Reid declare potential AG 'unconfirmable'

[NorthSideSox72]

Or that he's the completely wrong man for the job.

 

After all, if you advocate simulating the death of a detainee as a means to coerce information of dubious reliability, something tells me that you shouldn't be responsible for enforcing the laws of this country.

What gave you the impression he was advocating it? Quite the opposite, what he has said seems to me to say he probably would be against it, but can't say for sure in such a non-contextual reference.

 

[Texsox]

I always struggle to articulate this. I believe Bush should be allowed to nominate a hard core conservative whose ideology closely matches his. That is why out Constitution calls for the President to nominate. I also believe that same ideology should not be a reason to not confirm someone. Their qualifications, character, morals, and ethics should come into play, but not their ideology. I disagree with these "litmus" tests for positions.

 

If Congress is that upset about this particular crime, and I do believe it is a crime, then write a new law which is very specific, do not use a confirmation as the opportunity to legislate.

 

And before someone labels me a hypocrite, I'd say the same thing if a Dem was President.

[Rex Kickass]

What gave you the impression he was advocating it? Quite the opposite, what he has said seems to me to say he probably would be against it, but can't say for sure in such a non-contextual reference.

 

I don't think there is a context where simulating death via drowning in interrogation is ever acceptable or legal or not torture.

[BigSqwert]

I don't think there is a context where simulating death via drowning in interrogation is ever acceptable or legal or not torture.

I'd have to agree with you on this one.

[Rex Kickass]

What gave you the impression he was advocating it? Quite the opposite, what he has said seems to me to say he probably would be against it, but can't say for sure in such a non-contextual reference.

 

OK, a law was recently passed that declared waterboarding, specifically, as out of bounds and illegal. Why isn't the Attorney General saying its beyond what passes for legal?

[NorthSideSox72]

OK, a law was recently passed that declared waterboarding, specifically, as out of bounds and illegal. Why isn't the Attorney General saying its beyond what passes for legal?

There was a law passed that specifically says its illegal? That I did not know. If that is true, then yes, the answer should be a simple "yes, its illegal."

 

[EvilMonkey]

OK, a law was recently passed that declared waterboarding, specifically, as out of bounds and illegal. Why isn't the Attorney General saying its beyond what passes for legal?

Do you have a link for that? Only had a few minutes to search this AM, and I can't find anything. So far.

[Rex Kickass]

I believe there was that McCain torture bill that went through Congress at the end of 2005, early 2006. It was attached to a Defense Appropriations bill, so I believe it ended up passing.

 

The other reason there is precedent? In 1947, we held a war crimes trial of a Japanese soldier who waterboarded an American. That soldier was sentenced to 15 years hard labor.

 

In 1968, the Pentagon investigated allegations of the same waterboarding methods being used in Vietnam.

 

 

[EvilMonkey]

I believe there was that McCain torture bill that went through Congress at the end of 2005, early 2006. It was attached to a Defense Appropriations bill, so I believe it ended up passing.

 

The other reason there is precedent? In 1947, we held a war crimes trial of a Japanese soldier who waterboarded an American. That soldier was sentenced to 15 years hard labor.

 

In 1968, the Pentagon investigated allegations of the same waterboarding methods being used in Vietnam.

I know the mccain bill in 2005 was left intentionally vague to protect the CIA, and that didn't list anything specific, including waterboarding. Yes, we tries some japaneese after the war for that, as well as other things, but that still doesn't make it a law specifically about waterboarding. And the vietnam investigations also don't make anything a law. I originally asked an honest question, because i couldn't find anything that specifically outlawed waterboarding, as you claimed to exist. . Now I have to ask, did you just say that without proof?

[Rex Kickass]

Nope, I was mistaken about what the McCain bill includes.

[Rex Kickass]

Here's a link to a blogger/journalist who got waterboarded for Current TV.

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kaj-larson/a...hy_b_70651.html

[Chet Lemon]

Mukasey will be confirmed as both Schumer and Feinsten have pledged to vote for him.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/11/02...ref=mpstoryview

[NorthSideSox72]

Its official. Mukasey confirmed.

 

[Rex Kickass]

It's a shame.

[NorthSideSox72]

It's a shame.

This guy is one heck of a lot better than Gonzales, who was probably the second worst Bush appointee, and that's saying something.

 

[EvilMonkey]

It's a shame.

Get over it.

[EvilMonkey]

Here's a link to a blogger/journalist who got waterboarded for Current TV.

