Iguchi Traded to Phillies for RP/SP Michael Dubee

[Vance Law]

KW accepts one A ball 21 year old for a solid second baseman who is in the middle of his prime (age wise.)

 

It is beyond rediculous to claim this was a bad trade and use, as support, things like Iguchi is "in the middle of his prime" or was "an all-star second baseman" (as someone else did) while deliberately, or out of ignorance, failing to mention such facts as:

 

-Iguchi is not having a good year, hitting just .250 with 6 home runs

-It is not the trade of a second baseman with several years remaining on a contract at a reasonable price in exchange for a single A pitcher, but rather a second baseman (having a bad year) who will give you 2 months of service

-There was basically no market for second basemen until Utley broke his hand the other day (yes Valentin got hurt, but the

Mets have enough in-house options so as to not need to trade)

-he will cost about $1 million for the rest of the season

- The Phillies only need him for (not 2 months, but) 1 month until Utley is back- the likely difference between whoever the Phils would otherwise have played at 2B for the next month, and Iguchi (hitting .250 this year) is extremely minimal- a handful of hits perhaps, thus making the Phillies demand even lower

-When Iguchi goes to free-agency the Sox get no compensation picks

Edited July 28, 2007 by Vance Law

[Dan]

Outlook: Updated Jul. 27: White Sox acquired RHP Michael Dubee from the Phillies for second baseman Tadahito Iguchi. A very disappointing return for the White Sox, who must have wanted to go to Danny Richar pretty badly. Dubee had a 3.88 ERA and a 54/22 K/BB ratio in 55 2/3 innings of relief for low Single-A Lakewood. The White Sox would have been a lot better off getting draft picks in return for Iguchi, but that wasn't possible, as they were going to be prevented from offering him arbitration.

 

Idiot move.

[Kalapse]

The White Sox would have been a lot better off getting draft picks in return for Iguchi, but that wasn't possible, as they were going to be prevented from offering him arbitration.

What does this line even mean? The Sox would have been better off just taking the draft picks except they couldn't have gotten any picks for him. That's like Saying the Sox should have traded him to the Mets for Milledge and Pelfrey, sure Minaya would never even think about making that deal but the Sox should have done it anyway. Who wrote this garbage?

[iamshack]

What does this line even mean? The Sox would have been better off just taking the draft picks except they couldn't have gotten any picks for him. That's like Saying the Sox should have traded him to the Mets for Milledge and Pelfrey despite the fact that Minaya would never do that deal. Who wrote this garbage?

 

They were trying to save face for their original mistake of claiming they could have gotten picks for him. They changed the last sentence, but not the rest of their comments, which is pretty stupid, since the rest of their comments were entirely tied to the last sentence, which was where their mistake lied.

[Kalapse]

They were trying to save face for their original mistake of claiming they could have gotten picks for him. They changed the last sentence, but not the rest of their comments, which is pretty stupid, since the rest of their comments were entirely tied to the last sentence, which was where their mistake lied.

There's a reason why I use Rotoworld as an RSS feed and nothing else.

[iamshack]

There's a reason why I use Rotoworld as an RSS feed and nothing else.

 

Rotoworld is good for breaking news and little else.

[greasywheels121]

What does this line even mean? The Sox would have been better off just taking the draft picks except they couldn't have gotten any picks for him. That's like Saying the Sox should have traded him to the Mets for Milledge and Pelfrey despite the fact that Minaya would never do that deal. Who wrote this garbage?

[Yossarian]

I think that basically the trade was made to dump someone and make it look like we are really making some moves here. Iguchi was a good player for the Sox and should have brought more than a class A level player in return.

That's the way I see it too, but we're apparently deeply in the minority here. It amazes me how Sox fans eat their own, as soon as they're no longer one of their own. All these descriptions of Iguchi, you'd think he was a lifetime .220 hitter (including Japan) who made an error every other game. It's true that he got off to a horrible start at the plate this year. He surely wasn't the only one. Kenny Williams does not get a lifetime pass from me, no matter who tells me he should. If you look at his tenure dispassionately, you'll see his performance lately is reminiscent of the rocky start he had. Even taking the long view that Iguchi will be a 2 or 3 month rental for the Phillies this is not a good trade.

