How about Fields for DH in 2008?

[RockRaines]

I'm not so sure spending 6 years, $85M on a 31 year old close to league average hitter with little speed who's playing out of position at SS -- he's obviously better suited for 2B -- is the best plan of attack. $16M a year for a guy who has posted an .830+ OPS only twice in his career and hasn't reached that mark in 2 years doesn't sound like a good investment, it sounds an awful lot more like another situation where Tom Hicks decided to throw WAY too much money at one player.

I dont know if hitting .300 is league average nowadays. I have the league avg for SS at .277. In fact for SS he is above the league avg in every hitting category.

 

Its true he is a bit expensive, but there arent many options out there for us to satisfy both the hole at SS and a lead off hitter.

[Kalapse]

I dont know if hitting .300 is league average nowadays. I have the league avg for SS at .277. In fact for SS he is above the league avg in every hitting category.

 

Its true he is a bit expensive, but there arent many options out there for us to satisfy both the hole at SS and a lead off hitter.

He has a .766 OPS, his AVG doesn't mean a whole hell of a lot when his IsoD is only 53 and he's slugging in the low .400's. His OPS+ is 99, 100 is league average. From 2009-2013 (age 32-36 seasons) he'll be guaranteed $16M a year, that's not "a bit expensive" that's possibly the most overpaid player in the league. There really isn't anything in the numbers that makes me want Michael Young for even $10M a year let alone $16M.

 

I'll take David Eckstein at say 3 years, $15M over Michael Young even though I truly dislike David Eckstein as a ballplayer.

[NorthSideSox72]

He has a .766 OPS, his AVG doesn't mean a whole hell of a lot when his IsoD is only 53 and he's slugging in the low .400's. His OPS+ is 99, 100 is league average. From 2009-2013 (age 32-36 seasons) he'll be guaranteed $16M a year, that's not "a bit expensive" that's possibly the most overpaid player in the league. There really isn't anything in the numbers that makes me want Michael Young for even $10M a year let alone $16M.

 

I'll take David Eckstein at say 3 years, $15M over Michael Young even though I truly dislike David Eckstein as a ballplayer.

Furcal and Renteria may be available in trade, for something like Garland-plus. And they are $10M and $13M for 2008 respectively (or maybe its the other way around, I can't recall). I think I'd rather have Furcal, if we can make it happen.

 

[Kalapse]

Furcal and Renteria may be available in trade, for something like Garland-plus. And they are $10M and $13M for 2008 respectively (or maybe its the other way around, I can't recall). I think I'd rather have Furcal, if we can make it happen.

Furcal is $13M and Renteria is $9M (w/ $11M TO for '08 + $3M buyout) so he's guaranteed $12M if you acquire him. I'd absolutely love to have Furcal since he'd fill the leadoff spot, play some solid D and would come in on a very limited investment (only a year left on his deal). If Rafael has a productive 2008 season with the White Sox you try to work out a long term deal and make him the franchise SS/leadoff hitter for the next 4 years or so. Renteria has already failed once in the AL and would steal leave a hole at the top of the lineup so I really wouldn't even consider him especially if the asking price is even close to what it was during the season (Garland).

 

And is there a reason Orlando Hudson has NEVER been used at SS? He has an incredibly quick first step, good foot speed and a very solid arm, he's probably the best defensive 2B in the game. If we're talking about a guy like Michael Young who has played most of his career out of position at SS then why not make a run at Orlando Hudson and switch him over to the other middle infield position? He's pretty much guaranteed to be a superior defender to the likes of Young and Eckstein.

[RockRaines]

Furcal and Renteria may be available in trade, for something like Garland-plus. And they are $10M and $13M for 2008 respectively (or maybe its the other way around, I can't recall). I think I'd rather have Furcal, if we can make it happen.

Either way we are looking at overpaying someone for their SS abilities and a little bit of lead off ability.

 

Of course I dont see many people complaining about the low OPS of Furcal or the horrific slg%. Of all of the choices brought up, are any of them really game changers?

 

Renteria is having a career year. I would count on more of his career avg production

.291 .349 .757 OPS 29 2B

 

Furcal career

.286 .351 .761 OPS 23 2B

 

Eckstein

.284 .349 .708 OPS 13 2B

 

Young

.301 .346 .793 OPS 33 2b-though has improved on his career numbers the last few seasons

 

ANY of these guys scream difference maker?

 

Maybe doubles should be something we look for?

 

 

Edited August 29, 2007 by RockRaines

[Kalapse]

Furcal's .351 OBP and 35 SB per season would fill 2 holes and would be a pretty a much smaller monetary investment than someone like Young.

[Kalapse]

Maybe doubles should be something we look for?

Doubles are a part of SLG%, if you're going to list doubles you might as well go the whole way and list 3B and HR as well, not to mention their contract status.

[RockRaines]

Doubles are a part of SLG%, if you're going to list doubles you might as well go the whole way and list 3B and HR as well.

i dont really look at slg for a lead off hitter at all. I dont see HR as THAT much value IMO. I like doubles, OBP, steals. either way those guys dont have any power to speak of.

[NorthSideSox72]

Furcal's .351 OBP and 35 SB per season would fill 2 holes and would be the smallest monetary investment of the bunch.

And just as important, Furcal is a better defender than Young (or Renteria for that matter). As bad as Uribe is at the plate, he is still a very good defensive SS, and if they went with someone like Young, the Sox pitching staff would suffer.

 

[Kalapse]

i dont really look at slg for a lead off hitter at all. I dont see HR as THAT much value IMO. I like doubles, OBP, steals. either way those guys dont have any power to speak of.

HR>2B, it's 2 extra bases and an automatic R and RBI. 3B are also better. If a leadoff hitter has a higher SLG% that means he's putting himself in scoring position more often, meaning less outs need to be sacrificed and pitches don't have to be wasted for SBs. Extra points if he can knock himself in with a HR ever once in a while.

[RockRaines]

And just as important, Furcal is a better defender than Young (or Renteria for that matter). As bad as Uribe is at the plate, he is still a very good defensive SS, and if they went with someone like Young, the Sox pitching staff would suffer.

For sure, thats a really valid point. His stolen bases have really taken a hit this year, I hope thats not age catching up with him.

[Gene Honda Civic]

I was thinking of Tom Collaro. Tons of K's, but hitting well over .300 with big power numbers. Plays RF. Something to consider as a possible backup OF, if you are looking for one that isn't a speed guy.

Well over .300? He's hit .305 in 82 AAA at-bats. Prior to that he hit .257 in Birmingham. And .217 there in '06. And .264 in W-S in '05.

 

Collaro isn't exactly a .300 hitter. He's simply masquerading as one right now thanks to a .411 batting average on balls in play.

[NorthSideSox72]

Well over .300? He's hit .305 in 82 AAA at-bats. Prior to that he hit .257 in Birmingham. And .217 there in '06. And .264 in W-S in '05.

 

Collaro isn't exactly a .300 hitter. He's simply masquerading as one right now thanks to a .411 batting average on balls in play.

Oh, I am not saying he's likely to hit .300 in the majors. Probably won't. Also, I am not talking about starting the guy. A poster was looking for a backup OF with pop in his bat - I think Collaro could be that guy, potentially. And I was very specific about his strikeout totals as well. This team, in 2008, will not be able to afford a bunch of multi-million dollar players riding the bench. There will have to be some kids in there. I suppose another possibility is Anderson.