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kaj-larson/a...hy_b_70651.html

From the very first reply in that post:

Fortunately there have been more Americans volunteering for waterboarding than there have been detainees waterboarded for information.

 

From ABC News:

 

"For all the debate over waterboarding, it has been used on only three al Qaeda figures, according to current and former U.S. intelligence officials.

 

As ABC News first reported in September, waterboarding has not been used since 2003 and has been specifically prohibited since Gen. Michael Hayden took over as CIA director.

 

Officials told ABC News on Sept. 14 that the controversial interrogation technique, in which a suspect has water poured over his mouth and nose to stimulate a drowning reflex as shown in the above demonstration, had been banned by the CIA director at the recommendation of his deputy, Steve Kappes.

 

Hayden sought and received approval from the White House to remove waterboarding from the list of approved interrogation techniques first authorized by a presidential finding in 2002."

 

http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2007/1...sive-only-.html

I also read somewhere that the guy who had this done used some sort of a safeguard over his mouth so that he didn't get the 'true' experience. I will find the link for that one later for you, don't have it here at work.

[Rex Kickass]

Get over it.

 

I'm sorry, but I won't. I won't get over this. I think it's awful that we had an Attorney General who thought torture was OK. I think it's worse that his replacement says that torture is illegal, but won't define what torture is - and further, won't call the act of simulating murder on a detainee as torture.

 

Whether or not the process is widely used, it's beyond the point. Our country just decided that torture is OK. And that's not OK with me.

[Rex Kickass]

From the very first reply in that post:

 

I also read somewhere that the guy who had this done used some sort of a safeguard over his mouth so that he didn't get the 'true' experience. I will find the link for that one later for you, don't have it here at work.

 

If you're saying that the CIA has banned its use, why would the Attorney General then have any qualms about calling it torture? That just makes the situation worse.

[EvilMonkey]

If you're saying that the CIA has banned its use, why would the Attorney General then have any qualms about calling it torture? That just makes the situation worse.

No, I am saying the guy who is trying to say he was all badass and stuff by being waterboarded wasn't REALLY waterboarded, as he had something covering his mouth and nose so that he didn't get the full effect.

[EvilMonkey]

If you're saying that the CIA has banned its use, why would the Attorney General then have any qualms about calling it torture? That just makes the situation worse.

Mukasey doesn't get to classify waterboarding as torture. The AG and the DoJ don't get to write their own laws. Congress writes the laws, and the AG makes sure that they are enforced. Congress has explicitly forbidden the Pentagon to use waterboarding as an interrogation technique, but has not yet passed that same restriction on other agencies -- and until they do, any instance of waterboarding cannot be said to be explicitly illegal. So you want the AG to enforce laws that congress hasn't passed.

[EvilMonkey]

Also, Clinton, Obama, Biden and McCain should be fined for missing this vote because of campaigning. They were elected to do a job and vote on things, and to miss a vote such as this is just a dereliction of their duty. They owe us some pay back for not doing their jobs.

[Balta1701]

Also, Clinton, Obama, Biden and McCain should be fined for missing this vote because of campaigning. They were elected to do a job and vote on things, and to miss a vote such as this is just a dereliction of their duty. They owe us some pay back for not doing their jobs.

It sure seems like virtually no one knew the vote was going to happen except Reid until it actually happened. They literally didn't have time after it was scheduled to get back to Washington from where they were.

[EvilMonkey]

It sure seems like virtually no one knew the vote was going to happen except Reid until it actually happened. They literally didn't have time after it was scheduled to get back to Washington from where they were.

But they shouldn't have to schedule time to be back, they should all be there doing the job they were elected to do, and are being paid to do, and that is to legislate, NOT campaign. If you hold a current office and want to run for a different office, you shuold have to resign, or at least return a percentage of your pay for all the work you are not doing. You want publically financed campaigns, well, you are partially (albeit a small percentage) the campaigns of several senators running for President.

[Balta1701]

Slightly more details. Supposedly, Reid struck a deal with the Republicans where he would allow a vote on Mukasey's nomination in exchange for the Republicans not blocking a vote on the gigantic, $470 billion DOD appropriation about to go through to fund the DOD next year...except for the Wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. Originally the thinking was for some reason to stick that into the DOD authorization bill, which would force pretty much everyone to vote for it who has a base or manufacturing plant in their district because otherwise they'd have had to vote against their own bases to vote against the Iraq war. Reid got that deal and immediately scheduled a vote. At about 7:00 p.m. he scheduled a midnight vote.