DBAHO Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 It's not suprising. Hopefully we move away from taking "safe college pitchers" early on in drafts now, and make some picks with some actualy high end potential. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanne Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 (edited) Shaffer, at the helm when the White Sox drafted such stalwarts as Jack McDowell (1987), Joe Crede (1996) and Mark Buehrle (1998), has been with the organization for all but two seasons since 1969 What's that saying about a blind squirrel..... I still blame KW. Shaffer was simply (in your best Brando voice)..."an errand boy..." It'll be the same s*** next year....with 15 pitchers being taken with the first 18 picks or some crap like that...then back the the blind squirrel theory. Edited June 23, 2007 by Wanne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 23, 2007 Author Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(Wanne @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 08:11 PM) What's that saying about a blind squirrel..... I still blame KW. Shaffer was simply (in your best Brando voice)..."an errand boy..." It'll be the same s*** next year....with 15 pitchers being taken with the first 18 picks or some crap like that...then back the the blind squirrel theory. I read that but I'm pretty sure McDowell was an Al Goldis/Larry Himes pick. I do know they wanted Mike Harkey but the Cubs took him right before Black Jack. They also wanted Jeff Jackson from Simeon a couple of years later, but Philadelphia selected him, so they had to settle for Frank Thomas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregory Pratt Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 08:20 PM) I read that but I'm pretty sure McDowell was an Al Goldis/Larry Himes pick. I do know they wanted Mike Harkey but the Cubs took him right before Black Jack. They also wanted Jeff Jackson from Simeon a couple of years later, but Philadelphia selected him, so they had to settle for Frank Thomas. That's the nature of the beast, though. I'm not happy with the draft in my lifetime and definitely not in hte last few years but this sort of thing is to be expected. Not signing high end picks for money + durability concerns, however, is what bothers me. Refusing to take risks. Bah! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baines3 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Maybe if Greg Walker was next to go, perhaps we could start hitting again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(chisoxfan79 @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 01:45 PM) Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out, and you can take you can take Mark johnson,Jeff Liefer, Jason Stumm, Joe Borchard, Matt Ginter,Kip Wells, Jason Dellaro, Chris Clemons, Scott Chrisman,Kris honel,Royce Ring,Brian Anderson, Kyle McCullough, and Aaron Poreda with you. I say dish out some money and get the scouting director from the Braves or the Twins Tell him to find the next Jose Reyes while he is at it You leave Liefy out of this! He was never given a full chance! Right now, the favorite seems to be Wilder, I would assume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 11:40 AM) Flash can't be reached for comment, as he has flown himself down to the jungles of Latin America, trying to find the next Liriano. Awesome As for the timing, I would think they wouldn't want to take out the draft head guy before the draft. It would be a bit of a mess otherwise. I am just making that up, but it sounds plausible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gosox41 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(Brian @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 06:37 PM) We had/have scouts? We have guys who cRry the title of 'scout'. It doesn't mean they're any good at it. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quickman Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 hmm, according to this board I thought we had a great farm system. Glad I listened to myself instead of the youth on the board. unfortunately Wilder blows as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitewashed in '05 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Didn't see this article posted, but some good stuff in it. "It doesn't mean my philosophy is any greater than his. It just means at this point and time, we're going to try it my way." KW "We've had our differences in the past and this is the way it is," Shaffer told MLB.com. "He has control and I don't. I probably would have done the same thing if it had been the other way around." Shaffer "That's what they wanted and they are the ones running the show. That's the way things work. When you don't see eye to eye on how things go, someone has to go." Shaffer - But the 2007 selections featured far more of Williams' input and direction than in the past, with a move toward players with a greater level of raw talent to be developed by the organization and not necessarily the more polished collegiate player. Link The last part from the article is what everyone has been screaming for. We'll see how they do. KW has a good eye with talent for the most part, but like everyone says if he is going to get involved he needs to do more than just give an order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBAHO Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(quickman @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 01:33 PM) hmm, according to this board I thought we had a great farm system. Glad I listened to myself instead of the youth on the board. unfortunately Wilder blows as well. 1 - Who has said on Soxtalk that we have a "great" farm system? I think most people have said it would be "average" at best. Decent depth with the pitching, but the position prospects obviously lacking. 2 - Why does Wilder blow as well? QUOTE(Whitewashed in @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 02:04 PM) The last part from the article is what everyone has been screaming for. We'll see how they do. KW has a good eye with talent for the most part, but like everyone says if he is going to get involved he needs to do more than just give an order. You have to ask yourselves, would we have taken Nevin Griffith if Shaffer was still in charge of our draft in the 3rd round? I don't think we would of, to be honest. So I think in that sense, people were definitely happier with our draft this time around (well at least earlier on), so I think we might be making some progress there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 In a surprise move, KW will hire himself as the head of scouting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 (edited) I love how KW said" He is tired of the safe pick" yet the Sox will not draft a high talent Boras client for example just like in this years draft and Schaffer was not involved in Porada pick. Sox management is in total denial. Edited June 23, 2007 by Soxfest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gosox41 