 

[iamshack]

That's the way I see it too, but we're apparently deeply in the minority here. It amazes me how Sox fans eat their own, as soon as they're no longer one of their own. All these descriptions of Iguchi, you'd think he was a lifetime .220 hitter (including Japan) who made an error every other game. It's true that he got off to a horrible start at the plate this year. He surely wasn't the only one. Kenny Williams does not get a lifetime pass from me, no matter who tells me he should. If you look at his tenure dispassionately, you'll see his performance lately is reminiscent of the rocky start he had. Even taking the long view that Iguchi will be a 2 or 3 month rental for the Phillies this is not a good trade.

 

You cannot ignore the turn the market has taken. You cannot judge Kenny's trades at this moment on what he or other GM's could have gotten in past years. That's comparing apples to oranges.

 

Unfortunately for us, we chose a really poor time to be a seller at the deadline.

[WCSox]

That's the way I see it too, but we're apparently deeply in the minority here. It amazes me how Sox fans eat their own, as soon as they're no longer one of their own.

 

It amazes me how some Sox fans expected the Sox to get anything other than crap in return for crap.

 

You cannot ignore the turn the market has taken. You cannot judge Kenny's trades at this moment on what he or other GM's could have gotten in past years. That's comparing apples to oranges.

 

Especially considering that the Rangers just got the same low-level crap for Lofton, who is having a much better year than Gooch.

 

[Kalapse]

It amazes me how some Sox fans expected the Sox to get anything other than crap in return for crap.

Max Ramirez may be in High A ball right now but he is far from crap.

[southsider2k5]

I am sad to see Tads go, but its not a big surprise that we didn't get much of a return for him. We traded a middle of the road 2B who had zero trade value, to get an arm, and the Phillies aren't going to get a damned thing for him. If we want a chance at bringing him back in 08, this is one of the best possible teams for him to go to, because Philly damned sure isn't going to resign him.

[Yossarian]

We traded a middle of the road 2B

At least you didn't call him crap. If he's crap what is Uribe? Cintron? Toby Hall? Mack in CF? BA at the plate this year and last? A middle of the road 2B is worth more than what we got for him. I didn't expect anything big. A better prospect and/or a decent reserve player would have been nice. I wish Iguchi the best. 05 was beyond great and he was an important part of it. He still has a few good years left in the tank I think, but we shall have to wait and see. In the meantime Richar is one of the few prospects we have that I think has a decent chance to pan out. He will now get his opportunity and I hope he makes the most of it. 2B has historically been a pretty strong position for the Sox. Sorry I responded to your post, instead of someone else who was far more critical. Go Danny Richar, and now I'm done with this particular event.

[WCSox]

At least you didn't call him crap. If he's crap what is Uribe? Cintron? Toby Hall? Mack in CF? BA at the plate this year and last?

 

You're right, he's a mediocre 2B with rapidly-declining defensive skills, a .722 OPS, few stolen bases, no more power, and is owed $1.2 million over the remaining two months of his contract. Players with such a skill set and contractual situation have a market value of "crap."

Edited July 28, 2007 by WCSox

[LVSoxFan]

The consensus among my crowd at the game last night--where I first learned of the trade--was: bad.

 

Gooch is the one guy I WOULD keep; not having a great year, but who is on this team?

 

We all thought Dye would be the one to go.

 

I'm not too happy about this.

[BearSox]

Iguchi with an rbi single in his first game as a phillie.

[Kalapse]

And Dubee with 1 IP, 3 K, 0 H, 0 BB in his Kannapolis debut.

