OPS = 835.

Major League, 2 seasons: 317 .376 .523 899, 29 home runs, 622 at bats. Highest OPS = 960.

Edited May 8, 2007 by Balta1701

[CWSGuy406]

I'm aware that it's hard to find a good catcher, but even the people who wrote the article said that they don't really know if you're getting the next Johnny Bench or the next Kevin Neilssen with him. Mauer at least has a bit more than two full seasons behind him and is a very solid defensive catcher, McCann has a little over one full year to his name so far, and I seriously doubt that he hits .333 with 24 homers again this year. If he does it again, then fine, put him up there, but no way I take ahead of a whole lot proven All-Star caliber players until he has a bit more of a track record.

 

Well, it's a little more than a season -- he's at 715 at-bats in his career, so that's right around a season-and-a-half, but I'm probably just splitting hairs.

 

I was more surprised at Hanley Ramirez ranking sixth, but after looking at his numbers, you can make a great case for him. 751 career at-bats with a 122 OPS+ with a real "athlete's" body to boot.

 

You also have to understand that Silver's main backing for his rankings are the PECOTA system and age. He's putting full confidence in the former.

[Flash Tizzle]

All divisional opponents have atleast one player.

 

Detroit -- Verlander (49), Bonderman (30)

Royals -- Gordon (23)

Minnesota -- Liriano (46), Morneau (40), Santana (3), Mauer (2)

Cleveland -- Martinez (37), Hafner (21), Sabathia (17), Sizemore (5)

 

That's not good.

 

Detroit has an additional two players (Granderson/Guillen) deemed honorable mentions.

 

Unless our payroll remains equal to or above 95+ million these next several seasons, blue-chip production from within the minor league system is a necessity to compete.

[witesoxfan]

All divisional opponents have atleast one player.

 

Detroit -- Verlander (49), Bonderman (30)

Royals -- Gordon (23)

Minnesota -- Liriano (46), Morneau (40), Santana (3), Mauer (2)

Cleveland -- Martinez (37), Hafner (21), Sabathia (17), Sizemore (5)

 

That's not good.

 

Detroit has an additional two players (Granderson/Guillen) deemed honorable mentions.

 

Unless our payroll remains equal to or above 95+ million these next several seasons, blue-chip production from within the minor league system is a necessity to compete.

 

The Sox are old though too Flash. You take 10 or even 6 years off of Thome's body and he might be top 10. Same thing goes for Konerko as well, though he'd be more in the 30-40s range as opposed to the top of the list. I'm obviously not arguing that being old is a good thing, I'm just arguing that the Sox have elite talent as well, it's just on the wrong side of 30. We've both agreed that the Sox are going to have to go into a rebuilding mode within the next 3 years, especially offensively, so the fact that the Sox don't have anyone to build around on this list is completely expected.

 

And I honestly don't care if the Sox keep their payroll at or above $95 million, the Sox need better production from their minor leagues period. KW's done an amazing job at finding players off the scrapheap and has really built a bullpen out of it; however, the Sox need to start producing talent that's not only very good from the minor leagues, but that produces from day 1. Sweeney is a nice looking prospect, but what else is there besides Sweeney offensively? The Sox have a ton of holes about to open up throughout the field, and they have 1 or maybe 2 replacements for those players, and that's if Fields gets his s*** together. The offense is just not looking pretty right now, and that needs to change within the next 2 years.

 

Also, I don't care if Buehrle is in the top 50 or not, he's a guy you can build a rotation around. He's going to be a cog in the rotation for however many years he's signed to, and he's going to put up above average numbers over the duration of his contract without ridiculous peripherals; there's not much value in PECOTA in that, but there is in the rebuilding and baseball aspect.

[aboz56]

How can Liriano be on this list?

 

He's out this season and there's no guarantee he'll ever be as effective as he was before his injury.

