Duane Shaffer Fires on KW

[Dick Allen]

Well to be honest, with that set of drafts we were coming off horrible seasons and had some top 10 draft picks.

 

McDowell was number 5 overall in 87. He was a stud in the college world series.

Ventura was next year, and if you look at his college numbers the guy was dominating.

Thomas was the next year.

Then Alex Fernandez, who won the golden spikes award that year.

 

Being bad over a period of years is a great way of retooling the old minor league system. Trust me, unless we are totally incompetent. If we are bad for a few years, our minor league system will go from baren to impressive in a short period of time. Its the nature of draft position. The only new factor these days is the boras factor.

They also got very lucky. They really wanted Mike Harkey, but the Cubs took him, so they had to settle for Black Jack. They also wanted Jeff Jackson, but the Phillies took the Simeon High School bust, and the Sox took Frank Thomas. I think Fernandez was drafted by Milwaukee or someone earlier and didn't sign. They did pick up guys like Bere and Durham in later rounds. Himes also picked up Roberto Hernandez from the Angels for minor league crap which was a coup.

[heirdog]

Surprise, surprise.. another Sox employee who has/had issue with Kenny. It's to bad that Kenny is able to continue to hide behind doors about this stuff. Personally, I can't wait till he is canned and all the real dirt is shaken out of the executive rugs.

Kudos to Duane for comparing Kenny to Larry Himes. I'm sure Kenny flipped a few tables after reading that one.

 

I have to admit I'm as big a Kenny fan as there is...maybe its the fact that he helped us win a championship but Steff, you seem to know more than a lot of people so I will defer to your assessment of what is happening behind the scenes but I have to challenge your one comment above...

 

Does Kenny need to show more tact in the media? Absolutely

Does Kenny need to take some accountability for this team? Definitely, and he has to a degree

Does Kenny hide behind doors? Definitely not

[Steff]

Does Kenny hide behind doors? Definitely not

 

 

Months ago Kenny openly put Duane on notice attempting to blame him for the complete state of s***tiness rather then man up and admit what anyone who's watched baseball for more than 5 minutes knew. Only yesterday did Kenny FINALLY admit his plan backfired. He definitely hid until he could hide no more.

[29andPoplar]

The whole scouting department sucks. I just hate the fact that the org replaced him with someone they fired before and has had worse drafts!

 

Here is a link to a Baseball America article about Laumann and Shaffer:

 

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/majors/news/264338.html

 

Laumann wasn't fired back in 2003, he was reassigned. He butted heads with Shaffer. I was told Laumann felt Shaffer was micromanaging him and assigning him to work (scout) colleges more than high schools. If this is true, and I believe the guy who told me wasn't BS'ing, it tracks with KW's philosophy of wanting potentially higher impact players. While I don't wish to generalize, if you are looking to hit more home runs with draft picks, generally it's with players who haven't fully developed. Logic says that means more HS players than college guys. Note that Baseball American has termed Laumann's departure in Nov. 2003 from the scouting director role attributable to "political reasons".

 

It is not necessarily true of course that college players can't have high ceilings but generally impact players that can be found later in the draft are guys who are still in HS.

 

I will post further on this in a few minutes, but Laumann was responsible for the drafts in 2001, 2002, and 2003. I will note who they drafted. Open for debate is how much latitude Laumann had because I believe (but am not 100% certain) he reported to Shaffer and not Williams directly. They "promoted" Shaffer to a Sr. Scouting/Advisory role when Laumann took the scouting director job.

[hitlesswonder]

I will post further on this in a few minutes, but Laumann was responsible for the drafts in 2001, 2002, and 2003. I will note who they drafted. Open for debate is how much latitude Laumann had because I believe (but am not 100% certain) he reported to Shaffer and not Williams directly. They "promoted" Shaffer to a Sr. Scouting/Advisory role when Laumann took the scouting director job.

 

Yeah, I just saw who the Sox drafted in 2001 and 2002 and I guess those were better than the other drafts -- I retract my earlier statement. I was focused on the first round picks which were just as bad as any other draft. Still wish the Sox had gone outside the organization to bring someone new in.

 

[29andPoplar]

Yeah, I just saw who the Sox drafted in 2001 and 2002 and I guess those were better than the other drafts -- I retract my earlier statement. I was focused on the first round picks which were just as bad as any other draft. Still wish the Sox had gone outside the organization to bring someone new in.