[southsider2k5]

At least you didn't call him crap. If he's crap what is Uribe? Cintron? Toby Hall? Mack in CF? BA at the plate this year and last? A middle of the road 2B is worth more than what we got for him. I didn't expect anything big. A better prospect and/or a decent reserve player would have been nice. I wish Iguchi the best. 05 was beyond great and he was an important part of it. He still has a few good years left in the tank I think, but we shall have to wait and see. In the meantime Richar is one of the few prospects we have that I think has a decent chance to pan out. He will now get his opportunity and I hope he makes the most of it. 2B has historically been a pretty strong position for the Sox. Sorry I responded to your post, instead of someone else who was far more critical. Go Danny Richar, and now I'm done with this particular event.

 

Nah, I never got into guys turning into something else just because they aren't with the Sox anymore. For some people the great players in White Sox history are the guys we traded, and for others, the guys who are gone are the worst ever. For me, Tads did a decent job while he was here, and the thing I like most about the guy is that he did whatever he was asked to while he was here. I wish him the best of luck whereever he goes. Heck I wouldn't mind having him back.

[Heads22]

And Dubee with 1 IP, 3 K, 0 H, 0 BB in his Kannapolis debut.

 

Why must you bring facts into this?

[rpmahr]

And Dubee with 1 IP, 3 K, 0 H, 0 BB in his Kannapolis debut.

 

hopefully there is something we saw in this kid that no one else saw.

[greg775]

Richar has nothing to do with this.

This is about the Iguchi trade. It was a horrible trade and KW should be ashamed.

What is so wrong about asking for a player who is at least a big leaguer for Iguchi??

If the Mets wanted him as well, it's really really a shame KW gave him away.

Disgraceful.

[BearSox]

Richar has nothing to do with this.

This is about the Iguchi trade. It was a horrible trade and KW should be ashamed.

What is so wrong about asking for a player who is at least a big leaguer for Iguchi??

If the Mets wanted him as well, it's really really a shame KW gave him away.

Disgraceful.

omg, how many times do we have to try and get this through your thick skull?

 

1. Iguchi was a free agent after the year and would be a 2-3 month rental.

2. Iguchi has a clause in his contract where he can't be offered arbitration and because of that he wouldn't bring back any compensation if he signed somewhere else.

3. Iguchi had been batting .250 this season with 6 homers and only 31 runs driven and had played poor defense.

4. There where probably 5-6 different options in the trade market that were better then him.

 

This isn't xbox where you can trade Iguchi for someone like Clay Buchholz. This is real life buddy, and if your expectations were so high on the value we'd receive for Iguchi, I'd hate to see your reaction for something we would get for Garland. Would you expect 3 A prospects and a MLB level player in return for Garland?

[supernuke]

Richar has nothing to do with this.

This is about the Iguchi trade. It was a horrible trade and KW should be ashamed.

What is so wrong about asking for a player who is at least a big leaguer for Iguchi??

If the Mets wanted him as well, it's really really a shame KW gave him away.

Disgraceful.

 

 

Before Utley went down the Mets were probably the only contender that may have been looking for a second base rental. Based on KW's quick call to the Phillies after Utley went down I woud have to think that there was really no interest in Tad from the Mets. I guess we should have just kept him for the rest of the season and let him earn his 1 million while sitting on the bench and then let him go for nothing at the end of the year.

 

 

 

 

[sf_soxfan]

Just watched Rowand bring Gooch home with a bomb. Kinda nice to see actually.

[beck72]

Richar has nothing to do with this.

This is about the Iguchi trade. It was a horrible trade and KW should be ashamed.

What is so wrong about asking for a player who is at least a big leaguer for Iguchi??

If the Mets wanted him as well, it's really really a shame KW gave him away.

Disgraceful.

Seeing what the Twins got for Castillo, a .300 hitter, and could have had a 1st round suuplemental draft pick, does this Iguchi deal look OK now? 2nd basemen are a dime a dozen, and not worth that much on the trade market if Castillo could be acquired for two guys who don't project to much of anything.