MMA Thread

[SoxFan562004]

The fight will go down. Affliction needs it badly since so far it's the only interesting fight that's basically confirmed for the card. Jay Hieron-Semtex is interesting and is rumored by MMA Weekly, but I don't think that's a done deal yet.

 

Fedor-Barnett is a joke. Barnett's wrestling is ridiculously overrated as is his sub game, and he hasn't beaten a legit top-level HW since he roided up and beat Randy in 2002. He's got nothing for Fedor. Hopefully after this fight Fedor's entire management team dies in a horrific accident, because that's the only way he's going to the UFC - which really, really, really sucks because Fedor-Lesnar, Fedor-Lyoto, and Fedor-Anderson are all huge wet dream fights. Plus Fedor-Cigano, Fedor-Rashad, Fedor-Shogun, Fedor-Randy, etc. are all entertaining fights. Man I wish he'd come to the UFC... I bet he'll end up going back and forth between Dream and Strikeforce though. Ugh.

Ultimately, like with Boras discussions, it's up to the athlete... if Fedor really wanted to be in the UFC he would be. I think the exclusivity is what it ultimately comes down to.

 

I don't see, as currently structured, how Affliction has much left in the tank after the 3rd show. As far as stability wise they're 3rd behind UFC and Strikeforce and after Barnett/Fedor there's not very many interesting matchups for Fedor left. They will promote Fedor as the guy who beat 5 former UFC champions, but that doesn't work as well when none of them are in the UFC or holding the belt now. Yes, the Belfort/Mosaui fight is great, but the casual fan will care very little to nothing about it, and to last in the long run, they need the casual fan. I guess they can survive a show or two if they sign Tito, but that's going to cost a ton of cash.

[SoxFan562004]

Evans/Rampage are the TUF 10 coaches. White says Rampage wanted the Evans fight more than the title fight at this point. Should make for good TV. Also, saw some reports that Machida turned it down because he wants to fight quicker than Dec.

 

Kind of leaves Machida's opponent in the air... I guess they could go with Shogun, and I am fully aware of his PRIDE career, but a loss to Forrest (I've heard all the excuses, but he still lost the fight) a completely uninspiring win over Coleman and a KO of a not-at-the-top-of-his-game Chuck isn't exactly the greatest resume, but I'm really struggling to find someone who they could put against him in Sept or Oct... ultimately I'm sure they would want to see if Forrest could upset the Spider and make that match (unlikely, but it's MMA, you never know). Spider and Machida won't fight, they're training partners and friends.

 

Maybe if Franklin beats Wand or if Henderson beats Bisping he can jump back to 205.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Ultimately, like with Boras discussions, it's up to the athlete... if Fedor really wanted to be in the UFC he would be. I think the exclusivity is what it ultimately comes down to.

 

I don't see, as currently structured, how Affliction has much left in the tank after the 3rd show. As far as stability wise they're 3rd behind UFC and Strikeforce and after Barnett/Fedor there's not very many interesting matchups for Fedor left. They will promote Fedor as the guy who beat 5 former UFC champions, but that doesn't work as well when none of them are in the UFC or holding the belt now. Yes, the Belfort/Mosaui fight is great, but the casual fan will care very little to nothing about it, and to last in the long run, they need the casual fan. I guess they can survive a show or two if they sign Tito, but that's going to cost a ton of cash.

I think the issue is almost 100% Fedor's management considering the UFC brass and Fedor have never even sat down together. Fedor's team wants a bunch of stuff that doesn't benefit Fedor, so the UFC of course responds coldly.

 

The exclusivity thing I don't see as a big deal on Fedor's side actually, because after Fedor wastes Barnett, there's exactly who left out there? Overeem? That's not much. The UFC would have no problem whatsoever keeping Fedor busy, and the thing is, where Fedor is will be where the top FA HW's in the future will want to go anyway.

 

The biggest obstacle I see it on the Fedor side - if Fedor had realistic management - would be the sambo competitions. I could actually see the UFC allowing that though if it really came down to it. But that would be something that they'd have to be pretty deep in discussion to negotiate on.

 

The biggest problem I see is M-1 wanting to plaster their logos all over the UFC products, and having the UFC build stadiums, and having the UFC bring in Red Devil fighters with M-1 having a hand in matchmaking, and having UFC events in Russia, and allowing M-1 to promote their own events in Russia using UFC's brand as a drawing point. None of that stuff is ever going to fly, and none of it actually benefits Fedor. The only way I see it working out is if the UFC buys out Fedor's commitment to M-1 (at an additional fee of course) and M-1 stays on board in an agent role only.