No problem hitless, here is the entire 2001 draft, I will post 2002 and 2003 in a few minutes:

 

1. Kris Honel, rhp, Providence Catholic HS, New Lenox, Ill. (Choice from Marlins‹16th‹as compensation for Type A free agent Charles Johnson).

1. (Choice to Indians as compensation for Type A free agent Sandy Alomar).

1. Wyatt Allen, rhp, U. of Tennessee (Supplemental pick‹39th‹for loss of Johnson).

2. Ryan Wing, lhp, Riverside (Calif.) CC

3. Jonathan Zeringue, c, White HS, Thibodeaux, La.

4. Jay Mattox, of, Conway (Ark.) HS

5. Andy Gonzalez, ss, Florida Air Academy, Melbourne, Fla.

6. Stevie Daniel, 2b/ss, U. of Tennessee

7. Brandon Camardese, lhp, Chaminade-Madonna HS, Cooper City, Fla.

8. Andrew Fryson, rhp, Wallace State (Ala.) JC

9. Jim Bullard, lhp, UC Santa Barbara

10. Tim Bittner, lhp, Marist U.

11. Tim Huson, 3b, Central Arizona JC

12. Chistopher Stewart, c, Riverside (Calif.) CC

13. Brian Sager, rhp, Georgia Tech

14. Matt Mitchell, rhp, JC of Lake County (Ill.)

15. Anthony Webster, of, Riverside HS, Parsons, Tenn.

16. Chris Young, of, Bellaire (Texas) HS

17. Jason McCurdy, lhp, South Dade HS, Miami

18. Justin Dowdy, lhp, Rancho Bernardo HS, San Diego

19. Wes Swackhamer, of, Delbarton HS, Morristown, N.J.

20. Brian Miller, rhp, Charlotte (Mich.) HS

21. Louis Palmisano, c, St. Thomas Aquinas HS, Fort Lauderdale, Fla.

22. Andrew Salvo, 2b, U. of Delaware

23. Josh Fields, rhp, Mesa (Ariz.) CC

24. Charlie Lisk, c, Fort Mill (S.C.) HS

25. Charles Haeger, rhp, Catholic Central HS, Plymouth, Mich.

26. Dustin Roddy, c, Searcy (Ark.) HS

27. Tom Collaro, of, Piper HS, Sunrise, Fla.

28. Jonathan Forest, rhp, Edouard Montpetit HS, St. Hubert, Quebec

29. Matthew Sibigtroth, ss, Hampshire (Ill.) HS

30. Heath Dobyns, rhp, U. of Northern Colorado

31. Nikolas Lubisich, lhp, Willamette (Ore.) U

32. Heath Castle, lhp, St. Catharine (Ky.) JC

33. Sean Kramer, lhp, Cornwall HS, New Windsor, N.Y.

34. Tim Tisch, lhp, Mesa (Ariz.) JC

35. Mike Moljewski, lhp, De la Salle Collegiate HS, Shelby, Mich.

36. Brent Speck, lhp, Broward (Fla.) JC

37. Juan Razzo, rhp, San Diego CC

38. Kenyatta Davis, of, Harlem Community Academy, Chicago

39. J.D. Johnson, rhp, Del Norte HS, Moriarty, N.M.

40. Chris Roque, 3b, Monsignor Pace HS, Opa Locka, Fla.

41. Chris Martinez, of, Florida Christian HS, Miami

42. Nick McMillan, rhp, El Dorado HS, Placentia, Calif.

43. Freddie LeBron, 2b, New Mexico JC

44. Ken Pridgeon, rhp, Cypress Fair HS, Cypress, Texas

45. Gerron McGary, lhp/of, Texarkana (Texas) JC

46. Roy Irle, rhp, Anderson (Ind.) Madison Heights HS

47. Adrian Casanova, c, Coral Park HS, Miami

48. Josh Crede, 3b, Fatima HS, Westphalia, Mo.

49. Richard Morman, of, Fayetteville (Ark.) HS

50. Zach Jackson, lhp, Seneca Valley HS, Cranberry Township, Pa.

 

[29andPoplar]

Here is 2002:

 

