In two more days, fire sale talk will pick up

[Kyyle23]

Very well...and I'll continue to say that we're not in that top or elite group with Boston, Cleveland, Detroit, and possibly the Yankees and Angels. We're very similar to the A's, if I had to make a comparison.

 

I didn't think Minnesota would struggle this badly. They will give it another month, but they have the same issue with Torii Hunter we have with Buehrle and Dye.

 

Our offense is still the worst in the AL after the last 2/3rd's of a season. It's difficult to argue with that measuring stick. We're 4th in pitching, ERA-wise. I doubt we can be first, but we need to stay 3-5 in that area and get our hitting/runs scored somewhere around 7-10th in the AL to have any chance.

 

Are we closer to being an "elite" team or a rebuilding team? I would say the latter. It's unfortunate, because we have the makings of a great bullpen, to go with our strong starting pitching.

 

Crede, Konerko, Erstad, Dye and Iguchi have looked really bad recently. Iguchi, Crede and Konerko are all huge question marks to me. We can't win without at least two of those three guys hitting.

 

We don't have anything close to resembling prospects at SS or 2B. The jury's out on Anderson and Fields as well, at best. What we do have is lots of pitching prospects, and the more legit prospects you have, the higher the odds that one or two will actually make it and become members of the rotation. I'm encouraged that Honel seems to coming back onto the radar screen as a prospect, and Danks has impressed nearly everyone.

 

We went through a 167-95 stretch of play in 2005 and 2006 (until the All-Star break). We would have won 105 games last year if continued to play like we did in the first half (best offense in the AL). Obviously that didn't happen, for a number of reasons.

 

Since then, we're 51-56. That's an incredible drop-off in the level of play.

 

Which is the prevailing trend? Well, we'll find out in the next 6 weeks, but having KC simply hand us four games out of four doesn't mean we're a good team or that anything is "fixed."

 

All I have to say about this is that there is more than "Elite" and "Rebuilding". I agree with a lot of the things you have said, but i remember much of the same things being said about the 2005 team for the entire year, all the way up to the first game of the playoffs. Sometimes you get the breaks, sometimes they get you.

 

I really dont see a firesale happening. At all. This team would have to go on an extended losing streak for KW to even think about it.

[Rowand44]

Very well...and I'll continue to say that we're not in that top or elite group with Boston, Cleveland, Detroit, and possibly the Yankees and Angels. We're very similar to the A's, if I had to make a comparison.

 

I didn't think Minnesota would struggle this badly. They will give it another month, but they have the same issue with Torii Hunter we have with Buehrle and Dye.

 

Our offense is still the worst in the AL after the last 2/3rd's of a season. It's difficult to argue with that measuring stick. We're 4th in pitching, ERA-wise. I doubt we can be first, but we need to stay 3-5 in that area and get our hitting/runs scored somewhere around 7-10th in the AL to have any chance.

 

Are we closer to being an "elite" team or a rebuilding team? I would say the latter. It's unfortunate, because we have the makings of a great bullpen, to go with our strong starting pitching.

 

Crede, Konerko, Erstad, Dye and Iguchi have looked really bad recently. Iguchi, Crede and Konerko are all huge question marks to me. We can't win without at least two of those three guys hitting.

 

We don't have anything close to resembling prospects at SS or 2B. The jury's out on Anderson and Fields as well, at best. What we do have is lots of pitching prospects, and the more legit prospects you have, the higher the odds that one or two will actually make it and become members of the rotation. I'm encouraged that Honel seems to coming back onto the radar screen as a prospect, and Danks has impressed nearly everyone.

 

We went through a 167-95 stretch of play in 2005 and 2006 (until the All-Star break). We would have won 105 games last year if continued to play like we did in the first half (best offense in the AL). Obviously that didn't happen, for a number of reasons.

 

Since then, we're 51-56. That's an incredible drop-off in the level of play.

 

Which is the prevailing trend? Well, we'll find out in the next 6 weeks, but having KC simply hand us four games out of four doesn't mean we're a good team or that anything is "fixed."

 

Last years team has nothing to do with this years, you have to stop taking last years 2nd half record into account because it means squat.

 

We're 3 games over .500 and only 2.5 out of a playoff spot when our best hitter has been out for a while, one of our best hitters against lhp has been out all season and just overall our offense has been brutal. No matter how good or bad you think this offense is, it's not THIS bad, they'll get better and a lot better.

 

This team can win this year, there will be no fire sale, so it's time to let that go.

[caulfield12]

Last years team has nothing to do with this years, you have to stop taking last years 2nd half record into account because it means squat.

 

We're 3 games over .500 and only 2.5 out of a playoff spot when our best hitter has been out for a while, one of our best hitters against lhp has been out all season and just overall our offense has been brutal. No matter how good or bad you think this offense is, it's not THIS bad, they'll get better and a lot better.

 

This team can win this year, there will be no fire sale, so it's time to let that go.

 

 

1st half 2006 (#1 offense in AL)

2nd half 2006 (#9 offense in AL)

1st half 2007 (#13-14 offense in AL)

 

How can anyone argue there is no correlation? Sure, Thome and Pods not being healthy...especially Jim...that's ONE factor.

 

But that doesn't explain Crede, Konerko, Iguchi and Dye all looking like shadows of their former selves.

 

We CAN'T win scoring 3.9 runs per game, we need to at least be in the mid 4's like the 2005 team. I willing to adopt the idea Sweeney can adequately replace Pods, but Thome, Dye, Konerko, Crede and Iguchi all need to pick it up for this team to go anywhere.

Edited May 13, 2007 by caulfield12

[beck72]

Very well...and I'll continue to say that we're not in that top or elite group with Boston, Cleveland, Detroit, and possibly the Yankees and Angels. We're very similar to the A's, if I had to make a comparison.

