Cedric Benson and Rex Grossman both suck

[Steve9347]

big f***ing time.

[Milkman delivers]

I agree with at least half of that. I'll wait a while before agreeing completely.

[SoxAce]

I agree with at least half of that. I'll wait a while before agreeing completely.

 

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

Thank you. And I'm sure your talking about waiting while for Grossman.

[WhiteSoxfan1986]

Cedric Benson had 16 carries tonight, and he was down on that fumble. Rex sucks but the jury is still out on Benson.

[Felix]

I agree, as much as I'd like to hold out hope for Rex.

[Jenksismyhero]

Here's what a wrote in an email to a group of friends this morning:

 

Meh, typical s***ty Bears loss. I pretty much expected this to happen. However I do think that Rex gets too much of the blame.

 

1. IMO he threw one bad interception - the one returned for a touchdown. The first one he let go of the ball before the receiver broke. It was similiar to his pick in the Chargers game where the receiver didn't run to the spot he was supposed to run too. The last one wasn't a surprise, he was just throwing it up hoping to get something going.

 

2. Too many dropped passes. Rex threw some good balls but the receivers failed to bring them in.

 

3. Bensons "fumble" was costly - I think the last replay they showed proved it was not a fumble and that his knee was down. Terrible call. At least say the play stands because there is not conclusive visual evidence to overturn it. Apparently he saw the ball come out before the knee was down which is BS.

 

4. Defense - so much for that vaunted Bears D. You can't expect them to go a whole game against a good (if not great) offense, but the complete lack of changing defensive schemes really got to me. From the 2nd through the 4th quarter I think Dallas ran the ball a total of 4 times. They hit Owens and the TE on crossing routes about 25 times. How does that happen? Why did they just let them march down the field without changing up some plays? And where was the D-Line? Obviously the injuries (especially to Briggs) hurt, but come on.

 

5. Offensive play calling. Everyone knows Rex is not a Brett Favre who can make a play every down. Ok we get that - so why are we running the ball on first and second down, getting stuffed, and then being forced into a long 3rd down attempt? I think about 5 drives ended because the play calling was atrocious. It's clear that Rex has horrible mechanics when he's getting pressured. He's also really small compared to the two lines in front of him, which causes him to throw off his backfoot and hope the ball lands where it's supposed to land. When he had clear passing lanes the Bears O had some good success. So why not try to move him out of the pocket more? Why not more play action rollouts?

 

6. The running game. I was a big Benson believer at the end of last year. But man, if he doesn't crank it up then this team is screwed.

 

7. Romo - Five seasons, Grossman - 1.3 seasons

 

Look, I'm not a Rex apologosit. I don't think he's a long-term answer and he's definitely not a franchise quarterback. But I do think he's good enough to help a superbowl caliber Bears D in winning a championship or two. I find it hilarious people want Griese in. No one remembers that guy took a two time superbowl champ team and had one decent year out of what, five seasons? Then he heads to Tampa Bay and Miami and gets cut. The rest of the NFL knows what Chicago fans apparently don't - he's not good enough to be a starter. I also like to remind you what it was like 2 years ago with Orton. Remember how terrible the offense was? Remember how great it felt when Rex came into the game? Remember the 100+ qb rating games he's had? The skills are obviously there. The rest of the team is to blame as much as Rex is to blame, especially with this loss.

 

/rant

 

[Steve9347]

Arguing for Rex is a lost cause.

 

I was one of his biggest backers for the longest time, but it's outwardly evident that he is not an NFL QB, and I will tell you why.

 

1) He cannot do anything when under pressure. As we all saw last night with Tony Romo, it is actually possible to create time and complete passes even when heavily rushed. Grossman's continued failure, whether it be because of bad coaching or what have you, to step up in the pocket or move around behind the line is crushing this team. Without PERFECT pass protection, Grossman not only fails to complete a pass, he also fails to even get a pass off. As you see this year with Schaub in Houston, this cannot be blamed on the offensive line. Once Houston got Carr out of there, all of the sudden the line got better? I don't think so, it's the indecision of the quarterback.