1. Royce Ring, lhp, San Diego State U.

2. Jeremy Reed, of, Long Beach State U.

3. Josh Rupe, rhp, Louisburg (N.C.) JC.

4. Ryan Rodriguez, lhp, Keller (Texas) HS.

5. B.J. LaMura, rhp, Clemson U.

6. Chris Getz, ss, Grosse Pointe (Mich.) South HS.

7. Micah Schnurstein, 3b, Basic HS, Henderson, Nev.

8. Sean Tracey, rhp, UC Irvine.

9. Todd Deininger, rhp, Texas A&M U.

10. Orionny Lopez, rhp, Forest Hill HS, West Palm Beach, Fla.

11. Matt Herring, 1b-of, Georgia Southern U.

12. Jason Ruhlman, lhp, L'Anse Creuse North HS, Macomb, Mich.

13. Demetrius Banks, lhp, Chattahoochee Valley (Ala.) CC.

14. Christian Madson, rhp, Bloomingdale HS, Valrico, Fla.

15. Adam Larson, rhp, Middle Tennessee State U.

16. Daniel Haigwood, lhp, Midland HS, Batesville, Ark.

17. Brandon McCarthy, rhp, Lamar (Colo.) CC.

18. Shane Scoville, c, U. of South Alabama.

19. Paul Keck, c, Granada HS, Pleasanton, Calif.

20. Boone Logan, lhp, Sandra Day O'Connor HS, Helotes, Texas.

21. Seth Morris, of, U. of Kentucky.

22. Eric Keefner, 1b, Mesa (Ariz.) CC.

23. David Beasley, lhp, Cooper City (Fla.) HS

24. Thomas Brice, 1b-of, Faulkner State (Ala.) JC.

25. Jay Marshall, lhp, Jefferson (Mo.) JC.

26. Kris Dufner, ss, U. of Delaware.

27. Michael Bohlander, 1b, Pace U.

28. Hector Ambriz, rhp, Valencia HS, Placentia, Calif.

29. Neil Giesler, 3b, Jasper (Ind.) HS.

30. Jacob Nowlen, rhp, U. of Arkansas-Monticello.

31. Edgar Varela, 3b, Long Beach State U.

32. Rick Hummel, rhp, U. of Indianapolis.

33. Tony Sipp, lhp, Okaloosa-Walton (Fla.) CC.

34. Brandon Durden, lhp, Cook (Ga.) HS.

35. Eric Everly, lhp, Seagoville (Texas) HS.

36. Jason Pilkington, lhp, Central Arizona JC.

37. Jamin Hutchingson, rhp, Fayetteville (Ark.) HS.

38. D.J. Wabick, of, Stagg HS, Palos Park, Ill.

39. Gabriel Casanova, 2b, Coral Park HS, Miami.

40. Dennis Pawelek, rhp, Snow (Utah) JC.

41. Daniel Barone, rhp, Monterey Peninsula (Calif.) JC.

42. Ian Ganzer, rhp, Wellington (Fla.) Community HS.

43. Matthew Sibigtroth, ss, Kishwaukee (Ill.) JC.

44. Ramon Castro, 2b-ss, George Washington HS, Manhattan.

45. Jorge Mico, c, Hialeah (Fla.) HS.

46. Jeremy Paul, c, Trinity International (Ill.) U.

47. Tim Grogan, ss, Covington (Ky.) Catholic HS.

48. Anthony Manuel, 2b, Kishwaukee (Ill.) JC.

49. Fernando Hernandez, rhp, Miami Southwest HS.

50. Matt Payne, rhp, U. of California.

 

 

[29andPoplar]

Here is 2003:

 