[ZoomSlowik]

Brian McCann (coming into this season)

 

Minor League, 5 seasons: .275 .334 .462 796, 36 home runs, 1082 at bats. Highest OPS = 835.

Major League, 2 seasons: 317 .376 .523 899, 29 home runs, 622 at bats. Highest OPS = 960.

 

Pretty big improvement from his minor league numbers to his major league numbers so far...

 

I'm not saying he sucks, I'd like to have that kind of player on the Sox, we could use a young catcher with his talent. I'm just saying it seems a bit pre-mature to put him in the top 10. Even in the MINORS he wasn't really elite...

[Soxfest]

That what happens with KW crappy job with minors.

[Flash Tizzle]

The Sox are old though too Flash. You take 10 or even 6 years off of Thome's body and he might be top 10. Same thing goes for Konerko as well, though he'd be more in the 30-40s range as opposed to the top of the list. I'm obviously not arguing that being old is a good thing, I'm just arguing that the Sox have elite talent as well, it's just on the wrong side of 30. We've both agreed that the Sox are going to have to go into a rebuilding mode within the next 3 years, especially offensively, so the fact that the Sox don't have anyone to build around on this list is completely expected.

 

I agree -- both are elite talents within their respective positions. The problem is estimating how long their production can remain consistent to others within our division.

 

I understand their respective ages, and how few players above 24 are on the list, but the issue is how long they can remain effective in the increasingly competitive American League Central? Thome, especially. If he's experiencing injury problems now, how's it going to be in a few seasons?

 

Konerko's contract extends through 2010; Thome's (under certain circumstances) 2009. And while that lapse in time may not be a concern to many, replacing the production of those two is a concern of mine. Based upon our current composition of minor leaguers, it's not coming from within.

 

It doesn't only begin and end with Konerko and Thome, either. Unless several players emerge from nowhere (which is a possibility), prospects are traded to/from another club, or our payroll remains high, our position in comparison to Detroit/Minnesota/Cleveland is nowhere near as appealing.

 

And I honestly don't care if the Sox keep their payroll at or above $95 million, the Sox need better production from their minor leagues period. KW's done an amazing job at finding players off the scrapheap and has really built a bullpen out of it; however, the Sox need to start producing talent that's not only very good from the minor leagues, but that produces from day 1. Sweeney is a nice looking prospect, but what else is there besides Sweeney offensively? The Sox have a ton of holes about to open up throughout the field, and they have 1 or maybe 2 replacements for those players, and that's if Fields gets his s*** together. The offense is just not looking pretty right now, and that needs to change within the next 2 years.

 

Including the high payroll figure was only to provide an alternative for a contributing minor league system. It's not something I'd want to fall back upon, obviously.

 

If only Anderson and Fields were only capable of AVERAGE production, it would provide so many more options for the White Sox. Even though Sweeney hasn't exactly proven himself capable of above average production for an OF, atleast he hasn't appeared over matched.

 

Honestly, I really don't believe many understand how much Fields and Anderson struggling has a residual effect throughout the team. If you don't have faith in those two, you can't trade Crede or release Erstad. We'll have enough to worry about with Dye/Buehrle/Iguchi as it is. Whether that is retaining them or finding replacements, the job only becomes more difficult without cheap prospects available.

 

What I am satisified with is is our collection of pitching prospects. When you have replacements available, a team is allowed the opportunity to deal someone such as McCarthy. Hopefully next season we'll have one of the JAGs available so an additional veteran starter may be traded.

 

Also, I don't care if Buehrle is in the top 50 or not, he's a guy you can build a rotation around. He's going to be a cog in the rotation for however many years he's signed to, and he's going to put up above average numbers over the duration of his contract without ridiculous peripherals; there's not much value in PECOTA in that, but there is in the rebuilding and baseball aspect.

 

I agree with you here. Buehrle is traditionally a pitcher PECOTA frowns upon.

 

It's just not going to be for the White Sox unless they're willing to pay him accordingly.

Edited May 8, 2007 by Flash Tizzle