 

2) Grossman does not throw well over the middle. Though many would argue this is because of his 6'1" height, I'd beg to differ. I think Grossman throws to the sidelines early and often because of his biggest weekness, his failure to look to his 2nd/3rd/and sure as hell 4th options. The first option (unless he's throwing to his TE (where you see success) is always outside to either Muhammed or Berrian. This makes it rather simple for defenses to lock down. 50/50 either TRIPLE cover Berrian or Muhammed. Though the WR haven't been helping Grossman, the reason they ALWAYS seem covered is simple... he locks in on his targets and rarely completes a pass to a reciever he hadn't decided he was throwing to before the snap even left the center. (It was obvious that his two decent completions to Desmond Clark and Greg Olsen were only made possible because of the fact that they were his #1 targets on that play.)

 

3) Grossman has lost this team. It's hard for teammates to have confidence in you if you don't have confidence in yourself. This team, though they are saying all the right things, has grown tired of making excuses for Grossman. Olin Kreutz is always the first to take the blame (for botched snaps, for bad pass blocking) but it's all mostly Grossman's fault.

 

I call for, and as a Bears fan, deserve, the Mr. 5 mill a year Brian Griese AT LEAST take some snaps with the first team offense this week. 50/50, and if Grossman struggles out of the box against a Lions team that gave up 56 to the Eagles this week (After facing San Diego, KC, and Dallas whom all have performed quite badly on defense this season), Griese goes in. I think that people underrate Griese (compare his career 84.5 passer ratings to tom brady's career 89+ passer rating). I'm not saying Griese = Brady, but he was impressive in his last starting opportunity with Tampa Bay before injury, and will do JUST FINE as a Bears starting QB.

 

Make the move now, make the move forever, bid Grossman goobye at the end of the season. It's Griese time.

[kwolf68]

Anyone who thinks Rex Grossman is an adequate starting QB needs their head examined.

 

Madden, for all his bloat, basically pointed it out when juxtaposing Romo w/ Grossman last night. Sure, speil on about how Grossman has only played 1.5 years or whatever, but the fact of the matter the guy has horrible instincts, doesn't play well with any kind of rush (it would be great to NEVER have any pressure, but that's not realistic), has terrible accuracy, doesn't read defenses well, has poor field vision, and some of the worst pocket presence I have ever seen in a QB.

 

Sure, we had a couple drops...as does Tom Brady and Peyton Manning, except Rex's fanclub feels compelled to speil on about how this guy dropped a ball and Rex had pressure. Just watch the guy play. He will be out of pro football in 3 years. He is utterly horrendous.

 

He has been hidden because the Bears have played a crappy schedule, are (were) in a putrid division, and have gotten some swell breaks. NOW, it appears the North (save the Bears) has gotten better and the Bears will now need to make some plays in the offense with the defense not being as good as some think not to mention the injuries that are building up.

 

I don't know if Griese is the answer. He very well may not be, but I see no reason why he couldn't have taken a mopup series or two last night just to get a feel for him. Meanwhile, we'll stick with Grossman until death to us part, sorta like that insidious playoff game against carolina when our coaching DID NOTHING to change the defensive gameplan against Steve Smith EVEN WHEN our CB had gotten injured and we had a PRACTICE SQUAD player covering one of the most electric receivers in football. Needless to say, Steve Smith blew up all over Soldier Field, but Lovie could have said, "this is our gameplan."

 

The Sox were horrible this year, and now this? I'd love to think the Blackhawks could do something, but I still think they are a year away from the playoffs. Whatever the case, this football season just got real s***ty real fast.

[RockRaines]

The offensive and defensive line blew last night.

[kwolf68]

 

As far as Benson, the jury is still out on him I will agree. He isn't getting much room to run so far. And I've only seen one guy (some dude named Walter something) who could actually gain yards without the benefit of competent blocking.

 

Still, he isn't breaking many tackles, isn't alluding the defense much, is running out of bounds avoiding contact, isn't catching the ball, has already fumbled twice, and the first year in the league ran his mouth more than I care to mentio...in short, the anti-Payton.