15 Brian Anderson of U. of Arizona AZ $1,600,000

2 15 52 Ryan Sweeney of Xavier HS, Cedar Rapids, Iowa IA $785,000

3 15 82 Clint King of U. of Southern Mississippi MS $440,000

4 15 112 Robert Valido ss Coral Park HS, Miami FL $285,000

5 15 142 Matt Nachreiner rhp Round Rock (Texas) HS TX $200,000

6 15 172 Chris Kelly of Pepperdine U. CA $140,000

7 15 202 James Casey rhp Azle (Texas) HS TX $120,000

8 15 232 John Russ rhp Frank Phillips (Texas) JC TX $80,000

9 15 262 David Cook of Miami (Ohio) U. FL $40,000

10 15 292 Fraser Dizard lhp U. of Southern California CA $153,000

11 15 322 Ricky Brooks rhp North Tonawanda (N.Y.) HS NY

12 15 352 Donald Veal lhp Buena HS, Hereford, Ariz. AZ

13 15 382 Wes Hodges ss The Baylor School, Ooltewah, Tenn. TN

14 15 412 Ricardo Nanita of Florida International U. FL

15 15 442 Greg Moviel lhp St. Ignatius HS, Cleveland OH

16 15 472 Cody Dickens rhp Surry (N.C.) CC NC

17 15 502 Guillermo Martinez ss Coral Park HS, Miami FL

18 15 532 Cory Haggerty 2b Cortland State (N.Y.) U. NY

19 15 562 Mike Moat rhp San Diego State U. CA

20 15 592 Jeff Schmidt ss Mira Mesa HS, San Diego CA

21 15 622 Matt Lenderman c Plano (Texas) East HS TX

22 15 652 Travis Doyle lhp Grand Rapids (Mich.) CC MI

23 15 682 John Hurd rhp JC of Southern Idaho ID

24 15 712 Burke Baldwin lhp Neuqua Valley HS, Naperville, Ill. IL

25 15 742 Antoin Gray 3b Southern U. LA

26 15 772 Logan Williamson lhp Penscola (Fla.) Catholic HS FL

27 15 802 Dwayne Pollok rhp Texas A&M U. TX

28 15 832 Van Pope 3b Meridian (Miss.) CC MS

29 15 862 Gerardo Cabrera of Miami-Dade CC South FL

30 15 892 Brandon Lowe 1b Vidalia HS, Mt. Vernon, Ga. GA

31 15 922 Robbie Grinestaff c Jeffersonville (Ind.) HS IN

32 15 952 Josh Morgan of Meridian (Miss.) CC MS

33 15 982 Alex Acevedo ss Dr. Carlos Gonzales HS, Aguada, P.R. PR

34 15 1012 Scott Martin of Delaware State U. DE

35 15 1042 Sean Thompson lhp UC Santa Barbara CA

36 15 1072 Paul Moviel rhp Kishwaukee (Ill.) JC IL

37 15 1102 Neil Giesler 1b Okaloosa-Walton (Fla.) JC FL

38 15 1132 Michael Mendrin lhp Central HS, Fresno, Calif. CA

39 15 1162 Jason Sullivan rhp Joplin (Mo.) HS MO

40 15 1192 Matt Deuchler c James Madison U. VA

41 15 1222 Rolando Acosta ss Pima (Ariz.) CC AZ

42 15 1251 Eric Everly lhp Olney Central (Ill.) JC IL

43 15 1280 Dustin Shafer ss Russell HS, Flatwoods, Ky. KY

44 15 1308 Brandon Johnson 2b Crowder (Mo.) JC MO

45 14 1335 Mitchell Woolf rhp JC of Southern Idaho ID

46 14 1362 Greg Del George ss Monsignor Farrell HS, Staten Island, N.Y. NY

47 14 1389 Richard O'Brien c Catholic HS, Little Rock, Ark. AR

48 14 1416 Mike Alvarez rhp Monsignor Pace HS, Opelika, Fla. FL

49 14 1442 Tim Edmeades 3b Buena Regional HS, Weymouth, N.J. NJ

50 14 1468 Sean Gaston c Brownsburg (Ind.) HS IN

 

 

 

 

 

[29andPoplar]

Quick analysis which I will edit as I review each list -

 

2001, a miss on Honel. Giving up a 1st round pick to sign an aging Sandy Alomar, dumb. Wyatt Allen, this was a guy throwing 95 and higher for Tennessee but then he came into the system and tanked. They did not sign the 3rd or 4th rounders, the catcher went to LSU and I think the Cubs ended up drafting him a couple of years ago and he flamed out. Jay Mattox was a CF prospect and I don't know where his career is.

 

Then you see Ryan Wing who they got back on waivers and although he is 25 now he may still have some promise, he is doing some decent things in Birmingham but he certainly can't be counted as a major leaguer.

 

Fringe guys like Andy Gonzalez and Chris Stewart were chosen.

