And That's A White Sox Loser

[fathom]

Chris Young with another mammoth homer tonight.

[Dick Allen]

Chris Young with another mammoth homer tonight.

That was a great trade.

[Gregory Pratt]

Chris Young with another mammoth homer tonight.

 

That's the sonofab**** that's standing between Morris and a shutout/win. f***!

[Flash Tizzle]

Chris Young with another mammoth homer tonight.

Williams owes this team a player of Chris Young's calibur.

 

Surely if he traded Vazquez after next season he'd receive one, right?

[CWSGuy406]

Couple of comments...

 

-For those expecting Milledge + Pelfrey for Buehrle, keep dreaming. If that offer was on the table this winter, Kenny would have jumped on it right away. You think Minaya is going to offer six years each of the afformentioned players for two-three months of Mark Buehrle?

 

-I think Kenny would be best served trying to find a taker for Contreras, get Jose to waive his NTC and offer a reasonably big contract to Buehrle (5/$75). If the Mets would do Contreras for Milledge straight up, I'd be all over that, and I think Jose would waive his NTC for that (big latin influence on New York including El Duque).

 

-Why is any ire being directed at Javy Vazquez? I know the trade sucks, but he (along with the other four on the starting staff) are the last guys who people should be complaining about. If their ERA wasn't collectively around 4.00, this team would be behind KC.

[caulfield12]

Williams owes this team a player of Chris Young's calibur.

 

Surely if he traded Vazquez after next season he'd receive one, right?

 

What's done is done, CY wasn't going to lead us to the championship last year, and that was our last, best chance to compete for the next 2-3 seasons. KW tried, at least.

 

Couple of comments...

 

-For those expecting Milledge + Pelfrey for Buehrle, keep dreaming. If that offer was on the table this winter, Kenny would have jumped on it right away. You think Minaya is going to offer six years each of the afformentioned players for two-three months of Mark Buehrle?

 

-I think Kenny would be best served trying to find a taker for Contreras, get Jose to waive his NTC and offer a reasonably big contract to Buehrle (5/$75). If the Mets would do Contreras for Milledge straight up, I'd be all over that, and I think Jose would waive his NTC for that (big latin influence on New York including El Duque).

 

-Why is any ire being directed at Javy Vazquez? I know the trade sucks, but he (along with the other four on the starting staff) are the last guys who people should be complaining about. If their ERA wasn't collectively around 4.00, this team would be behind KC.

 

 

Because he represents the future we don't have, thanks to KW.

 

At least it's not poor Erstad that was traded for Young...it would be interesting if it was Rowand, maybe less of the "love" would stick to him in that case!!

[sf_soxfan]

Completely Agree

 

There's nothing that can be done with what we have; we could maybe invert the order just for sh*ts and giggles, but what does that do?

[BearSox]

And That's A White Sox Loser

 

Am I repeating the same day over and over?

[bulokis]

We should change the name of the forum to:

 

And That's A White Sox Loser

 

I am ready for a change. Trade and get prospects now that are almost ready to play. This current team is so frustrating to watch.

[iamshack]

Perhaps Mike Pelfrey and Carlos Gomez, instead of Milledge?

 

And enough of the CY stuff every night.

 

He is GONE. GET over it. QUIT whining about it.

[SoxFan1]

"I feel like I'm watching 9 dead people walking." - Ozzie Guillen

[witesoxfan]

But did you see all the strikeouts Javy Vazquez was able to accumulate?

 

 

It's funny to see posters b**** for minor leaguers to have high K numbers and high speed gun readings, yet when we get to the major league level they bomb out. See Vazquez and the bullpen.

 

Last I checked, Javy had to throw a shutout to win tonight, yet you two are putting any blame on him at all? Just brilliant.

 

He didn't have a good outing, but 4 runs allowed in 6 innings against the 4th best offense and perhaps the most talented lineup in baseball isn't a bad days work. Rip the deal all you want to, but mentioning Vazquez's name in a negative light and ripping him at all in this thread is an absolute joke.