 

 

[Steve9347]

The offensive and defensive line blew last night.

 

Marc Columbo sure looked good for Big D last night...

[thedoctor]

i'm still willing to reserve judgment on benson, primarily because he's the type of back that is going to do his best damage later in the game, and later in the game the bears were not in position to run the ball.

 

grossman, well, what can i say. i've defended him but as time is progressing it's becoming painfully apparent that he's not the guy. he looked like a bumbling idiot back there last night.

 

but i will say that the bears' offensive problems run much deeper than grossman. outside of berrian our receivers are poor. our offensive line is aging and showing signs of wear and tear and just is bad in pass protection. in past years you could say that the run blocking was at least solid, but it hasn't been good yet this year.

 

i give angelo credit for drafting some great defensive players, but outside of berrian he hasn't drafted one offensive player who's proven to be an impact guy.

[klaus kinski]

Here's what a wrote in an email to a group of friends this morning:

 

Meh, typical s***ty Bears loss. I pretty much expected this to happen. However I do think that Rex gets too much of the blame.

 

1. IMO he threw one bad interception - the one returned for a touchdown. The first one he let go of the ball before the receiver broke. It was similiar to his pick in the Chargers game where the receiver didn't run to the spot he was supposed to run too. The last one wasn't a surprise, he was just throwing it up hoping to get something going.

 

2. Too many dropped passes. Rex threw some good balls but the receivers failed to bring them in.

 

3. Bensons "fumble" was costly - I think the last replay they showed proved it was not a fumble and that his knee was down. Terrible call. At least say the play stands because there is not conclusive visual evidence to overturn it. Apparently he saw the ball come out before the knee was down which is BS.

 

4. Defense - so much for that vaunted Bears D. You can't expect them to go a whole game against a good (if not great) offense, but the complete lack of changing defensive schemes really got to me. From the 2nd through the 4th quarter I think Dallas ran the ball a total of 4 times. They hit Owens and the TE on crossing routes about 25 times. How does that happen? Why did they just let them march down the field without changing up some plays? And where was the D-Line? Obviously the injuries (especially to Briggs) hurt, but come on.

 

5. Offensive play calling. Everyone knows Rex is not a Brett Favre who can make a play every down. Ok we get that - so why are we running the ball on first and second down, getting stuffed, and then being forced into a long 3rd down attempt? I think about 5 drives ended because the play calling was atrocious. It's clear that Rex has horrible mechanics when he's getting pressured. He's also really small compared to the two lines in front of him, which causes him to throw off his backfoot and hope the ball lands where it's supposed to land. When he had clear passing lanes the Bears O had some good success. So why not try to move him out of the pocket more? Why not more play action rollouts?

 

6. The running game. I was a big Benson believer at the end of last year. But man, if he doesn't crank it up then this team is screwed.

 

7. Romo - Five seasons, Grossman - 1.3 seasons

 

Look, I'm not a Rex apologosit. I don't think he's a long-term answer and he's definitely not a franchise quarterback. But I do think he's good enough to help a superbowl caliber Bears D in winning a championship or two. I find it hilarious people want Griese in. No one remembers that guy took a two time superbowl champ team and had one decent year out of what, five seasons? Then he heads to Tampa Bay and Miami and gets cut. The rest of the NFL knows what Chicago fans apparently don't - he's not good enough to be a starter. I also like to remind you what it was like 2 years ago with Orton. Remember how terrible the offense was? Remember how great it felt when Rex came into the game? Remember the 100+ qb rating games he's had? The skills are obviously there. The rest of the team is to blame as much as Rex is to blame, especially with this loss.

 

/rant

 

You are completely correct-the middle is open down field-Turner sends in sideline passes doomed to fail. The weapons we have, Mark Bradley, Garret Wolfe , and Hester on offense-dont even get a sniff. They are the only team still trying to set up the pass by the run-its a offensive scheme no one can succeed at .