 

Chris Young stands out, Anthony Webster helped get a key piece in Carl Everett. Lou Palmisano the catcher made the show and Charlie Haeger is there but it's fair to say Haeger didn't throw the knuckler then. They did not sign Palmisano as I recall.

 

Basically 2001 was not a good draft but not a total bust either.

 

2002: Ring, Reed, and Rupe all made the big leagues. Each was traded for other parts. To me it is ok to get guys who show promise that other teams want and you make the trades for things you need. Sox fans loved Reed and lots of teams would've traded for him, Sox got Garcia and that worked out.

 

Then there are some misses, then fringe guys like Sean Tracey and Daniel Haigwood. Brandon McCarthy is in there, as is Boone Logan. Those are some good picks. Jay Marshall is also in the big leagues, they let him go in last yr's Rule 5.

 

2003: Anderson at the top and then Sweeney. OK, not great. Then a whole bunch of misses, power arm guys who they couldn't harness. Nachreiner was the guy with a great arm and bad knees, a gamble that didn't work. Veal and Hodges and Moviel are guys they didn't sign but appear to be decent talent. Veal is in the Cubs system. Other than that I don't see a whole lot from 2003.

 

To me, these drafts are most fairly evaluated 4 years afterwards. I would grade these drafts average at the very best. Slightly below average is probably better. If you look at a 3 yr. snapshot of most other teams drafts you will find much the same thing. Two of the better drafting teams are in our division and that's a problem.

 

The next area to be scrutinized is player development.

Edited July 24, 2007 by 29andPoplar

[heirdog]

Months ago Kenny openly put Duane on notice attempting to blame him for the complete state of s***tiness rather then man up and admit what anyone who's watched baseball for more than 5 minutes knew. Only yesterday did Kenny FINALLY admit his plan backfired. He definitely hid until he could hide no more.

 

Not sure that building a bullpen of power arms and having anemic drafts are the same argument in terms of "manning up" to the poor season. Granted Kenny's plan for the bullpen backfired but most of the recent trades seem to have worked out in the Sox favor. I remember a few months ago that Kenny said that his recent plan is not working but that was because he was trying to win now and retool a farm system that sucked (mostly due to weak drafts...and that is why he put the scouting dept on notice). So, Kenny's error was trying to fix two things at once and not really addressing either fully. So what he hoped was that he could retool the pitching and leave the position players status quo and hope the either produce more or continue to produce...neither has really happened. That doesn't excuse the poor drafts, which in the end fall on the scouting dept...if Kenny had options, he may not have had to try and retool the farm system and just focused on the present.

[SoxFan77]

29th.. ONly one player in 3 years has been worth a damn, maybe 2 if you count Ring.. That is sad, that we wasted 3 years of drafting for nothing. Hell I think we would have been better off, if they would have done a NBA lottery for us to pick players. I know that the draft is a crap shoot, but still you would think you could have gotten something better than that.

[Steff]

Not sure that building a bullpen of power arms and having anemic drafts are the same argument in terms of "manning up" to the poor season. Granted Kenny's plan for the bullpen backfired but most of the recent trades seem to have worked out in the Sox favor. I remember a few months ago that Kenny said that his recent plan is not working but that was because he was trying to win now and retool a farm system that sucked (mostly due to weak drafts...and that is why he put the scouting dept on notice). So, Kenny's error was trying to fix two things at once and not really addressing either fully. So what he hoped was that he could retool the pitching and leave the position players status quo and hope the either produce more or continue to produce...neither has really happened. That doesn't excuse the poor drafts, which in the end fall on the scouting dept...if Kenny had options, he may not have had to try and retool the farm system and just focused on the present.

 

 

They aren't. Which is my point.

 

We do seem to be agreeing on the overall. I just like to lay more blame on Kenny.

[hitlesswonder]

Not sure that building a bullpen of power arms and having anemic drafts are the same argument in terms of "manning up" to the poor season. Granted Kenny's plan for the bullpen backfired but most of the recent trades seem to have worked out in the Sox favor. I remember a few months ago that Kenny said that his recent plan is not working but that was because he was trying to win now and retool a farm system that sucked (mostly due to weak drafts...and that is why he put the scouting dept on notice). So, Kenny's error was trying to fix two things at once and not really addressing either fully. So what he hoped was that he could retool the pitching and leave the position players status quo and hope the either produce more or continue to produce...neither has really happened. That doesn't excuse the poor drafts, which in the end fall on the scouting dept...if Kenny had options, he may not have had to try and retool the farm system and just focused on the present.