 

And when posters b**** for minor leaguers like that, they are b****ing for Jake Peavy or Jeremy Bonderman or even Matt friggin Garza. Pitchers with Buehrle and Garland's stuff can never dominate over the course of a year, but they can pitch well. Pitchers with Contreras's stuff in 2005 and Vazquez now and maybe Gio have that chance. No one in AAA brings that, and there might be like 5 pitchers in the entire organization that bring that as a starter, and that's a big if. Right now, this is about organizational ineptitude, as KW seems to want power arms that get a ton of strikeouts and Cooper is a pitching coach that tells his pitchers to pitch to contact. You really can't have it both ways.

 

This organization needs to get on the same page up and down.

[santo=dorf]

I've tried defending Javy for a long time. I know he has sexy "peripherals," but he doesn't have what it takes to be a dominant pitcher over a long period of time like Jake Peavy.

 

Last time I checked, Wang is a pretty good pitcher who isn't going to give up 4 runs a game like Javy did in one inning early in the game. He had a very similar outing against the Yanks at home last year where he went 5 innings, gave up 6 hits, 6 walks, 2 earned runs and had 8 K's. Like the Yankees yesterday, the Sox had a 4 run inning early in the game giving him some room to work with. These things balance out in the end.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/boxscore;_ylt=...F?gid=260810104

[Dick Allen]

Last I checked, Javy had to throw a shutout to win tonight, yet you two are putting any blame on him at all? Just brilliant.

 

He didn't have a good outing, but 4 runs allowed in 6 innings against the 4th best offense and perhaps the most talented lineup in baseball isn't a bad days work. Rip the deal all you want to, but mentioning Vazquez's name in a negative light and ripping him at all in this thread is an absolute joke.

 

And when posters b**** for minor leaguers like that, they are b****ing for Jake Peavy or Jeremy Bonderman or even Matt friggin Garza. Pitchers with Buehrle and Garland's stuff can never dominate over the course of a year, but they can pitch well. Pitchers with Contreras's stuff in 2005 and Vazquez now and maybe Gio have that chance. No one in AAA brings that, and there might be like 5 pitchers in the entire organization that bring that as a starter, and that's a big if. Right now, this is about organizational ineptitude, as KW seems to want power arms that get a ton of strikeouts and Cooper is a pitching coach that tells his pitchers to pitch to contact. You really can't have it both ways.

 

This organization needs to get on the same page up and down.

That's a 6.00 ERA and it sucks. He threw so many pitches he had to be lifted. At $12.5 million its not crazy to expect more. Excepting this as not a bad game from him and looking at his strikeouts is something teams have been doing the last 4 seasons with him. The object of the game is to win. Its nice to see DJ question his concentration last night.

[caulfield12]

That's a 6.00 ERA and it sucks. He threw so many pitches he had to be lifted. At $12.5 million its not crazy to expect more. Excepting this as not a bad game from him and looking at his strikeouts is something teams have been doing the last 4 seasons with him. The object of the game is to win. Its nice to see DJ question his concentration last night.

 

Except he's only making $9.5 million, from the Sox.

 

And there are 100 more pressing problems that can be pointed out, besides the results from a fourth starter whose overall stats would be much better than the average MLB 4th starter. It is what it is. We won this exact same type of game last year when our offense scored four runs for Javy early in the game. Expecting our starters to give up 0 or 1 runs per game is simply unrealistic. The harder they try to be too "fine," that's when you'll start seeing 3-5 runs given up per game by starters.

[RME JICO]

"I feel like I'm watching 9 dead people walking." - Ozzie Guillen

He sees dead people.

[caulfield12]

He sees dead people.

 

 

Maybe he was confused after watching POTC: At World's (Wit's) End

[Dick Allen]

Except he's only making $9.5 million, from the Sox.

 

And there are 100 more pressing problems that can be pointed out, besides the results from a fourth starter whose overall stats would be much better than the average MLB 4th starter. It is what it is. We won this exact same type of game last year when our offense scored four runs for Javy early in the game. Expecting our starters to give up 0 or 1 runs per game is simply unrealistic. The harder they try to be too "fine," that's when you'll start seeing 3-5 runs given up per game by starters.

He was the one who got the Sox behing 4 early. Look at Vazquez's White Sox career. He has had the lead in the vast majority of games he has pitched. Last season he had the lead in all but 3 or 4 starts and still sucked. He is what he is. Stop making excuses for his overpaid, overhyped ass.

[BigSqwert]

Anyone still think this is a playoff team? If so, put the crack pipe down.