 

[LosMediasBlancas]

Give Rex four starts, then go to the back up. Rex spent most of the off season learning to scramble? Really??

[Texsox]

The Bears do not have a Pro Bowl caliber QB on the roster. Three weeks with Greise, and the Rex chants will begin. Cowboys are for real. Sucks to live in Texas when the "boys have a closer to great than good" team.

[RockRaines]

The offensive line is getting too easy of a pass on this one. How many times did an untouched Cowboy get to Rex? Where were the running holes? They are too old and cant get a push to save their lives.

 

The defensive line had about ONE good rush and it was the first series. From then on they couldnt generate a damn thing. Romo had all the time in the world to throw last night.

[Steve9347]

The defensive line had about ONE good rush and it was the first series. From then on they couldnt generate a damn thing. Romo had all the time in the world to throw last night.

 

Dude, what game were you watching? The Bears often had paws on Romo, who is one of the best QB's in the league at EVADING PRESSURE. I know we've all seen too much of Grossman and him falling to the ground anytime someone got near him, but Romo was freaking amazing last night, and was pressured many times and dodged in and out of arms grabbing at him to look up and dart a pass to TO for a 3rd and long first down.

 

Tony Romo made me a believer last night for many reasons.

[Gregory Pratt]

I just wish we had made Tony Romo cry.

[RockRaines]

Dude, what game were you watching? The Bears often had paws on Romo, who is one of the best QB's in the league at EVADING PRESSURE. I know we've all seen too much of Grossman and him falling to the ground anytime someone got near him, but Romo was freaking amazing last night, and was pressured many times and dodged in and out of arms grabbing at him to look up and dart a pass to TO for a 3rd and long first down.

 

Tony Romo made me a believer last night for many reasons.

The game where Romo had hours to throw the ball 9 times out of 10. The only pressure I saw him avoid was Darwin Walker.

[Rowand44]

The Bears do not have a Pro Bowl caliber QB on the roster. Three weeks with Greise, and the Rex chants will begin. Cowboys are for real. Sucks to live in Texas when the "boys have a closer to great than good" team.

I don't think anyone is expecting Griese to be pro bowl caliber but he's better than Rex who is probably the worst starting qb in the league right now.

[klaus kinski]

The game where Romo had hours to throw the ball 9 times out of 10. The only pressure I saw him avoid was Darwin Walker.

 

There was little pressure-we put "paws" on him when he ran into our defense-D lineman had ONE tackle eack-thats pathetic

[Texsox]

I don't think anyone is expecting Griese to be pro bowl caliber but he's better than Rex who is probably the worst starting qb in the league right now.

 

And he will be replaced by a QB who will be about the same ranking in the league. It isn't like there is a huge difference. Just a different jersey to throw a shoe at and scream "you are an idiot . . ." But sometimes that's fun.

[Steve9347]

And he will be replaced by a QB who will be about the same ranking in the league. It isn't like there is a huge difference.

Yes, let's ignore Grossman's career 69.3 QB ratings vs. Brian Greise's career 84.5.

 

IDENTICAL.

[whitesoxfan101]

Brian Griese needs to be the QB and he is modestly better than Rex (who isn't?), but it won't change much. He makes a lot of mistakes too, which is why his career QB rating isn't higher when you consider how accurate a passer he is. Griese won't fix our old and bad o line, our black hole at tailback and wide receiver, Adam Archuleta sucking at life, or the fact we have 5/11 of our defensive starters hurt right now. This team just isn't that good right now, simple as that.

Edited September 24, 2007 by whitesoxfan101

[Steve9347]

Brian Griese needs to be the QB and he is modestly better than Rex (who isn't?), but it won't change much. He makes a lot of mistakes too, which is why his career QB rating isn't higher when you consider how accurate a passer he is. Griese won't fix our old and bad o line, our black hole at tailback and wide receiver, Adam Archuleta sucking at life, or the fact we have 5/11 of our defensive starters hurt right now. This team just isn't that good right now, simple as that.

QB ratings take into account completion %, and Griese's career 84.5 > Grossman's career 69.3 passer rating.