Williams is the GM. The farm system is his responsibility. As Hopper said in A Bug's Life: "First rule of leadership: everything is your fault ..." I'm not saying that changes shouldn't have been made, I think they should have. But if Williams actually shifted blame to Duane Shaffer for the state of the organization, that's less than admirable.

[hitlesswonder]

2002: Ring, Reed, and Rupe all made the big leagues. Each was traded for other parts. To me it is ok to get guys who show promise that other teams want and you make the trades for things you need. Sox fans loved Reed and lots of teams would've traded for him, Sox got Garcia and that worked out.

 

McCarthy was a 2002 pick.

 

Basically, if you think Young and McCarthy were the 2 best Sox draftees since 2001, they happened while Laumann was the amateur scouting director.

[Guest]

after seeing those drafts, just fire kenny williams already.

[29andPoplar]

The other aspect to consider is looking at these draft results big picture. If it is a GM's philosophy to trade prospects for useful parts then the scouting guys better find guys other teams want to trade for. It is an entire organizational approach. I will give some credit to the scouting guys for finding guys other teams will trade for, there are several on the lists 2001 - 2003.

 

One advantage to changing the drafting philosophy is that potentially higher impact guys are usually younger and therefore will take a bit more time to reach their potential. Which also gives the GM and his staff more time to trade the player, if some other team is hot for him and will offer up a proven useful part. Anthony Webster was one example, Daniel Haigwood another, there are prob. a few more.

[29andPoplar]

Now for sake of comparison, here is Shaffer's 2004 draft. Remember that many (most?) of the amateur scouting staff was the same, Laumann was doing pro scouting after being reassigned.

 