[caulfield12]

He was the one who got the Sox behing 4 early. Look at Vazquez's White Sox career. He has had the lead in the vast majority of games he has pitched. Last season he had the lead in all but 3 or 4 starts and still sucked. He is what he is. Stop making excuses for his overpaid, overhyped ass.

 

We could single out any of about 15-20 players for blame, KW, Ozzie, JR, the scouting department, Walker, Cooper..."the blame game," whatever you want to call it, the best thing thing KW could do is trade Vazquez and get the equivalent of another Chris Young back.

 

Which basically means KW admitting he was wrong about Vazquez AND Anderson, which is going to be very difficult for him to do...in fact, I think one of the reasons he signed him long-term was to show that this trade was not just about 2006-07 but the long-term future of the White Sox as well.

[iamshack]

We could single out any of about 15-20 players for blame, KW, Ozzie, JR, the scouting department, Walker, Cooper..."the blame game," whatever you want to call it, the best thing thing KW could do is trade Vazquez and get the equivalent of another Chris Young back.

 

Which basically means KW admitting he was wrong about Vazquez AND Anderson, which is going to be very difficult for him to do...in fact, I think one of the reasons he signed him long-term was to show that this trade was not just about 2006-07 but the long-term future of the White Sox as well.

 

I don't care how long Chris Young's homer was last night. I'll take Javy for the the 5 years we'll end up having him over a Mike Cameron clone every day and twice on half-price Mondays.

 

The venom spewed for certain players on here is so ridiculously immature and pathetic. Some of you are so bitter and irritable that you add nothing other than sheer negativity and arrogance. Thanks for all that adds to this forum.

[fathom]

I don't care how long Chris Young's homer was last night. I'll take Javy for the the 5 years we'll end up having him over a Mike Cameron clone every day and twice on half-price Mondays.

 

The venom spewed for certain players on here is so ridiculously immature and pathetic. Some of you are so bitter and irritable that you add nothing other than sheer negativity and arrogance. Thanks for all that adds to this forum.

 

A Mike Cameron clone who's making no money is better than 4 years of Javy. I do find it funny how some people project Ryan Sweeney or Gio to be so damn good, yet they try and make Young sound bad by saying he can only be a Cameron clone.

[iamshack]

A Mike Cameron clone who's making no money is better than 4 years of Javy. I do find it funny how some people project Ryan Sweeney or Gio to be so damn good, yet they try and make Young sound bad by saying he can only be a Cameron clone.

 

I disagree, but hey, that's just me. I'd rather have our pitching solidified with some solid, durable starting pitchers than have CY and "hope" he doesn't finally hit his stride when it's time to pay him. With the offense on this team, having Brian out there in center should have been enough. When KW made that deal, it was with the notion that teams seeking to repeat usually have starting pitching that is tired or injured the following year. He studied the Braves and other teams that went deep into the playoffs and that is what occured. He was trying to win another championship, perhaps at the expense of the future of the ballclub. Simply because it didn't work out last year, and probably won't this year is no reason to condemn the guy now.

 

Move on already.

[fathom]

I disagree, but hey, that's just me. I'd rather have our pitching solidified with some solid, durable starting pitchers than have CY and "hope" he doesn't finally hit his stride when it's time to pay him. With the offense on this team, having Brian out there in center should have been enough. When KW made that deal, it was with the notion that teams seeking to repeat usually have starting pitching that is tired or injured the following year. He studied the Braves and other teams that went deep into the playoffs and that is what occured. He was trying to win another championship, perhaps at the expense of the future of the ballclub. Simply because it didn't work out last year, and probably won't this year is no reason to condemn the guy now.

 

Move on already.

 

Good post about the Anderson impact. KW put all of his chips into Brian Anderson, and it hurts this franchise.

[iamshack]

Good post about the Anderson impact. KW put all of his chips into Brian Anderson, and it hurts this franchise.

 

Well I happen to disagree about Anderson as well. This team was plenty loaded last year to absorb whatever negative impact Brian brought on by his struggling at the plate. I am a firm believer that he neutralized his weak offense by his spectacular defense. The pitching stafff, the offense in the second half, alot of things let this franchise down last year. It wasn't about one trade. It was about our division getting ridiculously strong, and out pitching letting us down. But it's too damn late to continue crying over spilt milk.