 

I didn't think Minnesota would struggle this badly. They will give it another month, but they have the same issue with Torii Hunter we have with Buehrle and Dye.

 

Our offense is still the worst in the AL after the last 2/3rd's of a season. It's difficult to argue with that measuring stick. We're 4th in pitching, ERA-wise. I doubt we can be first, but we need to stay 3-5 in that area and get our hitting/runs scored somewhere around 7-10th in the AL to have any chance.

 

Are we closer to being an "elite" team or a rebuilding team? I would say the latter. It's unfortunate, because we have the makings of a great bullpen, to go with our strong starting pitching.

 

Crede, Konerko, Erstad, Dye and Iguchi have looked really bad recently. Iguchi, Crede and Konerko are all huge question marks to me. We can't win without at least two of those three guys hitting.

 

We don't have anything close to resembling prospects at SS or 2B. The jury's out on Anderson and Fields as well, at best. What we do have is lots of pitching prospects, and the more legit prospects you have, the higher the odds that one or two will actually make it and become members of the rotation. I'm encouraged that Honel seems to coming back onto the radar screen as a prospect, and Danks has impressed nearly everyone.

 

We went through a 167-95 stretch of play in 2005 and 2006 (until the All-Star break). We would have won 105 games last year if continued to play like we did in the first half (best offense in the AL). Obviously that didn't happen, for a number of reasons.

 

Since then, we're 51-56. That's an incredible drop-off in the level of play.

 

Which is the prevailing trend? Well, we'll find out in the next 6 weeks, but having KC simply hand us four games out of four doesn't mean we're a good team or that anything is "fixed."

The sox bullpen is young and isn't going anywhere. The starting pitching is strong and should still be there. With those two key ingredients, the sox won't be "rebuilding" any time soon. If your beef is with the offense, that is easier to fix year in and year out than the pitching. Spend some offseason cash on Ichiro and he'd solidify the top of the order for the next 4, 5 yrs.

 

But the hitters the sox have will hit. It's just a matter of the pitching holding up.

[Gregory Pratt]

This fire sale talk is a bunch of horses***. This team has the pitching working right now and all it's going to take is the bats heating up, which you know is going to happen, and this team can easily retake 1st place. I've never seen this level of pessimism over a team that has played like crap and is still 3 games over. Just wait till they bring their A game.

 

We've heard that song before.

 

I'm cautiously optimistic, though.

[Rowand44]

but Thome, Dye, Konerko, Crede and Iguchi all need to pick it up for this team to go anywhere.

As long as Thome is healthy he is fine. As for the rest, every single one of them will get much, MUCH better as the season goes on. Like I said, we're 3 games over .500 when our best hitter has been hurt and our two other best hitters are hitting under .200, it's pretty nuts if you think about it. And it's not like Dye and Paul don't have a history to back them up, both are going to get back close to their career averages, and when they start hitting and Thome gets back watch the hell out. This is a good team that hasn't hit a lick yet and is still hanging around.

[Kyyle23]

1st half 2006 (#1 offense in AL)

2nd half 2006 (#9 offense in AL)

1st half 2007 (#13-14 offense in AL)

 

How can anyone argue there is no correlation? Sure, Thome and Pods not being healthy...especially Jim...that's ONE factor.

 

But that doesn't explain Crede, Konerko, Iguchi and Dye all looking like shadows of their former selves.

 

We CAN'T win scoring 3.9 runs per game, we need to at least be in the mid 4's like the 2005 team. I willing to adopt the idea Sweeney can adequately replace Pods, but Thome, Dye, Konerko, Crede and Iguchi all need to pick it up for this team to go anywhere.

 

Of this group, i think Thome, Dye and Konerko are the players that NEED to be better. And I dont see any reason why they wont. And actually Thome just needs to get healthy, not better.

 

Like i said before, its a long season. These players will be near their career averages before long. And to get to their career averages, they all will have to go on a streak. Hopefully those streaks coincide.

[Gregory Pratt]

As long as Thome is healthy he is fine. As for the rest, every single one of them will get much, MUCH better as the season goes on. Like I said, we're 3 games over .500 when our best hitter has been hurt and our two other best hitters are hitting under .200, it's pretty nuts if you think about it. And it's not like Dye and Paul don't have a history to back them up, both are going to get back close to their career averages, and when they start hitting and Thome gets back watch the hell out. This is a good team that hasn't hit a lick yet and is still hanging around.

 

I can see Konerko repeating 2003. I hope not, but it's a very real possibility.

[Rowand44]

I can see Konerko repeating 2003. I hope not, but it's a very real possibility.

Highly doubt it.

[Gregory Pratt]

Highly doubt it.

 

If someone told me he'd be hovering below .200 into May, I'd have said "Highly doubt it" too.

[caulfield12]

If someone told me he'd be hovering below .200 into May, I'd have said "Highly doubt it" too.

 

 

Or that Crede would have regressed to 2002-03 form...didn't see that one coming either.

 

Iguchi and Dye, we knew, due to their ages, there would be a dropoff, and Dye's decline was inevitable...but Konerko?

 

I just don't like the odds of spending $15 million on Ichiro in his mid 30's.

Edited May 13, 2007 by caulfield12

[Gregory Pratt]

Or that Crede would have regressed to 2002-03 form...didn't see that one coming either.

 

Iguchi and Dye, we knew, due to their ages, there would be a dropoff, and Dye's decline was inevitable...but Konerko?

 

I just don't like the odds of spending $15 million on Ichiro in his mid 30's.

 

I thought Crede would regress. Some people here think not, but I really think so. I'd have dealt him and Dye last offseason.