18 18 Josh Fields 3b Oklahoma State U. OK $1,550,000

1S 4 34 Tyler Lumsden lhp Clemson U. SC $975,000

1S 8 38 Gio Gonzalez lhp Monsignor Pace HS, Miami FL $850,000

2 12 53 Wes Whisler lhp UCLA CA $660,000

2 18 59 Donny Lucy c Stanford U. CA $525,000

2 28 69 Ray Liotta lhp Gulf Coast (Fla.) CC FL $499,000

3 18 89 Grant Hansen rhp Oklahoma City U. OK $430,000

4 18 119 Lucas Harrell rhp Ozark (Mo.) HS MO $270,000

5 18 149 Brandon Allen of Montgomery (Texas) HS TX $175,000

6 18 179 Adam Russell rhp Ohio U. OH $140,000

7 18 209 Tim Murphey lhp Glacock County HS, Gibson, Ga. GA $120,000

8 18 239 Nick Lemon rhp Brigham Young U. UT $54,000

9 18 269 Ryan McCarthy 3b UCLA CA $70,000

10 18 299 Adam Ricks 2b U. of Miami FL $25,000

11 18 329 Garry Bakker rhp U. of North Carolina NC

12 18 359 Daron Roberts of Cal State San Bernardino CA

13 18 389 John Egbert rhp Rutgers U. NJ

14 18 419 Michael Swain 3b Wabash Valley (Ill.) JC IL

15 18 449 Carlos Torres rhp Kansas State U. KS

16 18 479 Fernando Alvarez of Florida International U. FL

17 18 509 Jacob Wild rhp Bakersfield (Calif.) JC CA

18 18 539 Brett Scarpetta rhp Hononegah HS, Rockton, Ill. IL

19 18 569 Caleb Cooper 3b Cal State Hayward CA

20 18 599 Michael Dubee rhp Riverview HS, Sarasota, Fla. FL

21 18 629 Brian Flores lhp Carlsbad (N.M.) HS NM

22 18 659 Matt Mansilla ss American Heritage HS, Pembroke, Fla. FL

23 18 689 Derek McNeil ss St. Leo (Fla.) College FL

24 18 719 Josh Hansen c U. of San Diego CA

25 18 749 Justin Sincock rhp Millikan HS, Long Beach, Calif. CA

26 18 779 Danny Jordan 3b Gulliver Prep, Miami FL

27 18 809 Logan Williamson lhp Pensacola (Fla.) JC FL

28 18 839 Greg Young of Delaware Tech JC DE

29 18 869 Frank Viola rhp Florida CC FL

30 18 899 Mike Zaleski rhp Indiana State U. IN

31 18 929 Nicholas Walters lhp Mountain Ridge HS, Desert Hills, Ariz. AZ

32 18 959 Eric Sheridan rhp Saddleback (Calif.) JC CA

33 18 989 Brandon Cooney rhp Broward (Fla.) CC FL

34 18 1019 Mario Suarez 3b Florida International U. FL

35 18 1049 Evan Tartaglia of Elon U. NC

36 18 1079 Ken Williams of Plainfield (Ill.) HS IL

37 18 1109 Robert Grinestaff c Okaloosa-Walton (Fla.) CC FL

38 18 1139 Shaun Spearman ss St. Pius X HS, Atlanta, Ga. GA

39 18 1169 James Leigh lhp Bryant (Ark.) HS AR

40 18 1199 Justin Roelle lhp Iowa Western CC IO

41 18 1229 Matthew Rozier rhp Meridian (Miss.) CC MS

42 18 1258 Michael Schower lhp Riverview HS, Sarasota, Fla. FL

43 18 1287 Ian Murray rhp Jefferson (Mo.) JC MO

44 18 1316 Stephen Muck rhp Covington Catholic HS, Park Hills, Ky. KY

45 18 1345 Jason Sullivan rhp Crowder (Mo.) JC MO

46 18 1374 Jason Rodriquez ss Alta Loma HS, Rancho Cucamonga, Calif. CA

47 18 1403 Richard O'Brien c Connors State (Okla.) JC OK

48 18 1432 Peter Vuckovich c Clarion (Pa.) U. PA

49 18 1460 Dennis Guest 2b St. Joseph's (Ind.) College IN

50 18 1488 Bryan Wagner rhp Thunderbird HS, Phoenix AZ

 

 

As you can see it's still a little early to judge this draft. In particular you have very raw talent like Brandon Allen who is just now finding his way in Low Class A and is showing promise. Egbert and Adam Russell have also shown promise but haven't made it yet. Gio Gonzalez is in there, but there are some others who are clear misses.

[Steff]

As you can see it's still a little early to judge this draft. In particular you have very raw talent like Brandon Allen who is just now finding his way in Low Class A and is showing promise. Egbert and Adam Russell have also shown promise but haven't made it yet. Gio Gonzalez is in there, but there are some others who are clear misses.

 

I wonder who urged the 36th pick...

[29andPoplar]

Lastly here is Shaffer's 2000 draft.

 