 

I agree completely on Affliction. They're done, they just don't know it yet. I'd also say they're probably further down the list than just third. If you count the WEC as part of the UFC under the Zuffa umbrella, then IMO it goes: Zuffa, Strikeforce, Dream, Sengoku, Affliction, PFC, and on down that way. The only people that order Affliction are the hardcore fans anyway, and both Japanese shows air on HDNet, stream online, and have their fights put up everywhere just like everyone else. So really, the Japanese shows I think have almost as much appeal to the hardcores in North America as Affliction and get just as much exposure in North America as Affliction, with the difference being the Japanese shows don't cost money and are held much more frequently.

 

I really think Tito or no Tito they're screwed. Strikeforce's model is soooo much better it's not even funny, and this was even before the TV deal. Strikeforce can spread out the same amount of cash that Affliction pays Sylvia and use it to pay Diaz, Shields, Smith, Radach, etc. and more. They got more fights out of it, and they get better fights out of it. Strikeforce knows they can put a couple C-level sluggers in there and those fights will appeal to the casual fan more than Fedor will. The hardcores are a non-factor since they're watching both shows anyway.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Evans/Rampage are the TUF 10 coaches. White says Rampage wanted the Evans fight more than the title fight at this point. Should make for good TV. Also, saw some reports that Machida turned it down because he wants to fight quicker than Dec.

 

Kind of leaves Machida's opponent in the air... I guess they could go with Shogun, and I am fully aware of his PRIDE career, but a loss to Forrest (I've heard all the excuses, but he still lost the fight) a completely uninspiring win over Coleman and a KO of a not-at-the-top-of-his-game Chuck isn't exactly the greatest resume, but I'm really struggling to find someone who they could put against him in Sept or Oct... ultimately I'm sure they would want to see if Forrest could upset the Spider and make that match (unlikely, but it's MMA, you never know). Spider and Machida won't fight, they're training partners and friends.

 

Maybe if Franklin beats Wand or if Henderson beats Bisping he can jump back to 205.

Rashad-Rampage is a better fight anyway. Have to pick Rashad there. I think it was a bad move for Rampage because losing to Rashad hurts a lot more than getting embarrassed by Lyoto. I agree it'll make for good TV. It'll also be weird seeing the Wolfslair guys back on TUF for a second season in a row.

 

I think Lyoto gets Shogun, and really it doesn't matter who they feed to Machida. It's kind of like Fedor. Top contender? Take your shot. Doesn't matter anyway. The only thing I hope the UFC does NOT do is give him a top young fighter like Jonny Bones or Steve Cantwell and risk stunting their development. Those guys need to be built up.

 

PS how much does it suck to be Rich Franklin right now? Anderson owns him twice, basically kicking out of the MW division where he was definitely top-5 in the world, perhaps better. Then he goes and decides to move to the LHW division, but in the process he loses to another MW who Anderson also put in flux (Hendo). After that he decides to become buddy-buddy with Anderson and train with him and Blackhouse, but as soon as he does that, another Blackhouse guy goes and wins the LHW belt. LOL. Poor Rich! You have to feel bad for the guy.

Edited May 29, 2009 by Kenny Hates Prospects

[SoxFan562004]

PS how much does it suck to be Rich Franklin right now? Anderson owns him twice, basically kicking out of the MW division where he was definitely top-5 in the world, perhaps better. Then he goes and decides to move to the LHW division, but in the process he loses to another MW who Anderson also put in flux (Hendo). After that he decides to become buddy-buddy with Anderson and train with him and Blackhouse, but as soon as he does that, another Blackhouse guy goes and wins the LHW belt. LOL. Poor Rich! You have to feel bad for the guy.

Depends on what Rich wants to do, the Blackhouse thing isn't entrenched and I can easily see if he beats Wand going to a new camp or back to American Fighter full time, basically not training with Blackhouse anymore, and the UFC setting him up as a contender at 205, there's money in it for both sides if that happens. At this point I hope Hendo beats Bisping and jumps back to 205, I would have zero problem if they make him an automatic contender at 205.

 

UFC probably won't feed a young up and comer to Machida before Shogun, that's why I think that fight is announced fairly soon. I guess they could have a Shogun/Cane elimination match, but I think they just go with Shogun.

[Hawkfan]

I'm workin at a bar and i need to advertise for the next ufc event, last time i advertised 7:45 undercard fights, but I never saw anything til 9. What time is the first fight going to be central time?

[SoxFan562004]

I'm workin at a bar and i need to advertise for the next ufc event, last time i advertised 7:45 undercard fights, but I never saw anything til 9. What time is the first fight going to be central time?

the PPVs start at 9, undercard fights are only showed if they have time during the PPV. However, this event is in Germany, so there will probably be two feeds, the live one sometime in the afternoon and the normal 9:00 pm starting time

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

I'm workin at a bar and i need to advertise for the next ufc event, last time i advertised 7:45 undercard fights, but I never saw anything til 9. What time is the first fight going to be central time?