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(quickman @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 10:33 PM) hmm, according to this board I thought we had a great farm system. Glad I listened to myself instead of the youth on the board. unfortunately Wilder blows as well. I hear you. There's certain people that post here and elsewhere that would jump on people for questioning KW over the last 6 years. Something about how he inherited a mess from Schu and it takes years to fix. Also something about Borchard and Rowand and jock straps. But I digress. The proof of the pitifulness of the Sox farm system is obvious and has been for years. Schu's farm systems were a lot more productive then KW's. And while Schu was not a great GM, at least he drafted some major league talent.. Firing Schafer is a good start, but this whole system needs a complete overhaul. It's time to hire outside the organization ideally from a team that consistently produces major league talent. It's also time to follow hte blueprints of the teams (ie more scouts) and get something going here. Bob QUOTE(Soxfest @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 06:17 AM) I love how KW said" He is tired of the safe pick" yet the Sox will not draft a high talent Boras client for example just like in this years draft and Schaffer was not involved in Porada pick. Sox management is in total denial. I have this to say to KW: I'm sick of the stupid picks. Safe or high risk/high reward, why spend $1.5 million on a reliever when you could have had a Blanton? Stuff like that is what kills you. Almost any pitcher can be a reliever, in fact most ML relievers today used to be starters. But it's hard to find good quality starting pitching. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSOX45 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(danman31 @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 09:18 PM) Awesome As for the timing, I would think they wouldn't want to take out the draft head guy before the draft. It would be a bit of a mess otherwise. I am just making that up, but it sounds plausible. Not likely. Shaffer has probably been working on scouting those kids thoroughly since late October. By axing him before the draft that pretty much takes away a lot of information gathered, especially when the estimated number of players that each organization looks at is around 700. This was the right time if any to axe Duane Shaffer. Hopefully whoever replaces him knows how to draft good young talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(Soxfest @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 11:17 AM) I love how KW said" He is tired of the safe pick" yet the Sox will not draft a high talent Boras client for example just like in this years draft and Schaffer was not involved in Porada pick. Sox management is in total denial. KW wasn't involved in the Poreda pick either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sayitaintso Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(WHITESOXRANDY @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 11:42 AM) Now, who's going to pick our Matt Bush, Bryan Bullington or Kris Benson ? Damn the luck. per rotoworld: I just thought that this was interesting since you mentioned him yesterday. I didn't know he could pitch. Matt Bush-SS- Padres Jun. 23 - 9:13 am et Converted shortstop Matt Bush threw 94-98 mph while striking out two in a scoreless inning during a extended spring training game on Friday. "He's been the talk of minicamp," said Mike Wickham, assistant to Vice President Grady Fuson. Bush will continue to work as a reliever and could make an impact on the major league roster in 2008.Source: San Diego Union-Tribune Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SadChiSoxFanOptimist Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Replacing Schaeffer should be step 1 in a remaking the entire talent selection and development efforts of the Chicago White Sox. The problems run much deeper than Schaeffer...and extend thru talent selection and player development organizations and philosophies. This team needs to reexamine and determine its team philosophies -- speed/defense/grinder ball or "power ball" -- then build their organizations to realize the selected philosophies. That may mean selecting new scouts/checkers, minor league coaches and instructors and, yes, major league manager/coaching staff members. Every aspect of the team must be aligned and optimized. So yes, Schaeffer is gone. There still much to be done for our Sox to catch up to the scouting and talent development capabilities of Detroit, Minnesota and Arizona. This should have started years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danman31 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 QUOTE(CWSOX45 @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 08:12 AM) Not likely. Shaffer has probably been working on scouting those kids thoroughly since late October. By axing him before the draft that pretty much takes away a lot of information gathered, especially when the estimated number of players that each organization looks at is around 700. This was the right time if any to axe Duane Shaffer. Hopefully whoever replaces him knows how to draft good young talent. So you say not likely and then agree with me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
29thandPoplar Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 This Leland Maddox guy they're thinking about adding from the Red's scouting operation was reassigned not too long ago from amateur to pro scouting. He is based in Charlotte NC so the Sox obviously know him. He has been with the Reds for 7-8 years and was with the Pirates before that. Supposedly a very respected guy with a good eye for pro talent. Although it is fair to say Cincy hasn't been that good. If this speculation is true then maybe Williams wants to move somebody internally into Shaffer's spot and then add some pro scouting talent. We'll see what happens, I would welcome an outsider coming in for a different perspective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 (edited) QUOTE(sayitaintso @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 10:19 AM) per rotoworld: I just thought that this was interesting since you mentioned him yesterday. I didn't know he could pitch. Matt Bush-SS- Padres Jun. 23 - 9:13 am et Converted shortstop Matt Bush threw 94-98 mph while striking out two in a scoreless inning during a extended spring training game on Friday. "He's been the talk of minicamp," said Mike Wickham, assistant to Vice President Grady Fuson. Bush will continue to work as a reliever and could make an impact on the major league roster in 2008.Source: San Diego Union-Tribune Didn't work so well w/ Jason Dellaero or Brooks Kieschnick. Quick thought: Why not add Uribe to the bullpen? Edited June 24, 2007 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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