1. Joe Borchard, of Stanford

2. Tim Hummel, ss Old Dominion

3. Mike Morse, ss Nova HS, Ft. Lauderdale

4. Alvin Jones, rhp Seguin (Texas) HS

5. Tony Richie, c Bishop Kenny HS, Jacksonville, Fla.

6. Bjorn Ivy, of Shannon (Miss.) HS

7. Eddie Young, of Jones County HS, Macon, Ga.

8. Chris Amador, ss Crespo HS, Camuy, P.R.

9. Jason Aspito, 3b Loyola Marymount

10. Heath Phillips, lhp/1b Evansville Central HS, Evansville, Ind.

11. Tommy Nicholson, 2b Texas

12. Mike Spidale, ss Nazareth Academy, Chicago

13. Derek Wigginton, of Alabama

14. James Sweeney, lhp Holy Cross (Mass.) College

15. John Lackaff, 2b Miami (Ohio) U.

16. Brian Graham, rhp Portland

17. Ryan Liermann, 3b Downers Grove South HS, Downers Grove, Ill.

18. Curtis Young, rhp Lamar (Colo.) CC

19. Scott Perhla, lhp Southridge HS, Miami

20. Etienne Ratte-Delorme, rhp Edouard Montpetit (Quebec) College

21. Joe Solis, rhp Columbus HS, Miami

22. Gerron McGary, lhp Nashville (Ark.) HS

23. Rylan Reed, rhp/1b Crossett (Ark.) HS

24. Kyle Boyer, 3b Temecula Valley HS, Temecula, Calif.

25. Travis NeSmith, lhp Gulliver Prep, Miami

26. Victor Martinez, of Barbara Goleman HS, Hialeah, Fla.

27. Brad Murray, lhp Embry-Riddle (Fla.) U.

28. Kyle Bohannan, rhp Arkansas

29. Anthony Monegan, of Kishwaukee (Ill.) JC

30. Brian Keating, rhp Lewis & Clark(Ill.) CC

31. Darren Ciraco, of Briarcliffe (N.Y.) JC

32. Brandon Bounds, of Mansfield (Texas) HS

33. Jeff Lundgren, c Chaparral HS, Scottsdale, Ariz.

34. Ricky Spivey, rhp Glen Este HS, Cincinnati

35. Michael Oehlberg, lhp Kishwaukee (Ill.) CC

36. Armando Perez, lhp Southwestern (Calif.) JC

37. Matt Maley, of Killian HS, Miami

38. Tom Gorzelanny, lhp Marist HS, Orland Park, Ill.

39. Tyrel Davis, 3b/of Columbia Basin (Wash.) CC

40. Jarod Tate, lhp Lumberton (Texas) HS

41. Brian Barr, rhp Arkansas HS, Texarkana, Ark.

42. Fernando Alvarez, of Dodge City (Kan.) CC

43. Brian Schweiger, c Fontana (Calif.) HS

44. Dustin Knight, c North Little Rock (Ark.) HS

45. Danny Girardo, of Coral Park HS, Miami

46. John Grose, c Green Valley HS, Henderson, Nev.

47. Corry Parrott, of Long Beach State

48. Jason Hutton, of UNC Charlotte

49. Tony Sterioti, rhp Kishwaukee (Ill.) JC

50. Freddie Mitchell, of UCLA

 

 

Talk about unimpressive. They knew Gorzelanny from their back yard but didn't sign him. This draft is as close to a total bust as you'll find.

[Chisoxfn]

Laumann was pretty highly regarded around the baseball circle as well and I'm personally glad he's back in charge. You can see he strikes a lot better on later draft picks. Pawlek is a guy that was a highly touted guy we took super late (ended up getting drafted by I think the Cubs pretty early in the draft the next year)...Zach Jackson/Johnson was a top round pick by the Brewers IIRC.

 

Plus you see a lot more hits on later round guys. Brandon McCarthy, Chris Young are two guys that were 10th round or later that turned into upper echelon prospects. Plus Haeger is a pretty respectable late round pick (although I really can't give much credit to anyone on that cause he pretty much dumb lucked his way into finding a knuckle ball and restoring his career...which is a great story).

[SoxFan77]

McCarthy was a 2002 pick.

 

Basically, if you think Young and McCarthy were the 2 best Sox draftees since 2001, they happened while Laumann was the amateur scouting director.

 

Which is not saying much. 2.5 players in what 5 years.. Can we steal someone from Atl to run our Scouting?

[29andPoplar]

I wonder who urged the 36th pick...

 

Don't know for sure but I think the Rockies redrafted him or maybe it was one of the other 4 brothers.

[Chisoxfn]

One of his sons is supposed to be a very good athlete, but I don't know if that was the one or not.

[29andPoplar]

One of his sons is supposed to be a very good athlete, but I don't know if that was the one or not.

 

A couple of them are Chisoxfn and Williams actually talked the scouting staff out of taking one of the sons again this year and he was picked by the Rockies. I will look it up.

 

Also to your comments about Laumann, I agree, I think of the two (vs. Shaffer) Laumann is a better choice but I also fully expect there will be some new blood brought in after the season, Laumann doing the hiring with KW's stamp of approval and quite possibly Wilder's and/or Regier's heavy input. There is a sr. scouting guy from the Reds who has been linked with the White Sox a few times in the past.

 

It was the same son, Kenny Williams Jr. who was taken by the Rockies this year. 32nd round out of Wichita State, where KW Jr. had transferred. He is not listed as signed in the database, but clearly he has been identified as having potential.

 

Pretty sure KW's son Kyle is a good athlete as well, I believe he's a 2B.

Edited July 24, 2007 by 29andPoplar

[Steff]

One of his sons is supposed to be a very good athlete, but I don't know if that was the one or not.

 

 

 

Good runner I hear... Very good at "bash and dash", too.