Before that, you need to advertise for the WEC card on June 7th.

 

Brown-Faber II...

Another beautiful Jose Aldo destruction...

:mouthwatering

[SoxFan562004]

http://www.mmaweekly.com/absolutenm/templa...77&zoneid=2

 

Looks like they couldn't work out the weight issue for Belfort and Mousasi so he will be fighting Babalu at 205

[SoxFan562004]

Kimbo Slice is a contestant on TUF season 10... mmaweekly.com has it as does pretty much every other mma site

[MHizzle85]

Kimbo Slice is a contestant on TUF season 10... mmaweekly.com has it as does pretty much every other mma site

Wow, that I did not expect. Maybe that's the guy that Rampage didn't like. (Rampage stated he didn't like one guy on his twitter.)

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Just saw that.

 

I have to say, Kimbo has earned serious respect for this. There's no telling how many guaranteed G's the guy gave up from Strikeforce or a Japanese promotion in order to prove himself. Even if he doesn't win one fight I think he deserves his due, unless of course Dana is paying him out the ass for the appearance.

 

Lashley has been rumored too but I highly doubt that one since he's got that Sapp freakshow fight lined up.

[SoxFan562004]

Just saw that.

 

I have to say, Kimbo has earned serious respect for this. There's no telling how many guaranteed G's the guy gave up from Strikeforce or a Japanese promotion in order to prove himself. Even if he doesn't win one fight I think he deserves his due, unless of course Dana is paying him out the ass for the appearance.

 

Lashley has been rumored too but I highly doubt that one since he's got that Sapp freakshow fight lined up.

basically my thought on it too. Kimbo doesn't seem to have any chin, so his window to make money in MMA is probably limited and he gave up some decent paydays in Japan or Strikeforce to attempt this, where I believe all these guys promised is a fight on the Finale, often untelevised. Another smart move by Zuffa, this should draw some more casual fans to their show.

[zenryan]

What a joke.

 

TUF is already a POS show but this is just comical.

 

 

I dont think Kimbo is giving up much actually from Strikeforce. Strikeforce already told Kimbo he would have to work his way up. Shoot, Strikeforce is going to have Roger Gracie start in their Challenger Series promotion so I doubt they were giving Kimbo that much.

[SoxFan562004]

What a joke.

 

TUF is already a POS show but this is just comical.

 

 

I dont think Kimbo is giving up much actually from Strikeforce. Strikeforce already told Kimbo he would have to work his way up. Shoot, Strikeforce is going to have Roger Gracie start in their Challenger Series promotion so I doubt they were giving Kimbo that much.

maybe strikeforce, but i believe the gate and TV ratings for the freak show "super hulk" tournament were good, so Kimbo would have had a good market there.

 

I completely disagree with you about TUF.

[zenryan]

maybe strikeforce, but i believe the gate and TV ratings for the freak show "super hulk" tournament were good, so Kimbo would have had a good market there.

 

I completely disagree with you about TUF.

 

 

Was Kimbo offered to be in that tournament? I'm starting to think there wasnt a market for him in Japan or he would be over there right now.

 

 

I think TUF has run its course. The first few seasons were good but now its just a mess. Mostly average fighters who get drunk and embarrass themselves. There might be a very good fighter that comes thru once in awhile. Mac Danzig ran right thru the TUF cast and he'll be lucky to ever get to "gatekeeper" status.

[SoxFan562004]

Was Kimbo offered to be in that tournament? I'm starting to think there wasnt a market for him in Japan or he would be over there right now.

 

 

I think TUF has run its course. The first few seasons were good but now its just a mess. Mostly average fighters who get drunk and embarrass themselves. There might be a very good fighter that comes thru once in awhile. Mac Danzig ran right thru the TUF cast and he'll be lucky to ever get to "gatekeeper" status.

the quality of fighters isn't as good, I'll grant you that, but I'm entertained by it and it's probably necessary so people recognize some of the fighters on the Spike cards.

[zenryan]

the quality of fighters isn't as good, I'll grant you that, but I'm entertained by it and it's probably necessary so people recognize some of the fighters on the Spike cards.

 

 

When I watch its really only to see the coaches.

 

Dan Henderson has always been a favorite of mine so this season isnt that bad.

 

[SoxFan562004]

When I watch its really only to see the coaches.

 

Dan Henderson has always been a favorite of mine so this season isnt that bad.

Love Hendo, fight for fight he's had one of the toughest careers, he's awesome.

