whitesoxfan101 Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 (edited) QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jul 20, 2007 -> 03:39 PM) I also knew that all the Kings/Lakers series were fixed. I never had any real evidence or vindication, but it was always in the back of my mind. Remember when Doug Christie's chin fouled Kobe's elbow? Yeah. That's the play a lot of people remember. Game 6 was the worst though, Lakers shot 27 free throws in the 4th quarter alone, Vlade fouled out, Pollard fouled out, Webber had 5 fouls, and Shaq had 4 and was never really in any foul trouble, so the Lakers 5 field goals made to the Kings 10 in the 4th quarter of a game that was tied after 3 wasn't enough. And no, I don't know that off hand, I am reading off the box score and recap in the nba.com archives. Edited July 20, 2007 by whitesoxfan101 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EvilMonkey Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 There are 'mystery' fould in every game. Refs making a call where there are 5 players between the ref and the supposed foul. They 'assume' alot, and thus are wrong alot. However this doesn't suprise me. I hope the league had a good vetting process for the refs and that this guy went to some extreme measures to get around it, or Stern may need some Rolaids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 3 minutes of searching on Google, and you find that the infamous 2002 game 6 was reffed by #27 Dick Bavetta , #16 Ted Bernhardt , and #26 Bob Delaney. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan101 Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Jul 20, 2007 -> 05:00 PM) 3 minutes of searching on Google, and you find that the infamous 2002 game 6 was reffed by #27 Dick Bavetta , #16 Ted Bernhardt , and #26 Bob Delaney. So? I doubt this ref today is the only one doing this stuff, he's just the only one (so far) to get caught. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santo=dorf Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 This response brings a question to my mind. I'm by no means singling you out, B>W, because I've heard plenty of people say the same thing, but my question to everyone is, if you truly believe that the games are fixed, why are you watching? I thought you were going to ask "why don't you prove it?" Seriously B>W, if you can guarantee, like testify in court, that NCAA officials are worse, what is holding you back? I would love to have the games cleaned up. Please come forward to the FBI with your information. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 A few notables. LA Times piece: Donaghy was one of three referees who worked the infamous NBA game between the Detroit Pistons and Indiana Pacers in November 2004, in which nine players were suspended for a skirmish between the teams that escalated into a brawl with fans in Auburn Hills, Mich. Tribune: Donaghy, 40, has officiated 772 regular-season games over 13 seasons. One of four NBA officials to attend Cardinal O'Hara High School in suburban Philadelphia, Donaghy worked 68 regular-season games last season, including four Bulls games. Donaghy also worked five playoff games, none in the conference finals or NBA Finals. AP: Donaghy, who reportedly has resigned, was an NBA official for 13 years. He officiated 68 games in the 2005-06 season and 63 games in 2006-07, according to the Elias Sports Bureau. He also worked 20 playoff games, including five last season - Pistons-Magic on April 23; Warriors-Mavericks on April 27; Suns-Lakers on April 29; Nets-Raptors on May 4; and Spurs-Suns on May 12. Those studying Donaghy's games might have noticed some trends. When the home team was favored by 0-4½ points, it went 5-12 against the spread in games officiated by Donaghy this season, according to Covers.com, a Web site that tracks referee trends. Home underdogs were 1-7 against the spread when it was 5-9.5 points. Donaghy was part of a crew working the Heat-Knicks game in New York in February when the Knicks shot 39 free throws to the Heat's eight, technical fouls were called on Heat coach Pat Riley and assistant Ron Rothstein, and the Knicks won by six. New York was favored by 4½. If he gave the Knicks an extra win, he cost us Greg Oden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jul 21, 2007 -> 01:38 PM) If he gave the Knicks an extra win, he cost us Greg Oden. Interesting point. He may have thrown other drafts out of whack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Jul 20, 2007 -> 03:31 PM) I also knew that all the Kings/Lakers series were fixed. I never had any real evidence or vindication, but it was always in the back of my mind. Remember when Doug Christie's chin fouled Kobe's elbow? Yeah. All those years, the Kings were the best team in the NBA. I felt so bad for Webber. After the Bulls, that was my favorite team. It was Bibby, and I think it was his nose; Kobe just went gangbusters into him trying to get the ball on an inbound, elbowed him in the face, and then got a foul called on Bibby. That was one of the most disappointing times I recall ever watching the NBA. It actually turned me off the game for a little bit just because of how blatant it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LosMediasBlancas Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 Surprising this kind of thing doesn't happen more often. How difficult would it be to track down a ref, or umpire and threaten him. Who is gonna protect that ref? The cops? Pfft, how exactly and for how long? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines Donaghy is always involved in games that have strange circumstances and outcomes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mplssoxfan Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 QUOTE(kyyle23 @ Jul 21, 2007 -> 03:23 PM) http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines Donaghy is always involved in games that have strange circumstances and outcomes Always might be too strong, but here's Bill Simmons' take on the situation. Suns fans, if you have tears, prepare to shed them now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan101 Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 http://test.denverpost.com/sports/ci_6434030','231 This is a classic case of an article that somehow buries a glaring lead. According to a source, the NBA has been aware of the FBI investigation since January and had suspicions regarding Donaghy and gambling. Well Mr. Stern, the man who orchestrated the idea of the NBA Draft Lottery and the Ewing frozen envelope, WHY was this guy reffing games after January? Why was allowed to be the ref of five PLAYOFF games, including the epically poor officiated game 3 of the Spurs/Suns series, when you had already known for 3 months plus at that point that Donaghy had the FBI on his ass? That is just plain sickening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vandy125 Posted July 23, 2007 Author Share Posted July 23, 2007 Donaghy getting threatened Unsurprisingly, Donaghy is getting threats now, but to add to this is this interesting quote: The Daily News reported Sunday, citing unidentified law enforcement sources, that Donaghy will cooperate with authorities and possibly name other officials and players involved in the betting scandal. So, now we may have more officials and players involved. This just keeps getting worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan101 Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 QUOTE(vandy125 @ Jul 23, 2007 -> 08:44 AM) Donaghy getting threatened Unsurprisingly, Donaghy is getting threats now, but to add to this is this interesting quote: So, now we may have more officials and players involved. This just keeps getting worse. Not surprising though. The odds of this going on, but just one single official being the only party involved are slim to none and slim left town. I have doubts as to if players are involved too, but I'd be surprised if there weren't other refs involved. Just too unlikely it's isolated to this one ref. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 This is everything that Stern and his sh** eating grin have been laughing off for the past 20 years. You have a serious problem when the integrity of the game is questioned, as it has been for a while. The problem increases 1000X when the integrity of the game is compromised, Stern is going to have quite an uphill battle to regain the respect of the fans that pay to watch this game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mplssoxfan Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 If the Association was aware since January that Donaghy was under investigation and allowed him to work games, then every fan who attended those games deserves a full refund and the entire executive offices of the Association should resign forthwith. I realize that none of this will happen, but they suits in New York should realize that most of the people who were on the fence about the quality of play and officiating just jumped off the fence and are walking away. I let my partial season tickets lapse a few years ago, but it'll be a very long time before I pay for an NBA ticket, if indeed I ever do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo's Drinker Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 QUOTE(Mplssoxfan @ Jul 23, 2007 -> 02:30 PM) If the Association was aware since January that Donaghy was under investigation and allowed him to work games, then every fan who attended those games deserves a full refund and the entire executive offices of the Association should resign forthwith. I realize that none of this will happen, but they suits in New York should realize that most of the people who were on the fence about the quality of play and officiating just jumped off the fence and are walking away. I let my partial season tickets lapse a few years ago, but it'll be a very long time before I pay for an NBA ticket, if indeed I ever do. Harsh but somewhat true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo's Drinker Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 This ref has his life threatened and some lunatic will probably kill him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mplssoxfan Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 QUOTE(Jimbo's Drinker @ Jul 23, 2007 -> 02:56 PM) Harsh but somewhat true. Harsh, yes, but that's how I feel, and I'm sure I'm not alone. The only thing I can see is that if the FBI told the NBA that they needed more time to make a case against some other people involved and would you please shut up about it -- then I understand, I guess. Still, though, the NBA should have told the FBI that Donaghy wouldn't be working any playoff games, so they better get their investigation wrapped up by then. Stern has a lot of work to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo's Drinker Posted July 23, 2007 Share Posted July 23, 2007 I just wonder who else is involved, please let it be James Posey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 24, 2007 Share Posted July 24, 2007 (edited) Did Tim Donaghy fix Game 3 of the Suns vs Spurs? Edited July 24, 2007 by kyyle23 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkBomber Posted July 24, 2007 Share Posted July 24, 2007 I was discussing this at work today and became curious if any other sports have been fixed on this level. I honestly must have been too naive but I always doubted professional sports were fixed. I had the friends that always said the fix was in or that Vegas calls the shots. My question is, how often do you guys think this happens and in what other sports? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesoxfan101 Posted July 24, 2007 Share Posted July 24, 2007 QUOTE(DrunkBomber @ Jul 23, 2007 -> 09:28 PM) I was discussing this at work today and became curious if any other sports have been fixed on this level. I honestly must have been too naive but I always doubted professional sports were fixed. I had the friends that always said the fix was in or that Vegas calls the shots. My question is, how often do you guys think this happens and in what other sports? Well among the 4 major sports, IMO it is just about impossible to fix hockey and baseball like this. Football is somewhat possible, but that is another sport that would be very hard to fix. The one thing you could say if there is holding on every play, but besides that.....I mean Super Bowl 40 was as bad as it gets for officials, and even Mike Holmgren rightly said "maybe we would have won if not for the guys in the striped shirts", but who knows. The NFL is the most likely sport to be "run by Vegas" since, as much as people hate to admit it, gambling is the ONLY reason the NFL is so popular, but to fix a football game without it being obvious would be very hard to do. Basketball is the one game where the officials directly affect almost every game, and every official calls a game different, and that is why it will always have problems with integrity questions and the refs. I bet this isn't the first time it's happened, but it's so hard to prove. It just so happened this time, Donaghy got into such a deep hole that he ended up making it obvious for the investigators. The NBA is never going to be the same though now that the conspiracy theorists have been proven right, the NCAA has had stuff like with CCNY and Arizona State, but not only is this the first NBA gambling scandal, but it's the first at any level I can remember with the ref as the culprit. Strange stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkBomber Posted July 24, 2007 Share Posted July 24, 2007 Well in baseball, lets say someone wanted to bet the over/under. The homeplate umpire could call a smaller strike zone to try to force the game to go over and vice versa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted July 24, 2007 Share Posted July 24, 2007 QUOTE(DrunkBomber @ Jul 23, 2007 -> 11:10 PM) Well in baseball, lets say someone wanted to bet the over/under. The homeplate umpire could call a smaller strike zone to try to force the game to go over and vice versa. Its easier to fix a game through the players than it is through the umpires. Even if an umpire opens up or shrinks the strike zone, he still doesnt have control of what the pitcher and hitter are going to do. If the zone is tight, the hitter still may swing at a pitch he percieves to be good and ground out, and if the zone is wide open, the hitter could get a hanging curvevball and go yard. Baseball is a really unpredictable sport, i think it would be really hard for an ump to control an outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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