 

FWIW, Dana is in LA at a meeting with Lorenzo Fertitta (sp?) working on a deal that "will change the face of MMA and UFC." Usually when he says this it is a big business deal and it honks MMA message board fan boys off. So I'm speculating a big sponsor (like Reebok or Nike) or a big foreign TV deal

Edited June 2, 2009 by SoxFan562004

[MHizzle85]

IMO, I think this season of TUF has been pretty good. More enjoyable than the last couple of seasons.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

Love Hendo, fight for fight he's had one of the toughest careers, he's awesome.

 

FWIW, Dana is in LA at a meeting with Lorenzo Fertitta (sp?) working on a deal that "will change the face of MMA and UFC." Usually when he says this it is a big business deal and it honks MMA message board fan boys off. So I'm speculating a big sponsor (like Reebok or Nike) or a big foreign TV deal

Actually I agree with Dana on his previous huge announcements that have pissed people off. The video games, action figures, all the other merchandise, the Bud Light sponsorship, Lorenzo taking on major role in sanctioning and international expansion, etc. have all done and will continue to do enormous things for the brand itself, and the stronger the brand is, the more it will benefit the sport as a whole. I think some fans simply don't realize that, and I'm guessing it's because they're stupid. Sorry, but Lorenzo stepping in to, among other things, resolve the AKA issue, expand the sport and brand globally, and push through sanctioning are far more important long-term than Fedor is. Speaking of which, the first step to MMA in Madison Square Garden has been taken. That is HUGE.

 

I'm hoping this announcement is a network deal, preferably one that showcases a weekly or bi-monthly fight card, and not some sort of new fight hype or catch-up program like Countdown or Unleashed. Or maybe a new or revised deal with Versus to show more WEC events, because WEC really needs to put on more shows since they're so unbelievably awesome.

 

PS agree on Hendo. Your comment reminded me what a tough dude he is, I almost forgot. He kind of flies under the radar. Just looking at his fight finder is like reading a who's who of MMA. Anderson, Franklin, Renzo, Nog, Wandy, Arona, Ninja, Rampage, Babalu, Newton, Belfort... it just goes on and on. How many future HOF-caliber fighters can you possibly fit into one resume? The only current names he's missing are guys like Shogun, Fedor, Lyoto, Randy, etc. but I think that 3 of those fights could possibly happen. And now that I think of it, I'd be 1000X more interested in Hendo vs. Randy than Nog vs. Randy. I know they used to train together and are probably friends, but he did fight Rampage, and Randy is game, so I really hope that one happens at some point. I still think Randy has another few fights in him.

[zenryan]

PS agree on Hendo. Your comment reminded me what a tough dude he is, I almost forgot. He kind of flies under the radar. Just looking at his fight finder is like reading a who's who of MMA. Anderson, Franklin, Renzo, Nog, Wandy, Arona, Ninja, Rampage, Babalu, Newton, Belfort... it just goes on and on. How many future HOF-caliber fighters can you possibly fit into one resume? The only current names he's missing are guys like Shogun, Fedor, Lyoto, Randy, etc. but I think that 3 of those fights could possibly happen. And now that I think of it, I'd be 1000X more interested in Hendo vs. Randy than Nog vs. Randy. I know they used to train together and are probably friends, but he did fight Rampage, and Randy is game, so I really hope that one happens at some point. I still think Randy has another few fights in him.

 

I'd love to see a Henderson/Couture fight at 205.

[SoxFan562004]

very strong Strikeforce card on Showtime tonight starting at 9:00 CT... I just can't believe how many people don't have Showtime!

[MHizzle85]

very strong Strikeforce card on Showtime tonight starting at 9:00 CT... I just can't believe how many people don't have Showtime!

Eh, I don't have any premium channels. I wouldn't watch enough to justify having it. Luckily for me, streams of the fight are my friend.

[SoxFan562004]

Strikeforce with a good card, but to me, the catch weight fight thing is getting a little old, eventually they have to try and push their champions and divisions and their announcers are quickly becoming old WCW Nitro announcers where every fight is the biggest fight ever and every fighter is the best fighter in the world, that gets old very quick.

 

Fedor and Barnett on promoting their PPV, I believe it was part of the deal to let AA on the card since his contract is held by Affliction. Man, Fedor is a bad man, but it's tough to promote him, he lacks the entertainment value outside the ring and stuff like that means alot to grabbing casual fans, especially when the UFC owns most of his old fight footage.

 

Looks like AA might be done. Rogers will enter the top ten with this win, but I don't see him giving any top 10 HW a legit fight, he always has the one punch chance going for him, but AA looked terrible.

 

Diaz looked good again, but Smith's "defense" on his feet was non-existent.

 

Shields is excellent, I would love to see him in the UFC with a deeper 170 division.